# "Matrix Theory" vs. the Mighty Ducks: What went wrong **URL:** \ **Category:** Miscellaneous and Personal Stuff I Must Share\ **Created:** [June 10, 2003, 8:46pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/matrix-theory-vs-the-mighty-ducks-what-went-wrong/180961 "2003-06-10T20:46:56Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 1
**Author:** ![KGS](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/k/90ced4/32.png) [@KGS](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/KGS)\ **Post date:** [June 10, 2003, 8:46pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/matrix-theory-vs-the-mighty-ducks-what-went-wrong/180961/1 "2003-06-10T20:46:56Z")
Ok, here we go. To recap for those who missed the drama of 6/9/3, it all started when KGS (yes I’m referring to myself in the 3rd person deliberately, because it is necessary to do so…hey Bob Dole did it, why can’t I?) was instructed by guiding voices to post a silly yet what he felt was an appropriate thread in GQ (which was his FIRST mistake…) in which he describes in detail a particular vision he had: [http://boards.straightdope.com/sdmb/showthread.php?s=&threadid=189586](http://boards.straightdope.com/sdmb/showthread.php?s=&threadid=189586) …which received a number of serious and intriguing responses, albeit ones that made it clear that a transfer to GD was imminent. INSTEAD, **manhattan** (a problem child of a mod if ever there was one, and I speak from FACT and experience, I remember full well when he had to take a break from mod duties because he was, well, losing his grip) chose to lock the thread, and took a few totally misguided potshots at me and my beliefs, which I still believe were completely uncalled for (to say the least!) Naturally, I was pissed, and felt driven to open a BBQ PIt Thread (my SECOND big mistake): [http://boards.straightdope.com/sdmb/showthread.php?s=&threadid=189586](http://boards.straightdope.com/sdmb/showthread.php?s=&threadid=189586) …in which manhattan, and several other wolves and psychic vampires, leapt into the fray and, well, tore KGS to shreds. Clearly, there are evil people in the world, and The Pit is where they hang out, and they take absolute delight in goading a person to a complete and total “meltdown”, all for their amusement. [Note to GD mods: Please allow me some leeway if I happen to cross the line for what’s appropriate for GD, as well as the potential respondants. Emotions are still running high in both camps, and I, at least, will make every attempt to keep it within the rules, but may occasionally slip here and there. A simple warning will suffice…at least, for the 1st offence.] The irony is, all this bullshit could have been avoided if a mod (other than manny) had merely moved the original thread to GD and let it go from there. Since this tiny box is way too difficult to write in, esp. with the URLs screwing up the margins, I will post this and start the OP as a reply to this “pre-OP”, if you like. (PLease nobody respond until I do so.) Oh, and keep in mind…when I refer to “Matrix Theory”, or simply say “Matrix”, I am referring to MY OWN PERSONAL THEORY which has been worked on since 1987 or thereabouts, and NOT the movies “Matrix”, or “Matrix Reloaded”, or the forthcoming “Matrix Revolutions” which are FICTION and should be taken as such. Please, remember that. Ok… ---
**Author:** ![PatriotX](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/p/c4cdca/32.png) [@PatriotX](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/PatriotX)\ **Post date:** [June 10, 2003, 8:51pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/matrix-theory-vs-the-mighty-ducks-what-went-wrong/180961/2 "2003-06-10T20:51:25Z")
Ummm… the debate is? ---
**Author:** ![KGS](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/k/90ced4/32.png) [@KGS](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/KGS)\ **Post date:** [June 10, 2003, 9:02pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/matrix-theory-vs-the-mighty-ducks-what-went-wrong/180961/3 "2003-06-10T21:02:36Z")
It all started when I made a prediction about the final Devils/Ducks game. (Refer to the GQ thread for details.) Unfortunately, the prediction was obviously incorrect. I’ve thought long and hard WHY it went wrong, and here are the possibilities I’ve come up with: \*\*1. The outcome of the game was never predetermined, the future is completely random, “true visions” do not exist, and there was no way any human being could predict the outcome. 1. The vision was real, but misinterpreted. (This is my most likely working theory.) For instance, I missed it badly when I described the “Gold Rhythm” striking the CITY OF ANAHEIM, when in fact the final game took place in New Jersey (when I thought it would be at the Pond, my bad.) So all this means is, I saw the future, but the 2nd “Gold Rhythm” went somewhere else. Where? I’m still puzzling that out. 2. The vision was real, the outcome was pretermined, BUT – the mere act of me posting my vision in an unconscionably cocky way, and for whatever reason, certain powers and forces decided to CHANGE THE FUTURE, for varying reasons that I will elaborate on if anyone asks. Ok, let’s debate this. Also, let’s debate my “basic Matrix Theory”, which, to recap went something like this (in the BBQ Thread): > [@](#): > > The best explanation I’ve ever come up with is the analogy of a TV screen. Our 3-D world which we live, die, work and play in, exists on the face of the 2-D tv screen. Beneath the screen – the world we cannot see (or rather, MOST people cannot see) – lie the Rhythms, which form and shape the Matrix. (This is strikingly close to the Wokowski (sp?) brothers’ vision of the MOVIE Matrix, except in my original theory, “The Matrix” ONLY applied to the world beneath, not the TV screen itself. Since '99, it’s kind of evolved to represent the whole of the universe itself. The word “Matrix”, anyway. > > I do NOT believe that we are all really plugged into machines that use our body heat for energy. That, to use a word that triggered this whole mess, is just plain STUPID. What’s the truth, then? Hell if I know. We _can’t_ know. At least, not until we die. But human beings by their very nature require a working theory in absence of tactile fact, so here’s mine: it’s all a Game. We are here to learn lessons, to be the architects of Purpose, or to just plain have fun. Sometimes I can tell which kind of person is which, just by seeing how they act, if they are conflicted or if they are at peace, or if they are struggling “up the corporate ladder”, as it were. > > That’s basically it. Oh, and by the way, the reason I make constant illusions to films & TV and such (esp. the Matrix movies), is because that is the world I live in, and that is the world MOST people live in…at least, my circle of friends in the REAL world. And making analogies to movies & other works of art is how I try and explain my far-out beliefs to laymen, because most people I know are NOT as well-read as most of the Doper community is. (For what is worth, **ratty** is write – I need to get out and feed my brain more.) Let the debate commence… ---
**Author:** ![Loopus](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/loopus/32/15343_2.png) [@Loopus](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Loopus)\ **Post date:** [June 10, 2003, 9:08pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/matrix-theory-vs-the-mighty-ducks-what-went-wrong/180961/4 "2003-06-10T21:08:51Z")
As the one making an extraordinary claim, the burden of proof is with you. What evidence do you have for any of your theories? In the absence of evidence, we ought to employ Occam’s Razor, which tells us that the simplest explanation is usually the correct one. This would suggest that the future is not predetermined and that the real world is exactly as it appears. ---
**Author:** ![Tars\_Tarkas](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/6a8cbe/32.png) [@Tars\_Tarkas](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Tars_Tarkas)\ **Post date:** [June 10, 2003, 9:09pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/matrix-theory-vs-the-mighty-ducks-what-went-wrong/180961/5 "2003-06-10T21:09:50Z")
Matrix is from WB, Mighty Ducks are Disney, Disney and WB can only co-exist in the Roger Rabbit-verse, so you should have realized your dream meant the opposite of what it said. ---
**Author:** ![Greyson3](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/g/258eb7/32.png) [@Greyson3](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Greyson3)\ **Post date:** [June 10, 2003, 9:10pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/matrix-theory-vs-the-mighty-ducks-what-went-wrong/180961/6 "2003-06-10T21:10:53Z")
I know a [better theory](http://www.timecube.com/). ---
**Author:** ![KGS](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/k/90ced4/32.png) [@KGS](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/KGS)\ **Post date:** [June 10, 2003, 9:19pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/matrix-theory-vs-the-mighty-ducks-what-went-wrong/180961/7 "2003-06-10T21:19:16Z")
Hmm, I thought some people in GD and The Pit threads were really interested in this topic. Was I misled? Or have they not woken up yet? **Tars Tarkas** makes a good point. I _did_ get a lot of things wrong. For instance (as I think I already said), the meteor in my vision struck ANAHEIM, not New Jersey. And I am not here to PROVE anything! I am here for DEBATE. Like I said in the Pit thread, “Matrix Theory” is a work-in-progress, and I’m calling on the wisdom and acumen of the Dopers to help point out flaws in my logic and direct me to what conclusion is the most likely one. (Occam’s Razor is good, and I would agree with that, if it weren’t for visions of mine [and other people] that HAVE come true.) And let’s field questions about “Matrix Theory”, ok? I’m willing to discuss that, and get away from the whole visions crap, because obviously most people have pre-determined beliefs that visions are NEVER real, PERIOD, whereas in ancient times, visionaries (such as Joseph, Daniel, and that whacky Jesus guy) were taken as the real deal. Yes, I know, the world has changed since then…but what was acceptable in the past and unacceptable in the present, does not necessarily make it a bunch of hooey. ---
**Author:** ![Zabali\_Clawbane](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/z/ecd19e/32.png) [@Zabali\_Clawbane](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Zabali_Clawbane)\ **Post date:** [June 10, 2003, 9:24pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/matrix-theory-vs-the-mighty-ducks-what-went-wrong/180961/8 "2003-06-10T21:24:11Z")
Just stating a fact here. Threads aren’t moved very often because the SDMB servers can’t take the extra strain. As stated [in this thread.](http://boards.straightdope.com/sdmb/showthread.php?s=&threadid=186323) > [@](#): > > Originally posted by Jeff Olsen closing threads instead of moving them is pretty common around here. Over three million active posts puts enough strain on the servers as it is without moving any threads around. Sorry to dig that one back up, Manny. Thought it was necessary to make the point though. Forgive? 🙂 ---
**Author:** ![BrightNShiny](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/7bcc69/32.png) [@BrightNShiny](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/BrightNShiny)\ **Post date:** [June 10, 2003, 9:30pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/matrix-theory-vs-the-mighty-ducks-what-went-wrong/180961/9 "2003-06-10T21:30:35Z")
Here’s another possibility: Your vision was produced by your brain based on a combination of sleep and hunger deprivation and your own personal experiences. Therefore, your vision is based on your _past_ experiences. It says nothing about the future or whether or not the future is predetermined. ---
**Author:** ![Zabali\_Clawbane](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/z/ecd19e/32.png) [@Zabali\_Clawbane](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Zabali_Clawbane)\ **Post date:** [June 10, 2003, 9:31pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/matrix-theory-vs-the-mighty-ducks-what-went-wrong/180961/10 "2003-06-10T21:31:58Z")
Um, \*\*KGS \*\* this forum is based on the premise of presenting points, and counter points. To do this, you need to “present your case” with FACTS, that can either be proved or disproved. That is what “debate” generally means in referrance to this forum as far as I have observed. _Puts down 2 cp, and walks away._ ---
**Author:** ![hansel](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/h/6bbea6/32.png) [@hansel](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/hansel)\ **Post date:** [June 10, 2003, 9:32pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/matrix-theory-vs-the-mighty-ducks-what-went-wrong/180961/11 "2003-06-10T21:32:37Z")
Your list of possibilities misses one: [list=4] 4. Predestination aside, my vision was simply bunk, a brain-fart, a meaningless discharge of electricity in my brain that took semi-coherent form for the same reason that dreams do: because pattern-matching and cognitive synthesis are what our brains do. [/list=4] ---
**Author:** ![Joe\_Random](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/j/e8c25b/32.png) [@Joe\_Random](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Joe_Random)\ **Post date:** [June 10, 2003, 9:33pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/matrix-theory-vs-the-mighty-ducks-what-went-wrong/180961/12 "2003-06-10T21:33:15Z")
> [@](#): > > \*Originally posted by KGS \* > **Like I said in the Pit thread, “Matrix Theory” is a work-in-progress, and I’m calling on the wisdom and acumen of the Dopers to help point out flaws in my logic and direct me to what conclusion is the most likely one.** Flaws in your logic? The only flaw I see is that you don’t appear to be using logic at all. Just WAGs and hypotheses based on what appears to be wishful thinking. > [@](#): > > **(Occam’s Razor is good, and I would agree with that, if it weren’t for visions of mine [and other people] that HAVE come true.)** Yeah, and if you flip a coin, and I randomly call out either “heads” or “tails”, I’ll eventually get it right. Does that makes me psychic? Am I predicting the future? Or is it just a coincidence? > [@](#): > > \*\*I’m willing to discuss that, and get away from the whole visions crap, because obviously most people have pre-determined beliefs that visions are NEVER real, PERIOD, whereas in ancient times, visionaries (such as Joseph, Daniel, and that whacky Jesus guy) were taken as the real deal. Yes, I know, the world has changed since then…but what was acceptable in the past and unacceptable in the present, does not necessarily make it a bunch of hooey. \*\* When something has no supporting evidence (anecdototal evidence doesn’t count), and seems to fly in the face of all logic and reason that we now possess, then of _course_ we’re going to thinh it’s a bunch of hooey! If you were to propose some method to test your visions, and the results were significantly more correct that educated guesses from people who have similiar levels of information concerning the event in question, then you might be on to something. ---
**Author:** ![Loopus](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/loopus/32/15343_2.png) [@Loopus](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Loopus)\ **Post date:** [June 10, 2003, 9:33pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/matrix-theory-vs-the-mighty-ducks-what-went-wrong/180961/13 "2003-06-10T21:33:27Z")
> [@](#): > > \*Originally posted by KGS \* > **And I am not here to PROVE anything! I am here for DEBATE. Like I said in the Pit thread, “Matrix Theory” is a work-in-progress, and I’m calling on the wisdom and acumen of the Dopers to help point out flaws in my logic and direct me to what conclusion is the most likely one. (Occam’s Razor is good, and I would agree with that, if it weren’t for visions of mine [and other people] that HAVE come true.)** Of course _some_ “visions” are going to “come true.” We live in an infinite universe with infinite possibilities, so there are going to be a few coincidences. What interests me most with people who have visions is not whether they have any that come true, but what their success rate is. If only 3% of their 100s of visions come true, I’m not impressed. If it were, say, 98% of a significant sample size of predictions of random events, I would be intrigued. However, if you’re here to debate beliefs that you feel can’t be proven, I’m not interested. If you have no proof for your wild beliefs, why should we even debate them? ---
**Author:** ![KGS](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/k/90ced4/32.png) [@KGS](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/KGS)\ **Post date:** [June 10, 2003, 9:33pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/matrix-theory-vs-the-mighty-ducks-what-went-wrong/180961/14 "2003-06-10T21:33:49Z")
Oh, and regarding #3 (which is more fanciful, but hey, “Great Debates” is what this type of theory-making is all about) here are possibilites of what went wrong: 1. The future may be pretermined, but by the Laws of the Matrix (not the movie, again) revealing such knowledge is dangerous, and the Powers That Be had to “fix” that, as well as bitch-slap me for breaking the rules. 2. The future was NOT pretermined, but certain forces in play were leading up to a Ducks victory, and I saw that. Unfortunately, the balance got thrown off somehow. Posting my GD/BBQ threads had some effect, but also, certain other events, both outside and within, “reversed” the outcome. 3. (this is the whackiest one, so bear with me) While watching the game, I decided to go “on the Matrix” (that is, become reactive to the various Rhythms) and take notes on what I saw. Problem was, I had a lot of things backwards (for instance, I had trouble telling the teams apart, since I’m used to seeing the Ducks in their home uniforms of green and white, instead of green and purple) – and in the process, I tried to pull certain “forbidden” information out of the “Matrix” (especially one in particular, which resulted in the first NJ score!) I know, this sounds like complete and utter lunacy. But there IS a method to my madness. I’m hoping the wolves (who have already arrived in droves, apparently) will relent long enough until the people who are REALLY interested in this topic arrive – I get the feeling that most of them haven’t woken up yet. ---
**Author:** ![Morbo](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/morbo/32/389_2.png) [@Morbo](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Morbo)\ **Post date:** [June 10, 2003, 9:34pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/matrix-theory-vs-the-mighty-ducks-what-went-wrong/180961/15 "2003-06-10T21:34:05Z")
I’ve got some serious money on the Cardinals / Red Sox series coming up. I realize that, according to [you](http://boards.straightdope.com/sdmb/showthread.php?s=&postid=3544675#post3544675), a demonic attack from the Red Matrix has taken place, but I can’t figure out if the demonic Red Matrix swears allegiance to the “Red” Sox, or the “Red” Birds. Can you help me out? ---
**Author:** ![KGS](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/k/90ced4/32.png) [@KGS](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/KGS)\ **Post date:** [June 10, 2003, 9:37pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/matrix-theory-vs-the-mighty-ducks-what-went-wrong/180961/16 "2003-06-10T21:37:53Z")
> [@](#): > > \*Originally posted by BrightNShiny \* > \*\*Here’s another possibility: > > Your vision was produced by your brain based on a combination of sleep and hunger deprivation and your own personal experiences. Therefore, your vision is based on your _past_ experiences. It says nothing about the future or whether or not the future is predetermined. \*\* You are dead on right. After all, the other three things I saw that were affected (NJ fire, Challenger, Angels victory) all were in the PAST. I’m definitely more deft at making connections with events that have already happened, especially ones that affect me personally. And PLEASE, everyone else, bear with me. This thread is moving VERY fast and I want to reply to each post individually (the serious ones, at least) so if it sounds like I haven’t read the complete thread when I make a post, it’s because I haven’t. ---
**Author:** ![KGS](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/k/90ced4/32.png) [@KGS](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/KGS)\ **Post date:** [June 10, 2003, 9:43pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/matrix-theory-vs-the-mighty-ducks-what-went-wrong/180961/17 "2003-06-10T21:43:11Z")
> [@](#): > > \*Originally posted by Dooku \* > \*\*I’ve got some serious money on the Cardinals / Red Sox series coming up. I realize that, according to [you](http://boards.straightdope.com/sdmb/showthread.php?s=&postid=3544675#post3544675), a demonic attack from the Red Matrix has taken place, but I can’t figure out if the demonic Red Matrix swears allegiance to the “Red” Sox, or the “Red” Birds. > > Can you help me out? \*\* Unfortunately, no. I’m not a baseball fan, and just because a “Red Rhythm” is in play here, doesn’t necessarily mean that one “Red” team will win over the other one. Besides, I am no psychic (clearly!) and I’m only any good at things that interesect my life at certain tangents. (Yes, I know that sounds narcissistic, but the truth is, it is everyone’s own responsibility to determine their own outcomes and world views.) I think this is going well so far… ---
**Author:** ![Apos](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/838e76/32.png) [@Apos](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Apos)\ **Post date:** [June 10, 2003, 9:46pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/matrix-theory-vs-the-mighty-ducks-what-went-wrong/180961/18 "2003-06-10T21:46:17Z")
I think the debate is: which forum did THIS post actually belong in? ---
**Author:** ![KGS](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/k/90ced4/32.png) [@KGS](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/KGS)\ **Post date:** [June 10, 2003, 9:48pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/matrix-theory-vs-the-mighty-ducks-what-went-wrong/180961/19 "2003-06-10T21:48:55Z")
Oh, and in the original GQ thread, **Joe Random** said, “You’ve set up your belief system such that it is \*unavoidably tautological./i]” (Italics mine) A big word, I had to look it up 🙂 but what he apparently meant was, my theory boils down to “Whatever is, is.” (I think that’s a **Yes** song…GREAT band btw…and they deal a lot with Eastern mysticism.) Which, if you think about it, is what ALL OF IT boils down to. How do we know, that this whole universe is NOT just a dream of the Gods? (And once again, **ratty** is right, I do need to study other religions & scientific principles more. My mother tells me that my theories smack of Hinduism, and since she is a born-Again Christian who is highly prejudiced against other religious theories [esp. Hinduism], I wish I had some ammo to refute the things she says.) ---
**Author:** ![pepperlandgirl](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/p/f17d59/32.png) [@pepperlandgirl](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/pepperlandgirl)\ **Post date:** [June 10, 2003, 10:02pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/matrix-theory-vs-the-mighty-ducks-what-went-wrong/180961/20 "2003-06-10T22:02:27Z")
**KGS** , out of curiosity, how old are you? [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/matrix-theory-vs-the-mighty-ducks-what-went-wrong/180961.md?page=2)