# Media too pro-muslim? **URL:** \ **Category:** Great Debates\ **Created:** [February 27, 2016, 4:07pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/media-too-pro-muslim/747303 "2016-02-27T16:07:14Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 7
**Author:** ![iiandyiiii](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/iiandyiiii/32/7924_2.png) [@iiandyiiii](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/iiandyiiii)\ **Post date:** [March 2, 2016, 9:27am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/media-too-pro-muslim/747303/121 "2016-03-02T09:27:26Z")
> [@Civilrighte](#): > > As an Indian who grew up around a lot of Middle Easterners, I can say for sure that most Middle Easterners are indistinguishable from Pakistanis, and if you bother to read up on scientific race in that region, you’d find that most Pakistanis are Middle Easterners… I don’t believe you’re overcoming your bias here. There are plenty of ethnic groups that overlap India and Pakistan. ---
**Author:** ![Latro](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/l/a87d85/32.png) [@Latro](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Latro)\ **Post date:** [March 2, 2016, 9:53am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/media-too-pro-muslim/747303/122 "2016-03-02T09:53:28Z")
Just skim-read an interresting article how around 1984 a journalist watchdog organisation was founded, in the Netherlands, to ‘combat racism in journalism’. Seems they have been quite active in policing the press. It was based off a BBC workgroup and similar organisations sprang up throughout Europe. ---
**Author:** ![Monty](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/monty/32/47_2.png) [@Monty](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Monty)\ **Post date:** [March 2, 2016, 12:35pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/media-too-pro-muslim/747303/123 "2016-03-02T12:35:28Z")
> [@Civilrighte](#): > > I just reread this. You are proving my point. I was arguing that Pakistanis and people from Muslim countries were playing the Islamaphobia card when it wasn’t relavent. Read my inital post. > > Race is personal. If I, and the majority of Indians, do not feel racially aligned with Pakistanis, then we should have our way. > > I fall into the camp that lumps everyone from Turkey to Maldives into one race; Pakistanis, North Indians and South Indians are three different ethnic groups. To be blunt, you don’t have a clue as to what you’re talking about. Nothing I posted proves anything you’ve posted. You’re reading that into my post all by your lonesome. ---
**Author:** ![iiandyiiii](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/iiandyiiii/32/7924_2.png) [@iiandyiiii](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/iiandyiiii)\ **Post date:** [March 2, 2016, 1:39pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/media-too-pro-muslim/747303/124 "2016-03-02T13:39:53Z")
Of the largest 10 or so ethnic groups in Pakistan, four of them (Punjabis, Sindhis, Gujarati, and Kashmiris), including the largest (Punjabi) have significant populations in both Pakistan and India, and most of the others have at least small populations in both countries. So it’s entirely inaccurate to say that most Pakistanis are more closely related to Middle Easterners than Indians. The opposite is fare more accurate – most Pakistanis are more closely related to various groups in India than to groups in the Middle East. ---
**Author:** ![lance\_strongarm](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/l/87869e/32.png) [@lance\_strongarm](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/lance_strongarm)\ **Post date:** [March 2, 2016, 3:24pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/media-too-pro-muslim/747303/125 "2016-03-02T15:24:08Z")
Nothing funnier than a brown-skinned racist. ---
**Author:** ![T.M](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/ad7895/32.png) [@T.M](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/T.M)\ **Post date:** [March 2, 2016, 5:11pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/media-too-pro-muslim/747303/126 "2016-03-02T17:11:55Z")
> [@lance\_strongarm](#): > > Nothing funnier than a brown-skinned racist. A Pakistani friend of mine born in England always used to call me a bloody immigrant because my father was born in the Punjab ---
**Author:** ![lance\_strongarm](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/l/87869e/32.png) [@lance\_strongarm](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/lance_strongarm)\ **Post date:** [March 2, 2016, 5:16pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/media-too-pro-muslim/747303/127 "2016-03-02T17:16:43Z")
> [@T.M](#): > > A Pakistani friend of mine born in England always used to call me a bloody immigrant because my father was born in the Punjab Sure, because you are a bloody immigrant! Did he call you a Paki or something like that though? That would be much more fun. ---
**Author:** ![tomndebb](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/b9e5f3/32.png) [@tomndebb](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/tomndebb)\ **Post date:** [March 2, 2016, 5:54pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/media-too-pro-muslim/747303/128 "2016-03-02T17:54:06Z")
> [@Civilrighte](#): > > Race is personal. If I, and the majority of Indians, do not feel racially aligned with Pakistanis, then we should have our way. So, race is just a feeling and your earlier attempt to claim science was bullshit. > [@Civilrighte](#): > > I fall into the camp that lumps everyone from Turkey to Maldives into one race; Pakistanis, North Indians and South Indians are three different ethnic groups. As already demonstrated by an actual discussion of ethnic groups, whatever “camp” you belong to has no legitimate grounds on which to base their beliefs. Basically, you have decided to separate people you dislike from people you like and then pretend that there is some difference between your arbitrary groups that does not actually exist in the real world. ---
**Author:** ![tomndebb](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/b9e5f3/32.png) [@tomndebb](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/tomndebb)\ **Post date:** [March 2, 2016, 5:59pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/media-too-pro-muslim/747303/129 "2016-03-02T17:59:42Z")
> [@lance\_strongarm](#): > > Sure, because you are a bloody immigrant! Did he call you a Paki or something like that though? That would be much more fun. This only works if his father was descended from ethnic groups native to Pakistan, but fails if his father was born to an Anglo-Saxon functionary of the British Empire. ---
**Author:** ![lance\_strongarm](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/l/87869e/32.png) [@lance\_strongarm](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/lance_strongarm)\ **Post date:** [March 2, 2016, 6:43pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/media-too-pro-muslim/747303/130 "2016-03-02T18:43:29Z")
> [@tomndebb](#): > > This only works if his father was descended from ethnic groups native to Pakistan, but fails if his father was born to an Anglo-Saxon functionary of the British Empire. Who cares? He’s brown and foreign-looking. Call him a name! ---
**Author:** ![Really\_Not\_All\_That\_Bright](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/e8c25b/32.png) [@Really\_Not\_All\_That\_Bright](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Really_Not_All_That_Bright)\ **Post date:** [March 2, 2016, 6:48pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/media-too-pro-muslim/747303/131 "2016-03-02T18:48:09Z")
If his father was a British foreign service officer or something he ™ won’t be brown. I mean, his dad would be a bit darker from living in India but you don’t pass a tan on to your offspring. ---
**Author:** ![T.M](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/ad7895/32.png) [@T.M](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/T.M)\ **Post date:** [March 3, 2016, 1:04am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/media-too-pro-muslim/747303/132 "2016-03-03T01:04:06Z")
> [@Really\_Not\_All\_That\_Bright](#): > > If his father was a British foreign service officer or something he ™ won’t be brown. I mean, his dad would be a bit darker from living in India but you don’t pass a tan on to your offspring. In fact Anglo Saxon with blond hair, blue eyes, pink skin and red lips as a black mate of mine said I was not just coloured I clashed. My grand father was a serving soldier in India and my father was born there in 1901 they returned to England in 1904. My Pak friend Ben was a great guy sadly has passed and I miss the banter there was between us ---
**Author:** ![HMS\_Irruncible](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/hms_irruncible/32/7394_2.png) [@HMS\_Irruncible](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/HMS_Irruncible)\ **Post date:** [March 3, 2016, 1:06am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/media-too-pro-muslim/747303/133 "2016-03-03T01:06:41Z")
> [@Civilrighte](#): > > I’m gay and athiest, but I come from a Hindu background. That is totally epic bro. ---
**Author:** ![andros](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/e480ec/32.png) [@andros](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/andros)\ **Post date:** [March 3, 2016, 1:20am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/media-too-pro-muslim/747303/134 "2016-03-03T01:20:10Z")
> [@HMS\_Irruncible](#): > > That is totally epic bro. And this is an excellent time to point out that [Gaytheist](https://gaytheist.bandcamp.com/)is a hell of a band. ---
**Author:** ![HMS\_Irruncible](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/hms_irruncible/32/7394_2.png) [@HMS\_Irruncible](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/HMS_Irruncible)\ **Post date:** [March 3, 2016, 2:54am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/media-too-pro-muslim/747303/135 "2016-03-03T02:54:43Z")
> [@andros](#): > > And this is an excellent time to point out that [Gaytheist](https://gaytheist.bandcamp.com/)is a hell of a band. Eat a dick. ---
**Author:** ![Acsenray](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/acsenray/32/4519_2.png) [@Acsenray](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Acsenray)\ **Post date:** [March 3, 2016, 3:03am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/media-too-pro-muslim/747303/136 "2016-03-03T03:03:54Z")
> [@Civilrighte](#): > > Hindu as in Indian (North Indian + South Indian). I usually use the two terms interchangeably. > > Indians are more anthropologically close to each other, while Pakistanis are closer to Middle Easterners. > > Hindi is only spoken by a segment of North Indians in the Hindi belt. No-one ever refers to North Indians as “Hindi”. > [@Civilrighte](#): > > You are overlooking people of your own race. > > Pakistanis and Indians are racially different. It’s like Ugryurs and Han Chinese, North Africans and Blacks, or Turks and Europeans. > > Anyway, the term “muslim” is slang/colloquium for Pakistanis in the UK, and Africans in mainland Europe. You haven’t the first clue of anything you’re talking about. ---
**Author:** ![Miller](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/miller/32/481_2.png) [@Miller](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Miller)\ **Post date:** [March 3, 2016, 3:14am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/media-too-pro-muslim/747303/137 "2016-03-03T03:14:54Z")
> [@Civilrighte](#): > > Race is personal. If I, and the majority of Indians, do not feel racially aligned with Pakistanis, then we should have our way. What if the majority of Pakistanis feel that they _are_ racially aligned with Indians? Why don’t they get to have _their_ way? ---
**Author:** ![tomndebb](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/b9e5f3/32.png) [@tomndebb](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/tomndebb)\ **Post date:** [March 3, 2016, 4:05am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/media-too-pro-muslim/747303/138 "2016-03-03T04:05:22Z")
> [@HMS\_Irruncible](#): > > Eat a dick. This is a Warning to refrain from personal insults in Great Debates. [/Moderating] ---
**Author:** ![Spectre\_of\_Pithecanthropus](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/spectre_of_pithecanthropus/32/12343_2.png) [@Spectre\_of\_Pithecanthropus](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Spectre_of_Pithecanthropus)\ **Post date:** [March 3, 2016, 5:51am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/media-too-pro-muslim/747303/139 "2016-03-03T05:51:05Z")
I won’t offer an opinion on whether this is true today, but there has certainly been a history of it in years past. It astonishes me now to recall how, during the 1980s and early 1990s we were told routinely that the Islamist rebels in Afghanistan wanted to establish a “religious republic”. In the sense that one could arguably describe Stalin’s USSR and Hitler’s Germany as republics–just not democratic ones, we could also apply the same term to Taliban Afghanistan. But there’s no gainsaying that “religious republic” sounds a lot nicer than “republic lorded over by brutally fanatic religious fundamentalists”. Nor was it just media talking heads that did this. Anyone who had the opportunity to be quoted in print or to appear in broadcasts would use the same phraseology. It’s the adjective “religious” that seems to be the issue, making it sound rather benign and charitable, thus reminding us of religious organizations that we’re more familiar with. For example, the Salvation Army does a great deal of good community work, even if to many of us the uniforms and official creed seem to be over the top. And obviously the same is true of numerous Islam-based organizations. But to call the Taliban government a religious republic simply feels wrong. ---
**Author:** ![UDS](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/u/ecae2f/32.png) [@UDS](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/UDS)\ **Post date:** [March 3, 2016, 6:21am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/media-too-pro-muslim/747303/140 "2016-03-03T06:21:36Z")
> [@Spectre\_of\_Pithecanthropus](#): > > . . . But to call the Taliban government a religious republic simply feels wrong. It may “feel wrong” to you, but it’s not inaccurate, and it hardly counts as evidence of a “pro-Muslim” bias. The truth is that for a long time the Taliban got fairly benign coverage in the western media because they started out opposing the Soviet occupation, and were backed by the US and its client, Pakistan, for that reason. Later on, Washington backed the Tabliban because they saw it as opposing Iranian influence in the region. The fact is that the Taliban only started to get bad press in the West when they began to host forces that directly attacked western targets (like Al-Qaeda). As long as their human rights abuses were only directed at other Muslims, nobody gave a stuff. if there’s a bias at work there it’s not a pro-Muslim bias. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/media-too-pro-muslim/747303.md?page=6) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/media-too-pro-muslim/747303.md?page=8)