# Mark McGwires brother writes book about Marks steroid use **URL:** \ **Category:** The Game Room\ **Created:** [January 23, 2009, 3:49am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/mark-mcgwires-brother-writes-book-about-marks-steroid-use/482575 "2009-01-23T03:49:28Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 2
**Author:** ![Marley23](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/45deac/32.png) [@Marley23](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Marley23)\ **Post date:** [January 23, 2009, 6:17pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/mark-mcgwires-brother-writes-book-about-marks-steroid-use/482575/21 "2009-01-23T18:17:23Z")
> [@Hawkeyeop](#): > > Steriods is a very general term. Some are illegal and some aren’t. Some are helpful and some aren’t. Saying steroids=bad is a overly simplistic way of looking at things. True. In this context, however, the issue isn’t really whether the drug itself is good are bad. The anabolic steroids ballplayers use to bulk up or recover from injuries are illegal without a prescription if I remember correctly. I don’t think anyone is trying to argue that it’s wrong to use steroids to treat asthma. > [@](#): > > Oh and he was absolutely right. Congress should not have been focusing on his past. It’s usually stupid when Congress gets into sports, but McGwire was refusing to incriminate himself, not criticizing Congress for focusing on the wrong thing. He said, “My lawyers have advised me that I cannot answer these questions without jeopardizing my friends, my family and myself. I don’t know. I’m a retired player. I will do everything I can in my power to turn this around from a negative to a positive. I’m not here to talk about the past.” ---
**Author:** ![Hawkeyeop](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/h/958977/32.png) [@Hawkeyeop](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Hawkeyeop)\ **Post date:** [January 23, 2009, 6:31pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/mark-mcgwires-brother-writes-book-about-marks-steroid-use/482575/22 "2009-01-23T18:31:55Z")
> [@Marley23](#): > > True. In this context, however, the issue isn’t really whether the drug itself is good are bad. The anabolic steroids ballplayers use to bulk up or recover from injuries are illegal without a prescription if I remember correctly. I don’t think anyone is trying to argue that it’s wrong to use steroids to treat asthma. Yes, but lots of things are illegal. Do you think Tim Raines should be ineligible for doing drugs? Doing something illegal has never been something that bars you from getting into the hall of fame. > [@](#): > > It’s usually stupid when Congress gets into sports, but McGwire was refusing to incriminate himself, not criticizing Congress for focusing on the wrong thing. He said, “My lawyers have advised me that I cannot answer these questions without jeopardizing my friends, my family and myself. I don’t know. I’m a retired player. I will do everything I can in my power to turn this around from a negative to a positive. I’m not here to talk about the past.” I’m not saying his motive was pure here. I agree with the statement, even if his reasons for it might have been different. ---
**Author:** ![Munch](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/munch/32/5281_2.png) [@Munch](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Munch)\ **Post date:** [January 23, 2009, 6:48pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/mark-mcgwires-brother-writes-book-about-marks-steroid-use/482575/23 "2009-01-23T18:48:47Z")
> [@Marley23](#): > > I’m not sure those TV stats make for a valid comparison, **Munch** , although they’re interesting. The Cardinals and Cubs weren’t in the World Series to begin with, and there’s also the proliferation of new networks and satellite TV to account for. Well, the argument was that Sosa/McGwire helped all of baseball, not just the Cubs and Cardinals. You’d think you’d see an increase in TV ratings for baseball’s biggest event that same year, not a 17% dip. And new networks/satellite TV don’t really factor into a comparison of ratings for three consecutive years. ---
**Author:** ![gonzomax](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/g/e8c25b/32.png) [@gonzomax](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/gonzomax)\ **Post date:** [January 23, 2009, 6:49pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/mark-mcgwires-brother-writes-book-about-marks-steroid-use/482575/24 "2009-01-23T18:49:19Z")
HGH is still uncatchable. There are a lot of drugs we do not know about yet. Baseball like any human endeavor is not clean. Speed was common in the 60s and 70s. ---
**Author:** ![Munch](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/munch/32/5281_2.png) [@Munch](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Munch)\ **Post date:** [January 23, 2009, 7:12pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/mark-mcgwires-brother-writes-book-about-marks-steroid-use/482575/25 "2009-01-23T19:12:12Z")
> [@gonzomax](#): > > The cutaways could generate a larger long term audience. people who were tepid about baseball may have gotten heated up and became more active fans. And yet the numbers I provided paint a much different picture. Just because you say “more people ended up watching!” doesn’t mean it’s true. Saying “the same number of people watched - here’s proof!” does. ---
**Author:** ![Marley23](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/45deac/32.png) [@Marley23](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Marley23)\ **Post date:** [January 23, 2009, 8:27pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/mark-mcgwires-brother-writes-book-about-marks-steroid-use/482575/26 "2009-01-23T20:27:37Z")
> [@Munch](#): > > Well, the argument was that Sosa/McGwire helped all of baseball, not just the Cubs and Cardinals. You’d think you’d see an increase in TV ratings for baseball’s biggest event that same year, not a 17% dip. And new networks/satellite TV don’t really factor into a comparison of ratings for three consecutive years. That’s true. Okay, this looks like a myth, although I do believe baseball believed it and acted accordingly- by ignoring the problem as long as possible. > [@Hawkeyeop](#): > > Yes, but lots of things are illegal. Do you think Tim Raines should be ineligible for doing drugs? Show me cocaine’s a performance enhancer rather than a career destroyer and I might think that. But since Doc Gooden and Darryl Strawberry only lasted one ballot each and never came anywhere near reaching their potential or the Hall of Fame, I don’t see it happening. ---
**Author:** ![gonzomax](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/g/e8c25b/32.png) [@gonzomax](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/gonzomax)\ **Post date:** [January 23, 2009, 8:35pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/mark-mcgwires-brother-writes-book-about-marks-steroid-use/482575/27 "2009-01-23T20:35:04Z")
Lots of ways to gage. The sales of Andro went up 1000 percent after the race. McGwire shirts sold 10 x more than ever. If the race was shown on prime time cut aways, I am perfectly justified in saying more people were aware of baseball and the home run race. Many were probably annoyed that they did it. others were reminded of baseball . Yes, more were watching and aware of the homerun race. ---
**Author:** ![Munch](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/munch/32/5281_2.png) [@Munch](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Munch)\ **Post date:** [January 23, 2009, 8:42pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/mark-mcgwires-brother-writes-book-about-marks-steroid-use/482575/28 "2009-01-23T20:42:11Z")
> [@gonzomax](#): > > If the race was shown on prime time cut aways, I am perfectly justified in saying more people were aware of baseball and the home run race. Many were probably annoyed that they did it. others were reminded of baseball . Yes, more were watching and aware of the homerun race. Again, I’m still looking for regular season TV ratings - I’m sure you’re right that there was a spike. However - and this is the important part - it was a short-lived spike at the end of the season that did not translate, IN ANY SINGLE WAY, to overall viewership to baseball’s premiere event, the World Series. In fact, as I have already said, viewership of the WS declined by 17% that very year. To be clear: You are contending that Sosa & McGwire somehow “resurrected” baseball, correct? Would you not agree that measuring something like television viewership would be helpful in this discussion? ---
**Author:** ![pravnik](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/p/8edcca/32.png) [@pravnik](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/pravnik)\ **Post date:** [January 23, 2009, 8:45pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/mark-mcgwires-brother-writes-book-about-marks-steroid-use/482575/29 "2009-01-23T20:45:24Z")
Next Thanksgiving is going to be mucho awkward at the McGwire house. ---
**Author:** ![Marley23](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/45deac/32.png) [@Marley23](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Marley23)\ **Post date:** [January 23, 2009, 9:05pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/mark-mcgwires-brother-writes-book-about-marks-steroid-use/482575/30 "2009-01-23T21:05:26Z")
> [@pravnik](#): > > Next Thanksgiving is going to be mucho awkward at the McGwire house. These two haven’t spoken in years anyway. ---
**Author:** ![Cisco](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/ccd318/32.png) [@Cisco](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Cisco)\ **Post date:** [January 23, 2009, 11:13pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/mark-mcgwires-brother-writes-book-about-marks-steroid-use/482575/31 "2009-01-23T23:13:57Z")
> [@Hawkeyeop](#): > > Plenty of people wreck there body to compete. You think pitching is a natural motion. That linemen’s natural weight is 350. Being hit the head repeatedly is good for the brain? But ALL pitchers have to make the same motion, big men have been selected to play line for over a century, ALL boxers get hit in the head. They’re necessary components of the game. Steroids are not. It’s not a gray area; steroids are against the rules and using them is cheating. Period. ---
**Author:** ![pseudotriton\_ruber\_ruber](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/p/a9a28c/32.png) [@pseudotriton\_ruber\_ruber](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/pseudotriton_ruber_ruber)\ **Post date:** [January 23, 2009, 11:29pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/mark-mcgwires-brother-writes-book-about-marks-steroid-use/482575/32 "2009-01-23T23:29:42Z")
And not everyone who gets caught is going to be punished, so you have to make sure you punish those you catch harshly enough to discourage the others. Is being kept from an induction ceremony your idea of a harsh punishment? ---
**Author:** ![AppallingGael](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/b9bd4f/32.png) [@AppallingGael](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/AppallingGael)\ **Post date:** [January 24, 2009, 1:02am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/mark-mcgwires-brother-writes-book-about-marks-steroid-use/482575/33 "2009-01-24T01:02:04Z")
> [@Marley23](#): > > Show me cocaine’s a performance enhancer rather than a career destroyer and I might think that. But since Doc Gooden and Darryl Strawberry only lasted one ballot each and never came anywhere near reaching their potential or the Hall of Fame, I don’t see it happening. Another illustration: Paul Molitor, the first player in MLB history (with a decent minimum # of at-bats) to become a lifetime .300 hitter after turning 30, claimed to have been a cocaine user early in his career. Barry Bonds (alleged to have used steroids in his later career) became a lifetime .300 hitter only after turning 40. ---
**Author:** ![Justin\_Bailey](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/justin_bailey/32/8792_2.png) [@Justin\_Bailey](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Justin_Bailey)\ **Post date:** [January 24, 2009, 1:11am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/mark-mcgwires-brother-writes-book-about-marks-steroid-use/482575/34 "2009-01-24T01:11:01Z")
> [@Marley23](#): > > At least he didn’t lie to Congress, which Sammy Sosa and Rafael Palmeiro did at the same hearing and Roger Clemens did later. I can’t let this pass (I never let this pass actually and it pisses a few people off), but Sammy Sosa has never been seriously suspected of steroid use. Yes, he hit a lot of home runs in the “steroid era”, but no one has ever come up with more proof than “He must be guilty! Look at all the HRs he hit!” No disgraced trainers. No batboys with prying eyes. No disgruntled brothers. Nothing. Sammy gets crapped on because Barry Bonds’ head grew three sizes one day. ---
**Author:** ![pseudotriton\_ruber\_ruber](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/p/a9a28c/32.png) [@pseudotriton\_ruber\_ruber](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/pseudotriton_ruber_ruber)\ **Post date:** [January 24, 2009, 1:20am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/mark-mcgwires-brother-writes-book-about-marks-steroid-use/482575/35 "2009-01-24T01:20:07Z")
And because he indignantly refused to take a voluntary test for steroids. ---
**Author:** ![gonzomax](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/g/e8c25b/32.png) [@gonzomax](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/gonzomax)\ **Post date:** [January 24, 2009, 1:27am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/mark-mcgwires-brother-writes-book-about-marks-steroid-use/482575/36 "2009-01-24T01:27:02Z")
> [@Munch](#): > > Again, I’m still looking for regular season TV ratings - I’m sure you’re right that there was a spike. However - and this is the important part - it was a short-lived spike at the end of the season that did not translate, IN ANY SINGLE WAY, to overall viewership to baseball’s premiere event, the World Series. In fact, as I have already said, viewership of the WS declined by 17% that very year. > > To be clear: You are contending that Sosa & McGwire somehow “resurrected” baseball, correct? Would you not agree that measuring something like television viewership would be helpful in this discussion? no. It would not. There were tons of articles about it while it was going on. The press and news stories were endless. The World Series going down without Sosa and Mcgwire just accents their importance. ---
**Author:** ![Moirai](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/96bed5/32.png) [@Moirai](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Moirai)\ **Post date:** [January 24, 2009, 3:56am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/mark-mcgwires-brother-writes-book-about-marks-steroid-use/482575/37 "2009-01-24T03:56:22Z")
> [@gonzomax](#): > > HGH is still uncatchable. There are a lot of drugs we do not know about yet. Baseball like any human endeavor is not clean. Speed was common in the 60s and 70s. Speed is common _right now_. Greenies are eaten like Skittles in big league locker rooms. Some steroids do indeed help you heal faster after injuries- that’s actually why most players take them, from what I understand. It’s a long season, they play almost every day, and their bodies break down. There is a huge financial incentive to heal quickly and get back out there. MLB’s policy encouraged steroid use- don’t kid yourself otherwise. It’s foolish to say “don’t do it, but if you do, you’ll never get caught because we’ll never test you.” The players union was equally to blame. I have said it before that only one thing can keep you out of the Hall- betting on baseball or associating closely with those who do. There are wife-beaters, alcoholics, drug addicts, racists, bigots, bastards and murders (allegedly) in the Hall. Now perhaps, rumours of steroid use will keep players out as well (I say rumours because no future HOFer has actually been caught yet, except for Rafi Palmiero, right?). ---
**Author:** ![FoieGrasIsEvil](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/foiegrasisevil/32/16638_2.png) [@FoieGrasIsEvil](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/FoieGrasIsEvil)\ **Post date:** [January 24, 2009, 4:59am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/mark-mcgwires-brother-writes-book-about-marks-steroid-use/482575/38 "2009-01-24T04:59:27Z")
> [@Justin\_Bailey](#): > > I can’t let this pass (I never let this pass actually and it pisses a few people off), but Sammy Sosa has never been seriously suspected of steroid use. > > Yes, he hit a lot of home runs in the “steroid era”, but no one has ever come up with more proof than “He must be guilty! Look at all the HRs he hit!” No disgraced trainers. No batboys with prying eyes. No disgruntled brothers. Nothing. > > Sammy gets crapped on because Barry Bonds’ head grew three sizes one day. So did Sammy Sosa’s body. Look at pictures of him, McGwire and Bonds earlier in their careers and then look at the “after” photos…all three of those guys bulked up beyond belief in a short period of time, and simply “working out” isn’t going to explain that away. All three of them used. Fuck them and their tainted bullshit records! They should have to earn it the old fashioned way, by being perennial boozers and womanizers that played so hung over that it was amazing that they could see the pitches! 🙂 ---
**Author:** ![gonzomax](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/g/e8c25b/32.png) [@gonzomax](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/gonzomax)\ **Post date:** [January 24, 2009, 5:08am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/mark-mcgwires-brother-writes-book-about-marks-steroid-use/482575/39 "2009-01-24T05:08:41Z")
[http://pointofview.typepad.com/pov/2006/03/\_the\_green\_line.html](http://pointofview.typepad.com/pov/2006/03/_the_green_line.html) Yes Sosa has been painted with the steroid brush. he got bigger and stronger at an age when players fade. I have read many stories of his use. It is just Bonds and McGwire are bigger stories. ---
**Author:** ![Marley23](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/45deac/32.png) [@Marley23](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Marley23)\ **Post date:** [January 24, 2009, 5:25am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/mark-mcgwires-brother-writes-book-about-marks-steroid-use/482575/40 "2009-01-24T05:25:12Z")
> [@Jas09](#): > > How many home runs would Mark have hit if he never used steroids? We’ll obviously never know. I will note that if we take Jay at his work (that Mark started using after getting injured in 1993), then Mark McGwire hit 220 HRs before he ever used and was a 6-time all-star. Pretending that he was nothing without the juice is as dumb as making the same claim about Barry Bonds. He could definitely hit home runs without steroids. I believe his brother’s point was that he likely would have washed out of baseball with about 220 home runs without steroids, however. We’ll never know what he would have done without them. > [@Justin Bailey](#): > > I can’t let this pass (I never let this pass actually and it pisses a few people off), but Sammy Sosa has never been seriously suspected of steroid use. Bullshit. Sosa’s body and career follow the same pattern as McGwire’s: he showed power, then bulked up to a very great degree in a short period of time, hit a lot of home runs, then his health started to go quickly - Sosa missed a ton of time after allegedly throwing his back out during a big sneeze - and then he was out of baseball. I believe Sosa credited his increased muscle mass and power to creatine and to a dental operation that allowed him to eat more. > [@pseudotriton ruber ruber](#): > > And because he indignantly refused to take a voluntary test for steroids. He’s also been criticized for struggling with his English when testifying before Congress even though he’s fluent - although I have not seen a transcript. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/mark-mcgwires-brother-writes-book-about-marks-steroid-use/482575.md?page=1) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/mark-mcgwires-brother-writes-book-about-marks-steroid-use/482575.md?page=3)