# Martin/Zimmerman: humble opinions and speculation thread **URL:** \ **Category:** In My Humble Opinion\ **Created:** [April 18, 2012, 4:41am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/martin-zimmerman-humble-opinions-and-speculation-thread/619125 "2012-04-18T04:41:41Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 203
**Author:** ![Poochey](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/p/7ea924/32.png) [@Poochey](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Poochey)\ **Post date:** [July 18, 2012, 11:43pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/martin-zimmerman-humble-opinions-and-speculation-thread/619125/4042 "2012-07-18T23:43:04Z")
> [@emeraldia](#): > > Nope, just inference based on time and physics. One big problem I see is that Zimmerman said he walked all the way to the street. There are no streets in the gated community. The nearest street is just outside the community. Did he mean that street? It would seem to explain the several minute, not one like the police claimed, gap between Z’s getting off the phone, and confrontation. It takes seconds to reach the T from Z’s vehicle, not minutes. (why would Trayvon still be there?) If Z left the gated community, to look at the nearby street sign, it might explain the time. ---
**Author:** ![emeraldia](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/c2a13f/32.png) [@emeraldia](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/emeraldia)\ **Post date:** [July 18, 2012, 11:53pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/martin-zimmerman-humble-opinions-and-speculation-thread/619125/4043 "2012-07-18T23:53:18Z")
> [@Evil\_Economist](#): > > …getting out of your car to follow them more closely… Zimmerman wasn’t following Trayvon “closely” at all. He didn’t even know where he _was_ for crap sake (which is the actual reason he got out of his car.) > [@](#): > > I’m a big guy, but if someone did that to me I would get scared, my heart rate would speed up, I would get ready to fight. If I had a gun I might take it out. And people criticize Zimmerman’s use of _his_ gun? You don’t pull out a gun because someone approaches you. Maybe it’s best you don’t get one. > [@](#): > > Martin did exactly what I would have done at 17 if I’d been in that same situation; hit the threating guy a good one, follow him to the ground, give him a couple more to take the fight out of him. Notwithstanding how terrible that type of thinking is, Trayvon Martin went beyond that and continued long after the “fight was out of him” (especially since it was probably never in him in the first place). > [@](#): > > Look at you, playing the victim card. Read the posts in this very thread; can you tell me with a straight face that all the Zimmerman defenders are just clamoring for a fair trial? Some of them are (e.g., **Bricker** ), but lots of them aren’t. > [@](#): > > Answer this question honestly (I will judge you based on your answer); do you think there’s no race element powering the wide support for Zimmerman? Do you think some of our more recent posters are defending Zimmerman just becasue they believe he deserves a fair trial? Do you think the same people defending Zimmerman now would be defending him if he were black were black and the kid white? It shouldn’t surprise me that a Trayvenger has a propensity to see racism that’s not really there, and to make sweeping conclusions about someone based on insufficient evidence. This question not addressed to me, but I’ll answer it anyway. Most racists support Zimmerman, but most supporters of Zimmerman are not racist. I disagree with Becker- I don’t think Zimmerman should have ever been charged. (although my understanding is that he still believes there is a smoking gun coming in the future). ---
**Author:** ![doorhinge](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/a5b964/32.png) [@doorhinge](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/doorhinge)\ **Post date:** [July 18, 2012, 11:58pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/martin-zimmerman-humble-opinions-and-speculation-thread/619125/4044 "2012-07-18T23:58:19Z")
> [@Airbeck](#): > > Ok, so which of these groups do I belong to specifically? Who am I attacking, what action am I advocating? Who have I killed? Am I being disorderly in some way? > > In other words, your point please? Are you saying that this justifies insinuating that anyone in this thread that disagrees with your viewpoint is part of a lynch mob and therefore fits one of these categories? Which one do you want to belong to? It’s your choice. FYI - Those aren’t “categories”, they’re three dictionary definitions of the term “lynch mob”. Is Zimmerman entitled to a fair trial? Did the FBI find any “credible” evidence that Zimmerman has acted as a racist? Does W9 have any credibility with either the prosecution or the defense? Did Martin break Zimmerman’s nose? Did Martin or Zimmerman do anything illegal up until the first blow was struck? Did NBC/MSNBC falsely edit audio and video recordings to generate interest in this story and boost their ad revenue? Did ABC buy stolen tapes of Zimmerman entering the Sanford PD from someone in the Sanford PD? ---
**Author:** ![crowmanyclouds](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/crowmanyclouds/32/19884_2.png) [@crowmanyclouds](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/crowmanyclouds)\ **Post date:** [July 19, 2012, 12:02am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/martin-zimmerman-humble-opinions-and-speculation-thread/619125/4045 "2012-07-19T00:02:46Z")
> [@Poochey](#): > > … There are no streets in the gated community. … Umm, then exactly what are; Retreat View Circle, Twin Trees Lane, and Long Oak Way? And why are cars allowed to drive and park on them? CMC fnord! ---
**Author:** ![doorhinge](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/a5b964/32.png) [@doorhinge](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/doorhinge)\ **Post date:** [July 19, 2012, 12:09am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/martin-zimmerman-humble-opinions-and-speculation-thread/619125/4046 "2012-07-19T00:09:50Z")
> [@Poochey](#): > > \*\*One big problem I see is that Zimmerman said he walked all the way to the street. There are no streets in the gated community. \*\*The nearest street is just outside the community. Did he mean that street? It would seem to explain the several minute, not one like the police claimed, gap between Z’s getting off the phone, and confrontation. It takes seconds to reach the T from Z’s vehicle, not minutes. (why would Trayvon still be there?) If Z left the gated community, to look at the nearby street sign, it might explain the time. There are several streets inside the gated community. Twin Trees Lane, Retreat View Circle, and Long Oak Way. ---
**Author:** ![John\_Mace](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/john_mace/32/185_2.png) [@John\_Mace](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/John_Mace)\ **Post date:** [July 19, 2012, 12:10am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/martin-zimmerman-humble-opinions-and-speculation-thread/619125/4047 "2012-07-19T00:10:17Z")
> [@enomaj](#): > > [Sean Hannity George Zimmerman Interview: Fox News Host Gets First Sitdown With Trayvon Martin Shooter | HuffPost Latest News](http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2012/07/18/sean-hannity-george-zimmerman-interview_n_1683300.html) > > Hannity! Zimmerman! One on [del]one[/del] two. Now why do I get a feeling that this is a really stupid idea? I don’t care who the interviewers are. Lay low and **STFU**. That’ll be $1,000 attorney’s fees for that nugget of advice! ---
**Author:** ![Fear\_Itself](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/fear_itself/32/19637_2.png) [@Fear\_Itself](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Fear_Itself)\ **Post date:** [July 19, 2012, 12:22am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/martin-zimmerman-humble-opinions-and-speculation-thread/619125/4048 "2012-07-19T00:22:15Z")
> [@John\_Mace](#): > > Now why do I get a feeling that this is a really stupid idea? My thoughts as well. No up side for Zimmerman at all, and potential for disaster. I suppose if Zimmerman and O’Mara are so convinced he is going to walk, they are thinking about how to cash in after the trial, and are laying the groundwork for his celebrity. ---
**Author:** ![you\_with\_the\_face](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/y/ecccb3/32.png) [@you\_with\_the\_face](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/you_with_the_face)\ **Post date:** [July 19, 2012, 12:45am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/martin-zimmerman-humble-opinions-and-speculation-thread/619125/4049 "2012-07-19T00:45:00Z")
O’Mara is trying to wrassle up money, IMHO. Going to Hannity helps them rally the base and drum up donations. Since its not live, there is little chance of GZ slipping up and saying something incriminating. This is probably the closest they will come to GZ actually taking the witness stand, with the added benefit of no cross examination. Verily I say, though, 'tis the day that the defense counsel has officially jumped the shark. Its not like in his most recent motion to dq the judge, O’Mara didn’t just whine about concerns of media bias and a fair trial. So what he does he do shortly after submitting this complaint to the court? And, I might add, while his request _is still freaking pending_? He turns FoxNews into GZ’s podium. Bravo counsellor. Bravo. Usually hypocrisy is a bit more subtle than this. ---
**Author:** ![Belowjob2.0](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/b9e5f3/32.png) [@Belowjob2.0](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Belowjob2.0)\ **Post date:** [July 19, 2012, 1:06am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/martin-zimmerman-humble-opinions-and-speculation-thread/619125/4050 "2012-07-19T01:06:27Z")
> [@doorhinge](#): > > What rape are you referring to? Do you disapprove of falsely accusing someone of rape? Do you disapprove of people defending themselves? Do you disapprove of the State of Florida permitting taxpaying voters to carry firearms, regardless of what the taxpaying voters want? > > Have you already decided that Zimmerman is guilty regardless of what some silly ol’ court might eventually decide? Is the court case getting in the way of your guilty until proven innocent mentality? > > Lynch mobs don’t require court rooms. A law abiding society does. Encourage your family, friends, and neighbors to obey the law. Then they won’t find themselves in the same situation as Zimmerman. Not too hard, is it? ---
**Author:** ![emeraldia](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/c2a13f/32.png) [@emeraldia](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/emeraldia)\ **Post date:** [July 19, 2012, 1:18am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/martin-zimmerman-humble-opinions-and-speculation-thread/619125/4051 "2012-07-19T01:18:30Z")
> [@Belowjob2.0](#): > > Encourage your family, friends, and neighbors to obey the law. Then they won’t find themselves in the same situation as Zimmerman. Not too hard, is it? No credible evidence that Zimmerman broke any law. That’s why they didn’t charge him originally. ---
**Author:** ![Belowjob2.0](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/b9e5f3/32.png) [@Belowjob2.0](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Belowjob2.0)\ **Post date:** [July 19, 2012, 1:18am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/martin-zimmerman-humble-opinions-and-speculation-thread/619125/4052 "2012-07-19T01:18:58Z")
A comparable case, with an appropriate verdict. [http://articles.latimes.com/2009/sep/01/local/me-uscmurder1](http://articles.latimes.com/2009/sep/01/local/me-uscmurder1) > [@](#): > > Contradicting the prosecution, Ford said he never entered his mother’s apartment that night. He claimed that he was choking badly while pinned on the ground by Frost and that he used the knife, which he said he carried for protection in a sweat shirt pocket, “as a last resort.” Bullshit, of course. Let’s hope we can get 16 to life for Mr. Zimmerman as well. ---
**Author:** ![Belowjob2.0](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/b9e5f3/32.png) [@Belowjob2.0](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Belowjob2.0)\ **Post date:** [July 19, 2012, 1:21am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/martin-zimmerman-humble-opinions-and-speculation-thread/619125/4053 "2012-07-19T01:21:40Z")
> [@emeraldia](#): > > No credible evidence that Zimmerman broke any law. That’s why they didn’t charge him originally. See, when you make excuses for lawbreaking, you just encourage it. Stop doing this, and encourage the people in your community to take responsibility for their own actions. If Zimmerman had been held to account for his bad behavior in the past, he wouldn’t be in this situation now. ---
**Author:** ![Bricker](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/977dab/32.png) [@Bricker](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Bricker)\ **Post date:** [July 19, 2012, 1:22am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/martin-zimmerman-humble-opinions-and-speculation-thread/619125/4054 "2012-07-19T01:22:32Z")
> [@Airbeck](#): > > Was he convicted of the crime of lynching? How many years did he get for that crime? No, which is why I drew the distinction between the crime of violence by a mob upon the body of any person which results in the death of that person, and the analogous metaphor. > [@](#): > > Are you saying that lynch mobs exist in our current culture? Are lynch mobs actually out to get George Zimmerman right now? How many, approximately, are currently hunting down Zimmerman to murder him in the night? I don’t know. [But it seems at least foreseeable that at least some people were motivated by the desire to do that.](http://www.theblaze.com/stories/report-new-black-panther-party-issues-wanted-dead-or-alive-poster-for-george-zimmerman/) > [@](#): > > Do you think it helps or hurts the discussion when someone constantly demonizes everyone who disagrees with them? Does that advance the conversation? If so, in a good direction, or bad one? Frankly I have seen such demonization from people on both sides, against both sides. ---
**Author:** ![Idle\_Thoughts](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/i/838e76/32.png) [@Idle\_Thoughts](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Idle_Thoughts)\ **Post date:** [July 19, 2012, 1:23am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/martin-zimmerman-humble-opinions-and-speculation-thread/619125/4055 "2012-07-19T01:23:07Z")
> [@emeraldia](#): > > Airbeck is a lynching lyncher that intends to lynch Zimmerman. I know you’re a little new here, **emealdia** ; just so you know, you start a topic in the BBQ Pit forum if you want to call another poster names or if you have a problem with them. Don’t do it in this topic or any topic in this forum. ---
**Author:** ![emeraldia](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/c2a13f/32.png) [@emeraldia](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/emeraldia)\ **Post date:** [July 19, 2012, 1:25am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/martin-zimmerman-humble-opinions-and-speculation-thread/619125/4056 "2012-07-19T01:25:21Z")
Interesting interview. I’ve seen one mistake that he’ll have to clarify at some point. He said he went to his street because he planned on meeting the police there. But it was on his way back to his car that he was attacked by Trayvon Martin. If he was going to meet the police there, why did he head back to his car? It can be explained, but it’s another _apparent_ contradiction. Otherwise, he’s done OK so far. ---
**Author:** ![Magiver](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/4491bb/32.png) [@Magiver](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Magiver)\ **Post date:** [July 19, 2012, 1:28am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/martin-zimmerman-humble-opinions-and-speculation-thread/619125/4057 "2012-07-19T01:28:13Z")
> [@emeraldia](#): > > Interesting interview. I’ve seen one mistake that he’ll have to clarify at some point. He said he went to his street because he planned on meeting the police there. But it was on his way back to his car that he was attacked by Trayvon Martin. If he was going to meet the police there, why did he head back to his car? It can be explained, but it’s another _apparent_ contradiction. Otherwise, he’s done OK so far. He originally headed toward his street to get a house number since he knew the name of the street. He abandoned that and went back to his original instructions which would have brought the police to his truck. ---
**Author:** ![DragonAsh](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/db5fbb/32.png) [@DragonAsh](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/DragonAsh)\ **Post date:** [July 19, 2012, 1:34am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/martin-zimmerman-humble-opinions-and-speculation-thread/619125/4058 "2012-07-19T01:34:10Z")
So I guess you’re just going to hand-wave away the small little matter of never being asked where he was before he got out of the truck? And how he -then- changed his mind to have the cops call when they got there and he’d tell 'em where he was, but then -still- didn’t get an address…you know, something he could use to tell the cops where he was at, and instead said he wanted to go back to his car. No worries - hand wave away. ---
**Author:** ![doorhinge](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/a5b964/32.png) [@doorhinge](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/doorhinge)\ **Post date:** [July 19, 2012, 1:41am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/martin-zimmerman-humble-opinions-and-speculation-thread/619125/4059 "2012-07-19T01:41:51Z")
> [@Belowjob2.0](#): > > Encourage your family, friends, and neighbors to obey the law. Then they won’t find themselves in the same situation as Zimmerman. Not too hard, is it? Very good advice. Let me add a few that you forget. Encourage your family, friends, and neighbors to believe that everyone is Innocent Until Proven Guilty in a Court of Law. Encourage your family, friends, and neighbors not to spread false stories about anyone. Encourage your family, friends, and neighbors not to participate in lynch mobs. ---
**Author:** ![you\_with\_the\_face](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/y/ecccb3/32.png) [@you\_with\_the\_face](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/you_with_the_face)\ **Post date:** [July 19, 2012, 1:42am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/martin-zimmerman-humble-opinions-and-speculation-thread/619125/4060 "2012-07-19T01:42:55Z")
> [@emeraldia](#): > > Interesting interview. I’ve seen one mistake that he’ll have to clarify at some point. He said he went to his street because he planned on meeting the police there. But it was on his way back to his car that he was attacked by Trayvon Martin. Okay, this is funny. We should take this as an indication that even GZ thinks the “I exited my car to look for a street sign” explanation is too implausible to accept. If its the truth, there would no need to come with up some other storyline; he would stick by it no matter now ridiculous it sounds. So we have Modification #153, the “I exited the car to meet the cops” explanation. The basic question stills remains unanswered, though: Why was it necessary for him to get out of his car and run one street over in the dark, in the rain, just to meet the cops? It ain’t like the cops were over there or even knew to meet him over there. He could have met them at the front gate, if that was really his goal. So Zimmerman still manages to screw himself, in spite of having the interview be pre-recorded and conducted by a friendly “journalist”. Lol. (I didn’t see the interview; just going by **emerilda’s** post) ---
**Author:** ![Belowjob2.0](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/b9e5f3/32.png) [@Belowjob2.0](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Belowjob2.0)\ **Post date:** [July 19, 2012, 1:42am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/martin-zimmerman-humble-opinions-and-speculation-thread/619125/4061 "2012-07-19T01:42:57Z")
> **[Tensions high as trial approaches in fatal stabbing of USC student](https://www.latimes.com/archives/la-xpm-2009-aug-13-me-usc-murder13-story.html)** > > Tensions high as trial approaches in fatal stabbing of USC student > [@](#): > > Ford’s relatives and friends say his case is being handled more harshly because it involves a white USC student and a black defendant and because the school wants to project a security-conscious image. Sound familiar? Ghetto logic. How about, instead complaining about how your boy is getting is being punished unduly, you impress upon him the importance of not using a deadly weapon when he loses the fight that he started? And since your boy has had a history of run ins with the law that family members had to bail him out of, how about you impress upon him the importance of not breaking the law. Of course, for all his flaws, Mr Ford has never, to my knowledge, been accused of child rape, so he’s a bit safer in prison than Mr Zimmerman would be. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/martin-zimmerman-humble-opinions-and-speculation-thread/619125.md?page=202) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/martin-zimmerman-humble-opinions-and-speculation-thread/619125.md?page=204)