# Martin/Zimmerman: humble opinions and speculation thread **URL:** \ **Category:** In My Humble Opinion\ **Created:** [April 18, 2012, 4:41am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/martin-zimmerman-humble-opinions-and-speculation-thread/619125 "2012-04-18T04:41:41Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 608
**Author:** ![Bricker](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/977dab/32.png) [@Bricker](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Bricker)\ **Post date:** [July 10, 2013, 3:57pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/martin-zimmerman-humble-opinions-and-speculation-thread/619125/12144 "2013-07-10T15:57:07Z")
> [@Magiver](#): > > It’s also reasonable inference to say it was Zimmerman because it was heard faintly. This backed up by the evidence of who was clearly assaulted and who wasn’t. Now it’s possible that Martin was assaulted but all the other evidence shows Zimmerman stayed in the upper part of the T and Martin moved from his house to this area which suggests Zimmerman avoided conflict and Martin sought it out. Yes, that’s also a permissible inference, especially because Jeantel, under cross-examination, conceded she wasn’t sure. But my point is: you can’t say there’s NO evidence. ---
**Author:** ![Condescending\_Robot](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/a183cd/32.png) [@Condescending\_Robot](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Condescending_Robot)\ **Post date:** [July 10, 2013, 3:57pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/martin-zimmerman-humble-opinions-and-speculation-thread/619125/12145 "2013-07-10T15:57:34Z")
Amazing how many Team Zimmerman members don’t know what streets are in their neighborhood. Do they all patrol them regularly too? And of course, “he can’t be lying because that would mean he’s lying.” Amazing. ---
**Author:** ![Tollhouse](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/e99b99/32.png) [@Tollhouse](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Tollhouse)\ **Post date:** [July 10, 2013, 3:57pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/martin-zimmerman-humble-opinions-and-speculation-thread/619125/12146 "2013-07-10T15:57:57Z")
> [@Hbns](#): > > You must have been in some high school full of precocious students to have gotten that talk then. They came around in Grammar school to preach stranger danger in my neck of the woods. By 17 there weren’t many male students that would have feared someone matching Zimmerman’s description. > > Or you are just pulling more “facts” out of your ass. Your post is irrelevant. Of course in grammar school we had a age appropriate assembly on it, when i was in tenth grade we had a more specific or graphic talk by a deputy. you make it sound as if this is something that doesnt apply to teenage kids, you are either ill informed, or trying to downplay or minimize the reality of molestation child abductions that do happen to older kids. ---
**Author:** ![Bricker](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/977dab/32.png) [@Bricker](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Bricker)\ **Post date:** [July 10, 2013, 4:01pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/martin-zimmerman-humble-opinions-and-speculation-thread/619125/12147 "2013-07-10T16:01:14Z")
> [@Condescending\_Robot](#): > > No. > > Remember “reasonable” doubt and what the “reasonable” fear of great bodily harm is? “Reasonable” is a very important concept in evidence. > > It is not reasonable to believe that a man who lives in a neighborhood with three streets AND regularly drives around those streets on self-appointed patrol had any confusion whatsoever about what street he was on. Applying reasonable standards of likelihood, common sense, and human functioning to people’s claims is exactly what the jury is supposed to be doing. It’s not only allowable, but incumbent, upon that jury to conclude that Zimmerman being honest about his reason for exiting the car is, by any reasonable standard, a lie. No. And multiple posters here have said that they don’t know all the cross streets in their neighborhood. I myself didn’t know the name of the closest cross-street to my house when challenged IRL by someone to name it. So many people here have given you personal assurances that they also don’t know this kind of fact that I don’t understand why you keep repeating your claim. I don’t agree at all with your idea that it’s incumbent on the jury to conclude that’s a Zimmerman lie. ---
**Author:** ![Tollhouse](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/e99b99/32.png) [@Tollhouse](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Tollhouse)\ **Post date:** [July 10, 2013, 4:01pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/martin-zimmerman-humble-opinions-and-speculation-thread/619125/12148 "2013-07-10T16:01:27Z")
> [@Human\_Action](#): > > So, when Zimmerman was unable to tell the NEN dispatcher what address he was parked at, that was a…? (cough, cough, gag)…a LIE ? ---
**Author:** ![Bricker](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/977dab/32.png) [@Bricker](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Bricker)\ **Post date:** [July 10, 2013, 4:02pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/martin-zimmerman-humble-opinions-and-speculation-thread/619125/12149 "2013-07-10T16:02:21Z")
> [@Tollhouse](#): > > Your post is irrelevant. Of course in grammar school we had a age appropriate assembly on it, when i was in tenth grade we had a more specific or graphic talk by a deputy. you make it sound as if this is something that doesnt apply to teenage kids, you are either ill informed, or trying to downplay or minimize the reality of molestation child abductions that do happen to older kids. What channel was the deputy on? Was it the same one as the other show you watched? > [@Tollhouse](#): > > (cough, cough, gag)…a LIE ? You tell me. ---
**Author:** ![Tollhouse](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/e99b99/32.png) [@Tollhouse](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Tollhouse)\ **Post date:** [July 10, 2013, 4:05pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/martin-zimmerman-humble-opinions-and-speculation-thread/619125/12150 "2013-07-10T16:05:54Z")
Bricker, your the genius…you tell me ---
**Author:** ![Bricker](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/977dab/32.png) [@Bricker](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Bricker)\ **Post date:** [July 10, 2013, 4:07pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/martin-zimmerman-humble-opinions-and-speculation-thread/619125/12151 "2013-07-10T16:07:19Z")
> [@Tollhouse](#): > > Bricker, your the genius…you tell me Ok. The deputy was on the same channel as the other guy, and it’s a channel you watch quite frequently when you need facts to buttress your claims here. ---
**Author:** ![Tollhouse](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/e99b99/32.png) [@Tollhouse](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Tollhouse)\ **Post date:** [July 10, 2013, 4:15pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/martin-zimmerman-humble-opinions-and-speculation-thread/619125/12152 "2013-07-10T16:15:39Z")
Bricker, I dont know how old you are, if you ever went to school , or if it was in the last half a century, but in todays society, there is something called child abductions, the most dangerous situation that kids are warned to avoid or be aware of is when a stranger is following them or approaches them in a car. This is something that can and does happen to kids even high school age kids. When the deputy talked to us at my school it was emphasized to us the reason the car scenario is so dangerous, is because of the obvious potential to be pulled inside and taken to a second location and that is always a situation that ends badly. Your attempt to mock this makes it clear you just really really dont want the whole picture to be considered, because thats not helpful to your cause ---
**Author:** ![Human\_Action](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/h/ac91a4/32.png) [@Human\_Action](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Human_Action)\ **Post date:** [July 10, 2013, 4:18pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/martin-zimmerman-humble-opinions-and-speculation-thread/619125/12153 "2013-07-10T16:18:33Z")
> [@Tollhouse](#): > > (cough, cough, gag)…a LIE ? Ok, same questions I put to **Condescending Robot** : To what end? Are you proposing that Zimmerman was setting up a cover story several minutes before the confrontation and shooting occured? And undermining the cover story by telling the dispatcher he was following Martin? ---
**Author:** ![Human\_Action](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/h/ac91a4/32.png) [@Human\_Action](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Human_Action)\ **Post date:** [July 10, 2013, 4:19pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/martin-zimmerman-humble-opinions-and-speculation-thread/619125/12154 "2013-07-10T16:19:40Z")
> [@Condescending\_Robot](#): > > Amazing how many Team Zimmerman members don’t know what streets are in their neighborhood. Do they all patrol them regularly too? And of course, “he can’t be lying because that would mean he’s lying.” Amazing. So, is it your theory that Zimmerman was setting up a cover story for an event that hadn’t happened yet, or what? ---
**Author:** ![Tollhouse](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/e99b99/32.png) [@Tollhouse](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Tollhouse)\ **Post date:** [July 10, 2013, 4:22pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/martin-zimmerman-humble-opinions-and-speculation-thread/619125/12155 "2013-07-10T16:22:11Z")
> [@Bricker](#): > > Ok. The deputy was on the same channel as the other guy, and it’s a channel you watch quite frequently when you need facts to buttress your claims here. Are you saying that high schools do not have child safety assemblies on the issue of child molestation, abduction? make fun all you want of the fact I simply was honest in saying I couldnt remember the name of a news show I saw in regards to a different event…have at it, make fun of it all you want…apparently you have never forgotten or been able to recall the name of a program you saw, and you compulsively write notes on everything you see, hear. I was honest in the fact i simply couldnt recall the name of the show. This has not a damm thing to do with the reality of child abduction/ molestation. Your attempt to reinvent reality of this very real issue is just an attempt to sweep away this piece of the puzzle, because it doesnt help your cause ---
**Author:** ![Magiver](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/4491bb/32.png) [@Magiver](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Magiver)\ **Post date:** [July 10, 2013, 4:25pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/martin-zimmerman-humble-opinions-and-speculation-thread/619125/12156 "2013-07-10T16:25:52Z")
> [@Bricker](#): > > Yes, that’s also a permissible inference, especially because Jeantel, under cross-examination, conceded she wasn’t sure. > > But my point is: you can’t say there’s NO evidence. Well yes I agree but I’m just pointing out the nature of evidence. It’s far from conclusive. " I think I sorta heard something" is different testimony than loudly hearing “get off me you crazy ass cracker” (having just called him that earlier which lends more credence that it’s Martin). So far, the only thing remotely suggesting Zimmerman attacked Martin is that one bit of weak testimony. ---
**Author:** ![Magiver](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/4491bb/32.png) [@Magiver](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Magiver)\ **Post date:** [July 10, 2013, 4:29pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/martin-zimmerman-humble-opinions-and-speculation-thread/619125/12157 "2013-07-10T16:29:30Z")
> [@Tollhouse](#): > > Bricker, I dont know how old you are, if you ever went to school , or if it was in the last half a century, but in todays society, there is something called child abductions, the most dangerous situation that kids are warned to avoid or be aware of is when a stranger is following them or approaches them in a car. This is something that can and does happen to kids even high school age kids. When the deputy talked to us at my school it was emphasized to us the reason the car scenario is so dangerous, is because of the obvious potential to be pulled inside and taken to a second location and that is always a situation that ends badly. Your attempt to mock this makes it clear you just really really dont want the whole picture to be considered, because thats not helpful to your cause I’m not sure where you’re going with this but do these instructions include not calling the police, leaving the safety of your house and attacking the stalker? ---
**Author:** ![Tollhouse](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/e99b99/32.png) [@Tollhouse](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Tollhouse)\ **Post date:** [July 10, 2013, 4:33pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/martin-zimmerman-humble-opinions-and-speculation-thread/619125/12158 "2013-07-10T16:33:53Z")
> [@Magiver](#): > > I’m sorry but this is factually incorrect. I do not know the names of the streets around me and I’ve lived in the same house for 20 years.. You have lived in the same house for twenty hears and you dont know the name of even a couple streets right next to you? ;). That is wow, that is really a bit unusual And you make fun of ME for not remembering the name of a news show I happened to see? ---
**Author:** ![Human\_Action](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/h/ac91a4/32.png) [@Human\_Action](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Human_Action)\ **Post date:** [July 10, 2013, 4:41pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/martin-zimmerman-humble-opinions-and-speculation-thread/619125/12159 "2013-07-10T16:41:02Z")
> [@Tollhouse](#): > > You have lived in the same house for twenty hears and you dont know the name of even a couple streets right next to you? ;). That is wow, that is really a bit unusual > > And you make fun of ME for not remembering the name of a news show I happened to see? I just moved out of house where I lived for six years, and I can name one of the streets in the neighborhood: the one where my house was, which was also the one that connected the neighborhood to the street that the neighborhood was bounded by. I can name three streets of my new neighborhood, out of about eight: the ones I have to take to reach the house. It’s not as unusual as you might think. ---
**Author:** ![Shodan](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/9f8e36/32.png) [@Shodan](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Shodan)\ **Post date:** [July 10, 2013, 4:47pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/martin-zimmerman-humble-opinions-and-speculation-thread/619125/12160 "2013-07-10T16:47:53Z")
[QUOTE=Bricker] Yes, that’s also a permissible inference, especially because Jeantel, under cross-examination, conceded she wasn’t sure. But my point is: you can’t say there’s NO evidence. [/QUOTE] Correction accepted - there’s no _good_ evidence in its favor, and some against it. Regards, Shodan ---
**Author:** ![Tollhouse](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/e99b99/32.png) [@Tollhouse](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Tollhouse)\ **Post date:** [July 10, 2013, 4:48pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/martin-zimmerman-humble-opinions-and-speculation-thread/619125/12161 "2013-07-10T16:48:03Z")
> [@Human\_Action](#): > > I just moved out of house where I lived for six years, and I can name one of the streets in the neighborhood: the one where my house was, which was also the one that connected the neighborhood to the street that the neighborhood was bounded by. > > I can name three streets of my new neighborhood, out of about eight: the ones I have to take to reach the house. > > It’s not as unusual as you might think. . well, im not sure about normal average people, but at least not for people on team zimmerman…;). must be a phenomenom specific for TEAM ZIMMERMAN “Go team Zimmerman!” ---
**Author:** ![Human\_Action](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/h/ac91a4/32.png) [@Human\_Action](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Human_Action)\ **Post date:** [July 10, 2013, 4:51pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/martin-zimmerman-humble-opinions-and-speculation-thread/619125/12162 "2013-07-10T16:51:19Z")
> [@Tollhouse](#): > > . > well, im not sure about normal average people, but at least not for people on team zimmerman…;). must be a phenomenom specific for TEAM ZIMMERMAN > > “Go team Zimmerman!” Treating this as a team sport is childish. Any interest in explaining why Zimmerman would lie to the dispatcher about knowing the address where he parked? ---
**Author:** ![Shodan](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/9f8e36/32.png) [@Shodan](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Shodan)\ **Post date:** [July 10, 2013, 4:55pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/martin-zimmerman-humble-opinions-and-speculation-thread/619125/12163 "2013-07-10T16:55:03Z")
> [@Human\_Action](#): > > Any interest in explaining why Zimmerman would lie to the dispatcher about knowing the address where he parked? Because he is a racist. Duh. Regards, Shodan [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/martin-zimmerman-humble-opinions-and-speculation-thread/619125.md?page=607) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/martin-zimmerman-humble-opinions-and-speculation-thread/619125.md?page=609)