# Maybe I am not so Agnostic after all? **URL:** \ **Category:** Miscellaneous and Personal Stuff I Must Share\ **Created:** [March 10, 2011, 12:20am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/maybe-i-am-not-so-agnostic-after-all/574108 "2011-03-10T00:20:57Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 9\ **Page:** 3
**Author:** ![Shagnasty](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/9dc877/32.png) [@Shagnasty](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Shagnasty)\ **Post date:** [March 21, 2011, 1:27am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/maybe-i-am-not-so-agnostic-after-all/574108/41 "2011-03-21T01:27:20Z")
> [@Diogenes\_the\_Cynic](#): > > If you’re using the word “miracle” in a more figurative sense, like “the miracle of childbirth,” then I wont contest the point, but it really has nothing to do with the theistic questions unless you think it literally needs a supernatural explanation. It is not figurative like childbirth. Most people know what causes that from the starting point forward. The same is not true of the Big Bang. It is not possible to know how the universe originated according to current laws of physics. Some of the hypotheses are downright odd if not metaphysical on their own. A more apt analogy would be if women started spontaneously giving birth randomly to new children with no clues about how they originated and the doctors saying they will never be able to explain it no matter how hard they try. The popular version of a strong atheist would say just do the best you can with the kid and don’t think about it further. The agnostic would do the same but recognize that there are some extreme fundamental gaps in knowledge with proof in their very hands. ---
**Author:** ![Diogenes\_the\_Cynic](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/e99b99/32.png) [@Diogenes\_the\_Cynic](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Diogenes_the_Cynic)\ **Post date:** [March 21, 2011, 1:41am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/maybe-i-am-not-so-agnostic-after-all/574108/42 "2011-03-21T01:41:51Z")
> [@Shagnasty](#): > > It is not figurative like childbirth. Most people know what causes that from the starting point forward. The same is not true of the Big Bang. It is not possible to know how the universe originated according to current laws of physics. This is simply not correct. We know exactly how it originated. ---
**Author:** ![Shagnasty](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/9dc877/32.png) [@Shagnasty](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Shagnasty)\ **Post date:** [March 21, 2011, 1:46am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/maybe-i-am-not-so-agnostic-after-all/574108/43 "2011-03-21T01:46:35Z")
> [@Diogenes\_the\_Cynic](#): > > This is simply not correct. We know exactly how it originated. Test question: Explain the origin of the universe according to the Big Bang model but be sure to emphasize how the Big Bang itself originated. If our common definitions of space and time don’t work at some point in you discussion, use others. Show your work. ---
**Author:** ![Diogenes\_the\_Cynic](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/e99b99/32.png) [@Diogenes\_the\_Cynic](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Diogenes_the_Cynic)\ **Post date:** [March 21, 2011, 2:47am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/maybe-i-am-not-so-agnostic-after-all/574108/44 "2011-03-21T02:47:23Z")
> [@Shagnasty](#): > > Test question: > > Explain the origin of the universe according to the Big Bang model but be sure to emphasize how the Big Bang itself originated. It is not necessary to explain what caused the Big Bang to know that it created the universe. Your position is akin to saying we don’t have an explanation for the origin of species and diversity of life unless we know exacyly how life originated. Having said that, we don’t need to look to the supernatural to explain the Big Bang. All we have are hypotheses at this point, but hypotheses are all we _need_ to exclude the supernatural. ---
**Author:** ![sisu](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/df705f/32.png) [@sisu](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/sisu)\ **Post date:** [August 2, 2012, 5:02am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/maybe-i-am-not-so-agnostic-after-all/574108/45 "2012-08-02T05:02:41Z")
Well it has been well over a year now since coming clean on my Atheism and to be honest my world has not changed that much. One thing that has really struck me is that when i attend church on a Sunday morning I get a lot more from it. WTF? some are asking. Simple before I was tied up in knots trying to believe, now I hear the message and learn from the stories. Being an atheist makes me a better christian! My sense of wonder is even more pronounced, I am happy to say “Don’t know” to why things are as they are. It has made me more curious and open to understanding. Atheism is a sane world view. ---
**Author:** ![Alan\_Smithee](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/2acd7d/32.png) [@Alan\_Smithee](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Alan_Smithee)\ **Post date:** [August 2, 2012, 5:18am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/maybe-i-am-not-so-agnostic-after-all/574108/46 "2012-08-02T05:18:37Z")
Congrats! I kept going to church for a while after I became an atheist because I liked the songs and stories, but I found it less and less meaningful. I have been leading a Bible study for an atheist group recently, though, and I find I like the Bible more now than when I was Christian, for similar reasons to what you said. I was a very liberal Christian, so I never worried too much about “believing” anything, but I struggled with how on earth some passages in the Bible were supposed to be meaningful or inspiring! ETA: I just started listening to “Point of Inquiry” recently. It is a great podcast! CFI has a new one all about the Bible hosted by Robert M. Price, and it’s pretty awesome, too. It’s called _The Human Bible_. I was never crazy about Price on PoI, but he’s really in his element here. ---
**Author:** ![Yookeroo](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/yookeroo/32/323_2.png) [@Yookeroo](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Yookeroo)\ **Post date:** [August 3, 2012, 2:01am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/maybe-i-am-not-so-agnostic-after-all/574108/47 "2012-08-03T02:01:08Z")
> [@sisu](#): > > Being an atheist makes me a better christian! Can’t say this is surprising.Taking the Bible too seriously (and literally) can lead to very un-Christ-like behaviors. Taking a step back can help you put the good stuff in perspective. You can do worse than following the teachings of Jesus. ---
**Author:** ![grude](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/g/e47774/32.png) [@grude](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/grude)\ **Post date:** [August 3, 2012, 2:35am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/maybe-i-am-not-so-agnostic-after-all/574108/48 "2012-08-03T02:35:06Z")
If the question is “is the Christian god real?” then I guess I am an atheist. If the question is “is the universe entirely mechanistic with no supernatural(or that appears supernatural) things” I dunno if I can commit to that. ---
**Author:** ![Taomist](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/53a042/32.png) [@Taomist](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Taomist)\ **Post date:** [August 3, 2012, 2:59am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/maybe-i-am-not-so-agnostic-after-all/574108/49 "2012-08-03T02:59:59Z")
Here’s the thing: You believe what you believe. The label doesn’t matter, and nobody needs one. It’s the labels pigeonholing your beliefs; don’t worry, and be happy. 🙂 Besides, it doesn’t matter WHAT we believe. What is, is, whether we believe it or not. /wonders if I could meta things a couple more levels. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/maybe-i-am-not-so-agnostic-after-all/574108.md?page=2)