# May I have a moment of your time, scott evil? **URL:** \ **Category:** The BBQ Pit\ **Created:** [July 17, 2002, 1:46am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/may-i-have-a-moment-of-your-time-scott-evil/119324 "2002-07-17T01:46:41Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 5
**Author:** ![Mockingbird](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/c68b51/32.png) [@Mockingbird](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Mockingbird)\ **Post date:** [July 17, 2002, 4:12pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/may-i-have-a-moment-of-your-time-scott-evil/119324/81 "2002-07-17T16:12:44Z")
> [@](#): > > \*Originally posted by minty green \* > \*\*\*\*Matt:\*\*So, precisely which “powerful majority” member claimed oppression? I called **Hastur** on acting like a jerk by employing an offensive slur, not for oppressing me or anybody else. > > **Hastur:** Nigger jokes aren’t funny either. \*\* No shit, Dick Tracy. You want to be hyper offended by a joking question, fine. What does it serve to beat the horse when it has already reached putrefaction and you still are not getting what you want? ---
**Author:** ![minty\_green](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/f6c823/32.png) [@minty\_green](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/minty_green)\ **Post date:** [July 17, 2002, 4:15pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/may-i-have-a-moment-of-your-time-scott-evil/119324/82 "2002-07-17T16:15:56Z")
An admission that you’re a complete dickhead who thinks that using slurs is acceptable if the targeted group happens to be a favored majority? I really wasn’t expecting it. ---
**Author:** ![matt\_mcl](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/7ab992/32.png) [@matt\_mcl](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/matt_mcl)\ **Post date:** [July 17, 2002, 4:18pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/may-i-have-a-moment-of-your-time-scott-evil/119324/83 "2002-07-17T16:18:58Z")
Offensive slurs are a form of oppression when used to create a climate of fear. ---
**Author:** ![Trion](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/ccd318/32.png) [@Trion](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Trion)\ **Post date:** [July 17, 2002, 4:21pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/may-i-have-a-moment-of-your-time-scott-evil/119324/84 "2002-07-17T16:21:25Z")
> [@](#): > > Not quite - it’s disingenuous for a powerful majority to claim to be oppressed by a disempowered minority. As others have pointed out, we aren’t talking oppression, we’re talking civility. Courtesy. And who should be treated in a respectful manner. > [@](#): > > But you get points for trying. Spare me your points. I would rather that people tried harder. ---
**Author:** ![minty\_green](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/f6c823/32.png) [@minty\_green](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/minty_green)\ **Post date:** [July 17, 2002, 4:21pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/may-i-have-a-moment-of-your-time-scott-evil/119324/85 "2002-07-17T16:21:26Z")
Yes, matt, but they’re also offensive independently of any intent to create a climate of fear. ---
**Author:** ![Hamadryad](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/h/6de8d8/32.png) [@Hamadryad](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Hamadryad)\ **Post date:** [July 17, 2002, 4:33pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/may-i-have-a-moment-of-your-time-scott-evil/119324/86 "2002-07-17T16:33:37Z")
> [@](#): > > \*Originally posted by matt\_mcl \* > \*\*I wasn’t aware that WalMart was bisexual or heterosexual space. For what it’s worth, I am not offended, threatened, or otherwise discomfited by straight smoochage in a gay bar. But I presume that QueenAl is referring to the concept of safe space, which has been discussed at length without arriving at any particular conclusion. \*\* It’s not that Wal\*Mart is bi- or heterosexual space…I was just trying to think of a really mainstream public area and that’s the first that came to mind. I hadn’t really thought of the “safe space” issue…and I can see where strict Kinsey 6’s would want areas in which Kinsey 1-5’s were not particularly welcome. I can **see** it, but I can also see where a “straights only” space would be roundly condemned, and the contradiction disturbs me. I understand it and because of vast injustices and cruelties I can’t really fault it; but it disturbs me. I’m hopelessly naive and I know this. I know that the world doesn’t work this way, but I desperately wish it didn’t. And I have avoided ANY gay events for a few YEARS because I was so tired of being looked down on for being female and unwilling to give up penis. And having the audacity to marry a man. I made t-shirts that say “50% gay; 50% straight; 100% QUEER!” I ought to start a business selling not-so-goddamned-serious bisexual gear. I think far too many of us are as ham-handedly earnest as I. 😃 So in short: Thank you, and I can see QueenAl’s point now…but that doesn’t make me any happier that it seems necessary. (And as a side note, girls who are only bi because they know it turns on men are vile to me.) ---
**Author:** ![matt\_mcl](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/7ab992/32.png) [@matt\_mcl](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/matt_mcl)\ **Post date:** [July 17, 2002, 4:38pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/may-i-have-a-moment-of-your-time-scott-evil/119324/87 "2002-07-17T16:38:15Z")
I’m having trouble seeing that a word that’s never been used to create a climate of fear could qualify as offensive in the first place. But if your delicate sensibilities are sent all-aquiver by the graphism “str8,” I’m sure Hastur will consider apologizing for so discomfiting you. ---
**Author:** ![minty\_green](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/f6c823/32.png) [@minty\_green](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/minty_green)\ **Post date:** [July 17, 2002, 5:11pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/may-i-have-a-moment-of-your-time-scott-evil/119324/88 "2002-07-17T17:11:52Z")
My senistivities as an English teacher are certainly set off by “str8,” but I don’t object to it for any other reason. We’re talking about the derogatory epithet “breeders,” matt. And could you take a moment to explain why “intent to create a climate of fear” is a prerequisite for “offensive”? Shoot, I _intend_ to be offensive to Hastur when I call him an asshole, but that word has never been used to create a climate of fear, has it? ---
**Author:** ![matt\_mcl](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/7ab992/32.png) [@matt\_mcl](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/matt_mcl)\ **Post date:** [July 17, 2002, 5:19pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/may-i-have-a-moment-of-your-time-scott-evil/119324/89 "2002-07-17T17:19:37Z")
Seems to me there are a few ways for a word to be offensive: 1. be a taboo word (the smallest category); 2. have been used to create a climate of fear; 3. have an offensive intent behind it. If you call Hastur an asshole, that’s #3, for example. Taboo words (such as “fuck”) have never been unacceptable in the Pit. “Breeder” has never been used to create a climate of fear. And Hastur specifically disavowed any offensive intent. Therefore it seems you’re claiming offense on awfully thin grounds. ---
**Author:** ![racinchikki](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/eada6e/32.png) [@racinchikki](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/racinchikki)\ **Post date:** [July 17, 2002, 5:20pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/may-i-have-a-moment-of-your-time-scott-evil/119324/90 "2002-07-17T17:20:52Z")
::sigh:: **Anthracite** had it right. I don’t feel personally oppressed or any such shit by the use of “breeder”. I just don’t think it’s _fair or respectful_ to use terminology that is a sexual, racial, ethnic, or religious slur. Why the FUCK is that so hard to understand? ---
**Author:** ![pldennison](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/p/9fc29f/32.png) [@pldennison](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/pldennison)\ **Post date:** [July 17, 2002, 5:21pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/may-i-have-a-moment-of-your-time-scott-evil/119324/91 "2002-07-17T17:21:19Z")
Since when is “climate of fear” the determining factor in whether something is offensive or not? Under that criterion, the following words are no longer, nor have they ever been, offensive: Honky Ofay Cunt Jackass Asshole Shit-for-brains Cracker White Trash I can go on for hours, of course, but I don’t need to. It’s a patently silly argument, and a baldly hypocritical one at that. It isn’t up to the speaker to determine if something is offensive or not, it’s up to the listener, which is **exactly why** so many of us “str8s” drag people like dalovindj over the coals for using “gay” the way he does, or stinkpalm for using “cocksucker.” I’ll jokingly refer to myself as a “breeder” in threads involving gay rights topics, but there is little doubt that the term is meant by the gay community to be derogatory. To claim otherwise is to be disingenuous in the extreme. ---
**Author:** ![Drastic](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/f9ae1b/32.png) [@Drastic](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Drastic)\ **Post date:** [July 17, 2002, 5:24pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/may-i-have-a-moment-of-your-time-scott-evil/119324/92 "2002-07-17T17:24:38Z")
Assholes are sometimes correlated with producing fearful climates. Technically, that has more to do with bad digestion and/or diet further upstream, but people do blame the messenger. ---
**Author:** ![wring](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/w/838e76/32.png) [@wring](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/wring)\ **Post date:** [July 17, 2002, 5:25pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/may-i-have-a-moment-of-your-time-scott-evil/119324/93 "2002-07-17T17:25:13Z")
is it your claim, **matt** that **only** when the speaker _intends_ offense, can it be considered offensive? Surely the recipient of the slur has a stake in if it should be considered offensive. ---
**Author:** ![minty\_green](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/f6c823/32.png) [@minty\_green](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/minty_green)\ **Post date:** [July 17, 2002, 5:32pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/may-i-have-a-moment-of-your-time-scott-evil/119324/94 "2002-07-17T17:32:37Z")
I seem to recall a poster who recently got banned in part over a couple threads where he employed the n-word, but disavowed any offensive intent. That’s a pretty weak argument when the speaker knows fully well that the word will be received as offensive. And Hastur certainly knew “breeders” would be received as offensive, or he would not have sarcastically asked whether we would prefer it to the merely stupid “str8.” ---
**Author:** ![Fenris](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/fenris/32/498_2.png) [@Fenris](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Fenris)\ **Post date:** [July 17, 2002, 5:41pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/may-i-have-a-moment-of-your-time-scott-evil/119324/95 "2002-07-17T17:41:41Z")
> [@](#): > > _Originally posted by QueenAl \* > \*\* > I had no idea ‘breeder’ was such a common pejorative term. Have any of you really been called that before? Still, I would hold back from using it now that I know people are offened by it._\* **QueenAl** : Only once. I’ve got a pal who’s gay and when I dared to comment on some “gay” issue or other (something about the St. Patrick’s Day parade I think.) I was informed that a “breeder” had no business commenting on the issue. But he’s a jackass anyway. **Hastur** : I know that you were making a joke and wasn’t offended by your comment. It was the idiotic followup comments that others made about how minorities somehow can’t be bigoted jerks like everyone else because they’re oppressed. :rolleyes: (Although I’ll stand by my “str8” comments! 😉 ) Fenris ---
**Author:** ![Mockingbird](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/c68b51/32.png) [@Mockingbird](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Mockingbird)\ **Post date:** [July 17, 2002, 7:16pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/may-i-have-a-moment-of-your-time-scott-evil/119324/96 "2002-07-17T19:16:53Z")
> [@](#): > > \*Originally posted by Fenris \* > \*\* > **Hastur** : I know that you were making a joke and wasn’t offended by your comment. It was the idiotic followup comments that others made about how minorities somehow can’t be bigoted jerks like everyone else because they’re oppressed. :rolleyes: (Although I’ll stand by my “str8” comments! 😉 ) > > Fenris \*\* That was not my point at all. My point was purely on the offensensitivity shown by minty green and others on a comment that was purely in jest, and was just a humorous suggestion and nothing more. Perhaps I did not express myself well, yet I will not apologize to prigs who want to see offensiveness where it was not intended, which many have seen quite clearly. ---
**Author:** ![Exgineer](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/a88e4f/32.png) [@Exgineer](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Exgineer)\ **Post date:** [July 17, 2002, 7:19pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/may-i-have-a-moment-of-your-time-scott-evil/119324/97 "2002-07-17T19:19:28Z")
> [@](#): > > Originally posted by **QueenAl** > I had no idea ‘breeder’ was such a common pejorative term. Have any of you really been called that before? Still, I would hold back from using it now that I know people are offened by it. Only once, but I wasn’t offended by the _word_ so much as the _tone_ the guy used. [snotty, superior voice dripping with contempt] “Well, what do you know? You’re just a breeder.” [/snotty, superior voice dripping with contempt] This was accompanied by the appropriate sneer/chin lift/peering down the nose expression. FWIW - the other two gay guys present took him to task for it. I just mentally labeled him an “asshole” and went on with things. ---
**Author:** ![Guinastasia](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/guinastasia/32/5751_2.png) [@Guinastasia](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Guinastasia)\ **Post date:** [July 17, 2002, 7:21pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/may-i-have-a-moment-of-your-time-scott-evil/119324/98 "2002-07-17T19:21:52Z")
**Kambucta** -that’s exactly what I meant. I was answering **Hastur** by saying it was a dead horse. Hehehe… BTW, I also hate seeing str8. I mean, what next? Is **scott** going to start typing lyke this u no? i mean that sux n it sounds lyke a teeny gurl. u no? 4 evR!!! GAAAHHH!!! ---
**Author:** ![Mockingbird](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/c68b51/32.png) [@Mockingbird](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Mockingbird)\ **Post date:** [July 17, 2002, 7:22pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/may-i-have-a-moment-of-your-time-scott-evil/119324/99 "2002-07-17T19:22:09Z")
> [@](#): > > \*Originally posted by minty green \* > \*\*I seem to recall a poster who recently got banned in part over a couple threads where he employed the n-word, but disavowed any offensive intent. That’s a pretty weak argument when the speaker knows fully well that the word will be received as offensive. And Hastur certainly knew “breeders” would be received as offensive, or he would not have sarcastically asked whether we would prefer it to the merely stupid “str8.” \*\* How dare you presume to know what I think. No, I did not see it as offensive, nor was I being sarcastic. You need to get over yourself and stop trying to see an attack where nothing exists. And regarding the spelling… **WHATEVER**. If you are going to take offense at spelling and the way some people choose to not use full words, you are going to be quite busy correcting people. Of course u may think I am wrong and IMHO, YMMV. ---
**Author:** ![Guinastasia](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/guinastasia/32/5751_2.png) [@Guinastasia](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Guinastasia)\ **Post date:** [July 17, 2002, 7:39pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/may-i-have-a-moment-of-your-time-scott-evil/119324/100 "2002-07-17T19:39:31Z")
**Hastur** -chat speak is EVIL. I have to deal with that shit from morons who invade El SAANo and the like. This place is supposed to be my haven away from that sort of thing. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/may-i-have-a-moment-of-your-time-scott-evil/119324.md?page=4) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/may-i-have-a-moment-of-your-time-scott-evil/119324.md?page=6)