# Men, we're facing a crisis with button up shirts **URL:** \ **Category:** In My Humble Opinion\ **Created:** [November 19, 2014, 2:20am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/men-were-facing-a-crisis-with-button-up-shirts/705033 "2014-11-19T02:20:25Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 2
**Author:** ![pbbth](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/p/f9ae1b/32.png) [@pbbth](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/pbbth)\ **Post date:** [November 19, 2014, 3:21am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/men-were-facing-a-crisis-with-button-up-shirts/705033/21 "2014-11-19T03:21:57Z")
Clothing is getting weird. I’m a chick but I’m dealing with similar issues. I have 10 year old pairs of jeans that are in excellent shape despite being worn twice a week for 10 years. I haven’t been able to find a pair of jeans in the last two years that will last for more than 4 months. They basically rub away to nothingness like that paper kindergartners use to practice their letters. I have old t-shirts and sweaters that are in excellent shape but new t-shirts and work tops that are so thin you can see every detail of my bra through them even on a first wear. Seriously, I have freaking Wal-Mart sweaters from 7 or 8 years ago that look awesome and are in perfect shape but I can’t keep a new sweater from self destructing before the end of the season. ---
**Author:** ![usedtobe](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/u/ec9cab/32.png) [@usedtobe](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/usedtobe)\ **Post date:** [November 19, 2014, 6:55am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/men-were-facing-a-crisis-with-button-up-shirts/705033/22 "2014-11-19T06:55:06Z")
The code word is/was “tailored” - if you don’t have a descernable-from-30-feet waist, do not buy “tailored” shirts. There used to be people, called “sales assistants” or some such, who could tell you if you were a good match for a garment. Find a brand that fits and save yourself and the retailer some trouble. Or learn the new code words for “young and trim” vs “no longer young, and all that entails” (to put it nicely). ---
**Author:** ![CarnalK](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/carnalk/32/486_2.png) [@CarnalK](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/CarnalK)\ **Post date:** [November 19, 2014, 8:55am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/men-were-facing-a-crisis-with-button-up-shirts/705033/23 "2014-11-19T08:55:30Z")
> [@Leaffan](#): > > Now that’s interesting, because pant size in inches seems to be very consistent for me. I’ll try them on, but I can almost be guaranteed that a 32/30 will fit just fine. I agree. I was a 32/32 for years. Now I’m at 34/32 and Im afraid I can’t blame a “skinny trend” Quite the opposite on my part frankly. As for S M L sold shirts, I find the cheaper ones do seem to be getting smaller. I just assumed they were trying to save a buck. ---
**Author:** ![Starving\_Artist](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/aeb1de/32.png) [@Starving\_Artist](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Starving_Artist)\ **Post date:** [November 19, 2014, 9:09am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/men-were-facing-a-crisis-with-button-up-shirts/705033/24 "2014-11-19T09:09:07Z")
> [@sparky\_1](#): > > Sizes really make no sense. > > I also tried on 3 different pairs of pants tonight (different companies, too). > > All were size 36/30. > > One was too loose in the waste (could pull them down while buttoned). > > One was too tight and could barely button. > > One fit normally, so I bought them. This is the result of [vanity sizing](http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2010/09/08/vanity-sizing-mens-pants_n_709004.html). ---
**Author:** ![DinoR](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/dinor/32/2821_2.png) [@DinoR](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/DinoR)\ **Post date:** [November 19, 2014, 11:10am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/men-were-facing-a-crisis-with-button-up-shirts/705033/25 "2014-11-19T11:10:07Z")
> [@sparky\_1](#): > > Get the hell off my lawn. But he can’t wave the cane properly because his shirt’s too tight!!! ---
**Author:** ![TriPolar](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/tripolar/32/3008_2.png) [@TriPolar](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/TriPolar)\ **Post date:** [November 19, 2014, 11:32am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/men-were-facing-a-crisis-with-button-up-shirts/705033/26 "2014-11-19T11:32:56Z")
There is not a single article of clothing ever made in my size. Everything is either too long, too short, too wide, too narrow, too tight, too loose, and off in some other way. I gave up looking for clothes that fit decades ago. ---
**Author:** ![sparky\_1](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/77aa72/32.png) [@sparky\_1](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/sparky_1)\ **Post date:** [November 19, 2014, 11:33am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/men-were-facing-a-crisis-with-button-up-shirts/705033/27 "2014-11-19T11:33:05Z")
> [@Starving\_Artist](#): > > This is the result of [vanity sizing](http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2010/09/08/vanity-sizing-mens-pants_n_709004.html). I’m that happens, but I was referring to the very poor standard in sizing. I’m a 36/30 and own and wear many 36/30 pants from many different makes. It bugs me to go to a store and grab multiple pairs of the same pant in the same stated size, but have them all in reality not be the same size. There was a thread similar to this in regards to jeans. ---
**Author:** ![GrumpyBunny](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/g/bc8723/32.png) [@GrumpyBunny](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/GrumpyBunny)\ **Post date:** [November 19, 2014, 1:02pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/men-were-facing-a-crisis-with-button-up-shirts/705033/28 "2014-11-19T13:02:30Z")
_falls over laughing_ Welcome to what it’s like for women to buy clothing. 😃 ---
**Author:** ![elbows](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/b3f665/32.png) [@elbows](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/elbows)\ **Post date:** [November 19, 2014, 1:12pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/men-were-facing-a-crisis-with-button-up-shirts/705033/29 "2014-11-19T13:12:32Z")
I was thinking the same thing! It’s been like this for a decade or more for women, try to keep up! (I quit shopping at The Gap when I became a size zero. WTF? I’m a 6 or 8 everywhere else, that’s just bullshit vanity sizing that makes no freaking sense, and shopping extra hard at your store. Idiots!) ---
**Author:** ![Leaffan](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/leaffan/32/299_2.png) [@Leaffan](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Leaffan)\ **Post date:** [November 19, 2014, 1:34pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/men-were-facing-a-crisis-with-button-up-shirts/705033/30 "2014-11-19T13:34:00Z")
> [@GrumpyBunny](#): > > _falls over laughing_ > > Welcome to what it’s like for women to buy clothing. 😃 It never used to be like this for men: not that I’ve ever noticed anyway. I haven’t had to buy pants in a couple of years, so maybe things have changed. I did buy some jeans at Costco about a year ago. The 32/30 fit perfectly, which is good since there are no change rooms at Costco. ---
**Author:** ![epbrown01](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/7ba0ec/32.png) [@epbrown01](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/epbrown01)\ **Post date:** [November 19, 2014, 2:28pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/men-were-facing-a-crisis-with-button-up-shirts/705033/31 "2014-11-19T14:28:15Z")
> [@sparky\_1](#): > > What’s a guy to do? Sizes change as fashions change, and body types change with the market. You’re not the current Gap customer’s idea of a large. I apparently want too high a rise on my jeans. Such is life. ---
**Author:** ![brendon\_small](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/brendon_small/32/17101_2.png) [@brendon\_small](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/brendon_small)\ **Post date:** [November 19, 2014, 2:35pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/men-were-facing-a-crisis-with-button-up-shirts/705033/32 "2014-11-19T14:35:15Z")
> [@sparky\_1](#): > > I’m that happens, but I was referring to the very poor standard in sizing. I’m a 36/30 and own and wear many 36/30 pants from many different makes. It bugs me to go to a store and grab multiple pairs of the same pant in the same stated size, but have them all in reality not be the same size. > > There was a thread similar to this in regards to jeans. I read one time before that this has to do with the way that mass produced clothes are made. For example, jeans are cut in a group of so many. Imagine a stack of paper that you cut but is slightly too large for the cut, so some pieces are stretched and some have slack, but they are generally the same size. The same thing happens with fabric, but when it is stitched together it kind of is the same overall. Not perfect, but you get what you pay for. I don’t know if that is true, but ever since then I’ve always tried on every pair of pants before I bought it (unless I was at a store where I couldn’t - certain thrift stores don’t have a dressing room). I find that two pair of pants hanging next to each other might have a big difference in size, so I generally only buy them if they fit. If one pair feels tight, I may look to see if another pair appears bigger before moving a size up, but likely I’ll just pass. ---
**Author:** ![Winston\_Smith](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/w/e95f7d/32.png) [@Winston\_Smith](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Winston_Smith)\ **Post date:** [November 19, 2014, 2:37pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/men-were-facing-a-crisis-with-button-up-shirts/705033/33 "2014-11-19T14:37:41Z")
It’s not just button-down shirts. I was at Macy’s last week, and bought 3 Polo shirts (size L). I’ve been wearing them since I was a teenager, and have always worn the same size, so I didn’t bother trying them on. A couple days later, I put one on, and it was _snug_, to say the least. WTF? I took it off, looked at the label “Custom Fit”. WTF? Two of the three shirts I bought were Custom Fit, aka skinny shirts (or something). Annoying. ---
**Author:** ![sparky\_1](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/77aa72/32.png) [@sparky\_1](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/sparky_1)\ **Post date:** [November 19, 2014, 2:45pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/men-were-facing-a-crisis-with-button-up-shirts/705033/34 "2014-11-19T14:45:57Z")
> [@Winston\_Smith](#): > > It’s not just button-down shirts. I was at Macy’s last week, and bought 3 Polo shirts (size L). I’ve been wearing them since I was a teenager, and have always worn the same size, so I didn’t bother trying them on. A couple days later, I put one on, and it was _snug_, to say the least. WTF? I took it off, looked at the label “Custom Fit”. WTF? Two of the three shirts I bought were Custom Fit, aka skinny shirts (or something). Annoying. Exactly what I’m talking about! I recently bought an Izod and a Nautica shirt that mostly fit the way shirts always used to (the Nautica was slightly slim, which looks good and is still comfortable). I guess I’ll stick to them for the time being. ---
**Author:** ![sparky\_1](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/77aa72/32.png) [@sparky\_1](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/sparky_1)\ **Post date:** [November 19, 2014, 2:46pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/men-were-facing-a-crisis-with-button-up-shirts/705033/35 "2014-11-19T14:46:57Z")
> [@GrumpyBunny](#): > > _falls over laughing_ > > Welcome to what it’s like for women to buy clothing. 😃 > [@elbows](#): > > I was thinking the same thing! It’s been like this for a decade or more for women, try to keep up! > > (I quit shopping at The Gap when I became a size zero. WTF? I’m a 6 or 8 everywhere else, that’s just bullshit vanity sizing that makes no freaking sense, and shopping extra hard at your store. Idiots!) I’ve heard of this issue with women’s clothing. You have my full sympathy! ---
**Author:** ![Macca26](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/13edae/32.png) [@Macca26](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Macca26)\ **Post date:** [November 19, 2014, 2:54pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/men-were-facing-a-crisis-with-button-up-shirts/705033/36 "2014-11-19T14:54:14Z")
> [@GrumpyBunny](#): > > _falls over laughing_ > > Welcome to what it’s like for women to buy clothing. 😃 Yeah, I’ve noticed the retailers seem to think that women are born without shoulders or something. And I’m completely average in the bust but god forbid they make a button-down shirt that won’t gap between the buttons without being a giant bag everywhere else on the body (and yet somehow…the shoulders will still be tight!) I love winter simply because I can wear sweaters and cardigans the whole time. They can try and make those too small too, but they’ll stretch to make up the difference. ---
**Author:** ![Labrador\_Deceiver](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/l/7c8e57/32.png) [@Labrador\_Deceiver](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Labrador_Deceiver)\ **Post date:** [November 19, 2014, 3:22pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/men-were-facing-a-crisis-with-button-up-shirts/705033/37 "2014-11-19T15:22:22Z")
> [@Cubsfan](#): > > 34 year old guy here. > > Yes. Yes. Yes. > > I hate older button ups because they are so goddamm baggy, too much fabric in the arms and don’t cut at the waist. I’m 5’9" and weigh 165. I don’t have a gut really but am not ripped. Pretty well proportioned. I absolutely cannot go back to wearing button up shirts that are older than 3-4 years because they are cut so unshapely. In order for a button up to look right you need to at least slightly fill out the chest. Old shirts that was impossible for me. Amen. Current men’s fashion is a much needed breath of fresh air. ---
**Author:** ![Fuzzy\_Dunlop](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/f/848f3c/32.png) [@Fuzzy\_Dunlop](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Fuzzy_Dunlop)\ **Post date:** [November 19, 2014, 3:40pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/men-were-facing-a-crisis-with-button-up-shirts/705033/38 "2014-11-19T15:40:06Z")
> [@sparky\_1](#): > > It’s this damn skinny trend that’s screwing it all up. If there is one crisis America is absolutely not facing, it’s a skinny trend. I have to buy slim or tailored fit shirts and I am unequivocally not _slim_. I’m a little overweight, but if I buy regular shirts they hang off me like a tent. I don’t think you mentioned exactly how old you are, but maybe it’s time you start buying a brand better suited for adult men? LL Bean makes several slimmer fits than their classic fit. There’s nothing wrong with wearing Gap shirts if they still fit, but I don’t think their target customer has been around long enough to have 10 year old Gap shirts in their closet. ---
**Author:** ![Chefguy](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/chefguy/32/138_2.png) [@Chefguy](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Chefguy)\ **Post date:** [November 19, 2014, 3:43pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/men-were-facing-a-crisis-with-button-up-shirts/705033/39 "2014-11-19T15:43:51Z")
> [@GrumpyBunny](#): > > _falls over laughing_ > > Welcome to what it’s like for women to buy clothing. 😃 Honestly. My wife tried to find a pair of jeans a few weeks ago. Manufacturers have all gone to the skinny leg jeans, even for plus sizes, which just look stupid on a 68 year old woman. ---
**Author:** ![sparky\_1](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/77aa72/32.png) [@sparky\_1](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/sparky_1)\ **Post date:** [November 19, 2014, 3:45pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/men-were-facing-a-crisis-with-button-up-shirts/705033/40 "2014-11-19T15:45:51Z")
> [@Fuzzy\_Dunlop](#): > > If there is one crisis America is absolutely not facing, it’s a skinny trend. I have to buy slim or tailored fit shirts and I am unequivocally not _slim_. I’m a little overweight, but if I buy regular shirts they hang off me like a tent. > > I don’t think you mentioned exactly how old you are, but maybe it’s time you start buying a brand better suited for adult men? LL Bean makes several slimmer fits than their classic fit. > > There’s nothing wrong with wearing Gap shirts if they still fit, but I don’t think their target customer has been around long enough to have 10 year old Gap shirts in their closet. I’m 39. My point being is that it’s not just The Gap, but rather seemingly every brand you’d find at a major mall. And it’s not me, since I’ve been buying the shirts for years (always size L, and I’m actually less heavy now) and they now don’t fit due to the “skinny” trend. I imagine people dealt with the same thing when bell bottoms were popular. I guess I’m that “square” guy still wanting a straight leg. Dammit, this is making me feel old and fat, yet I’m neither (mostly) [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/men-were-facing-a-crisis-with-button-up-shirts/705033.md?page=1) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/men-were-facing-a-crisis-with-button-up-shirts/705033.md?page=3)