I was always worried that I’d be training myself too fall asleep when I meditate. Do you ever have a problem with that?
If that happens, it’s probably a sign that you aren’t getting enough sleep. Sleep is very important. Maybe even more importing that meditating.
Sometimes although that predates using meditation to get to sleep.
I also sometimes meditate after taking Modafinil, with my eyes open or staring at a bright, high color temperature lamp. No falling asleep there.
I use a lot of breathwork and breathing patterns. They are good tools to modulate your energy level. If you think you might fall asleep, switch to a more energizing breath pattern. If you feel anxious, switch to a more relaxing pattern. I usually do this by manipulating the relative length of the inhales and exhales as per my previous post. Notice your breath and concentrate on it. And I use mantras and visualizations to keep my mind steady. It gets easier with practice. I sometimes use a breath pattern called “Breathe of Fire” which is a rapid powerful breath that originates from abdomen. I find it really assists focus if done for an extended period of time, I sometime do 30 minutes of meditation with that breath although I had to work up to it.
Once, very recently, I had a LOT of crap on my mind when I started. I was thinking “Yeah, this is going to work, before I set down. But after a few minutes my mind tried to wander. It couldn’t . The thoughts just weren’t there. It’s hard to explain but it was pretty awesome.
Missed edit window.
The other thing I wanted to add is the thing no one wants to hear. I think the best assist to meditation is physical exercise beforehand. I prefer yoga because it combines physical exercise with a high degree of focus - it’s good mind prep. But other forms of vigorous exercise can work, too.
I’m finding it interesting that there are so many different ways to approach meditation. That’s its not just this big monolith, but a multifaceted thing. I’m glad I started this thread!
As an update for me. Today was day 20 in a row of practice. Yesterday and today I sat for 15 minutes instead of 10. I was genuinely nervous, about sitting for so long but it was pretty good. I found that with the longer time it was actually a little easier to stick with it. Maybe just because I had told myself before that I would be sitting for longer. I’m not sure.
I also started reading “Mindfulness in Plain English.” I am liking the headspace guided meditations, especially now I with the longer meditations where there is a lot more silence, but I figured I needed a little outside guidance too. Short of finding an actual teacher, a couple of highly recommended books will have to do. Mindfulness in Plain English leans pretty heavily on Buddhism (talks about possibly developing powers? All roads leading to Nirvana etc) but the advice is geared towards non believers and he explains the philosophy behind Vipassana pretty well. In particular I have really found the chapter on how to deal with discomfort during meditation helpful.
I’m glad you started the thread too. I’d already started 2 in the past but they didn’t really stick as a place that people came back to. I hope this one will.
Longer sessions: There seems to be a fixed cost, a certain amount of time required to quiet one’s mind. I.e.: 4 15 minute sessions are not the same as 1 60 minute session since if it takes you 10 minutes to get your mind to a pretty quiet place, the 4 15 minute sessions will result in 20 minutes of quiet whereas the 1 60 minute session will result in 50 minutes of quiet.
You could try different lengths and see what you like best.
Could you share some the advice about how to deal with discomfort during meditation?
Coincidentally, I am starting, too. I meant to anyway but I heard a bit on NPR a week or so ago, a talk with the author of:
“10% Happier: How I Tamed the Voice in My Head, Reduced Stress Without Losing My Edge, and Found Self-Help That Actually Works–A True Story”
Now, I’m not one for self-help books, but I thought the talk was interesting. Didn’t intend to but the book, but went to the Play Store over the weekend to find something to read, and lo, it was on the front page discounted to $1.99. So yeah ok, gotta get it. Not a bad read, considering.
Started back at yoga, too. Meditation is going ok, I am not doing well at carving out time. Despite recommendations to the contrary, I do find myself doing it in bed.
That’s interesting. I had been pointed to Sam Harris and have been listening to some of his Waking Up Podcast. Mostly the episodes with Joseph Goldstein (whose book the Experience of Insight I almost got instead) but I also saw this print interview with him and Dan Harris talking about 10% Happier.
https://www.samharris.org/blog/item/taming-the-mind
I know nothing about Sam Harris but I get the impression he is a person people feel ways about reading some of his stuff. Still, his meditation stuff is interesting.
I started meditating by taking a Mindfulness Based Stress Reduction (MBSR) class. I found it very helpful, and it was surprisingly Science-based. You might also check out the writings of Jon Kabat Zinn.
Yeah. It’s the whole of chapter 10 so I may come back and give more later, but the main thing (after making sure you are avoiding causing unnecessary discomfort in the first place) is to make the discomfort a temporary focus of the meditation. Focus on it long enough to understand it and recognize that it is a sensation like any other. Just like a noise you hear or a thought you have. Remove your emotional reaction to it and let it go. The emotional response to the discomfort causes further discomfort and if you can relax the emotional response and treat it with distance you can manage the discomfort.
I’m not sure if I can put that into practice or not, (heck I’m hoping I stated it correctly here, I’m going to have to double check in the morning) but I’m trying.
Funny that Dan & Sam Harris should be mentioned, Dan harris was on Joe Rogan’s podcast yesterday: - YouTube . There’s one Rogan podcast where both Sam and Dan Harris were on: - YouTube
If you’re interested in meditation, you might find these two podcasts interesting.
Discomfort: I’ve noticed that, whether it’s unpleasant sensations, thoughts or emotions, a lot of the unpleasantness isn’t the initial stimulus, it’s the result of our reaction to it. It’s like there are sparks we can’t control but we can control whether or not we give them fuel to feed on and grow. If you want to practice equanimity toward unpleasant sensations, you may want to try a cold shower. It doesn’t have to be 100% cold for the whole duration; You could have 1/2 cold shower then 2/3 cold or you could end your shower with 10 seconds of fully cold water then 15 seconds next time. A cold shower is a pretty good exercise of equanimity.
Could you rephrase your impression of Sam Harris? You seem to have accidentally a word. I personally much prefer when he talks about meditation, the brain and psychedelics than when he ventures into politics even if I largely agree with him.
Yes, thats a clearer way of saying what I was trying to say. I find it to be surprisingly helpful.
Ha. I didn’t actually but I understand why you may think I did. I’ll rephrase. The one time I listened to a non meditation podcast with him he spent a lot of time talking about his enemies and how people on Facebook hate him and take his words out of context all the time. Knowing nothing about the guy beyond that it left me with a slightly unfavorable impression of how he carries himself, but a strong impression that he is polarizing among people who know who he is.
But, I have really enjoyed his stuff on meditation and think his talks with Goldstein are fascinating.
Wherever you go there you are is my next book to pick up. Kabat Zinn is another one who seems to be a really thoughtful guy on the subject.
So, an update.
Keeping at it.
Mindfulness in Plain English introduced me to the concept of “the sinking mind” which is, essentially, the opposite of the monkey mind. It’s a quasi sleep like state where you are not thinking per se, but are also not aware.
I feel like this is where I have been going a lot recently, but yesterday I managed to notice it happening and was able to keep myself alert. So, I’m pretty proud of that. It genuinely feels good to have been doing this for a little over a month. I’m starting to get to the point where I feel like the guided part of the meditation is a bit annoying after we start…
Maybe that’s a good sign too? I probably need to find a class. I did track down a “mindfulness center” near where I live with two “certified mindfulness coaches” but the website gives me a bit of pause. I may check it out anyway and see if it seems more legit in person.
It’s been a month since the last update, can we get another?
Steven Hayes is worth a watch: Psychological flexibility: How love turns pain into purpose | Steven Hayes | TEDxUniversityofNevada - YouTube
Mental Brakes to Avoid Mental Breaks | Steven Hayes | TEDxDavidsonAcademy - YouTube
Sure.
I didn’t want to bump the thread twice in a row.
I have progressed to regularly doing 20 minutes at a time which seems to be about the most I can handle for now. I am also using a mostly unguided meditation though it still has an intro and a exit speech and one brief reminder about 5 minutes in to stay focused.
The anxiety seems to have gone as have most of the strange itches. I still have issues with “the sinking mind” or the dull mind as others have called it. But not nearly as regularly. I still get lost in thought, but not for as long.
I read 10% Happier (great book, just a really well done memoir.) That book got me reading Real Happiness by Sharon Salzburg. Which I liked. I’m trying to incorporate some Metta into my practice, but I’m honestly not sure if I’m doing it right.
I’m thinking my next book will be something by Joseph Goldstein.
I just got Real Love by Sharon Salzburg for my kindle. I’m going to start listening to it tomorrow morning when I walk. She is really good. My hat’s off to you NAF1138–you’re doing great. 