# Mass shootings at mosques in New Zealand **URL:** \ **Category:** The BBQ Pit\ **Created:** [March 15, 2019, 4:15am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/mass-shootings-at-mosques-in-new-zealand/831169 "2019-03-15T04:15:53Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 3
**Author:** ![Rick\_Kitchen](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/rick_kitchen/32/522_2.png) [@Rick\_Kitchen](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Rick_Kitchen)\ **Post date:** [March 15, 2019, 8:24pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/mass-shootings-at-mosques-in-new-zealand/831169/41 "2019-03-15T20:24:00Z")
Individual 1 actually just called it a terrorist attack. ---
**Author:** ![BobLibDem](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/boblibdem/32/3149_2.png) [@BobLibDem](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/BobLibDem)\ **Post date:** [March 15, 2019, 8:52pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/mass-shootings-at-mosques-in-new-zealand/831169/42 "2019-03-15T20:52:24Z")
> [@Rick\_Kitchen](#): > > Individual 1 actually just called it a terrorist attack. Surely a large number of his supporters cheered the news. ---
**Author:** ![Inigo\_Montoya](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/inigo_montoya/32/124_2.png) [@Inigo\_Montoya](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Inigo_Montoya)\ **Post date:** [March 15, 2019, 8:57pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/mass-shootings-at-mosques-in-new-zealand/831169/43 "2019-03-15T20:57:35Z")
> [@Novelty\_Bobble](#): > > I have to say that I’ve never understood actually seeking out such videos. Curiosity–what does one of these rampages look like? What would one look like in places _I_ frequent? What chances did the victims have to escape that they failed to take? What chances did the lucky ones have to overcome the shooters? Confirm it actually happened. To humanize the victims, and to make the killings real vs names or categories of people on the television. To see whether the body count is due to the specific weapon & configuration or to strategy, luck, and helplessness of the victims. I could go on, and none of my reasons would have anything resembling a pleasant orientation. To say a viewer would watch the video for kicks or worse (although this being the world it is, there are surely some) is just plain lazy and ridiculously judgmental. For what it’s worth, I don’t look these sorts of things up because I don’t have the need and I don’t want to contribute to “hits” and popularization of the videos. ---
**Author:** ![clairobscur](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/839c29/32.png) [@clairobscur](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/clairobscur)\ **Post date:** [March 15, 2019, 9:11pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/mass-shootings-at-mosques-in-new-zealand/831169/44 "2019-03-15T21:11:37Z")
> [@puzzlegal](#): > > He was on Twitter, presumably reading about the incident, and it started playing with no warning. > > I “inadvertently” see the first several seconds of video of every ad Facebook feeds to me, along with some videos that friend have posted/linked. I turned off “auto-next” on YouTube, but I used to inadvertently see all sorts of crap there. It seems completely unsurprising to me that this happened to him. But who is posting this kind of video on twitter or youtube ??? ---
**Author:** ![Aspidistra](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/aspidistra/32/3894_2.png) [@Aspidistra](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Aspidistra)\ **Post date:** [March 15, 2019, 9:59pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/mass-shootings-at-mosques-in-new-zealand/831169/45 "2019-03-15T21:59:58Z")
People who play FPS video games, probably. They’re getting quite realistic. ---
**Author:** ![nearwildheaven](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/n/90db22/32.png) [@nearwildheaven](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/nearwildheaven)\ **Post date:** [March 15, 2019, 10:34pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/mass-shootings-at-mosques-in-new-zealand/831169/46 "2019-03-15T22:34:39Z")
> [@asahi](#): > > New Zealand can probably do more to regulate firearms, but nothing is going to stop the occasional nutter from doing something like this. > > It’s times like this when I wonder what, if anything, should we be doing about ‘taking away the microphone’ from people who troll with hatred. I’m not a fan of restricting speech, particularly if it’s the government being the arbiter or censor, but I think there’s clearly a responsibility of companies like Google, Facebook, et al to do more to police this kind of shit. > > In all fairness, though, it seems like much of this took place in seedy, underground chat rooms and web boards. Maybe it’s time to start shining the spotlight on companies that play host to these animals. > > Which websites did he visit? Who owns them? Who hosts them? This has Tor written all over it. ---
**Author:** ![Der\_Trihs](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/der_trihs/32/233_2.png) [@Der\_Trihs](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Der_Trihs)\ **Post date:** [March 15, 2019, 10:36pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/mass-shootings-at-mosques-in-new-zealand/831169/47 "2019-03-15T22:36:17Z")
> [@Lamoral](#): > > Jesus Christ…in New Zealand of all places? I’d never imagine something like this happening there. The killer said that’s partly why he chose New Zealand as a target, so that no place felt safe. > [@Rick\_Kitchen](#): > > Individual 1 actually just called it a terrorist attack. And then immediately [started talking](https://twitter.com/ddale8/status/1106641548740100097?ref_src=twsrc%5Etfw%7Ctwcamp%5Etweetembed%7Ctwterm%5E1106641548740100097&ref_url=https%3A%2F%2Fs9e.github.io%2Fiframe%2F2%2Ftwitter.min.html%231106641548740100097) about the Evil Foreigners: > [@](#): > > Per pool: Trump called the terror attack a “horrible, horrible thing” and said he called the PM to convey US “sorrow,” then turned to “crimes of all kinds coming through our southern border.” He added, "People hate the word invasion, but that’s what it is.” Most likely he’s perfectly happy about this, it’s standard right wing rhetoric tactics for the aftermath of right wing terrorism. Throw out some crocodile tears about deploring violence, then make it immediately clear that they actually support what happened. I’m sure the great majority of the western Right thinks this was great, it’s just that most aren’t willing to openly admit it. But among themselves and in their own heads they’re gloating. ---
**Author:** ![nearwildheaven](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/n/90db22/32.png) [@nearwildheaven](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/nearwildheaven)\ **Post date:** [March 15, 2019, 10:36pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/mass-shootings-at-mosques-in-new-zealand/831169/48 "2019-03-15T22:36:19Z")
> [@BobLibDem](#): > > Surely a large number of his supporters cheered the news. Or said the worshippers should have been armed - until realizing that this happened on the other side of the world. I just heard on NBC News that the youngest surviving victim is 4 years old. ☹ ---
**Author:** ![Noelq](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/noelq/32/16438_2.png) [@Noelq](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Noelq)\ **Post date:** [March 15, 2019, 10:41pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/mass-shootings-at-mosques-in-new-zealand/831169/49 "2019-03-15T22:41:03Z")
> [@aldiboronti](#): > > I thought Pewdiepie was some sort of teen idol on Youtube. I had no idea he was mixed up with the alt-right. Hard to keep up sometimes. As a rule, I stay out of the pit. This, however, needs to be addressed. In no way does Pewdiepie support this, encourage this, and he is definitely not alt-right. He’s already condemned their actions. Just like shooting the president to get to Jodie Foster, this in no way involves him. ---
**Author:** ![SlackerInc](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/slackerinc/32/275_2.png) [@SlackerInc](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/SlackerInc)\ **Post date:** [March 15, 2019, 10:45pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/mass-shootings-at-mosques-in-new-zealand/831169/50 "2019-03-15T22:45:55Z")
I have echoed Sam Harris in pointing out in the past that these kinds of attacks are almost always inflicted by, not against, Muslims. This is a massive counterexample, and I just wanted to state for the record that I see and recognize that. Really terrible, and I hope not the start of a trend. > [@Inigo\_Montoya](#): > > Curiosity–what does one of these rampages look like? What would one look like in places _I_ frequent? What chances did the victims have to escape that they failed to take? What chances did the lucky ones have to overcome the shooters? Confirm it actually happened. To humanize the victims, and to make the killings real vs names or categories of people on the television. To see whether the body count is due to the specific weapon & configuration or to strategy, luck, and helplessness of the victims. Cosigned, although you seemed to undercut your point later in your comment. I always wonder, when people get on their high horse disapproving of those of us who are curious to see these things: do they also think it was wrong for people to want to see World War II footage on newsreels in the 1940s, or decades later on the History Channel? ---
**Author:** ![Inigo\_Montoya](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/inigo_montoya/32/124_2.png) [@Inigo\_Montoya](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Inigo_Montoya)\ **Post date:** [March 15, 2019, 10:56pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/mass-shootings-at-mosques-in-new-zealand/831169/51 "2019-03-15T22:56:51Z")
> [@SlackerInc](#): > > Cosigned, although you seemed to undercut your point later in your comment. Undercut by, “I don’t have the need and I don’t want to contribute to “hits” and popularization of the videos”? “Need” may be the wrong word, because I like to think I would try to act against the bad guys and it would be good to have at least a basic strategy for that. I just can’t say that on any given day I’d care if I got taken out this way–it’s a personal thing. Dunno, it was clumsily worded. But I stick by the other comment about not wanting to help popularize it. I may not care if I get brained, but I’m not especially eager for it to happen. ---
**Author:** ![Der\_Trihs](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/der_trihs/32/233_2.png) [@Der\_Trihs](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Der_Trihs)\ **Post date:** [March 15, 2019, 11:00pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/mass-shootings-at-mosques-in-new-zealand/831169/52 "2019-03-15T23:00:20Z")
> [@SlackerInc](#): > > I have echoed Sam Harris in pointing out in the past that these kinds of attacks are almost always inflicted by, not against, Muslims. This is a massive counterexample, and I just wanted to state for the record that I see and recognize that. Translation: “This makes the Right look bad, so I’d better make sure everyone knows that The Muslims Are The Real Monsters.” ---
**Author:** ![Monty](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/monty/32/47_2.png) [@Monty](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Monty)\ **Post date:** [March 15, 2019, 11:02pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/mass-shootings-at-mosques-in-new-zealand/831169/53 "2019-03-15T23:02:13Z")
> [@Euphonious\_Polemic](#): > > white supremacist right wing terrorism is pretty much standard for Trump & Fox & Friends. You repeated yourself twice, maybe thrice, here. > [@BobLibDem](#): > > Surely a large number of his supporters cheered the news. Want to really go down a rabbit-hole? Check the “reactions”/comments on the Yahoo! articles about this incident. You will only be surprised at the level of vehemence of such support, not the existence itself. ---
**Author:** ![iiandyiiii](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/iiandyiiii/32/7924_2.png) [@iiandyiiii](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/iiandyiiii)\ **Post date:** [March 15, 2019, 11:22pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/mass-shootings-at-mosques-in-new-zealand/831169/54 "2019-03-15T23:22:44Z")
> [@SlackerInc](#): > > I have echoed Sam Harris in pointing out in the past that these kinds of attacks are almost always inflicted by, not against, Muslims. “Almost always”? Do you have a cite, or is this just more ass-derived bullshit? From what I’ve seen, in the West and in Europe, mass shootings are more likely to be perpetrated by Western men, usually young and white. ---
**Author:** ![bobot](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/bobot/32/21622_2.png) [@bobot](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/bobot)\ **Post date:** [March 15, 2019, 11:29pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/mass-shootings-at-mosques-in-new-zealand/831169/55 "2019-03-15T23:29:29Z")
Der Trihs had it right. Why ask questions of him? It would be nice if this thread didn’t turn into a slacker inc feed fest. ---
**Author:** ![clairobscur](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/839c29/32.png) [@clairobscur](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/clairobscur)\ **Post date:** [March 15, 2019, 11:30pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/mass-shootings-at-mosques-in-new-zealand/831169/56 "2019-03-15T23:30:45Z")
> [@SlackerInc](#): > > I always wonder, when people get on their high horse disapproving of those of us who are curious to see these things: do they also think it was wrong for people to want to see World War II footage on newsreels in the 1940s, or decades later on the History Channel? I expect, maybe wrongly, that these videos will be much more graphic and shocking than old WWII footages. Also, it’s for me in large part related to the idea of seeing people in the process of dying, rather than already dead, regardless how graphic the latter could be. ---
**Author:** ![SlackerInc](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/slackerinc/32/275_2.png) [@SlackerInc](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/SlackerInc)\ **Post date:** [March 15, 2019, 11:31pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/mass-shootings-at-mosques-in-new-zealand/831169/57 "2019-03-15T23:31:38Z")
Andy, I am talking about mass terrorism in advanced democracies, involving either Muslims as the killers or the primary targets. > [@Der\_Trihs](#): > > Translation: “This makes the Right look bad, so I’d better make sure everyone knows that The Muslims Are The Real Monsters.” Better get that translator checked. :rolleyes: I have always vigorously opposed the right, since I started posting here and well before. In my adult life, I voted for Gore, Kerry, Obama, Obama, and Hillary. And I will not be voting Trump in 2020! ---
**Author:** ![clairobscur](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/839c29/32.png) [@clairobscur](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/clairobscur)\ **Post date:** [March 15, 2019, 11:38pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/mass-shootings-at-mosques-in-new-zealand/831169/58 "2019-03-15T23:38:07Z")
> [@Monty](#): > > You repeated yourself twice, maybe thrice, here. > > Want to really go down a rabbit-hole? Check the “reactions”/comments on the Yahoo! articles about this incident. You will only be surprised at the level of vehemence of such support, not the existence itself. Upon reading your post, I did. I opened the comments of the last published article on Yahoo news related to the topic (it was about the reaction of French Muslims at some mosque, asking them if the attack made them afraid). I just checked the original comments, not the answers to them. Out of 22 comments, one was supportive. The 21 others were various level of anti-islam, anti-Muslims or anti-immigrant sentiment, many brutal and insulting. The 21 anti-Muslim comments garnered a total of 51 thumb down. The only supportive comment got 24 thumb down. ---
**Author:** ![iiandyiiii](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/iiandyiiii/32/7924_2.png) [@iiandyiiii](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/iiandyiiii)\ **Post date:** [March 16, 2019, 12:11am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/mass-shootings-at-mosques-in-new-zealand/831169/59 "2019-03-16T00:11:02Z")
> [@SlackerInc](#): > > Andy, I am talking about mass terrorism in advanced democracies, involving either Muslims as the killers or the primary targets. This is weirdly specific. I imagine if we look at all terrorism in which white supremacists are either the killers or the primary targets, we’d find that white supremacists are much, much more likely to be the killers. ---
**Author:** ![SlackerInc](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/slackerinc/32/275_2.png) [@SlackerInc](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/SlackerInc)\ **Post date:** [March 16, 2019, 12:37am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/mass-shootings-at-mosques-in-new-zealand/831169/60 "2019-03-16T00:37:46Z")
We constantly hear “mentally ill people are much more likely to be the victims than the perpetrators of violence.” Is that “weirdly specific” too? And you seem to be missing that my point was to say “this is a terrible tragedy, first and foremost; secondarily, it undercuts my thesis and I am acknowledging that.” I thought you might be glad I didn’t just go dark after this shooting, and selectively pipe up when shootings fit my narrative. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/mass-shootings-at-mosques-in-new-zealand/831169.md?page=2) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/mass-shootings-at-mosques-in-new-zealand/831169.md?page=4)