# Maureen Dowd and "You Lie, Boy" **URL:** \ **Category:** Great Debates\ **Created:** [September 16, 2009, 1:16pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/maureen-dowd-and-you-lie-boy/510314 "2009-09-16T13:16:10Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 10\ **Page:** 7
**Author:** ![Cisco](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/ccd318/32.png) [@Cisco](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Cisco)\ **Post date:** [September 19, 2009, 6:34am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/maureen-dowd-and-you-lie-boy/510314/121 "2009-09-19T06:34:15Z")
Doesn’t one of the kids yell “You lie!” in _Stand By Me_? ---
**Author:** ![DanBlather](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/f4b2a3/32.png) [@DanBlather](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/DanBlather)\ **Post date:** [September 19, 2009, 10:01am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/maureen-dowd-and-you-lie-boy/510314/122 "2009-09-19T10:01:16Z")
Joyce wrote a whole book based on it; _You Lie-cese_. ---
**Author:** ![Evil\_One](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/45deac/32.png) [@Evil\_One](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Evil_One)\ **Post date:** [September 19, 2009, 5:03pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/maureen-dowd-and-you-lie-boy/510314/123 "2009-09-19T17:03:49Z")
> [@CalMeacham](#): > > I’m perfectly aware of that – my question is "Why did she hear that “boy” appended to “you lie”. Is/was “You lie, boy” a common put-down in the south, so common that she automatically completed the sentence? Otherwise I don’t get why she “seemed to hear it”. Because she is desperate to discredit those who disagree with her. She’s following this line of logic. A. The people that disagree with me are idiots. B. Racists are the ultimate idiots in our PC society. C. Therefore, people who disagree with me are racists since the President is black. ---
**Author:** ![Sage\_Rat](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/sage_rat/32/399_2.png) [@Sage\_Rat](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Sage_Rat)\ **Post date:** [September 19, 2009, 5:17pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/maureen-dowd-and-you-lie-boy/510314/124 "2009-09-19T17:17:03Z")
> [@lalenin](#): > > You can always make a case that any individual may be a racist. But it is still a dangerous argument, much like in previous administrations the charge of “unpatriotic” or “unamerican” was used to label those who disagreed with the policies of the time. Dangerous and yet very successful. ---
**Author:** ![Squink](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/b5e925/32.png) [@Squink](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Squink)\ **Post date:** [September 19, 2009, 5:32pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/maureen-dowd-and-you-lie-boy/510314/125 "2009-09-19T17:32:25Z")
> [@Evil\_One](#): > > Because she is desperate to discredit those who disagree with her. But Wilson _already_ discredited himself by showing an utter lack of civility. I’m more inclined to take Carter’s word than Dowd’s on the racism angle, but it seems even [Minority Leader John Boehner](http://www.politico.com/news/stories/0909/27254.html) agrees that Wilson behaved jerkishly: > [@](#): > > John Boehner spent much of last week trying to persuade a stubborn Rep. Joe Wilson to apologize to the House — telling associates he needed to “get to” Wilson before the weekend to elicit an apology. > > But as the days dragged on, Boehner had to back off: Wilson’s spine was stiffened by $1.5 million in campaign contributions, the Democrats’ anti-Wilson rhetoric had become increasingly extreme, and the South Carolina Republican was rapidly accumulating support from the conference’s dominant right wing. > > “At some point, he realized he had no choice but to get behind Wilson because that’s where his conference was going — and he was just so angry that the Democrats had pushed this thing so far,” said a GOP aide with knowledge of the situation. ---
**Author:** ![PBear42](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/p/ecccb3/32.png) [@PBear42](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/PBear42)\ **Post date:** [September 20, 2009, 6:37am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/maureen-dowd-and-you-lie-boy/510314/126 "2009-09-20T06:37:19Z")
I agree with **DanBlather** that whether “You lie!” is a natural grammatical construction comprises no part of Dowd’s argument (reread the link in the OP). Further, I will add it sounds like a perfectly natural spontaneous verbal interjection to me. No cite. Where the heck would one find a cite for this sort of thing, anyway. Just my own ear, based on many years using and listening to the languge. BTW, I’m an Obama supporter and an advocate of UHC. No apologist for Wilson. OTOH, nor do I think playing the race card is a good thing. Just commenting on this one narrow issue. ---
**Author:** ![Captain\_Amazing](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/6de8d8/32.png) [@Captain\_Amazing](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Captain_Amazing)\ **Post date:** [September 20, 2009, 7:42am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/maureen-dowd-and-you-lie-boy/510314/127 "2009-09-20T07:42:02Z")
> [@Squink](#): > > But Wilson _already_ discredited himself by showing an utter lack of civility. > I’m more inclined to take Carter’s word than Dowd’s on the racism angle, but it seems even [Minority Leader John Boehner](http://www.politico.com/news/stories/0909/27254.html) agrees that Wilson behaved jerkishly: It sort of sounds from that account that Wilson just said it, and then it became such a big controversy that he got swept up by events. The situation got so polarizing so quickly that Wilson really couldn’t back down and apologize, without alienating the people who were supporting him and making the Democrats feel like they won. ---
**Author:** ![njtt](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/n/ecd19e/32.png) [@njtt](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/njtt)\ **Post date:** [September 20, 2009, 8:04am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/maureen-dowd-and-you-lie-boy/510314/128 "2009-09-20T08:04:52Z")
It seems to me that the real racism here lies in the obsessive concern that no illegal immigrant (read, Mexican, or other Dago) should _ever_ be allowed to benefit from an American government supported health care system. The mindset seems to be that it is better to pour billions of dollars into the coffers of insurance and drug companies, and better that millions of American citizens go uninsured, than to risk the possibility that one of “those people” might be helped at taxpayer expense. ---
**Author:** ![Zoe](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/z/a4c791/32.png) [@Zoe](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Zoe)\ **Post date:** [September 20, 2009, 8:54am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/maureen-dowd-and-you-lie-boy/510314/129 "2009-09-20T08:54:04Z")
I’ve checked several dictionary resources and have been unable to find any that describe the use of _boy_ to address or insult a black adult male as being primarily in the South. It was certainly used in the South. And it was used in the North. I heard it used frequently in movies where it was customary to call train porters “boy” even if they were older gentlemen. Are you all truly unaware of the racial prejudice in the North? You can be rude by calling a man a _boy_ and you can be rude by whitewashing and stereotyping regions of the country. Some of you really have a blind spot about what life was like for blacks in the North prior to 1964. We all know how horrible it was in the South. As for the statement “you lie, boy,” there was something a little familiar about it and it finally came to me. In my childhood in the South, I sometimes heard an expression “You lie, white dog.” I hadn’t thought about it in fifty years. I googled it to be sure that I wasn’t just dreaming. I found two hits. ---
**Author:** ![Shot\_From\_Guns](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/ccd318/32.png) [@Shot\_From\_Guns](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Shot_From_Guns)\ **Post date:** [September 21, 2009, 5:21pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/maureen-dowd-and-you-lie-boy/510314/130 "2009-09-21T17:21:29Z")
> [@PBear42](#): > > I agree with **DanBlather** that whether “You lie!” is a natural grammatical construction comprises no part of Dowd’s argument (reread the link in the OP). Psh, why the hell would I want to actually \*\*read \*\*something by Dowd, who I’m generally not a fan of, when I could just jump right into the discussion here based on how people are characterizing it? 😉 [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/maureen-dowd-and-you-lie-boy/510314.md?page=6)