# Mass Effect 3 \[Massive Spoilers\] **URL:** \ **Category:** The Game Room\ **Created:** [February 15, 2012, 3:32am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/mass-effect-3-massive-spoilers/612894 "2012-02-15T03:32:25Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 17
**Author:** ![Johnny\_Angel](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/j/d26b3c/32.png) [@Johnny\_Angel](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Johnny_Angel)\ **Post date:** [March 25, 2012, 9:20pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/mass-effect-3-massive-spoilers/612894/323 "2012-03-25T21:20:19Z")
> [@Ferret\_Herder](#): > > **Quimby** : > > To get TIM to off himself, you have to be 100% Paragon or Renegade. I chose to bitch out the quarian admirals after they attacked the ship I was on and led a drinking chant with other marines in the bar on the Citadel, so I had a sliver of Renegade. I was overwhelmingly Paragon, with a few points in Renegade and I got Lulu to shoot himself ---
**Author:** ![Ferret\_Herder](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/f/e47774/32.png) [@Ferret\_Herder](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Ferret_Herder)\ **Post date:** [March 25, 2012, 9:44pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/mass-effect-3-massive-spoilers/612894/324 "2012-03-25T21:44:31Z")
> [@Johnny\_Angel](#): > > I was overwhelmingly Paragon, with a few points in Renegade and I got Lulu to shoot himself The conversation option was gray for me - I must have had just a bit too much for it to work. ---
**Author:** ![Quimby](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/q/22d042/32.png) [@Quimby](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Quimby)\ **Post date:** [March 25, 2012, 11:37pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/mass-effect-3-massive-spoilers/612894/325 "2012-03-25T23:37:03Z")
I had some Renegade as well FWIW but very little compared to Paragon. ---
**Author:** ![velveeta](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/v/13edae/32.png) [@velveeta](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/velveeta)\ **Post date:** [March 26, 2012, 2:45am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/mass-effect-3-massive-spoilers/612894/326 "2012-03-26T02:45:09Z")
> [@Quimby](#): > > Just finished. I was sure the rage over the ending would just me more Internet over reaction and to some degree I think it is (this is after all a game) but yeah, wow that was really underwhelming. > > I am guessing the fact that my score wasn’t maxxed was the reason I only saw three survivors step out of the Normandy at the end. I have the answer to one of your questions. No one gets more than three squad members to step out of the Normandy. In my case, 2 of the 3 were squad members I had with me on my run to the beam. They don’t have a scratch on them. How is that possible?? Don’t worry, that’s a rhetorical question. No one can answer it. ---
**Author:** ![MJinks](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/da6949/32.png) [@MJinks](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/MJinks)\ **Post date:** [March 26, 2012, 2:48am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/mass-effect-3-massive-spoilers/612894/327 "2012-03-26T02:48:40Z")
> [@Quimby](#): > > I was also unhappy that it was not possible to get the best possible ending without playing Mutiplayer. I scanned every asset and the only mission I missed was the Citadel Power Relay one because I didn’t get the Relay until after the Cerberus attack triggered which makes it impossible to turn in but yet I only had 3800+ readiness because of the 50%. I get that people like multiplayer and I am probably in the minority as to not liking it but this is a single player game. You want multiplayer to matter, make it a separate story or something. I am guessing the fact that my score wasn’t maxxed was the reason I only saw three survivors step out of the Normandy at the end. [spoiler]According to [this](http://uk.ign.com/wikis/mass-effect-3/Endings): As long as you have over 2800 EMS then the only ending that changes after that is the destruction option ending. At 2800 Shepard dies. At 4000 Shepard lives if Anderson lives. At 5000 Shepard lives even if Anderson died. By living they mean a very brief scene showing Shepard moving amongst some rubble. As if it matters one iota if Shepard lives or dies at the end. The control ending doesn’t change after 2350 EMS and the synthesis ending is always the same but isn’t available before 2800.[/spoiler] ---
**Author:** ![velveeta](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/v/13edae/32.png) [@velveeta](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/velveeta)\ **Post date:** [March 26, 2012, 2:56am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/mass-effect-3-massive-spoilers/612894/328 "2012-03-26T02:56:33Z")
> [@mikews99](#): > > This was posted originally on 4chan and is now a huge topic over on the Bioware forum. WARNING: may contain massive spoilers about the DLC (or is complete BS – you decide): > > [April 24th DLC info](http://social.bioware.com/forum/Mass-Effect-3/Mass-Effect-3-Story-and-Campaign-Discussion-Spoilers-Allowed/NEW-INFO-Possible-leak-of-April-24th-DLC-and-next-game-Either-this-or-an-elaborate-fake-10560313-1.html) [spoiler]I’ve read about this. I’m supposed to believe Shepard survives re-entry in a part of the Citadel - also the part where the massive explosion was centered - and this explains the breath scene. This is the face I am making right now: :dubious: I wish Bioware could see it. The rest of it gets even worse. “The Advent”. Yes, everyone loved the star kid so much that no one will mind playing a mind-melded version of it and their much-beloved Shep! And, they will fly around the galaxy in a lonely reaper exterminating synthetic life! Wheeeeeeeeeeeee! One of their minions has denied this rumor, but my trust in them is pretty low right now… and it almost sounds bad enough to be true. [/spoiler] I think the guy who originally posted it has come out and admitted it’s fake. ---
**Author:** ![Ferret\_Herder](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/f/e47774/32.png) [@Ferret\_Herder](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Ferret_Herder)\ **Post date:** [March 26, 2012, 3:10am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/mass-effect-3-massive-spoilers/612894/329 "2012-03-26T03:10:01Z")
> [@velveeta](#): > > I have the answer to one of your questions. > > No one gets more than three squad members to step out of the Normandy. In my case, 2 of the 3 were squad members I had with me on my run to the beam. They don’t have a scratch on them. How is that possible?? Don’t worry, that’s a rhetorical question. No one can answer it. Same thing happened in my ending. ---
**Author:** ![velveeta](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/v/13edae/32.png) [@velveeta](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/velveeta)\ **Post date:** [March 26, 2012, 3:28am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/mass-effect-3-massive-spoilers/612894/330 "2012-03-26T03:28:02Z")
Hey Quimby, try to wrap your head around this! 😃 > **[A Logical Breakdown of Why the Mass Effect 3 Ending Makes No Sense](https://docs.google.com/document/d/1QT4IUepvrU1pfv_B95oQj0H84DlCTUmzQ_uQh1voTUs/mobilebasic?pli=1)** > > This Doc is private Wow, he’s even added to that doc since I last read it. ---
**Author:** ![velveeta](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/v/13edae/32.png) [@velveeta](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/velveeta)\ **Post date:** [March 26, 2012, 4:10am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/mass-effect-3-massive-spoilers/612894/331 "2012-03-26T04:10:40Z")
Ok, I admit that I’m spending far, far too much time trying to make sense of \ logic when I should be asleep, but I just thought of something else. If the catalyst controls the reapers and they are there to make sure synthetics don’t get out of control or advanced enough to wipe out all organic life, then why did the reapers upgrade the Geth? Sigh. ---
**Author:** ![Unauthorized\_Cinnamon](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/u/bc8723/32.png) [@Unauthorized\_Cinnamon](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Unauthorized_Cinnamon)\ **Post date:** [March 26, 2012, 4:54pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/mass-effect-3-massive-spoilers/612894/332 "2012-03-26T16:54:13Z")
velveeta, you know there was more than enough up-front “that doesn’t make any sense” with the ending, that I never bothered to pursue the Fridge Logic, but yeah, everything you say makes sense. And now my head hurts too! ---
**Author:** ![Quimby](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/q/22d042/32.png) [@Quimby](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Quimby)\ **Post date:** [March 26, 2012, 7:37pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/mass-effect-3-massive-spoilers/612894/333 "2012-03-26T19:37:06Z")
Thanks for the link. I plan to start wrapping my head around that doc…thanks 🙂 Re: scores. Thank you for the clarification. I read somewhere that 5000 was necessary to get the “best” ending but best was never defined. Knowing the difference was that minor makes me feel a bit better ---
**Author:** ![TBG](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/c89c15/32.png) [@TBG](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/TBG)\ **Post date:** [March 26, 2012, 11:14pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/mass-effect-3-massive-spoilers/612894/334 "2012-03-26T23:14:07Z")
Finally (finally? It’s only been out 3 weeks…) beat the game for the first time last night, and wow, I do not understand all the nerdrage out there over the ending (and I haven’t read through this thread so I don’t know if you all are on that crybaby bandwagon or not). It wasn’t what I was expecting, probably not what I wanted, but it delivered Shep taking out the reaper threat once and for all, so the rest is just gravy. If it had ended with getting zapped by the reaper when trying to get up to the citadel, THAT would’ve been rage worthy. The game’s got 99 problems but the ending ain’t one. ---
**Author:** ![Mr.Kobayashi](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/4af34b/32.png) [@Mr.Kobayashi](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Mr.Kobayashi)\ **Post date:** [March 26, 2012, 11:26pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/mass-effect-3-massive-spoilers/612894/335 "2012-03-26T23:26:05Z")
> [@TBG](#): > > Finally (finally? It’s only been out 3 weeks…) beat the game for the first time last night, and wow, I do not understand all the nerdrage out there over the ending (and I haven’t read through this thread so I don’t know if you all are on that crybaby bandwagon or not). It wasn’t what I was expecting, probably not what I wanted, but it delivered Shep taking out the reaper threat once and for all, so the rest is just gravy. If it had ended with getting zapped by the reaper when trying to get up to the citadel, THAT would’ve been rage worthy. > > The game’s got 99 problems but the ending ain’t one. See it from the perspective of someone who has played all three games. Or, even just invested in the third. The central premise - that your choices have consequences - is complete abandoned by the ending. What did you do with the rachni queen? Did you save the Council? Who did you save on Virmire? Did you blow up the Collector base? Who cares? [Pick a colour!](https://images.nonexiste.net/popular/wp-content/uploads/2012/03/Casey-Hudson-s-Mass-Effect-3-demonstration.jpeg) Also; all those characters, your LI? They’re stuck on some random planet where they will probably inbreed or starve to death. Fortunately indoctrination theory fanwanks most of the plotholes in the ending (and there are a lot - read the link posted above), but as-is it’s a wholly unsatisfactory ending to the trilogy. Compare ME1 or ME2’s endings. See also; [10 reasons we hate Mass Effect 3’s ending.](http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6M0Cf864P7E&feature=relmfu) ---
**Author:** ![Ike\_Witt](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/ike_witt/32/283_2.png) [@Ike\_Witt](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Ike_Witt)\ **Post date:** [March 26, 2012, 11:29pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/mass-effect-3-massive-spoilers/612894/336 "2012-03-26T23:29:35Z")
> [@TBG](#): > > The game’s got 99 problems but the ending ain’t one. What are the problems you see with the game? ---
**Author:** ![Ferret\_Herder](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/f/e47774/32.png) [@Ferret\_Herder](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Ferret_Herder)\ **Post date:** [March 27, 2012, 12:01am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/mass-effect-3-massive-spoilers/612894/337 "2012-03-27T00:01:18Z")
> [@Ike\_Witt](#): > > What are the problems you see with the game? Exactly - my only problem with the game besides the ending involved the PC controls using the space bar for nearly every command. ---
**Author:** ![Quimby](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/q/22d042/32.png) [@Quimby](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Quimby)\ **Post date:** [March 27, 2012, 12:17am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/mass-effect-3-massive-spoilers/612894/338 "2012-03-27T00:17:51Z")
Like I wrote above, I could accept the whole thing except for the part where I made galactic civilization impossible and didn’t have a choice in the matter. ETA: I am cool with the space bar as the master control except it ruins me for other games for a week or two afterwards. ---
**Author:** ![Johnny\_Angel](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/j/d26b3c/32.png) [@Johnny\_Angel](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Johnny_Angel)\ **Post date:** [March 27, 2012, 2:28am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/mass-effect-3-massive-spoilers/612894/339 "2012-03-27T02:28:09Z")
> [@TBG](#): > > Finally (finally? It’s only been out 3 weeks…) beat the game for the first time last night, and wow, I do not understand all the nerdrage out there over the ending (and I haven’t read through this thread so I don’t know if you all are on that crybaby bandwagon or not). I take it you also didn’t read the elaborate discussions that have already taken place about this? [Checce vous.](http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8rBJZn9UlFk&feature=related) ---
**Author:** ![velveeta](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/v/13edae/32.png) [@velveeta](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/velveeta)\ **Post date:** [March 27, 2012, 3:42am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/mass-effect-3-massive-spoilers/612894/340 "2012-03-27T03:42:58Z")
> [@TBG](#): > > Finally (finally? It’s only been out 3 weeks…) beat the game for the first time last night, and wow, I do not understand all the nerdrage out there over the ending (and I haven’t read through this thread so I don’t know if you all are on that crybaby bandwagon or not). It wasn’t what I was expecting, probably not what I wanted, but it delivered Shep taking out the reaper threat once and for all, so the rest is just gravy. If it had ended with getting zapped by the reaper when trying to get up to the citadel, THAT would’ve been rage worthy. > > The game’s got 99 problems but the ending ain’t one. So you are ok with dropping all the themes from ME and boiling it down to synthetics vs organics, introducing a shit load of plot holes in what is supposed to be the ending of a trilogy, retconning everything the reapers tell you from the previous games, introducing the “real villian” in the last 5 minutes, and killing more life than the reapers could ever manage to? I’m glad you like the endings. Seriously, I wish I did. Why are you preemptively calling people “crybabies” before reading the thread and finding out why some of us have issues with the end? I read this fantastic essay about what’s wrong, and I’ll link it here: [http://www.themetagames.com/2012/03/why-you-enjoy-art-and-one-problem-with.html](http://www.themetagames.com/2012/03/why-you-enjoy-art-and-one-problem-with.html) I’m not trying to talk you out of liking the ending, but people aren’t upset that Shepard died or that it was too bleak. All throughout the series, the narrative has never been particularly subtle at key points. All of a sudden, it gets all ambiguous and abstract. We’re supposed to fill in the blanks, fatalism replaces hope, our choices don’t matter. It’s totally jarring and left a sour taste for many, many people. I even understand that they were trying to be all edgy with the technological singularity angle. I still think it’s poorly conceived and not at all what was promised multiple times by Bioware. It reduces the awesomeness of the reapers to playthings of our new antagonist who we don’t know dick about. Worst of all, we can’t even argue with it. The author above explains it better, but essentially all the emotional build up towards the final battle never reaches a conclusion. At least it didn’t for me. After I got the crass “Buy More DLC!” message after the credits rolled, I felt frustrated, sad, and empty - total opposites from the previous two games. That’s why I hate the ending. Ok, switching topics a little… For you guys following the indoc thing, some new stuff has come to light. People have been pulling apart the audio in the dream sequences, particularly the second one after Tuchaunka. You can spend a lot of time wandering around this one if you don’t chase the boy. If you wait, you will notice that the “oily shadows” of the dead will surround the boy - possibly trying to block you from getting to him. In addition to the normal whispering of the dead, the audio has several distinct whispers that stand out. “Don’t trust him.” “Stay away!” and “Kill him!” Apparently, if you get close to the boy, but not close enough to trigger the cut scene, you hear a reaper growl. It’s in the audio files, but I haven’t tested this since I have no desire to replay the game. I think I’ll have to look at is scene though. Of course, it’s probably just more “speculation from everyone!” ---
**Author:** ![Crowbar\_of\_Irony\_3](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/f08c70/32.png) [@Crowbar\_of\_Irony\_3](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Crowbar_of_Irony_3)\ **Post date:** [March 27, 2012, 6:22am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/mass-effect-3-massive-spoilers/612894/341 "2012-03-27T06:22:39Z")
By this time I am gotten tired of sprouting why I don’t like the ending. I think I have gotten over it. There’s a whole new DLC for the Witcher 2, Diablo III on the horizon, Dragon’s Dogma from Capcom, remake of Baldur’s Gate and Baldur’s Gate II to try again, and Simcity 5 the next year. Tough fact of life is that if you don’t value your fans, you lose them. Go ahead and be artsy all you want. ---
**Author:** ![Gukumatz](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/g/74df32/32.png) [@Gukumatz](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Gukumatz)\ **Post date:** [March 27, 2012, 8:11am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/mass-effect-3-massive-spoilers/612894/342 "2012-03-27T08:11:08Z")
Still annoyed. At this point, it seems like BioWare’s PR campaign of “still waters” is succeeding. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/mass-effect-3-massive-spoilers/612894.md?page=16) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/mass-effect-3-massive-spoilers/612894.md?page=18)