Thank you Lynn for that helpful answer. To be clear on my parameters:
I would NEVER go into the handicapped stall if a regular stall were available … I’m only talking about situations where there is a line for the bathroom and all the stalls are in constant use.
I would NEVER go into a handicapped stall if I needed to spend more than a few seconds, I’d wait. If I was ill, needed to change a tampon, needed to poop, was wearing complicated clothing that would take a while to put on and take off, was struggling with my luggage, etc., I would not use the handicapped stall. Believe me, I wouldn’t spend 5 or 10 minutes in the handicapped stall, though I can believe that there are people who might.
I would NEVER go into a handicapped stall if there was a visibly handicapped person also waiting. (I do recognize that there are going to be instances where a medical problem doesn’t show.)
The thing is, if you do the math, and there is a long line for the bathroom (often the case at airports, which seems to be the principal location where I use public restrooms, and where people might reasonably be expected to need to HURRY), there is a significant difference in the wait time for everyone if 5 stalls are used, versus 6 stalls are used.
My guess is that an economic analysis based on real-world stats about how long people take to pee would show that the best outcome for everyone would be for the handicapped access stall to be kept in use.
That changes my response, by the way. I usually see women and girls skip merrily into the handicapped stall because it’s roomier, and thus a great deal more comfy, even though the regular stalls are open. If all the regular stalls are occupied, that’s one thing. Or if all the regular stalls are filthy, yeah, I’d skip past them too. But most of the time, when I use a public restroom, not all of the stalls are occupied. In fact, most of the time, fewer than half the stalls are occupied.
However, I am not a frequent flier (due to medical reasons, including my IBS), so my experience with airport restrooms is pretty rare. I expect that most people do as I do, and try to go before boarding or after landing. I can use an airplane toilet, but it’s quite cramped. On the other hand, I don’t have to really worry about falling down in an airplane toilet…there’s nowhere for me to fall!
The problem is people like my husband, who really can’t wait that minute or two. That’s why he carries spare underwear and jeans in the car - he has poor bladder and bowel control due to spina bifida.
Thing is, he doesn’t use a wheelchair or crutches (having “mild” spina bifida) so people don’t always clue into the fact that yes, he IS handicapped. Fortunately for him, he is able to use a regular stall, but other people are not so fortunate.
Yes, if there is a huge line out the door then use the handicapped stall - but be quick about it because you don’t know when someone in a wheelchair will be rolling in the door. No lingering in the handicapped stall unless you yourself are handicapped. And don’t use it if there is another stall you can use. I’ve seen people go into a toilet, pass a half dozen perfectly serviceable stalls, and then camp out in the handicapped stall. Just rude, if you ask me.
Granted, one or two of those people might have a handicap requiring grab bars or whatever, but I see it far too often for that to be likely
However - a single “hello - I’ll need to use that stall, do you think you’ll be long? shall I come back in a couple of minutes” will most likely yield a “sorry - be out in a sec!” - followed by the current occupant finishing up her business reasonably expiditiously. To me this is no different from an able-bodied person having to wait a minute or two for a regular stall when there’s a line.
There’s also a problem with many regular-size stalls being, well, too small to be able to maneuver around, reach the TP, reach the area needing to be wiped, etc. (this is the case at my current office location). As a result, I’ll often use the handicapped stall even though I’m able-bodied.
The situation in the OP? Fate getting back at the woman for improperly parking. Yes, the Secret Service should have blocked off the spaces well in advance. It’s a pretty common thing to see cardboard signs saying something like “event here on such-and-such date, parking prohibited” and they should have done that. NOT this crap of waiting until cars were there, then deciding to tow them - chances are, a lot of genuinely handicapped people were more than inconvenienced. The woman in the OP should be ashamed of herself.
I agree with you with the “hello” thing. Personally I’d be annoyed if there was a line for the bathroom and no one was using the handicap stall. But your answer brought me to another question: Does a handicap person get to cut in line to the handicap stall if there is a line? In other words, ten people, one in a wheel chair, five regular stalls, one handicap stall. Is it appropriate for the handicap person to skip ahead and go wait outside the handicap stall bypassing all the others previously waiting?
At one time I dated a girl in a wheelchair. she told me about a group of vigilantes who went around slashing tires of folks parked in handicapped spots without appropriate plates or stickers. (Some concern to me, since we were parking legitimately in handicapped spots, but things might not be noticed).
And I’ve known folks who continued to use temporary “handicapped” tags long after the need was gone.
I’d say yes. They’re likely to take more time, even just manuevering, it gets them out of line and thus the line moves faster.
I’ll admit I’ll use the handicap stall, but only when the regular stalls are too small to deal with my bag or any difficult clothes.
Here’s another perspective: at RenFaires the handicap privies should be called ‘Noble Privies’ because it’s the nobles with the big skirts that use them the most.
Since people with spinal injuries, among other disabilities that require use of a wheelchair, frequently have bladder and bowel control issues I’d say yes. It would be rude ask “Are you likely to piss or shit your pants?” no matter how politely phrased, so I’d say the best default response is to let them go ahead and get down to business.
So… if there’s a line it would be most courteous for the able-bodied to tell the wheelchair user to skip ahead of them and go directly to the handicapped accessible stall. The wheelchair user has the option to wait in line with everyone else or not, as they know their situation best.
Of course, a certain percentage of people, able-bodied or otherwise, are just inconsiderate assholes.
It’s not uncommon for public men’s rooms to only have one stall, which is of course equipped as the handicapped stall. It’s not like we’re not going to use it if we need it.
In my office building, we’ve got three men’s rooms on each floor, but it’s a long, thin building, so they’re a fair distance apart. Each men’s room has two stalls, one of which is the handicapped stall, or course. If they’re both full, it’s easier to go up or down one flight of stairs to get to another bathroom than to go to the next bathroom on your own floor. On some occasions, I’ve had to go down a few flights to get to a bathroom with an unoccupied stall.
So yeah, of course we’re gonna use the damned handicapped stall. Especially when we know good and well that there’s nobody working on this floor or the adjacent floors near this end of the building who is in a wheelchair.
To be fair, this vehicle was towed to clear the area for a presidential visit (I think they clear away cars just to eliminate the danger of car bombs, not because the president personally wants your parking space). I can understand they don’t post a few days’ worth of public notice of the president’s every move.
Well, on other boards I’ve been active on, board policy has been to avoid saying anything too negative about any institution that might Google its own name and threaten retaliatory lawsuits against the boards’ ownership. So I have intentionally withheld specifics. Is there a Straight Dope policy on that?
For the record, this was a foreign firm specializing in training business executives, and it’s unlikely an average person would avail himself or herself of its services, so you probably don’t need to worry that you’ve given money to the ethically disabled in this particular instance. I’m not guaranteeing you haven’t contributed to some other ethically disabled institution in other circumstances, of course.
In that case, would it be rude for an able-bodied person who is about to piss or shit their pants to move up in the line without having to explicitly say so? I have, on rare occasion, offered my place in front of someone (adult or child) looking to be in a state of biological emergency. I’d find it nice to have the same courtesy extended to me, since you don’t have to have an actual physical disability for a handicapped accessible stall to be of benefit to you.
I am an able-bodied person who would never think of parking in a handicapped stall; but, I use the handicapped toilet stalls quite regularly. The primary reason why is that I am claustrophobic and find about 90% of stalls extremely confining. If I am standing over the toilet just inside the door or if my knees/elbows touch the sides of the stall or paper dispenser, I am *very *uncomfortable, not just physically, but it mentally. Additionally, I find that non-handicapped stalls usually leave little to no room for a large laptop bag and backpack, which I frequently carry, but handicapped stalls often have a nice, large shelf in the form of a baby-changing table to put my stuff on. If no table, there’s generally plenty of floorspace for personal items that doesn’t exist in most non-handicapped stalls. Lastly, my bladder control has gotten worse over the years for whatever reason. When I need to pee, it comes on fast and intense. I go for the stall in which I can maneuver quickly without dropping personal items in the bowl while tearing through my clothing and accoutrement for relief.
I don’t feel particularly bad about this. But, then again, I spend as little time in public stalls as possible and I have never knowingly inconvenienced another public restroom user, handicapped or not. I do my business, I wash up and I get out. I make every attempt to be courteous.
I think if you appear able-bodied and about to have a “biological emergency” you’ll have to say something. Or look desperate enough explanations aren’t needed. Or, in one case I was witness to, be gripped by uncontrollable farting.
But yes, I’d saying allowing someone on the brink of a “biological emergency” to jump (or run, or perhaps walk slowly as the circumstances dictate) to the front of the line or to empty stall would be the best thing.
Handicapped stalls are also very useful if you have a small child with you. It’s hard to fit yourself and a toddler in the same small bathroom. You can’t just let the toddler run around unsupervised in the larger bathroom. I used them a lot when it was just me and my two year old.
I’m freshly back in the US. My 5 1/2 year old has special needs stemming from a rough birth. She’s in the godd*amn drawn out process of getting assesed in this country, but will likely end up with Autistic - non specific diagnosis. We asked for and received handicapped approval from the initial visit.
It’s been a godsend for our family. And as someone above pointed out, I would happily park in the worst place every time for the rest of my life in return for my daughter not having her challenges. Knowing that we have an almost guaranteed spot, don’t have to haul 50 pounds of kicking screaming maniac a half mile (on a bad day) or even 100 yards, etc makes dealing with the stroller, tantrums, physical inconvenience soooo much easier. And while my daughter is mobile (can walk), she can not reliably hold hands and safely walk for any distance.
That said, I do park in handicapped places like the store even when alone. I rationalize it by thinking that usually there is more than one empty HC space and more importantly saving those few minutes on shopping as I get much more than 10x that in time suck just dealing with all the daily stuff I do with my daughter. Eg, I can park, run in and grab milk, and get back home fast and then can take over from my wife and watch the bambina.
At work, there are handicapped spaces in the covered garage downstairs (these usually fill up) and in the visitor uncovered parkiing upstairs (never once seen these full in 3 months). I do park in the upstairs on the rare occaisions when I do drive. However, I worry about looking like GameHat and cow-orkers thinking I’m a dickwad. Again, getting those minutes back in my day which my daughter takes out is pretty nice.
So, wondering what other people think about this second derivative effect? Am I being a douche when not with my daughter?
I also don’t ever use a handicapped stall in the bathroom. Save that for someone that really might need it.
China Guy, to be harsh: yes, you’re a douche along with illegal.
No grocery store parking lot is so big you can’t get to the door in under two minutes.
Where I am, there are never enough HC spaces between the able bodied and the barely disabled who don’t really need it. I’m of the latter category and I won’t park there even though I have a tag.
