# meaning of "Austria" **URL:** \ **Category:** Factual Questions\ **Created:** [August 19, 2002, 11:31am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/meaning-of-austria/124572 "2002-08-19T11:31:58Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 1
**Author:** ![regnad\_kcin](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/85f322/32.png) [@regnad\_kcin](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/regnad_kcin)\ **Post date:** [August 19, 2002, 11:31am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/meaning-of-austria/124572/1 "2002-08-19T11:31:58Z")
Australopithecus means “southern ape” Australia probably has the word “south” tucked in there as well Austria seems to also, but the Austrians call their own country “Oesterreich”. Ill be damned if that doesnt look like “eastern empire”. Whats the deal here? ---
**Author:** ![jb\_farley](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/j/9d8465/32.png) [@jb\_farley](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/jb_farley)\ **Post date:** [August 19, 2002, 11:36am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/meaning-of-austria/124572/2 "2002-08-19T11:36:15Z")
last one- eastern empire. jb ---
**Author:** ![regnad\_kcin](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/85f322/32.png) [@regnad\_kcin](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/regnad_kcin)\ **Post date:** [August 19, 2002, 11:46am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/meaning-of-austria/124572/3 "2002-08-19T11:46:29Z")
But does the English word “Austria” mean “south”? Its this contradiction Im asking about. ---
**Author:** ![Acsenray](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/acsenray/32/4519_2.png) [@Acsenray](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Acsenray)\ **Post date:** [August 19, 2002, 12:23pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/meaning-of-austria/124572/4 "2002-08-19T12:23:01Z")
The English word “Austria” means the country that its natives call “Österreich.” There’s no contradiction here. ---
**Author:** ![jb\_farley](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/j/9d8465/32.png) [@jb\_farley](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/jb_farley)\ **Post date:** [August 19, 2002, 12:40pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/meaning-of-austria/124572/5 "2002-08-19T12:40:59Z")
nope. ‘Austria’ is the english phonetic version of the german ‘Osterreich’. i forget the term for bastardizing a word like so. it’s not a cognate… shit, anyway, they said “Osterreich”, we heard “Austria”, and there you go. of course, i’m sure it’s more complicated than that, but hey- what can you do? ‘australis’ is latin for ‘south’. notice that the ‘-a-’ immediately follows the ‘-tr-’. with etymology, little things like that are a huge deal. austria doesn’t have that ‘-tra-’. jb ---
**Author:** ![sailor](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/a587f6/32.png) [@sailor](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/sailor)\ **Post date:** [August 19, 2002, 1:01pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/meaning-of-austria/124572/6 "2002-08-19T13:01:06Z")
Just to add some trivia: North in latin was Septentrionis, referring to the 7 stars of Ursa Minor, the Little Dipper. In Chinese it is Bei (as in Beijing) South in Latin was Australis. In Chinese it is Nan, as in Nanjing. East in Latin was Orientalis from the word “rise”. In Chinese it is Dong, as in Dongjing. west in latin was Occidens, from the word meaning “fall, die, set”. In Chinese it is Xi, as in Xi’an. Maybe someone can give the origins of the English and French words. ---
**Author:** ![smiling\_bandit](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/e9a140/32.png) [@smiling\_bandit](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/smiling_bandit)\ **Post date:** [August 19, 2002, 1:17pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/meaning-of-austria/124572/7 "2002-08-19T13:17:40Z")
Little History: You may thing its is odd, since Ausatria is South of Germany. But the area first got that name by being the Ost-Mark, settled by soldiers of Karl der Grosse (the bastardizing Frenchmen call him Charlemagne) ---
**Author:** ![Sparc](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/65b543/32.png) [@Sparc](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Sparc)\ **Post date:** [August 19, 2002, 1:35pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/meaning-of-austria/124572/8 "2002-08-19T13:35:05Z")
A. Österreich in literal translation means the Eastern Realm. The date when this name came into common usage is highly disputed. The first mention of the name is in a [document from 996 AD](http://www.borg-graz.ac.at/erinnern/mille/urkunde.htm) where the Holy Roman Emperor Otto III refers to _“regione vulgari vocabulo Ostarrichi”_ (regions called the Eastern Realm in common speach). What he means exactly by that is uncertain. Clearly these regions at the time encompass number of different units variously in conflict with each other, why it is improbable that this should infer some sense of communality, but most probably refers to a geographic directional description. A region, roughly equal to Austria becomes an independent political unit of any sort for the first time in 1156 when Emperor Frederick Barbarossa creates the Duchy of Austria as independent from Bavaria. When the Habsburgs take power over the Empire in 1278 it is still doubtful that the name is in common usage, although it is certain that it is in academic usage. In the later Habsburg history the name slowly takes on an official _and_ common meaning as a compound part of the name Austria-Hungary. Nationalistic segregation within Austria-Hungary only takes strong root in the latter half of the 19th century after the loss of the Sven Weeks War in 1867 which initiates the crumbling of the Empire in an obvious way. It is only at this time that any popular sentiment equal to ‘we the Austrians’ arises. As a matter of fact, despite the creation of the Dual Monarchy in 1867 (which separates Austria and Hungary yet keeps them under one rule) the people in modern Austria are pretty late in that development, and it is in the provinces like Serbia and Bosnia that it starts. Austria as we know it is created only in 1919 after the defeat of the Central Powers in 1918. Today the nationalistic myth dates Austria as one millennium old due to Emperor Otto’s document. This is highly controversial considering that the Habsburgs and their people didn’t clearly see modern Austria as an independent unit, nor was the geographic region it encompasses always the heartland of the Habsburg Empire, which shifted as various Emperors changed their mind as re the seat of government - mostly between Prague, Innsbruck and Vienna. Therefore the name should be seen for what it is, a practical way to describe a variety of fiefs within a discrete geographical region that played a significant part as a trading chip in the geo-political games of Imperial Europe. B. Austria in English is just a phonetic version of the German name Österreich as already noted. ---
**Author:** ![regnad\_kcin](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/85f322/32.png) [@regnad\_kcin](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/regnad_kcin)\ **Post date:** [August 19, 2002, 4:44pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/meaning-of-austria/124572/9 "2002-08-19T16:44:30Z")
Realm and Reich may be related words also. Perhaps “realm” is related to “rex” as well, as in kingdom. Then it would basically mean “empire” which translates as “Reich” in German. ---
**Author:** ![Acsenray](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/acsenray/32/4519_2.png) [@Acsenray](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Acsenray)\ **Post date:** [August 19, 2002, 5:08pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/meaning-of-austria/124572/10 "2002-08-19T17:08:10Z")
If “realm” is related to “rex” as in king, then it basically means “kingdom,” not “empire.” “Rex” is from the Latin word for “king.” “Emperor” is from the Latin “imperator,” a title that was created specifically to indicate that the holder was _not_ a king. ---
**Author:** ![Sparc](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/65b543/32.png) [@Sparc](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Sparc)\ **Post date:** [August 19, 2002, 5:20pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/meaning-of-austria/124572/11 "2002-08-19T17:20:14Z")
Kind of, sort of and mostly yes… but no. ‘Realm’ means kingdom, domain or sphere and comes from the Latin ‘regimen’ which means ‘rule’. ‘Reich’ means more or less the same thing and has the same origin. The confusion arises because ‘Reich’ also means ‘empire’ in German. (rex and regimen are obviously related as well, but since it’s rex’s cousins in political geography we’re dealing with… let’s leave the king aside for the moment) The fact that the name Österreich predates Austrian-Hungarian imperial times by several hundred years is what indicates that it does in fact have the lesser meaning only denoting a cross regional domain. Remember from my earlier post that the first political unit with the name was a duchy. A little weird with a duchy called an empire as would be the case with the Duchy of the Eastern Empire… The Duchy of The Eastern Domain makes more sense, don’t you say? Sparc ---
**Author:** ![Sparc](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/65b543/32.png) [@Sparc](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Sparc)\ **Post date:** [August 19, 2002, 10:46pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/meaning-of-austria/124572/12 "2002-08-19T22:46:16Z")
I’m a little slow… but eventually the coin drops. So there I am having my dinner when somewhere between the filet and the cheese my claret suddenly starts tasting watery as all my senses get hijacked by afterthought and sudden realization (the deep reds don’t take lightly to pondering no matter what the intellectual Left tells you). “Austria…” thinks I “…but isn’t that the name in Latin as well?” Oddly perturbed I wobble over to my blue Moroccan bound copy of “Atlas of Columbus and the Great Discoverers” (you have to love the editors for not including C among the great discoverers) and much to my dismay every map of Europe that I peruse doesn’t have any Austria on it… well maybe this isn’t so astonishing given that Austria is a somewhat landlocked region and that I am browsing 15th and 16th century maps made by seafarers… how bothersome. One to not be so easily swayed from a task once undertaken, I looked her up in my old faithful Latin books and made a quick Internet double check to confirm that indeed it is as I had suddenly remembered. Austria as a name comes about very early and is the Latinized version of _Ostarricchi_ through the original Germanic root word for east _austar_ which has been deformed a little and given the proper suffix for land, regions and realms _-ia_ which gives us _Austria_ or once again in English; _Eastern Realm_. Incidentally first uses of _Austria_ dates to shortly after _Ostarricchi_. Once the old knob has started wandering in these paths it just can’t stop. So what about this _austar_ business. _East_ and _Easter_ sound frightfully close, don’t you say? Another quick perusal of some literature and a fast search of the American Heritage Dictionary gave me the following: _East_ just like _austar_ comes from the Indo-European root _aus-_ meaning _to shine_ which has also given us _aurora_ and yes the direction in which the sun rises, which would be the east. What about _Easter_ then? Well it is celebrated around the vernal equinox, which used to be the celebration of the dawn goddess _Aurora_ or _Ostara_ in the Germanic tribes. That gave _Eostre_ in old English, which eventually became _Easter_. But the OP wanted to know about _south_ and _Austria_… I was feeling a bit rummy after having dismissed the whole affair so casually earlier and while revisiting it all, I felt that I should try find that out as well. Unfortunately that one stumped me, as it seems to have stumped the etymologists of the world thus far as well. _Auster_ is the simplest known form for south in Latin and is believed to be named after the south wind, which relates back to the _aus-_ root as well, but by the devils beard that’s as far as we get. No one seems to know for sure why those pesky Romans used the same Indo-European root word for _south_ that the Germanic language makers used for _east_ when there is a perfectly sensible one that we others used namely _sâwel-_ which means _sun_. I saw two vague attempts at explanation fly by in somewhat less than reliable sources. One said it was due to the same fact as _sun_ became _south_ in Germanic, since that is where it travels in the sky, hence the south shines, hence _aus-_ or _shine_, that’s a maybe… The other source proposed that the speakers of the noble Latin tongue had simply botched the idea of the Italian peninsula’s direction on the globe and figured that down was east… now don’t think about that too long, because it hurts after a while. So in the end the OP is vindicated since _aus-_ gave both east and south and hence the Southern ape does have something vaguely to do with Otto’s eastern provinces. Sparc PS. _North_ is from the Indo-European _ner-_ for under or left, which only makes sence when you consider that left is north on an eastward oriented map as they traditionally were. _West_ is from _wes-_, which means evening and is quite symmetrical with _aus-_ out of the perspective of where the sun goes to bed. DS ---
**Author:** ![Manduck](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/manduck/32/256_2.png) [@Manduck](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Manduck)\ **Post date:** [August 20, 2002, 2:33am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/meaning-of-austria/124572/13 "2002-08-20T02:33:32Z")
I like to pronounce Oesterreich as “Easter egg”. ---
**Author:** ![Squish](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/8797f3/32.png) [@Squish](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Squish)\ **Post date:** [August 20, 2002, 3:51am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/meaning-of-austria/124572/14 "2002-08-20T03:51:38Z")
\ **Sparc** , that was a wonderfully well-writtten, erudite and entertaining post. ---
**Author:** ![Johanna](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/johanna/32/8318_2.png) [@Johanna](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Johanna)\ **Post date:** [August 20, 2002, 10:55am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/meaning-of-austria/124572/15 "2002-08-20T10:55:31Z")
Good one, **Sparc** ; let me top it off by noting that _Reich_, _rich_, _right_, _rex_, _reign_, and Hindi _raj_ ‘realm’ and _raja_ ‘king’ all come from the same Indo-European root, \*reg-. So you could just as well translate Austria as ‘Eastern _Raj_’. But in Turkish it’s called Nemse. 😕 ---
**Author:** ![CarnalK](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/carnalk/32/486_2.png) [@CarnalK](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/CarnalK)\ **Post date:** [August 20, 2002, 6:44pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/meaning-of-austria/124572/16 "2002-08-20T18:44:09Z")
Could it not have something to do with the German word “Aus” as in “Auslander”(foreigner)? While I like the idea that Austria is just an English pronunciation of Osterreich it’s possible we just borrowed another German group’s name for it. Much like Eskimo is an Iroqouis name for the Inuit (which in itself is merely the name one group gives itself amongst the various northern native populations) ---
**Author:** ![AHunter3](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/ahunter3/32/368_2.png) [@AHunter3](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/AHunter3)\ **Post date:** [August 20, 2002, 8:37pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/meaning-of-austria/124572/17 "2002-08-20T20:37:52Z")
So, based on what **Sparc** is telling us, we’re really saying “Eastria” without knowing it? ---
**Author:** ![Sparc](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/65b543/32.png) [@Sparc](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Sparc)\ **Post date:** [August 20, 2002, 10:36pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/meaning-of-austria/124572/18 "2002-08-20T22:36:31Z")
> [@](#): > > - CarnalK\* > > Could it not have something to do with the German word “Aus” as in “Auslander”(foreigner)? While I like the idea that Austria is just an English pronunciation of Osterreich it’s possible we just borrowed another German group’s name for it. Well yes… it was our first quick and dirty conclusion that _Austria_ was just an Anglicized version of Österreich. However, a bit further down in the thread than CarnalK stayed with us I conclude (under the beneficial effects so elegantly encapsulated by the saying ‘in vino veritas’) that _Austria_ was in fact borrowed to the English from medieval Latin, in which it is identical. While as _Ausländer_ might at first glance have something to do with all thi; it does in fact not at all. _Aus_ means _out_ and _länder_ is the plural form of _land_ (guess what that means) all together it gives _someone from out of the lands_, or as we say in the vernacular; ‘a forinr’. Incidentally the word is sometimes used in English where it is _auslander_. Anyhow _out_ and _aus_ both stem from the Old High German _uz_ which in turn comes from the Proto Indo-European root _ud-_ which means _up_ or _out_. Maybe its worthwhile to note at this point that English is more related to German, Dutch and Scandinavian languages than any other language. All of them belong to the West Germanic branch of the Indo European languages, it might seem astonishing when you ponder German words like _kreisverwaltungsreferat_, but I promise you, it’s a fact. It’s all got to do with Saxons, Anglians, Danes, Normans, a lot of boats, some frivolous sex and a few swordfights. > [@](#): > > So, based on what Sparc is telling us, we’re really saying “Eastria” without knowing it? Indeed we are. The _-ia_ suffix forms nouns in Latin as in _Academia, Suburbia, Arabia, Germania, Italia, Umbria,_ or\* Austria\* and is the standard way to form regional place names. As for the whole _east_ business and the etymology of Austria it is all available for verification at [The American Heritage[sup]®[/sup] Reference Collection](http://www.bartleby.com/am/), in Julius Pokorny’s \*Indogermanisches Etymologisches Wörterbuch \* [_Indo-European Etymological Dictionary_] (Bern, 1959), and various other sources about cartography and Austrian history that I am too lazy to list. If you prefer a more crackpot explanation to it all you can always side with the Slavic linguist _Otto Kronsteiner_ who like a Don Quixote of the place name sciences battles for the acceptance of the Slavic _Ostrik_ meaning _jagged mountains_ as the origin of _Österreich_. There sure as Austria is a republic are a hell of a lot of jagged mountains in the country, but he’s nevertheless pretty alone on that position and so far hasn’t convinced anyone except himself and a few others with somewhat dubious scientific credibility due to pretty outspoken political motives. Personally I’ll just be a boring old Sancho Panza and stick with the simple and logical solutions. Sparc ---
**Author:** ![CarnalK](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/carnalk/32/486_2.png) [@CarnalK](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/CarnalK)\ **Post date:** [August 21, 2002, 1:00am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/meaning-of-austria/124572/19 "2002-08-21T01:00:11Z")
Well **Sparc** your well researched answer definatly trumps my hunch(I was actually reading your post as I was submitting, the server was running so slow I thought I’d stopped it in time. curses). 🙂 We can thank you for some definate ignorance snuffing. ---
**Author:** ![Sparc](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/65b543/32.png) [@Sparc](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Sparc)\ **Post date:** [August 21, 2002, 12:45pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/meaning-of-austria/124572/20 "2002-08-21T12:45:12Z")
> [@](#): > > _CarnalK_ > > Well Sparc your well researched answer definatly trumps my hunch(I was actually reading your post as I was submitting, the server was running so slow I thought I’d stopped it in time. curses). No probs CarnalK, I didn’t mean to come across as if I thought you were being silly. In fact your insert provided an interesting opportunity to make a foray into the shared etymology of _aus_ and _out_, so I’m glad you didn’t manage to stop it in time. Thanks for all the kind words all of you, but the pleasure was truly mine. I just love this stuff since it is incredibly indicative of how closely related our human cultures are in the end. When one is forced to deal with a good majority of the languages in the Germanic branch and some Latin branch languages on a daily basis you start seeing patterns of communality that are truly remarkable – even typical Indo-European family traits that run across the branches. Sparc