# McDonald's to Hourly Workers; Drop Dead **URL:** \ **Category:** The BBQ Pit\ **Created:** [September 30, 2010, 2:37pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/mcdonalds-to-hourly-workers-drop-dead/555602 "2010-09-30T14:37:27Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 19\ **Page:** 6
**Author:** ![elucidator](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/8edcca/32.png) [@elucidator](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/elucidator)\ **Post date:** [October 2, 2010, 3:42am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/mcdonalds-to-hourly-workers-drop-dead/555602/101 "2010-10-02T03:42:56Z")
Money is power, poverty is an absence of power. An absence of power is the absence of choices, good, bad, or indifferent. Pious bloviations about respecting the choices of others is mockery when the choices offered are shit, go blind, or go fuck yourself. Some of my fellow citizens are stupid, either by genetics or no, it makes no difference. Ignorance can be cured, but we should protect the stupid just as we protect the blind and the lame. At the very least, one should be ashamed to make a business of taking advantage of the stupid. We don’t approve of someone robbing the blilnd because they are blind, why should we approve of someone outsmarting someone else, offering a choice not in their best interest and profiting by that? What ethical standard would insist that we tolerate that? ---
**Author:** ![Euphonious\_Polemic](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/euphonious_polemic/32/3002_2.png) [@Euphonious\_Polemic](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Euphonious_Polemic)\ **Post date:** [October 2, 2010, 4:29am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/mcdonalds-to-hourly-workers-drop-dead/555602/102 "2010-10-02T04:29:11Z")
> [@Paul\_in\_Qatar](#): > > Given your reasoning, what do you think McDonald’s puts in your hamburgers? If not for rules forcing them to do the right thing, they do bad things. So we have a rule about what goes in Special Sauce, and soon we will have a rule about what they can put in their insurance. > > But McDonald’s takes exception to that and wishes to rip people off. Ought we to give them a waiver on food safety rules too? Well, in Libertopia, all fast food restaurants would be completely unfettered by coercive and oppressive government regulations. They would be free to put whatever they desired into their food to increase profit. They would not have to follow red-tape rules that make them disclose their trade secret ingredients. (cough, rats, cough) In Libertopia, it would be up to the individual consumers to decide where to spend their money. Of course, the restaurants with the superior food quality would naturally end up on top, and the ones that sickened their customers would simply go out of business. Eventually. And then re-open under a new name. Until they caused too many customers to get ill, whereupon they would go out of business. Eventually. If you think otherwise, you clearly must be of the opinion that the general public consists of stupid rubes, who must be “protected” from themselves by an oppressive, coercive government. ---
**Author:** ![elucidator](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/8edcca/32.png) [@elucidator](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/elucidator)\ **Post date:** [October 2, 2010, 4:35am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/mcdonalds-to-hourly-workers-drop-dead/555602/103 "2010-10-02T04:35:52Z")
> [@Euphonious\_Polemic](#): > > …red-tape rules that make them disclose their trade secret ingredients. (cough, rats, cough) … Just a second, there! Are you trying to imply that the rats used by McDonald’s have tuberculosis? ---
**Author:** ![Euphonious\_Polemic](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/euphonious_polemic/32/3002_2.png) [@Euphonious\_Polemic](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Euphonious_Polemic)\ **Post date:** [October 2, 2010, 4:39am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/mcdonalds-to-hourly-workers-drop-dead/555602/104 "2010-10-02T04:39:12Z")
> [@elucidator](#): > > > [@Euphonious\_Polemic](#): > > > > …red-tape rules that make them disclose their trade secret ingredients. (cough, rats, cough) … > > Just a second, there! Are you trying to imply that the rats used by McDonald’s have tuberculosis? In Libertopia McDonalds, the only way you’d find out is if you brought your very own Junior Epidemiology field kit with you to lunch. Or hired a food testing service to do it for you. ---
**Author:** ![elucidator](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/8edcca/32.png) [@elucidator](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/elucidator)\ **Post date:** [October 2, 2010, 5:08am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/mcdonalds-to-hourly-workers-drop-dead/555602/105 "2010-10-02T05:08:43Z")
That’s all very well, so long as your are not slandering the fine name of McDonald’s by suggesting that they are using substandard rats in their nutritious and wholesome products. ---
**Author:** ![Paul\_in\_Qatar](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/p/ccd318/32.png) [@Paul\_in\_Qatar](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Paul_in_Qatar)\ **Post date:** [October 2, 2010, 1:28pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/mcdonalds-to-hourly-workers-drop-dead/555602/106 "2010-10-02T13:28:35Z")
Look, if an hourly worker buys this crummy insurance, and then busts through the low maximum, that person may be forced onto charity. That is onto society at large. But of course McDonald’s would have their profit. If McDonald’s offered insurance that met international norms, the number of people thrown onto charity, onto society at large would be reduced. ---
**Author:** ![Cat\_Whisperer](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/cat_whisperer/32/4839_2.png) [@Cat\_Whisperer](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Cat_Whisperer)\ **Post date:** [October 2, 2010, 4:07pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/mcdonalds-to-hourly-workers-drop-dead/555602/107 "2010-10-02T16:07:40Z")
Mmm, ratburgers. ---
**Author:** ![DrDeth](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/b487fb/32.png) [@DrDeth](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/DrDeth)\ **Post date:** [October 2, 2010, 11:22pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/mcdonalds-to-hourly-workers-drop-dead/555602/108 "2010-10-02T23:22:38Z")
> [@Paul\_in\_Qatar](#): > > Look, if an hourly worker buys this crummy insurance, and then busts through the low maximum, that person may be forced onto charity. That is onto society at large. But of course McDonald’s would have their profit. If McDonald’s offered insurance that met international norms, the number of people thrown onto charity, onto society at large would be reduced. McDonalds doesn’t make any money on that insurance, in fact it costs them. It’s also as good or better than the industry offers similar workers. And, from what I see, the maximum is as much as $10000. It depends on the types of services. ---
**Author:** ![Paul\_in\_Qatar](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/p/ccd318/32.png) [@Paul\_in\_Qatar](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Paul_in_Qatar)\ **Post date:** [October 3, 2010, 1:48am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/mcdonalds-to-hourly-workers-drop-dead/555602/109 "2010-10-03T01:48:44Z")
We do not know many of the numbers and details of this case. McDonald’s doesn’t have to tell us, and so doesn’t. We do not know if they are making money or not. But please consider that they have no salesmen to pay. The payroll department (is it centralized?) is dealing with these people anyway. It is sort of one-size-fits all insurance after all. We do know they are paying out less than 80% of what comes in. This is well in excess of international norms. It would seem they are making money off the insurance. But as I said, we do not know for sure. ---
**Author:** ![Rand\_Rover](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/db5fbb/32.png) [@Rand\_Rover](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Rand_Rover)\ **Post date:** [October 3, 2010, 2:44am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/mcdonalds-to-hourly-workers-drop-dead/555602/110 "2010-10-03T02:44:09Z")
> [@elucidator](#): > > Money is power, poverty is an absence of power. An absence of power is the absence of choices, good, bad, or indifferent. Pious bloviations about respecting the choices of others is mockery when the choices offered are shit, go blind, or go fuck yourself. > > Some of my fellow citizens are stupid, either by genetics or no, it makes no difference. Ignorance can be cured, but we should protect the stupid just as we protect the blind and the lame. At the very least, one should be ashamed to make a business of taking advantage of the stupid. > > We don’t approve of someone robbing the blilnd because they are blind, why should we approve of someone outsmarting someone else, offering a choice not in their best interest and profiting by that? What ethical standard would insist that we tolerate that? I love it when guys like you say guys like me hate poor people and then show that exactly the opposite is true. ---
**Author:** ![NinetyWt](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/n/cc9497/32.png) [@NinetyWt](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/NinetyWt)\ **Post date:** [October 3, 2010, 2:57am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/mcdonalds-to-hourly-workers-drop-dead/555602/111 "2010-10-03T02:57:29Z")
> [@VinylTurnip](#): > > Does \*any \*company offer free health care to its workers? My husband’s employer (the city) pays his entire premium. The plan is actually quite good, with a deductible of only $750. It’s a damn good thing too, because he’s been in the hospital twice in the last 18 months. If that had been me, we’d be in a huge amount of debt. > [@Long\_Time\_First\_Time](#): > > Actually, it appears as if the entire story is bogus. the WSJ is in such a hurry to discredit the new health care law that they essentially made it up. > > Link here: [http://www.politico.com/politicopulse/0910/politicopulse344.html](http://www.politico.com/politicopulse/0910/politicopulse344.html) > > The money quote: > Steve Russell, senior vice president and chief people officer McDonald’s USA, responds in a statement: “Media reports stating that we plan to drop health care coverage for our employees are completely false. These reports are purely speculative and misleading.” Reposted since it seemed to have been lost in the shuffle. ---
**Author:** ![suranyi](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/e36b37/32.png) [@suranyi](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/suranyi)\ **Post date:** [October 3, 2010, 6:04am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/mcdonalds-to-hourly-workers-drop-dead/555602/112 "2010-10-03T06:04:17Z")
> [@VinylTurnip](#): > > Does \*any \*company offer free health care to its workers? Missed this question. I would get my premiums completely covered by my company if I were single. However, I have chosen to put my wife and son under my medical plan, and that the company does not cover completely. ---
**Author:** ![DrDeth](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/b487fb/32.png) [@DrDeth](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/DrDeth)\ **Post date:** [October 3, 2010, 6:08am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/mcdonalds-to-hourly-workers-drop-dead/555602/113 "2010-10-03T06:08:04Z")
> [@Paul\_in\_Qatar](#): > > We do not know many of the numbers and details of this case. McDonald’s doesn’t have to tell us, and so doesn’t. We do not know if they are making money or not. But please consider that they have no salesmen to pay. The payroll department (is it centralized?) is dealing with these people anyway. It is sort of one-size-fits all insurance after all. > > We do know they are paying out less than 80% of what comes in. This is well in excess of international norms. It would seem they are making money off the insurance. > > But as I said, we do not know for sure. No, the \*Insurance Company \*is paying out less than 80% of what comes in. Not McDonalds. Yes, the insurance is only a small cost item for McD’s, but they are not making money on this, no one is claiming that McD;s takes in more from the employees that they pay to the Insurance company. If you have a cite that sez that, by all means link to it. ---
**Author:** ![Zebra](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/z/c0e974/32.png) [@Zebra](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Zebra)\ **Post date:** [October 3, 2010, 6:09am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/mcdonalds-to-hourly-workers-drop-dead/555602/114 "2010-10-03T06:09:00Z")
Gee, the WSJ seems to lost some essential reporting skills. I wonder why? ---
**Author:** ![Bosstone](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/22d042/32.png) [@Bosstone](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Bosstone)\ **Post date:** [October 3, 2010, 8:05am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/mcdonalds-to-hourly-workers-drop-dead/555602/115 "2010-10-03T08:05:49Z")
> [@Rand\_Rover](#): > > > [@elucidator](#): > > > > Money is power, poverty is an absence of power. An absence of power is the absence of choices, good, bad, or indifferent. Pious bloviations about respecting the choices of others is mockery when the choices offered are shit, go blind, or go fuck yourself. > > > > Some of my fellow citizens are stupid, either by genetics or no, it makes no difference. Ignorance can be cured, but we should protect the stupid just as we protect the blind and the lame. At the very least, one should be ashamed to make a business of taking advantage of the stupid. > > > > We don’t approve of someone robbing the blilnd because they are blind, why should we approve of someone outsmarting someone else, offering a choice not in their best interest and profiting by that? What ethical standard would insist that we tolerate that? > > I love it when guys like you say guys like me hate poor people and then show that exactly the opposite is true. Oh wah. Better to acknowledge reality and try to fix what’s broken than pretend everything’s all right and thereby take advantage of the problem. ---
**Author:** ![Paul\_in\_Qatar](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/p/ccd318/32.png) [@Paul\_in\_Qatar](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Paul_in_Qatar)\ **Post date:** [October 3, 2010, 1:02pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/mcdonalds-to-hourly-workers-drop-dead/555602/116 "2010-10-03T13:02:32Z")
> [@DrDeth](#): > > No, the \*Insurance Company \*is paying out less than 80% of what comes in. Not McDonalds. > > Yes, the insurance is only a small cost item for McD’s, but they are not making money on this, no one is claiming that McD;s takes in more from the employees that they pay to the Insurance company. If you have a cite that sez that, by all means link to it. Forgive me, I am willing to be corrected. As I now understand it, McDonald’s takes in the payments. It then pays Aetna to administer the program. McDonald’s is self-insuring, so when there is a claim, Aetna tells McDonald’s to pay it. McDonald’s then writes a check from its own account. Is this incorrect? ---
**Author:** ![Michael\_Ellis](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/977dab/32.png) [@Michael\_Ellis](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Michael_Ellis)\ **Post date:** [October 3, 2010, 1:26pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/mcdonalds-to-hourly-workers-drop-dead/555602/117 "2010-10-03T13:26:34Z")
So Paul, I take it that the latest married woman you’re fucking behind her husband’s back works at McDonald’s. Am I correct? ---
**Author:** ![E-Sabbath](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/e19adc/32.png) [@E-Sabbath](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/E-Sabbath)\ **Post date:** [October 3, 2010, 1:56pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/mcdonalds-to-hourly-workers-drop-dead/555602/118 "2010-10-03T13:56:30Z")
> [@Zebra](#): > > Gee, the WSJ seems to lost some essential reporting skills. I wonder why? Yeah, that’s what I’ve been thinking. This wasn’t an op-ed piece, was it? ---
**Author:** ![Dangerosa](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/22d042/32.png) [@Dangerosa](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Dangerosa)\ **Post date:** [October 3, 2010, 2:28pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/mcdonalds-to-hourly-workers-drop-dead/555602/119 "2010-10-03T14:28:25Z")
> [@Paul\_in\_Qatar](#): > > Look, if an hourly worker buys this crummy insurance, and then busts through the low maximum, that person may be forced onto charity. That is onto society at large. But of course McDonald’s would have their profit. If McDonald’s offered insurance that met international norms, the number of people thrown onto charity, onto society at large would be reduced. It wasn’t McDonald’s - it was student health care - but my brother in law just did that this year… He had diverticulitis. Which ate up every penny of his surgical maximum and left him with medical bills. In the same insurance year, he got diagnosed with cancer. So a guy who was doing the right thing by paying for insurance on his student income (which wasn’t large) didn’t get completely covered for one health emergency, much less both - and is waiting until the new year before his surgical maximum resets so he can have a tumor removed. Fortunately, chemo had a different maximum. People think “I have insurance.” They don’t generally think (and I suspect McDonald’s hourly workers are somewhat less likely than most to read their contracts) “I have lousy insurance.” [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/mcdonalds-to-hourly-workers-drop-dead/555602.md?page=5)