# Martin/Zimmerman: humble opinions and speculation thread **URL:** \ **Category:** In My Humble Opinion\ **Created:** [April 18, 2012, 4:41am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/martin-zimmerman-humble-opinions-and-speculation-thread/619125 "2012-04-18T04:41:41Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 278
**Author:** ![Magiver](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/4491bb/32.png) [@Magiver](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Magiver)\ **Post date:** [September 18, 2012, 9:14pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/martin-zimmerman-humble-opinions-and-speculation-thread/619125/5543 "2012-09-18T21:14:13Z")
> [@Honesty](#): > > I don’t know what happened. The peanut gallery espouses that Trayvon “brutally” attacked Zimmerman without cause because Trayvon is a thug, a ruffian, and a gangster. There’s no doubt he brutally attacked him. He earned the title “thug”. He didn’t paint himself a much better picture with his self titled no\_limit\_nigga internet tag or pictures of himself wearing grilz. As for the “without cause”, it seems quite clear that both form DD’s version and Zimmerman’s version that Trayvon began the confrontation. It’s speculation that he took offense to Zimmerman’s questioning his presence in the neighborhood but you and I both know that would be an insulting question. I would hazard to say that Martin was even more insulted by such a question given your view of how white people think. ---
**Author:** ![hmarvin](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/h/858c86/32.png) [@hmarvin](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/hmarvin)\ **Post date:** [September 19, 2012, 4:11pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/martin-zimmerman-humble-opinions-and-speculation-thread/619125/5544 "2012-09-19T16:11:06Z")
There were three DNA contributors found on Zimmerman’s holster, but two of the contributors were too inconclusive for identification. Essentially they can’t prove or disprove that Martin touched the holster at any time. George Zimmerman’s DNA was definite. ---
**Author:** ![johnpost](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/j/f17d59/32.png) [@johnpost](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/johnpost)\ **Post date:** [September 19, 2012, 5:05pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/martin-zimmerman-humble-opinions-and-speculation-thread/619125/5545 "2012-09-19T17:05:48Z")
no Martin DNA was found on the gun grip either. ---
**Author:** ![Honesty](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/h/f04885/32.png) [@Honesty](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Honesty)\ **Post date:** [September 19, 2012, 5:27pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/martin-zimmerman-humble-opinions-and-speculation-thread/619125/5546 "2012-09-19T17:27:07Z")
> [@johnpost](#): > > no Martin DNA was found on the gun grip either. Martin’s DNA was not found on the gun, period. It contradicts Zimmerman’s [testimony](http://www.nypost.com/p/news/national/shooter_claim_to_police_teenager_sA5nMjsWzDKkOHY8hBsMPI) that Martin attempted to grab his pistol. In the same vein, it also contradicts [brother of Zimmerman](http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2AV1W9d0IGw)who claimed that Trayvon attempted to “disarm” Zimmerman. It’s quite the paradox: how does a bare-fisted adolescent that lacks formal martial arts training “disarm” or “grab” a pistol from an adult without as much as a fingerprint or a speck of DNA-laden dust on the said weapon? Clearly, as the peanut gallery will undoubtedly point out, the only explanation is that Trayvon Martin was the living incarnation of [Jean Grey](http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Jean_Grey). - Honesty ---
**Author:** ![Bricker](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/977dab/32.png) [@Bricker](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Bricker)\ **Post date:** [September 19, 2012, 5:43pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/martin-zimmerman-humble-opinions-and-speculation-thread/619125/5547 "2012-09-19T17:43:53Z")
> [@Honesty](#): > > Martin’s DNA was not found on the gun, period. It contradicts Zimmerman’s [testimony](http://www.nypost.com/p/news/national/shooter_claim_to_police_teenager_sA5nMjsWzDKkOHY8hBsMPI) that Martin attempted to grab his pistol. In the same vein, it also contradicts [brother of Zimmerman](http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2AV1W9d0IGw)who claimed that Trayvon attempted to “disarm” Zimmerman. It’s quite the paradox: how does a bare-fisted adolescent that lacks formal martial arts training “disarm” or “grab” a pistol from an adult without as much as a fingerprint or a speck of DNA-laden dust on the said weapon? Clearly, as the peanut gallery will undoubtedly point out, the only explanation is that Trayvon Martin was the living incarnation of [Jean Grey](http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Jean_Grey). > > - Honesty Or he touched it without leaving any DNA traces, which is very possible. ---
**Author:** ![hmarvin](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/h/858c86/32.png) [@hmarvin](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/hmarvin)\ **Post date:** [September 19, 2012, 5:48pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/martin-zimmerman-humble-opinions-and-speculation-thread/619125/5548 "2012-09-19T17:48:25Z")
> [@Honesty](#): > > Martin’s DNA was not found on the gun, period. It contradicts Zimmerman’s [testimony](http://www.nypost.com/p/news/national/shooter_claim_to_police_teenager_sA5nMjsWzDKkOHY8hBsMPI) that Martin attempted to grab his pistol. In the same vein, it also contradicts [brother of Zimmerman](http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2AV1W9d0IGw)who claimed that Trayvon attempted to “disarm” Zimmerman. It’s quite the paradox: how does a bare-fisted adolescent that lacks formal martial arts training “disarm” or “grab” a pistol from an adult without as much as a fingerprint or a speck of DNA-laden dust on the said weapon? Clearly, as the peanut gallery will undoubtedly point out, the only explanation is that Trayvon Martin was the living incarnation of [Jean Grey](http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Jean_Grey). > > - Honesty This was actually a bad day for the Prosecutors. As reported in the Orlando Sentinel, not exactly pro-Zimmerman, the witness drawings appear to support Zimmerman’s version of events. I doubt the witnesses got together and compared notes. ---
**Author:** ![aceplace57](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/aceplace57/32/3500_2.png) [@aceplace57](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/aceplace57)\ **Post date:** [September 19, 2012, 6:47pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/martin-zimmerman-humble-opinions-and-speculation-thread/619125/5549 "2012-09-19T18:47:36Z")
Zimmerman never said Martin grabbed the gun. Zimmerman said he attempted to grab it. Zimmerman got it first and fired. I never expected Martin’s DNA on the gun. Zimmerman would be dead if Martin had got the gun first. ---
**Author:** ![JoelUpchurch](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/j/f05b48/32.png) [@JoelUpchurch](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/JoelUpchurch)\ **Post date:** [September 19, 2012, 9:43pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/martin-zimmerman-humble-opinions-and-speculation-thread/619125/5550 "2012-09-19T21:43:16Z")
> [@aceplace57](#): > > Zimmerman never said Martin grabbed the gun. Zimmerman said he attempted to grab it. Zimmerman got it first and fired. > > I never expected Martin’s DNA on the gun. > > Zimmerman would be dead if Martin had got the gun first. What is amazing is the number of sources that are reporting that Martin’s DNA not being on the gun like it is new information, when the DNA tests on the gun came out months ago. ---
**Author:** ![hmarvin](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/h/858c86/32.png) [@hmarvin](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/hmarvin)\ **Post date:** [September 20, 2012, 9:02pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/martin-zimmerman-humble-opinions-and-speculation-thread/619125/5551 "2012-09-20T21:02:36Z")
> [@JoelUpchurch](#): > > What is amazing is the number of sources that are reporting that Martin’s DNA not being on the gun like it is new information, when the DNA tests on the gun came out months ago. By the way, Omara wants further DNA testing in order to try and determine who the unidentified donors were on the holster, and the one on the slide of the gun. ---
**Author:** ![you\_with\_the\_face](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/y/ecccb3/32.png) [@you\_with\_the\_face](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/you_with_the_face)\ **Post date:** [September 20, 2012, 10:30pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/martin-zimmerman-humble-opinions-and-speculation-thread/619125/5552 "2012-09-20T22:30:31Z")
> [@hmarvin](#): > > By the way, Omara wants further DNA testing in order to try and determine who the unidentified donors were on the holster, and the one on the slide of the gun. Why? It’s clear that no matter what the results are, O’Mara is going to have a ready-made excuse to try to make it fit with Zimmerman’s story. So further testing is just a waste of time and money. I’m more curious about how Zimmerman’s blood wound up on the inside of Martin’s hoodie, but no drops were found on the outside. All that head banging and you mean to tell me no blood wound up splattering onto his sleeves? Yeah, real plausible. None of his blood was found under the kid’s nails either. I wish O’Mara all the luck in the world when he tries to explain both of these details away. ---
**Author:** ![emeraldia](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/c2a13f/32.png) [@emeraldia](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/emeraldia)\ **Post date:** [September 21, 2012, 3:44am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/martin-zimmerman-humble-opinions-and-speculation-thread/619125/5553 "2012-09-21T03:44:36Z")
> [@JoelUpchurch](#): > > What is amazing is the number of sources that are reporting that Martin’s DNA not being on the gun like it is new information, when the DNA tests on the gun came out months ago. Yes.. it is amazing. When you actually know a topic and then watch the media cover it, you really realize how inept and inaccurate the media really is. . ---
**Author:** ![emeraldia](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/c2a13f/32.png) [@emeraldia](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/emeraldia)\ **Post date:** [September 21, 2012, 3:49am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/martin-zimmerman-humble-opinions-and-speculation-thread/619125/5554 "2012-09-21T03:49:11Z")
> [@Honesty](#): > > Martin’s DNA was not found on the gun, period. It contradicts Zimmerman’s [testimony](http://www.nypost.com/p/news/national/shooter_claim_to_police_teenager_sA5nMjsWzDKkOHY8hBsMPI) that Martin attempted to grab his pistol. In the same vein, it also contradicts [brother of Zimmerman](http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2AV1W9d0IGw)who claimed that Trayvon attempted to “disarm” Zimmerman. It’s quite the paradox: how does a bare-fisted adolescent that lacks formal martial arts training “disarm” or “grab” a pistol from an adult without as much as a fingerprint or a speck of DNA-laden dust on the said weapon? Clearly, as the peanut gallery will undoubtedly point out, the only explanation is that Trayvon Martin was the living incarnation of [Jean Grey](http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Jean_Grey). > > - Honesty It’s old news, and does nothing but help to confirm that there never was any struggle for a gun. Which means that Zimmerman didn’t have his gun pointed at Trayvon (or there surely would have been.) And since he didn’t have his gun pointed at Trayvon, Z-haters are left with no plausible reason why Trayvon Martin would have been screaming for help. ---
**Author:** ![emeraldia](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/c2a13f/32.png) [@emeraldia](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/emeraldia)\ **Post date:** [September 21, 2012, 3:53am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/martin-zimmerman-humble-opinions-and-speculation-thread/619125/5555 "2012-09-21T03:53:55Z")
> [@Honesty](#): > > If George Zimmerman is attracted to black males, he might have propositioned Trayvon for some that ghetto, thug dick (Or as white people affectionally call it: cock). Given that Zimmerman grew up sexually assaulting his cousin, it doesn’t strike me as unreasonable that he felt he could approach a minor and demand sexual favors without repercussion. - Honesty Silly theory. By beating the hell out of Zimmerman as he screamed for help, Trayvon was propositioning Zimmerman for lead. ---
**Author:** ![you\_with\_the\_face](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/y/ecccb3/32.png) [@you\_with\_the\_face](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/you_with_the_face)\ **Post date:** [September 21, 2012, 12:13pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/martin-zimmerman-humble-opinions-and-speculation-thread/619125/5556 "2012-09-21T12:13:46Z")
> [@emeraldia](#): > > It’s old news, and does nothing but help to confirm that there never was any struggle for a gun. Which means that Zimmerman didn’t have his gun pointed at Trayvon (or there surely would have been.) And since he didn’t have his gun pointed at Trayvon, Z-haters are left with no plausible reason why Trayvon Martin would have been screaming for help. It’s not in doubt that Zimmerman pointed his gun at the kid, as he wouldn’t have been shot otherwise. ---
**Author:** ![Honesty](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/h/f04885/32.png) [@Honesty](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Honesty)\ **Post date:** [September 21, 2012, 1:44pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/martin-zimmerman-humble-opinions-and-speculation-thread/619125/5557 "2012-09-21T13:44:08Z")
> [@you\_with\_the\_face](#): > > . > > I’m more curious about how Zimmerman’s blood wound up on the inside of Martin’s hoodie, but no drops were found on the outside. All that head banging and you mean to tell me no blood wound up splattering onto his sleeves? Yeah, real plausible. None of his blood was found under the kid’s nails either. I wish O’Mara all the luck in the world when he tries to explain both of these details away. That’s interesting. Do you have a cite on that? I’ve been trying to find the actual document that prosecutors released this week but have only found second-hand sources of information. - Honesty ---
**Author:** ![Honesty](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/h/f04885/32.png) [@Honesty](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Honesty)\ **Post date:** [September 21, 2012, 1:49pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/martin-zimmerman-humble-opinions-and-speculation-thread/619125/5558 "2012-09-21T13:49:07Z")
> [@emeraldia](#): > > Silly theory. By beating the hell out of Zimmerman as he screamed for help, Trayvon was propositioning Zimmerman for lead. Serious question for you: As an adult, have you ever been attacked or been in a fist-fight with an adolescent? If so, were you beat to the point where “you feared for your life”? If not, can you imagine a scenario where you would get into a fist-fight with an adolescent and lose? - Honesty ---
**Author:** ![Honesty](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/h/f04885/32.png) [@Honesty](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Honesty)\ **Post date:** [September 21, 2012, 2:46pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/martin-zimmerman-humble-opinions-and-speculation-thread/619125/5559 "2012-09-21T14:46:44Z")
> [@Magiver](#): > > I would hazard to say that Martin was even more insulted by such a question given your view of how white people think. How does what I think have any bearing on if Trayvon Martin was insulted or not? I have never lived in Florida. This may surprise you but blacks do not belong to [the Borg](http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Borg_(Star_Trek))nor do we have a hive mind to communicate our thoughts, desires, and prejudices. Then again, given what white people consistently say about blacks here, I doubt you would think that we have any higher cognitive processes at all. - Honesty ---
**Author:** ![hmarvin](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/h/858c86/32.png) [@hmarvin](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/hmarvin)\ **Post date:** [September 21, 2012, 3:11pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/martin-zimmerman-humble-opinions-and-speculation-thread/619125/5560 "2012-09-21T15:11:47Z")
The questions I still have is why Zimmerman’s only functioning flashlight was found near the top of the T, while Zimmerman’s nonfunctioning flashlight was found beside the body, plus the fact Martin’s cellphone was found a considerable distance south of the body. Did they ever check the flashlight for Martin’s DNA? In the 911 call, you can hear heavy breathing for about about 12 seconds (in the reenactment video, ---
**Author:** ![you\_with\_the\_face](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/y/ecccb3/32.png) [@you\_with\_the\_face](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/you_with_the_face)\ **Post date:** [September 21, 2012, 3:29pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/martin-zimmerman-humble-opinions-and-speculation-thread/619125/5561 "2012-09-21T15:29:08Z")
> [@hmarvin](#): > > The questions I still have is why Zimmerman’s only functioning flashlight was found near the top of the T, while Zimmerman’s nonfunctioning flashlight was found beside the body, plus the fact Martin’s cellphone was found a considerable distance south of the body. Did they ever check the flashlight for Martin’s DNA? In the 911 call, you can hear heavy breathing for about about 12 seconds (in the reenactment video, My question is why did Zimmerman hide the fact that he had a working flashlight when he recounted his story? He acted as though he was enshrouded in darkness when he came upon Martin. ---
**Author:** ![hmarvin](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/h/858c86/32.png) [@hmarvin](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/hmarvin)\ **Post date:** [September 21, 2012, 3:30pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/martin-zimmerman-humble-opinions-and-speculation-thread/619125/5562 "2012-09-21T15:30:45Z")
> [@hmarvin](#): > > The questions I still have is why Zimmerman’s only functioning flashlight was found near the top of the T, while Zimmerman’s nonfunctioning flashlight was found beside the body, plus the fact Martin’s cellphone was found a considerable distance south of the body. Did they ever check the flashlight for Martin’s DNA? In the 911 call, you can hear heavy breathing for about about 12 seconds (in the reenactment video, than a series of banging, clicking and pauses. One could come to the logical conclusion that Zimmerman wasn’t following anyone, and was simply standing in one place, trying to get his flashlight to work for about thirty seconds. (it took about 15 seconds to walk from the police car to the T) He couldn’t plausibly have known Martin was around. (The body wasn’t that far from the T) You could constrtuct a scenario in which the incident happened at the T, moved south, Martin had picked up the larger flashlight and was pounding Zimmerman with it, which explains Zimmerman’s contention he felt like he was being hit with a brick. As far as the cellphone goes, Martin, in his haste, may simply have dropped it before reaching the T, making you wonder what DeeDee could have possibly heard. t [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/martin-zimmerman-humble-opinions-and-speculation-thread/619125.md?page=277) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/martin-zimmerman-humble-opinions-and-speculation-thread/619125.md?page=279)