# Masons and The New World Order **URL:** \ **Category:** Great Debates\ **Created:** [March 11, 2002, 2:17pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/masons-and-the-new-world-order/97571 "2002-03-11T14:17:50Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 1
**Author:** ![Sweet\_Willy](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/e95f7d/32.png) [@Sweet\_Willy](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Sweet_Willy)\ **Post date:** [March 11, 2002, 2:17pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/masons-and-the-new-world-order/97571/1 "2002-03-11T14:17:50Z")
So what’s up with the Masonic lodge? We have thier symbols and phrases on U.S. currency, what seems to be an inordinate number of them in high places around the world and a new conspiracy theory; Bin Laden and Sadam Hussien are Masons. Is it possible that GW and Bush sr. have let them slip away in favor of Masonic brotherhood? ---
**Author:** ![minty\_green](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/f6c823/32.png) [@minty\_green](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/minty_green)\ **Post date:** [March 11, 2002, 2:35pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/masons-and-the-new-world-order/97571/2 "2002-03-11T14:35:23Z")
Hey there, Willie! Good to see you followed us home from the temp board. Naturally, the Master has already given us his take on the Masons [here](http://www.straightdope.com/classics/a4_138.html). Cecil has also answered your inquiry about [the dollar bill](http://www.straightdope.com/classics/a5_022.html). Also not to be missed on the subject of secret organizations are [the Illuminati](http://www.straightdope.com/classics/a1_043.html) and [the Trilateral Commission](http://www.straightdope.com/classics/a2_295.html). It’s often a good idea to run a search on the archives of Cecil’s columns and the Staff Reports, which you can do by clicking on the “Search Archives” link on the Straight Dope front page (not the SDMB). Even if you don’t find what you’re looking for, you’ll find plenty of interesting and frequently hilarious reading. Better yet, buy Cecil’s books, without which no reference library is complete. And if you’re asking a General Question on the Board, it’s best to at least do a keyword/thread title search through the GQ archives, which are mind-bogglingly vast. Happy reading, and welcome aboard! ---
**Author:** ![Sweet\_Willy](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/e95f7d/32.png) [@Sweet\_Willy](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Sweet_Willy)\ **Post date:** [March 11, 2002, 2:40pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/masons-and-the-new-world-order/97571/3 "2002-03-11T14:40:03Z")
Thanks **Minty**. I’ll remember to search first. I like your new digs!!! ---
**Author:** ![Menocchio](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/9de053/32.png) [@Menocchio](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Menocchio)\ **Post date:** [March 12, 2002, 1:32am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/masons-and-the-new-world-order/97571/4 "2002-03-12T01:32:36Z")
Because Mason lodges are so private, they have been used as staging areas by would-be revolutionaries from time to time. One example in middle-eastern history would be the attempt of Muhammad Abduh al-Afghani to overthrow the Egyptian khedive, planning their revolution from the safety of lodges (the Brits beat him to teh punch and booted him out of the country). So small conspiracies have used the Masons, but I doubt that the Masons as a whole have any scary goals. They’ve bveen around a long time, and would have secured power before now if they were any threat. More friegtening is the tendancy of some world powers to use the assumption of a Masonic (and Jewish, more often than not) conspiracy to make major policy decisions, as the British did regarding the Ottoman Empire (and Palestine, to a lesser extent), during the latter years of the 19th century. ---
**Author:** ![Guinastasia](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/guinastasia/32/5751_2.png) [@Guinastasia](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Guinastasia)\ **Post date:** [March 12, 2002, 3:17am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/masons-and-the-new-world-order/97571/5 "2002-03-12T03:17:03Z")
Anymore, aren’t the Masons more of a social club, with charity benefits and the like? ---
**Author:** ![Sweet\_Willy](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/e95f7d/32.png) [@Sweet\_Willy](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Sweet_Willy)\ **Post date:** [March 12, 2002, 4:28am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/masons-and-the-new-world-order/97571/6 "2002-03-12T04:28:07Z")
> [@](#): > > :Anymore, aren’t the Masons more of a social club, with charity benefits and the like? Quite a bit more to it than that. I am not sure about the national and international impact, that is why I posted this. I do know, however, that there is a great deal of questionable behavior going on amoungst the masons. I have seen my dad dispose of citations with a handshake. I have seen him avoid citations with by the same. (LOTS of the highway patrol are masons). Then there is the Sheriff (mason) looks the other way concerning the gambling house run by, you guessed it, a mason. Then there was the state DOT bid rigging scandal. It is no secret to most familiar with them that they do “favors” for each other. There is considerable charity work done too. Aside from the petty corruption on local levels though, I wonder how much serious corruption is going on. Historically they have been involved in everything from revolutions to assasinations all over the world. ---
**Author:** ![reprise](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/ea666f/32.png) [@reprise](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/reprise)\ **Post date:** [March 12, 2002, 4:46am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/masons-and-the-new-world-order/97571/7 "2002-03-12T04:46:44Z")
Welcome aboard **Willy**. One thing you’ll find helpful around here is providing references to make up your assertions. There’s a huge difference between Masons (or any other organisation) giving each other preferencial treatment in business and attributing wide-ranging conspiracies such as assassinations and revolutions to the Order. It’s very easy to presume that because a Mason has been involved in some illegal activity his criminality can be attributed to the Masons as a group. But assumptions aren’t facts - facts require some verifiable proof. 🙂 ---
**Author:** ![Sweet\_Willy](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/e95f7d/32.png) [@Sweet\_Willy](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Sweet_Willy)\ **Post date:** [March 12, 2002, 4:43pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/masons-and-the-new-world-order/97571/8 "2002-03-12T16:43:58Z")
Thank you Reprise, Here is one of the articles I found interesting. There are a couple more I will have to look up and post later but take a look at this and see what you think. [http://www.ncoic.com/p2masons.htm](http://www.ncoic.com/p2masons.htm)? ---
**Author:** ![RickJay](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/bb73d2/32.png) [@RickJay](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/RickJay)\ **Post date:** [March 12, 2002, 5:52pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/masons-and-the-new-world-order/97571/9 "2002-03-12T17:52:21Z")
> [@](#): > > \*Originally posted by Sweet Willy \* > **Quite a bit more to it than that. I am not sure about the national and international impact, that is why I posted this. I do know, however, that there is a great deal of questionable behavior going on amoungst the masons. I have seen my dad dispose of citations with a handshake. I have seen him avoid citations with by the same. (LOTS of the highway patrol are masons).** Willy, unless you can provide objective evidence of this, I believe it’s complete malarky. ---
**Author:** ![Sweet\_Willy](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/e95f7d/32.png) [@Sweet\_Willy](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Sweet_Willy)\ **Post date:** [March 12, 2002, 6:39pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/masons-and-the-new-world-order/97571/10 "2002-03-12T18:39:10Z")
**RickJay** , Objective evedence is hard to come by in the case of secret societies. That is the thing about secrets, they are secret. There is an incredibly long list of U.S. presidents and Supreme Court justices that were masons and those are just the ones that admit to it. In the UK they have tried to mandate disclosure of membership because of the level of corruption amoungst masons in the Judicial system. Here is the thing. If I am a mason and the highway patrolman that stops me for speeding is a mason and I get off without a ticket because of that, where is the objective evidence? The lack of objective evidence doesn’t change the reality of the situation. If it sounds like malarky to you then it sounds like malarky. Just one question. Are you a mason and would you tell me if you were? ---
**Author:** ![Sweet\_Willy](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/e95f7d/32.png) [@Sweet\_Willy](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Sweet_Willy)\ **Post date:** [March 12, 2002, 6:57pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/masons-and-the-new-world-order/97571/11 "2002-03-12T18:57:42Z")
Here is a BBC article that illustates the potential and suspected corruption. [http://news6.thdo.bbc.co.uk/low/english/uk/newsid\_57000/57463.stm](http://news6.thdo.bbc.co.uk/low/english/uk/newsid_57000/57463.stm) ---
**Author:** ![CaptMurdock](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/captmurdock/32/11736_2.png) [@CaptMurdock](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/CaptMurdock)\ **Post date:** [March 12, 2002, 6:58pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/masons-and-the-new-world-order/97571/12 "2002-03-12T18:58:17Z")
> [@](#): > > \*Originally posted by Sweet Willy \* > Just one question. Are you a mason and would you tell me if you were? \*\* Actually, that’s two questions. But never mind that now… If the Masons, the Illuminati, the Trilaterals and the Council on Foreign Relations are planning on taking over the world, I wish they’d fecking hurry up and get the job done! \*Naturally, it’s because then they would have to come out of the shadows and stand in the light of day, and then they would be ripe for quick assassination and the world will be ready for domination by \*_my]/b] secret masters…the Toaster Ovens._ ---
**Author:** ![Johanna](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/johanna/32/8318_2.png) [@Johanna](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Johanna)\ **Post date:** [March 12, 2002, 7:05pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/masons-and-the-new-world-order/97571/13 "2002-03-12T19:05:19Z")
> [@](#): > > \*Originally posted by Menocchio \* > \*\*One example in middle-eastern history would be the attempt of Muhammad Abduh al-Afghani to overthrow the Egyptian khedive, planning their revolution from the safety of lodges (the Brits beat him to teh punch and booted him out of the country). \*\* You seem to have gotten Muhammad ‘Abduh confused with Jamal al-Din al-Afghani. They were pals. ---
**Author:** ![Sweet\_Willy](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/e95f7d/32.png) [@Sweet\_Willy](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Sweet_Willy)\ **Post date:** [March 12, 2002, 7:16pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/masons-and-the-new-world-order/97571/14 "2002-03-12T19:16:09Z")
> [@](#): > > Are you a mason and would you tell me if you were? **CaptMurdock** , The quote above is structured in grammar as a single interogative. Hence, one question. :rolleyes: ---
**Author:** ![Menocchio](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/9de053/32.png) [@Menocchio](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Menocchio)\ **Post date:** [March 12, 2002, 9:53pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/masons-and-the-new-world-order/97571/15 "2002-03-12T21:53:26Z")
> [@](#): > > \*Originally posted by Jomo Mojo \* > \*\*You seem to have gotten Muhammad ‘Abduh confused with Jamal al-Din al-Afghani. They were pals. \*\* That I did. I had them listed next to one another in my notebook, so I thought it was one long name. My bad. ---
**Author:** ![CaptMurdock](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/captmurdock/32/11736_2.png) [@CaptMurdock](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/CaptMurdock)\ **Post date:** [March 12, 2002, 10:43pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/masons-and-the-new-world-order/97571/16 "2002-03-12T22:43:06Z")
> [@](#): > > \*Originally posted by Sweet Willy \* > \*\* > **CaptMurdock** , > > The quote above is structured in grammar as a single interogative. Hence, one question. :rolleyes: \*\* To quote Frederick Frankenstein, “Don’t gimme dat!” It requires **two** answers; one, if the depondent is in fact a Mason, and two, if the depondent would tell you he is a Mason if in fact he were a Mason. Of course, if the answer to the second question is “No,” that pretty much renders the answer to the first question meaningless, as an negative answer would be immediately shown to be suspect in its validity, and an affirmative answer would likewise have no credibility. But the falsifiability of either question is not the point. If there are two answers, there are two questions. QED. ---
**Author:** ![Spavined\_Gelding](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/958977/32.png) [@Spavined\_Gelding](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Spavined_Gelding)\ **Post date:** [March 12, 2002, 10:45pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/masons-and-the-new-world-order/97571/17 "2002-03-12T22:45:32Z")
Good Lord, man, have you ever seen a lodge meeting? They are about a boring as they could be. My experience is that the meetings consist of a bunch of middle aged to elderly guys blundering through a scripted ritual and then retiring to the basement for an oyster stew lunch. During the 18th Century and into the Federalist period in the US the Masons may have been a radical political group on about the level of, for instance, Americans for Democratic Action, but since the Civil War it has turned into a social club on the order of the Elks Club and the Knights of Columbus. The big difference is that you can get a drink at the Elks and the KofC put on a fish fry. Once upon a time the Mason’s ideas of equality, brotherhood, state supported public education, representative government and universal suffrage were somewhat radical (the rank is but the Guinea’s stamp, a man’s a man for all of that), but there is nothing but the rantings of TV evangelists to support the idea that the Free and Accepted Masons are some sort of grand conspiracy, at least in the American Midwest. ---
**Author:** ![Sweet\_Willy](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/e95f7d/32.png) [@Sweet\_Willy](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Sweet_Willy)\ **Post date:** [March 12, 2002, 11:02pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/masons-and-the-new-world-order/97571/18 "2002-03-12T23:02:03Z")
> [@](#): > > . If there are two answers, there are two questions. QED. That is just horse crap dude. Example: Who signed the Declaration of independence? How many answers does this question require? Number of answers has absolutely nothing to do with the number of questions. This is completely off topic anyway. ---
**Author:** ![Dewey\_Cheatem\_Undhow](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/13edae/32.png) [@Dewey\_Cheatem\_Undhow](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Dewey_Cheatem_Undhow)\ **Post date:** [March 12, 2002, 11:27pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/masons-and-the-new-world-order/97571/19 "2002-03-12T23:27:58Z")
> [@](#): > > \*Originally posted by Sweet Willy \* > \*\*I have seen my dad dispose of citations with a handshake. I have seen him avoid citations with by the same. (LOTS of the highway patrol are masons). Then there is the Sheriff (mason) looks the other way concerning the gambling house run by, you guessed it, a mason. Then there was the state DOT bid rigging scandal. It is no secret to most familiar with them that they do “favors” for each other. \*\* Well, all I can say is “where do I sign up”? The savings on speeding tickets alone will probably offset my dues… 😃 Actually, this is something I’ve never understood about consipiracy rantings involving the Masons. If they’re so damned powerful that they run the world, why aren’t you filling out a membership application? ---
**Author:** ![Sweet\_Willy](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/e95f7d/32.png) [@Sweet\_Willy](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Sweet_Willy)\ **Post date:** [March 13, 2002, 5:19am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/masons-and-the-new-world-order/97571/20 "2002-03-13T05:19:54Z")
> [@](#): > > If they’re so damned powerful that they run the world, why aren’t you filling out a membership application? **Dewey** , problem is that they don’t take applications for admission. They chose thier members by invitation and it requires sponsorship by two other members. And yes, I was asked if I would be interested in joining. As for running the world, I don’t think so. I do think they are involved in some amount of corruption on an organized level. I, for one, think the latest conspiracy theory I repeated in the OP is just that, a conspiracy theory. I just asked if it were possible given the nature and scope of the organization. [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/masons-and-the-new-world-order/97571.md?page=2)