# Medieval bullcrap words in Words with Friends (scrabble) **URL:** \ **Category:** The Game Room\ **Created:** [July 13, 2013, 4:27am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/medieval-bullcrap-words-in-words-with-friends-scrabble/663388 "2013-07-13T04:27:17Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 1
**Author:** ![Evil\_Captor](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/f17d59/32.png) [@Evil\_Captor](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Evil_Captor)\ **Post date:** [July 13, 2013, 4:27am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/medieval-bullcrap-words-in-words-with-friends-scrabble/663388/1 "2013-07-13T04:27:17Z")
So the wife and I enjoy spending time together, generally mealtimes, playing Words with Friends with varying online adversaries. (Words, with Friends, in case you are unfamiliar with it, is an online form of Scrabble.) Like Scrabble, Words with Friends has a source of words that are acceptable, a built-in dictionary I suppose. What I’ve noticed is that the dictionary accepts a lot of Old English and Middle English words that I have never used, or heard anyone else use, or read in any book. Words like “smeek,” “abye” and “vrouw” to name a few. Words that make sense only if you are an English Lit. major who dug hard into the original Old English Pilgrim’s Progress and Chaucer. There are a lot of neologisms and slang words that Words With Friends will NOT allow, like zerg and nerf, and these are words that are in common usage with a lot of people. If you can’t allow neologisms that have been around for a decade, but DO allow terms from the Middle Ages, seems … funky. Look, I’m not complaining about words that I’m not familiar with, like dossel (which I now understand to be something you hang in a chancery) or “za” which is slang for “pizza” (though why this neologism and not the others?) or qi or jo or xi which I understand to be a “Scrabble words” that nobody uses but hey, worth points, you know? But what is it with all the medieval bullshit? I can’t see why these terms are acceptable Scrabble terms. Anyone know why? Is it that English speaking scrabble players in Scotland or Ireland or Wales still use these words? It’s the only explanation I can come up with. Any of our friends from across the pond got any input here? Do you take “smeek” breaks? Do you like to go out with the little vrouw? ---
**Author:** ![Giles](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/giles/32/60_2.png) [@Giles](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Giles)\ **Post date:** [July 13, 2013, 4:37am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/medieval-bullcrap-words-in-words-with-friends-scrabble/663388/2 "2013-07-13T04:37:12Z")
“Vrouw” is a Dutch word, not Middle English, and if it’s used in English at all it’s a recent borrowing from Dutch to mean “Dutch woman”. ---
**Author:** ![Joey\_P](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/j/919ad9/32.png) [@Joey\_P](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Joey_P)\ **Post date:** [July 13, 2013, 5:20am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/medieval-bullcrap-words-in-words-with-friends-scrabble/663388/3 "2013-07-13T05:20:05Z")
A few days ago my mom played deil and something else about as odd as that that I can’t remember off the top of my head. That told me she gave up her ‘no cheating’ rule and starting using my sisters’ trick of just sliding letters into place and hitting send to see what works. ---
**Author:** ![Yorikke](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/yorikke/32/4335_2.png) [@Yorikke](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Yorikke)\ **Post date:** [July 13, 2013, 5:38am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/medieval-bullcrap-words-in-words-with-friends-scrabble/663388/4 "2013-07-13T05:38:13Z")
You have to look at them not as words, but strings of letters that signify points. I play tons and tons of words that I only know from smartphone word games. I blow away people in real life who _only_ play tabletop - on the phone, it’s so easy to learn so much so quickly, because it’s casual. It can be an ordeal to play tabletop Scrabble, but right now, I have about two dozen word games going simultaneously. ---
**Author:** ![Evil\_Captor](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/f17d59/32.png) [@Evil\_Captor](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Evil_Captor)\ **Post date:** [July 13, 2013, 1:54pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/medieval-bullcrap-words-in-words-with-friends-scrabble/663388/5 "2013-07-13T13:54:39Z")
> [@Joey\_P](#): > > A few days ago my mom played deil and something else about as odd as that that I can’t remember off the top of my head. That told me she gave up her ‘no cheating’ rule and starting using my sisters’ trick of just sliding letters into place and hitting send to see what works. We do that form of “cheating” too in the sense we put up things that SEEM like they might be words and see if they go through. Mostly they don’t, but we’ve been surprised many times … “THAT’S a word?” ---
**Author:** ![Evil\_Captor](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/f17d59/32.png) [@Evil\_Captor](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Evil_Captor)\ **Post date:** [July 13, 2013, 1:56pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/medieval-bullcrap-words-in-words-with-friends-scrabble/663388/6 "2013-07-13T13:56:36Z")
> [@Yorikke](#): > > You have to look at them not as words, but strings of letters that signify points. I play tons and tons of words that I only know from smartphone word games. I blow away people in real life who _only_ play tabletop - on the phone, it’s so easy to learn so much so quickly, because it’s casual. It can be an ordeal to play tabletop Scrabble, but right now, I have about two dozen word games going simultaneously. Yeah, when we go out to eat, we bring our Ipad and play. Adds a lot to the dining experience. We run maybe a dozen games at a time ourselves. Just makes it hella more convenient. ---
**Author:** ![MaxTheVool](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/9fc29f/32.png) [@MaxTheVool](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/MaxTheVool)\ **Post date:** [July 13, 2013, 10:29pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/medieval-bullcrap-words-in-words-with-friends-scrabble/663388/7 "2013-07-13T22:29:02Z")
> [@Evil\_Captor](#): > > qi or jo or xi which I understand to be a “Scrabble words” that nobody uses but hey, worth points, you know? “Xi” is a letter of the greek alphabet, so it’s only slightly more obscure than “pi”. So certainly not up there with something like “oe” as far as being a “scrabble word” is concerned. (Now of course I expect someone to post about how often they hear and talk about an “oe” in everyday life.) ---
**Author:** ![Justin\_Bailey](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/justin_bailey/32/8792_2.png) [@Justin\_Bailey](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Justin_Bailey)\ **Post date:** [July 14, 2013, 2:28am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/medieval-bullcrap-words-in-words-with-friends-scrabble/663388/8 "2013-07-14T02:28:01Z")
> [@Evil\_Captor](#): > > There are a lot of neologisms and slang words that Words With Friends will NOT allow, like zerg and nerf, and these are words that are in common usage with a lot of people. If you can’t allow neologisms that have been around for a decade, but DO allow terms from the Middle Ages, seems … funky. “Zerg” and “Nerf” are both technically proper nouns. It’ll be many years before they move into the realm of just words. ---
**Author:** ![pulykamell](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/pulykamell/32/3166_2.png) [@pulykamell](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/pulykamell)\ **Post date:** [July 14, 2013, 2:57am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/medieval-bullcrap-words-in-words-with-friends-scrabble/663388/9 "2013-07-14T02:57:15Z")
> [@Giles](#): > > “Vrouw” is a Dutch word, not Middle English, and if it’s used in English at all it’s a recent borrowing from Dutch to mean “Dutch woman”. Also, Chaucer is not Old English, it’s Middle English, as is The Pilgrim’s Progress. Middle English still looks like English, but with funny spellings/pronunciations and some strange vocabulary. Old English, meanwhile, looks like a foreign language. Compare: > [@](#): > > WHAN that Aprille with his shoures soote > The droghte of Marche hath perced to the roote, > And bathed every veyne in swich licour, > Of which vertu engendred is the flour; (Chaucer, _Canterbury Tales_, Middle English) vs: > [@](#): > > Hwæt! We Gardena in geardagum, > þeodcyninga, þrym gefrunon, > hu ða æþelingas ellen fremedon. > Oft Scyld Scefing sceaþena þreatum, (Unknown, _Beowulf_, Old English.) Carry on with the rest of the discussion. I just wanted to clarify the difference between Old and Middle English, as it seems to come up a lot. ---
**Author:** ![pulykamell](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/pulykamell/32/3166_2.png) [@pulykamell](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/pulykamell)\ **Post date:** [July 14, 2013, 3:02am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/medieval-bullcrap-words-in-words-with-friends-scrabble/663388/10 "2013-07-14T03:02:46Z")
> [@Justin\_Bailey](#): > > “Zerg” and “Nerf” are both technically proper nouns. It’ll be many years before they move into the realm of just words. I have no clue what “zerg” could even possibly mean. Is this a common word? ---
**Author:** ![Tamerlane](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/tamerlane/32/7602_2.png) [@Tamerlane](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Tamerlane)\ **Post date:** [July 14, 2013, 3:29am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/medieval-bullcrap-words-in-words-with-friends-scrabble/663388/11 "2013-07-14T03:29:00Z")
> [@pulykamell](#): > > I have no clue what “zerg” could even possibly mean. Is this a common word? Only if you are a gamer, really. [zerg](http://www.urbandictionary.com/define.php?term=zerg). ETA: And mostly if you’re a specific sort of gamer. I know the word, but never use it myself in pretty much any context. I’ve mostly long since lost my taste for RTS games, confirmed when I couldn’t get past an hour of Starcraft II without getting bored. ---
**Author:** ![Evil\_Captor](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/f17d59/32.png) [@Evil\_Captor](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Evil_Captor)\ **Post date:** [July 14, 2013, 4:34am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/medieval-bullcrap-words-in-words-with-friends-scrabble/663388/12 "2013-07-14T04:34:45Z")
> [@Tamerlane](#): > > Only if you are a gamer, really. [zerg](http://www.urbandictionary.com/define.php?term=zerg). > > ETA: And mostly if you’re a specific sort of gamer. I know the word, but never use it myself in pretty much any context. I’ve mostly long since lost my taste for RTS games, confirmed when I couldn’t get past an hour of Starcraft II without getting bored. If you mean MMO gamers in general, maybe. I learned about it in SL Gor, where it means using mass bows to attack an enemy in overwhelming numbers to ensure a win. Not a popular tactic. ---
**Author:** ![Evil\_Captor](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/f17d59/32.png) [@Evil\_Captor](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Evil_Captor)\ **Post date:** [July 14, 2013, 4:46am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/medieval-bullcrap-words-in-words-with-friends-scrabble/663388/13 "2013-07-14T04:46:42Z")
> [@pulykamell](#): > > Also, Chaucer is not Old English, it’s Middle English, as is The Pilgrim’s Progress. Middle English still looks like English, but with funny spellings/pronunciations and some strange vocabulary. Old English, meanwhile, looks like a foreign language. > > Compare: > > (Chaucer, _Canterbury Tales_, Middle English) > > vs: > > (Unknown, _Beowulf_, Old English.) > > Carry on with the rest of the discussion. I just wanted to clarify the difference between Old and Middle English, as it seems to come up a lot. Middle English is certainly obscure enough all by its lonesome. It just occupies a special area of “lame” in terms of reasonableness as being a scrabble word source. Nobody uses these words. Now I’m not saying a word has to be in common usage to be acceptable. Specialist terms that SOMEBODY uses regularly, like “xylem” and “phloem” used by botanists, or “fibrocyst” used in medicine or “zymurgy” used by chemists, are just fine by me. But who the fuck uses the Middle English words any more? ---
**Author:** ![pulykamell](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/pulykamell/32/3166_2.png) [@pulykamell](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/pulykamell)\ **Post date:** [July 14, 2013, 5:06am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/medieval-bullcrap-words-in-words-with-friends-scrabble/663388/14 "2013-07-14T05:06:52Z")
> [@Evil\_Captor](#): > > Middle English is certainly obscure enough all by its lonesome. It just occupies a special area of “lame” in terms of reasonableness as being a scrabble word source. Nobody uses these words. Now I’m not saying a word has to be in common usage to be acceptable. Specialist terms that SOMEBODY uses regularly, like “xylem” and “phloem” used by botanists, or “fibrocyst” used in medicine or “zymurgy” used by chemists, are just fine by me. But who the fuck uses the Middle English words any more? I’m actually neither here nor there in terms of this argument. Is Middle English obscure enough to be a source for Scrabble words? Probably. If those words aren’t used contemporaneously, I would agree. But my post was just to clarify the difference between Old and Middle English. That’s the split where English really takes a turn. ---
**Author:** ![Little\_Plastic\_Ninja](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/l/f07891/32.png) [@Little\_Plastic\_Ninja](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Little_Plastic_Ninja)\ **Post date:** [July 14, 2013, 5:09am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/medieval-bullcrap-words-in-words-with-friends-scrabble/663388/15 "2013-07-14T05:09:43Z")
> [@Evil\_Captor](#): > > Middle English is certainly obscure enough all by its lonesome. It just occupies a special area of “lame” in terms of reasonableness as being a scrabble word source. Nobody uses these words. Now I’m not saying a word has to be in common usage to be acceptable. Specialist terms that SOMEBODY uses regularly, like “xylem” and “phloem” used by botanists, or “fibrocyst” used in medicine or “zymurgy” used by chemists, are just fine by me. But who the fuck uses the Middle English words any more? Medieval history and literature scholars? ---
**Author:** ![Evil\_Captor](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/f17d59/32.png) [@Evil\_Captor](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Evil_Captor)\ **Post date:** [July 14, 2013, 5:13am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/medieval-bullcrap-words-in-words-with-friends-scrabble/663388/16 "2013-07-14T05:13:35Z")
> [@Little\_Plastic\_Ninja](#): > > Medieval history and literature scholars? If that were grounds for inclusion in Scrabble, then I suppose that any foreign language’s words could be used, after all, we have scholars who study just about every language. ---
**Author:** ![Fear\_Itself](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/fear_itself/32/19637_2.png) [@Fear\_Itself](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Fear_Itself)\ **Post date:** [July 14, 2013, 5:24am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/medieval-bullcrap-words-in-words-with-friends-scrabble/663388/17 "2013-07-14T05:24:48Z")
WWF wouldn’t let me use “pugil”, as in pugil stick, the padded staff used in military martial arts training. [Pugil stick - Wikipedia](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Pugil_stick) ---
**Author:** ![Lightnin](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/lightnin/32/180_2.png) [@Lightnin](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Lightnin)\ **Post date:** [July 14, 2013, 2:30pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/medieval-bullcrap-words-in-words-with-friends-scrabble/663388/18 "2013-07-14T14:30:31Z")
> [@Justin\_Bailey](#): > > “Zerg” and “Nerf” are both technically proper nouns. It’ll be many years before they move into the realm of just words. Nah, they’re both verbs. **Zerg** : \*To assure ones victory using overwhelming numbers. To greatly outnumber the enemy, and swarm them. To trivialize en encounter using mass numbers of allies rather then skill\* **Nerf** : _To make worse or weaken, usually in the context of weakening something in order to balance out a game._ ---
**Author:** ![Justin\_Bailey](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/justin_bailey/32/8792_2.png) [@Justin\_Bailey](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Justin_Bailey)\ **Post date:** [July 14, 2013, 2:38pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/medieval-bullcrap-words-in-words-with-friends-scrabble/663388/19 "2013-07-14T14:38:55Z")
> [@Lightnin](#): > > Nah, they’re both verbs. Not in common usage. In common usage they are still connected to the original nouns they sprang from (an alien race and a foam toy line, respectively). As slang, they’ve moved over into verbs, but Words With Friends (and Scrabble) does not accept niche slang words. Like I said before, over time, both will surely be added. Nerf especially, as that one has even moved beyond gamer circles. ---
**Author:** ![Nava](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/n/da6949/32.png) [@Nava](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Nava)\ **Post date:** [July 14, 2013, 4:51pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/medieval-bullcrap-words-in-words-with-friends-scrabble/663388/20 "2013-07-14T16:51:21Z")
> [@Evil\_Captor](#): > > …“zymurgy” used by chemists, are just fine by me. But who the fuck uses the Middle English words any more? Fuck, I’m a chemical engineer (ok, I haven’t really worked as a chemist in a decade) and I swear it’s the first time I encounter that word. [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/medieval-bullcrap-words-in-words-with-friends-scrabble/663388.md?page=2)