# Martin/Zimmerman: humble opinions and speculation thread **URL:** \ **Category:** In My Humble Opinion\ **Created:** [April 18, 2012, 4:41am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/martin-zimmerman-humble-opinions-and-speculation-thread/619125 "2012-04-18T04:41:41Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 58
**Author:** ![Poochey](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/p/7ea924/32.png) [@Poochey](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Poochey)\ **Post date:** [April 29, 2012, 10:57pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/martin-zimmerman-humble-opinions-and-speculation-thread/619125/1141 "2012-04-29T22:57:51Z")
> [@Stoid](#): > > Using the locations on the maps you linked to, the distance between the truck and the body is 280 feet. Just FTR. that would be longer than the entire length of the development, and there’s only two townhouses between the body and vehicle, then the road turn to the vehicle. This a rather small area packed with townhouses. Martin had enough time to reach his father’s finance’s place. The question stll remains, why didn’t he? Though it’s longer than the trip to the vehicle it’s still less than a hundred feet to the father’s finance’s home, and Martin had to have had a considerable head start. ---
**Author:** ![Stoid](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/stoid/32/272_2.png) [@Stoid](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Stoid)\ **Post date:** [April 29, 2012, 11:11pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/martin-zimmerman-humble-opinions-and-speculation-thread/619125/1142 "2012-04-29T23:11:26Z")
> [@Poochey](#): > > that would be longer than the entire length of the development, and there’s only two townhouses between the body and vehicle, then the road turn to the vehicle. This a rather small area packed with townhouses. Martin had enough time to reach his father’s finance’s place. The question stll remains, why didn’t he? Though it’s longer than the trip to the vehicle it’s still less than a hundred feet to the father’s finance’s home, and Martin had to have had a considerable head start. Take it up with Google Earth. The distance from the body to the Green townhome is about 350 feet. ---
**Author:** ![PatriotX](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/p/c4cdca/32.png) [@PatriotX](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/PatriotX)\ **Post date:** [April 29, 2012, 11:27pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/martin-zimmerman-humble-opinions-and-speculation-thread/619125/1143 "2012-04-29T23:27:10Z")
> [@Poochey](#): > > that would be longer than the entire length of the development, and there’s only two townhouses between the body and vehicle, then the road turn to the vehicle. Google shows the development as about 900+ ft by 1000+ ft :shrug: > [@Poochey](#): > > This a rather small area packed with townhouses. Martin had enough time to reach his father’s finance’s place. The question stll remains, why didn’t he? I can only guess. Just like what I can do about why Zimmerman wasn’t able to make it back to his vehicle in 3.5 or 4 minutes when he is supposed to have stopped going after Martin after only ~15 seconds. If you like, I can begin speculating on what each of them was doing and why they were doing it. That could answer your question. Not sure what good it would do though. > [@Poochey](#): > > Though it’s longer than the trip to the vehicle it’s still less than a hundred feet to the father’s finance’s home… Based on the map you provided, you’re way off. That map shows M’s body as being ~300+ ft from BG’s place and ~175+ ft from M’s body to Z’s truck. > [@Poochey](#): > > … Martin had to have had a considerable head start. It would seem he did. ---
**Author:** ![PatriotX](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/p/c4cdca/32.png) [@PatriotX](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/PatriotX)\ **Post date:** [April 29, 2012, 11:31pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/martin-zimmerman-humble-opinions-and-speculation-thread/619125/1144 "2012-04-29T23:31:11Z")
> [@Poochey](#): > > [The Logistics Of Trayvon Martin and George Zimmerman's Encounter - The Last Refuge](http://theconservativetreehouse.com/2012/04/07/the-logistics-of-trayvon-martin-and-george-zimmermans-encounter/) One thing about this, Z said that he went to check a “street sign” [according to testimony at the bond hearing]. I don’t think there’s going to be a street sign where it says Z finished his call seeing as there’s not an intersection there. I also am hoping for an explanation about how he got confused about which of the three streets the neighborhood he was on. And an explanation about why he went to a different street than the one he was on to get the name off the street sign instead of the street where he was. I look forward to finally hearing from Zimmerman. ---
**Author:** ![Stoid](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/stoid/32/272_2.png) [@Stoid](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Stoid)\ **Post date:** [April 29, 2012, 11:39pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/martin-zimmerman-humble-opinions-and-speculation-thread/619125/1145 "2012-04-29T23:39:33Z")
> [@PatriotX](#): > > O > I also am hoping for an explanation about how he got confused about which of the three streets the neighborhood he was on. Especially considering that he describes his exact location to the dispatcher without any trouble at all. ---
**Author:** ![Stoid](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/stoid/32/272_2.png) [@Stoid](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Stoid)\ **Post date:** [April 29, 2012, 11:40pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/martin-zimmerman-humble-opinions-and-speculation-thread/619125/1146 "2012-04-29T23:40:47Z")
… ---
**Author:** ![JoelUpchurch](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/j/f05b48/32.png) [@JoelUpchurch](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/JoelUpchurch)\ **Post date:** [April 30, 2012, 12:41am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/martin-zimmerman-humble-opinions-and-speculation-thread/619125/1147 "2012-04-30T00:41:28Z")
> [@Fear\_Itself](#): > > Better yet, secrete it on a vehicle heading away from the airport, like a long distance semi. As soon as you open the bracelet, they are going to know you are not wearing it. You best bet is to open it somewhere where they don’t get your last location. ---
**Author:** ![JoelUpchurch](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/j/f05b48/32.png) [@JoelUpchurch](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/JoelUpchurch)\ **Post date:** [April 30, 2012, 12:55am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/martin-zimmerman-humble-opinions-and-speculation-thread/619125/1148 "2012-04-30T00:55:16Z")
> [@Stoid](#): > > Take it up with Google Earth. The distance from the body to the Green townhome is about 350 feet. 210 feet. Gilbreath said that fight happened 70 yards from Green’s townhouse. They probably didn’t measured it with a laser, but I doubt would it be more than 250 feet. I’m talking from her back door. The front door would be further. ---
**Author:** ![JoelUpchurch](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/j/f05b48/32.png) [@JoelUpchurch](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/JoelUpchurch)\ **Post date:** [April 30, 2012, 1:13am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/martin-zimmerman-humble-opinions-and-speculation-thread/619125/1149 "2012-04-30T01:13:45Z")
> [@Poochey](#): > > that would be longer than the entire length of the development, and there’s only two townhouses between the body and vehicle, then the road turn to the vehicle. This a rather small area packed with townhouses. Martin had enough time to reach his father’s finance’s place. The question stll remains, why didn’t he? Though it’s longer than the trip to the vehicle it’s still less than a hundred feet to the father’s finance’s home, and Martin had to have had a considerable head start. You scale seems to be off. You can measure the distances in Google Earth. Gilbreath said in court that Martin was 70 yards from Green’s house. It is a legitimate question to ask why he didn’t keep going. I think he was hiding from Zimmerman or getting out the rain. If he was wearing the gray hoodie I saw him pictured with, it was about the worst thing you could wear in the rain. It was a sweatsuit material that soaks up water instead of shedding it. ---
**Author:** ![Stoid](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/stoid/32/272_2.png) [@Stoid](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Stoid)\ **Post date:** [April 30, 2012, 1:55am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/martin-zimmerman-humble-opinions-and-speculation-thread/619125/1150 "2012-04-30T01:55:00Z")
> [@JoelUpchurch](#): > > YIt is a legitimate question to ask why he didn’t keep going. [ul] [li]1. Hiding from zimmerman, as you said[/li][li]2. Gettng out of the rain (as you said) WHILE he talked to his girlfriend[/li][li]3. Perhaps was a little turned around himself, this wasn’t his home and if we are supposed to swallow that Zimmerman, at a stop or a crawl, covering a single block of his home neighborhood where he’d lived for 3 years, could be confused as to his whereabouts and have no choice but to exit his car to look at a non-existent street sign to know where he was- after describing where he was perfectly to the dispatcher(!)- I think it’s easy to believe that Trayvon, running away from some creep following him, scared, in the rain, got a little mixed up about where he was.[/li][li]4. Deliberately avoiding going back to his apartment because the creepy guy was following him, not wanting to lead him back there. [/li][li]5. Overshot the direct path to the townhome and retraced his steps to get back.[/li][/ul] ---
**Author:** ![Stoid](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/stoid/32/272_2.png) [@Stoid](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Stoid)\ **Post date:** [April 30, 2012, 2:05am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/martin-zimmerman-humble-opinions-and-speculation-thread/619125/1151 "2012-04-30T02:05:59Z")
> [@JoelUpchurch](#): > > 210 feet. Gilbreath said that fight happened 70 yards from Green’s townhouse. They probably didn’t measured it with a laser, but I doubt would it be more than 250 feet. > > I’m talking from her back door. The front door would be further. Like I said, [take it up with google earth](http://stoid.org/mocktrial/distance.jpg). ---
**Author:** ![Terr](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/839c29/32.png) [@Terr](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Terr)\ **Post date:** [April 30, 2012, 2:18am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/martin-zimmerman-humble-opinions-and-speculation-thread/619125/1152 "2012-04-30T02:18:44Z")
> **[Unstable ground: The fine line between self-defense and murder | CNN](https://www.cnn.com/2012/04/29/us/stand-your-ground/index.html?hpt=hp_c2)** > > Four cases from around the nation raise questions about the Stand Your Ground law. by the way, just for those who keep claiming that if the races were reversed, an immediate arrest would have been made - in one of those cases described (the drive-through shooting), the shooter is black, the dead man is white, and no arrest has been made. ---
**Author:** ![Hbns](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/h/8edcca/32.png) [@Hbns](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Hbns)\ **Post date:** [April 30, 2012, 2:28am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/martin-zimmerman-humble-opinions-and-speculation-thread/619125/1153 "2012-04-30T02:28:28Z")
> [@Stoid](#): > > Especially considering that he describes his exact location to the dispatcher without any trouble at all. That isn’t so hard. I know that exactly 2 blocks up and 1 block over in my neighborhood there is a corner playground. It is on the corner of 7th and ??? Hell if I know what that street name is after 8 years living here. Yet I can describe that exact location. ---
**Author:** ![Bricker](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/977dab/32.png) [@Bricker](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Bricker)\ **Post date:** [April 30, 2012, 2:41am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/martin-zimmerman-humble-opinions-and-speculation-thread/619125/1154 "2012-04-30T02:41:33Z")
> [@Stoid](#): > > Especially considering that he describes his exact location to the dispatcher without any trouble at all. But not by referring to street names. ---
**Author:** ![JoelUpchurch](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/j/f05b48/32.png) [@JoelUpchurch](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/JoelUpchurch)\ **Post date:** [April 30, 2012, 10:10am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/martin-zimmerman-humble-opinions-and-speculation-thread/619125/1155 "2012-04-30T10:10:56Z")
> [@Stoid](#): > > Like I said, [take it up with google earth](http://stoid.org/mocktrial/distance.jpg). Since you have the wrong location for the body and Green’s townhome, it is hardly surprising that you have the wrong distance. ---
**Author:** ![DragonAsh](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/db5fbb/32.png) [@DragonAsh](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/DragonAsh)\ **Post date:** [April 30, 2012, 11:36am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/martin-zimmerman-humble-opinions-and-speculation-thread/619125/1156 "2012-04-30T11:36:23Z")
Apologies if it’s been covered already - I’m only part way through the 20-odd pages of this thread, but I’m wondering about the pictures reported to be of Zimmerman’s head taken just ‘minutes after the shooting’ by a neighbor. So many things seem really weird. Firstly, am I the only one bothered by the idea that a random neighbor, just minutes after a homicide, with police officers present, was allowed to wander the crime scene taking pictures and doing og knows what else? And if police officers -weren’t- on the scene…why is the neighbor taking pictures of GZ’s head and not trying to see if the guy lying face down a few feet away is, you know, breathing or not? Secondly, how in the hell does the neighbor even take that picture of Zimmerman’s head from angle? Is the neighbor actually Manute Bol? Did he ask Zimmerman to kneel down? Odd that, suddenly finding himself in the middle of a gun shot homicide crime scene, the first thing he’d photograph is…the back of the potential suspect’s head. Surely the lifeless body a few feet away was the most important feature of the entire area. And I can’t believe this random neighbor would be standing there with a cell phone asking the suspect to kneel down to take some pictures…all with police officers there. What was he taking pictures with? The reports I’ve seen say that the picture was taken with an iPhone 4S. My (admittedly not very scientific) experiment with my iPhone 4 outside in my yard last night suggested that taking a picture from slightly above my 2yr old son’s head didn’t highlight the grass below very well - but in the picture the grass seems pretty well exposed given that it was a dark and rainy night (with apologies to Snoopy). Make of that what you will. Slightly more importantly - I don’t see any sign of the black stripe across the back of GZ’s jacket - the stripe is very visible in the video from the station 30 minutes or so after the shooting. Could just be the crop of the photograph, but just eyeballing it, it sure looks like the stripe should be at least partially visible. ---
**Author:** ![JoelUpchurch](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/j/f05b48/32.png) [@JoelUpchurch](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/JoelUpchurch)\ **Post date:** [April 30, 2012, 12:06pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/martin-zimmerman-humble-opinions-and-speculation-thread/619125/1157 "2012-04-30T12:06:54Z")
[http://gzlegalcase.com/index.php/8-press-releases/8-questions-regarding-discovery-deadline-in-george-zimmerman-case](http://gzlegalcase.com/index.php/8-press-releases/8-questions-regarding-discovery-deadline-in-george-zimmerman-case) > [@](#): > > While the media and the public have an absolute right to know about this case, that right has to be balanced with the rights of these witnesses. They are doing their civic duty in testifying in this case. We doubt any of them enjoy the scrutiny they are under due to the coincidence of their involvement in such a high profile matter. We are delaying demanding the discovery until we can file motions to protect these witnesses. Once that is in place, discovery will flow to us, then the media and the public has access to it, under our rules. > > Ms. Corey in not violating any rule or statute, as it is our decision, not hers, to wait until proper motions regarding the witnesses have been drafted and filed. I suspect this means we aren’t seeing any evidence until after another hearing. I still don’t have a problem with redacting the names and addresses of the witnesses from the published statements. ---
**Author:** ![Stoid](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/stoid/32/272_2.png) [@Stoid](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Stoid)\ **Post date:** [April 30, 2012, 12:44pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/martin-zimmerman-humble-opinions-and-speculation-thread/619125/1158 "2012-04-30T12:44:01Z")
> [@DragonAsh](#): > > Apologies if it’s been covered already - I’m only part way through the 20-odd pages of this thread, but I’m wondering about the pictures reported to be of Zimmerman’s head taken just ‘minutes after the shooting’ by a neighbor. So many things seem really weird. I feel you completely. That picture seems really off to me on about 9 levels. But I didn’t even want to go there… ---
**Author:** ![you\_with\_the\_face](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/y/ecccb3/32.png) [@you\_with\_the\_face](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/you_with_the_face)\ **Post date:** [April 30, 2012, 1:32pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/martin-zimmerman-humble-opinions-and-speculation-thread/619125/1159 "2012-04-30T13:32:03Z")
> [@DragonAsh](#): > > Firstly, am I the only one bothered by the idea that a random neighbor, just minutes after a homicide, with police officers present, was allowed to wander the crime scene taking pictures and doing og knows what else? That seems weird to me too. But given other signs of incompetence shown by the Sanford PD, I wouldn’t put it pass them to not adequately secure the scene. ---
**Author:** ![PatriotX](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/p/c4cdca/32.png) [@PatriotX](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/PatriotX)\ **Post date:** [April 30, 2012, 1:36pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/martin-zimmerman-humble-opinions-and-speculation-thread/619125/1160 "2012-04-30T13:36:13Z")
> [@Hbns](#): > > That isn’t so hard. I know that exactly 2 blocks up and 1 block over in my neighborhood there is a corner playground. > It is on the corner of 7th and ??? > Hell if I know what that street name is after 8 years living here. Yet I can describe that exact location. Where Z is said to have walked is the same street as the one on which he lives. There’s not an intersection at that location, hence no street sign. Further, that street is not the street where Z’s truck was parked in that diagram. The story we’re getting is coming across as, “Z walked from the street where his truck was to a different street–his own street–to find a street sign [where there was not a intersection], so that he could tell the PD information about how to meet Z at his truck which was parked somewhere else.” As the above makes no sense to me, I look forward to a more complete accounting of Z’s version of events. I am curious about the encounter between Z and M which involves Z still being in his vehicle and rolling the window up. Is that actually in Z’s account? Or merely in the version of one of his proxies? [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/martin-zimmerman-humble-opinions-and-speculation-thread/619125.md?page=57) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/martin-zimmerman-humble-opinions-and-speculation-thread/619125.md?page=59)