# Master & Commander (the book) question: what's a prize agent? **URL:** \ **Category:** Cafe Society\ **Created:** [July 16, 2013, 9:15pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/master-commander-the-book-question-whats-a-prize-agent/663702 "2013-07-16T21:15:27Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 2
**Author:** ![Elendil\_s\_Heir](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/7cd45c/32.png) [@Elendil\_s\_Heir](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Elendil_s_Heir)\ **Post date:** [July 18, 2013, 3:52pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/master-commander-the-book-question-whats-a-prize-agent/663702/21 "2013-07-18T15:52:42Z")
:: bows to **muldoonthief** :: You are too kind, good sir. ---
**Author:** ![Miller](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/miller/32/481_2.png) [@Miller](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Miller)\ **Post date:** [July 18, 2013, 6:14pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/master-commander-the-book-question-whats-a-prize-agent/663702/22 "2013-07-18T18:14:41Z")
Save it for the Pit, you two! ---
**Author:** ![Bryan\_Ekers](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/bryan_ekers/32/183_2.png) [@Bryan\_Ekers](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Bryan_Ekers)\ **Post date:** [July 18, 2013, 7:13pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/master-commander-the-book-question-whats-a-prize-agent/663702/23 "2013-07-18T19:13:37Z")
I’ve not seen such rumjiggery since MelWallace spinner-rigged the foreswain under O’Banahan’s belportalen car’leray, and THAT was with a headwind! ---
**Author:** ![UncleRojelio](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/unclerojelio/32/3160_2.png) [@UncleRojelio](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/UncleRojelio)\ **Post date:** [July 18, 2013, 7:22pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/master-commander-the-book-question-whats-a-prize-agent/663702/24 "2013-07-18T19:22:25Z")
> [@muldoonthief](#): > > There are a few times where they explain everything to Stephen and other hopeless types - if you read those carefully, you can pick up a lot of information. Some of the very best (and funniest) passages are when Jack is trying to explain something to Stephen. One of the most interesting (for me at least) aspects is the number of idiomatic words or phrases that pop up in the series that are being used in their original context. I would find myself reading past them only to come to a complete stop a few sentences later with a virtual light bulb going off over my head. Fun stuff. ---
**Author:** ![Sampiro](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/2acd7d/32.png) [@Sampiro](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Sampiro)\ **Post date:** [July 18, 2013, 8:18pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/master-commander-the-book-question-whats-a-prize-agent/663702/25 "2013-07-18T20:18:09Z")
> [@Bryan\_Ekers](#): > > I’ve not seen such rumjiggery since MelWallace spinner-rigged the foreswain under O’Banahan’s belportalen car’leray, and THAT was with a headwind! Sailors can call it rumjiggery to each other, but it’s rude when you do it. ---
**Author:** ![Kizarvexius](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/k/da6949/32.png) [@Kizarvexius](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Kizarvexius)\ **Post date:** [July 18, 2013, 11:01pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/master-commander-the-book-question-whats-a-prize-agent/663702/26 "2013-07-18T23:01:14Z")
> [@UncleRojelio](#): > > Some of the very best (and funniest) passages are when Jack is trying to explain something to Stephen. > > One of the most interesting (for me at least) aspects is the number of idiomatic words or phrases that pop up in the series that are being used in their original context. I would find myself reading past them only to come to a complete stop a few sentences later with a virtual light bulb going off over my head. Fun stuff. As a word nerd (though I prefer verbivore), I was amazed by how many terms and expressions in common use today have their origin with nautical jargon. Just a few of them: [ul] [li]By and large[/li][li]Learning the ropes[/li][li]Mainstay[/li][li]To the bitter end[/li][li]Taken aback[/li][li]Broad in the beam[/li][li]Skyscraper[/li][li]Lifeline[/li][li]Batten down the hatches[/li][li]Gangway[/li][li]First-rate[/li][li]Feeling blue[/li][li]Scuttlebutt[/li][/ul] ---
**Author:** ![teela\_brown](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/d9b06d/32.png) [@teela\_brown](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/teela_brown)\ **Post date:** [July 18, 2013, 11:03pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/master-commander-the-book-question-whats-a-prize-agent/663702/27 "2013-07-18T23:03:56Z")
> [@Kizarvexius](#): > > As a word nerd (though I prefer verbivore), I was amazed by how many terms and expressions in common use today have their origin with nautical jargon. Just a few of them: > > [ul] > [li]By and large[/li][li]Learning the ropes[/li][li]Mainstay[/li][li]To the bitter end[/li][li]Taken aback[/li][li]Broad in the beam[/li][li]Skyscraper[/li][li]Lifeline[/li][li]Batten down the hatches[/li][li]Gangway[/li][li]First-rate[/li][li]Feeling blue[/li][li]Scuttlebutt[/li][/ul] And: Jury-rigged (or is it jerry-rigged?) The devil to pay and no pitch hot Going at loggerheads ---
**Author:** ![chela](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/chela/32/21582_2.png) [@chela](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/chela)\ **Post date:** [July 19, 2013, 12:31am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/master-commander-the-book-question-whats-a-prize-agent/663702/28 "2013-07-19T00:31:19Z")
another one… the whole shooting match and when they were fighting the american navy, someone passed on a phrase it cuts no ice, which was a native american expression. I passed on M&C to my Dad, who is not familiar with Obrien, I am hoping it hooks him! a real favorite, this is my third read through now, might be picking up the jargon a bit now. though a landlubber to the core, urp…😛 ---
**Author:** ![Malthus](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/85f322/32.png) [@Malthus](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Malthus)\ **Post date:** [July 19, 2013, 3:00pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/master-commander-the-book-question-whats-a-prize-agent/663702/29 "2013-07-19T15:00:38Z")
Not to mention “let the cat out of the bag” from the cat o’ nine tails 😃 Too bad it is likely false. ☹ > **[What's the Origin of 'Letting the Cat Out of the Bag'?](https://www.snopes.com/fact-check/let-the-cat-out-of-the-bag/)** > > There is nothing obvious about why letting a cat out of a bag has anything to do with truth. Let's fact check some popular explanations. ---
**Author:** ![Malthus](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/85f322/32.png) [@Malthus](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Malthus)\ **Post date:** [July 19, 2013, 3:02pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/master-commander-the-book-question-whats-a-prize-agent/663702/30 "2013-07-19T15:02:40Z")
My favorite phrase comming from this series (as opposed to nautical history) is the ever memorable " ’ Jack, you have debauched my sloth.” 😃 ---
**Author:** ![UncleRojelio](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/unclerojelio/32/3160_2.png) [@UncleRojelio](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/UncleRojelio)\ **Post date:** [July 19, 2013, 3:14pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/master-commander-the-book-question-whats-a-prize-agent/663702/31 "2013-07-19T15:14:56Z")
> [@Malthus](#): > > Not to mention “let the cat out of the bag” from the cat o’ nine tails 😃 > > Too bad it is likely false. ☹ > > [What's the Origin of 'Letting the Cat Out of the Bag'? | Snopes.com](http://www.snopes.com/language/phrases/catbag.asp) I think Snopes is full of shit on this one. ---
**Author:** ![Mekhazzio](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/b38774/32.png) [@Mekhazzio](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Mekhazzio)\ **Post date:** [July 19, 2013, 4:10pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/master-commander-the-book-question-whats-a-prize-agent/663702/32 "2013-07-19T16:10:07Z")
> [@muldoonthief](#): > > You sir, clearly show a level of wit equal to Jack Aubrey’s. Oh, come now! It ain’t very gentlemanly to, forgive the expression, piss on a man and tell him that it’s a half-dozen of the other. It’s rather like topping it the brass bull, if you smoke my meaning. ---
**Author:** ![teela\_brown](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/d9b06d/32.png) [@teela\_brown](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/teela_brown)\ **Post date:** [July 19, 2013, 9:33pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/master-commander-the-book-question-whats-a-prize-agent/663702/33 "2013-07-19T21:33:00Z")
I work in a large multi-story office building. Historically, about 3/4 of this office building was filled with a large nationwide accounting firm, but they moved out when they needed larger quarters. As a result, our indoor parking garage was mostly emptied of cars, and one had one’s choice when parking. The first week of the empty parking garage, I was giving someone a ride in to work. As I drove up the ramp, I looked around the completely empty second level and said “Someone’s made a clean sweep of this deck, fore and aft. I say _fore and aft_” and looked significantly at my passenger. Of course she didn’t get it, but it was a perfect time to use it. I felt smug, anyway. ---
**Author:** ![Little\_Nemo](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/little_nemo/32/3120_2.png) [@Little\_Nemo](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Little_Nemo)\ **Post date:** [July 19, 2013, 11:03pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/master-commander-the-book-question-whats-a-prize-agent/663702/34 "2013-07-19T23:03:41Z")
> [@Kizarvexius](#): > > I can’t recommend highly enough picking up a companion volume to help you with the naval vocabulary, not to mention the obscure historical, literary, biological, pharmacological, musical, anatomical, meteorological, geographical, military, astronomical (_etc., etc., ad absurdam_) references tossed about so casually by O’Brian. One of the best is [_A Sea of Words, Third Edition: A Lexicon and Companion to the Complete Seafaring Tales of Patrick O’Brian_](http://www.amazon.com/Sea-Words-Third-Companion-Seafaring/dp/0805066152/ref=sr_1_1?s=books&ie=UTF8&qid=1374089269&sr=1-1&keywords=a+sea+of+words) by Dean King, _et al_. As I have recently embarked upon my fourth (?) voyage through the series (currently about 1/3 of the way through Post Captain), I purchased this invaluable volume in e-book form and have it loaded up on my iPhone while reading to speed up the consultation process. > [@Eleanor\_of\_Aquitaine](#): > > I also find _Harbors and High Seas: An Atlas and Geographical Guide to the Complete Aubrey-Maturin Novels of Patrick O’Brian_ to be very helpful - lets me keep up with exactly where in the world the action is taking place. > > I’ve read the series twice, and I’m now slowly going through them again on audiobook during long car trips. I’m not an audiobook fan, but it’s really nice to hear the nautical stuff read aloud by someone who knows how to pronounce everything. I think the humor comes across better on the written page, though. Another excellent reference work is _Life in Nelson’s Navy_ by Dudley Pope. ---
**Author:** ![Damfino](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/f9ae1b/32.png) [@Damfino](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Damfino)\ **Post date:** [July 20, 2013, 12:26am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/master-commander-the-book-question-whats-a-prize-agent/663702/35 "2013-07-20T00:26:42Z")
> [@teela\_brown](#): > > I work in a large multi-story office building. Historically, about 3/4 of this office building was filled with a large nationwide accounting firm, but they moved out when they needed larger quarters. As a result, our indoor parking garage was mostly emptied of cars, and one had one’s choice when parking. > > The first week of the empty parking garage, I was giving someone a ride in to work. As I drove up the ramp, I looked around the completely empty second level and said “Someone’s made a clean sweep of this deck, fore and aft. I say _fore and aft_” and looked significantly at my passenger. Of course she didn’t get it, but it was a perfect time to use it. I felt smug, anyway. Would you care for a promenade along the quarterdeck perhaps? ---
**Author:** ![Elendil\_s\_Heir](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/7cd45c/32.png) [@Elendil\_s\_Heir](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Elendil_s_Heir)\ **Post date:** [July 20, 2013, 1:55am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/master-commander-the-book-question-whats-a-prize-agent/663702/36 "2013-07-20T01:55:03Z")
> [@teela\_brown](#): > > …“Someone’s made a clean sweep of this deck, fore and aft. I say _fore and aft_” and looked significantly at my passenger. Of course she didn’t get it, but it was a perfect time to use it. I felt smug, anyway. And its significance was…? ---
**Author:** ![vontsira](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/v/51bf81/32.png) [@vontsira](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/vontsira)\ **Post date:** [July 20, 2013, 6:12am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/master-commander-the-book-question-whats-a-prize-agent/663702/37 "2013-07-20T06:12:10Z")
It irritates me just a little, what a great number and variety of far-flung parts of the globe the guys get to visit, largely (I feel) so that Stephen and the Reverend Martin can indulge to the max, their passion for the natural world. None of it totally impossible in the context of that period of history; but in the aggregate, pretty amazingly unlikely – requiring the willing suspension of disbelief to work overtime. Worth it, I suppose, in the interests of getting good stories. ---
**Author:** ![Little\_Nemo](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/little_nemo/32/3120_2.png) [@Little\_Nemo](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Little_Nemo)\ **Post date:** [July 20, 2013, 6:25am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/master-commander-the-book-question-whats-a-prize-agent/663702/38 "2013-07-20T06:25:04Z")
> [@vontsira](#): > > It irritates me just a little, what a great number and variety of far-flung parts of the globe the guys get to visit, largely (I feel) so that Stephen and the Reverend Martin can indulge to the max, their passion for the natural world. None of it totally impossible in the context of that period of history; but in the aggregate, pretty amazingly unlikely – requiring the willing suspension of disbelief to work overtime. Worth it, I suppose, in the interests of getting good stories. Another problem with O’Brian is if you’ve read Forester first (as I did). You can sympathize with O’Brian. Back in 1969 when he was first starting on his Jack Aubrey books, the 800 lb gorilla of the genre was Horatio Hornblower (the last Hornblower books had been published in 1967). And I can appreciate why an author starting a new series with a new character in the same setting would dread comparisons. But it’s almost comical to see what lengths O’Brian went to in _Master and Commander_ to establish that Jack Aubrey is not Horatio Hornblower dammit! It’s like O’Brian made a list of every personality trait and quirk that Hornblower had and made sure to give Aubrey the opposite. ---
**Author:** ![vontsira](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/v/51bf81/32.png) [@vontsira](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/vontsira)\ **Post date:** [July 20, 2013, 7:19am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/master-commander-the-book-question-whats-a-prize-agent/663702/39 "2013-07-20T07:19:29Z")
I understand that there can be a bit of polarisation in Napoleonic-fiction fandom, between Forester-ites and O’Brian-ites. (I could never get on very well with Forester’s writing, whether about “sea or land”.) In recent decades, there seems in fact to have arisen in the wake of the two giants, almost a multitude of Napoleonic-Wars-Royal-Navy fiction series. Dudley Pope’s “Ramage” novels come to mind. I actually don’t have a lot of use for Pope’s stuff – find it rather dull and trite, and off-puttingly info-dump-ish. I sometimes feel that it would be a nice change to have such a set of novels from the point of view of the other side, i.e. the French navy. (The captain could be, personally, a sympathetic character, regardless of the cause for which he was fighting.) If one were a would-be author in this genre… For all I know, there _is_ a French Forester or O’Brian, doing his stuff which happens not to have been translated into English. I rather get the impression, though, that the French don’t “do” war-centred fiction as entertainment, in the mannner which we Anglophones are fond of. ---
**Author:** ![Little\_Nemo](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/little_nemo/32/3120_2.png) [@Little\_Nemo](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Little_Nemo)\ **Post date:** [July 20, 2013, 11:11am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/master-commander-the-book-question-whats-a-prize-agent/663702/40 "2013-07-20T11:11:00Z")
> [@vontsira](#): > > I understand that there can be a bit of polarisation in Napoleonic-fiction fandom, between Forester-ites and O’Brian-ites. (I could never get on very well with Forester’s writing, whether about “sea or land”.) In recent decades, there seems in fact to have arisen in the wake of the two giants, almost a multitude of Napoleonic-Wars-Royal-Navy fiction series. Dudley Pope’s “Ramage” novels come to mind. I actually don’t have a lot of use for Pope’s stuff – find it rather dull and trite, and off-puttingly info-dump-ish. Yes, Forester and O’Brian are the two big dogs of the genre. And I think O’Brian is now the champ. The Hornblower books are all rather dated to modern readers. In addition to Forester, O’Brian, and Pope, there’s also Douglas Reeman (using the pseudonym Alexander Kent) who writes the Richard Bolitho series; C. Northcote Parkinson, who wrote the Richard Delancey series; Dewey Lambdin, who writes the Alan Lewrie series; James L. Nelson, who writes the Isaac Biddlecomb series; and Richard Woodman, who writes the Nathaniel Drinkwater series. > [@vontsira](#): > > I sometimes feel that it would be a nice change to have such a set of novels from the point of view of the other side, i.e. the French navy. (The captain could be, personally, a sympathetic character, regardless of the cause for which he was fighting.) If one were a would-be author in this genre… For all I know, there _is_ a French Forester or O’Brian, doing his stuff which happens not to have been translated into English. I rather get the impression, though, that the French don’t “do” war-centred fiction as entertainment, in the mannner which we Anglophones are fond of. I think the problem is the French navy historically didn’t do all that much. The British pretty much blockaded France throughout the Napoleonic wars. So a book about about a French captain would have him sitting in pot for month after month, waiting for orders to sail. There have been some books written about American captains of this era. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/master-commander-the-book-question-whats-a-prize-agent/663702.md?page=1) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/master-commander-the-book-question-whats-a-prize-agent/663702.md?page=3)