# Merlin \[British TV show\]
**URL:** https://boards.straightdope.com/t/merlin-british-tv-show/676088
**Category:** Cafe Society
**Created:** [December 11, 2013, 6:24pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/merlin-british-tv-show/676088 "2013-12-11T18:24:14Z")
**Posts on this page:** 20
**Page:** 1
### Author:  [@twickster](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/twickster)
#### Post date: [December 11, 2013, 6:24pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/merlin-british-tv-show/676088/1 "2013-12-11T18:24:14Z")
I’m currently watching _Merlin_ – I always enjoy a new take on the Arthurian legend, and Merlin is definitely my favorite character.
One question, though, on Uther – is his character traditionally so anti-magic, or is that something they cooked up to provide the dramatic tension in the series?
[Note: I just started Season 3 last night, so pls. avoid spoilers for later developments.]
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### Author:  [@Revenant\_Threshold](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Revenant_Threshold)
#### Post date: [December 11, 2013, 7:24pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/merlin-british-tv-show/676088/2 "2013-12-11T19:24:45Z")
Well, he uses magic in order to rape a woman and conceive Arthur in some versions of the story, so not necessarily, at least. And many stories have him also counselled by Merlin in some fashion.
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### Author:  [@twickster](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/twickster)
#### Post date: [December 11, 2013, 7:35pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/merlin-british-tv-show/676088/3 "2013-12-11T19:35:13Z")
Yeah, they definitely seem to have made the whole parentage thing G-rated – Morgana not being related to either of them (at least as has been revealed so far, there seems to be additional unrevealed stuff about Igraine’s death, etc.), and Mordred alive and too old to be the child of anyone still, apparently, in their teens as this story unfolds.
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### Author:  [@Malacandra](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Malacandra)
#### Post date: [December 11, 2013, 8:43pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/merlin-british-tv-show/676088/4 "2013-12-11T20:43:22Z")
Next to none of the show bears any relationship to the story of Arthur as usually presented, so I’d suggest you just relax and enjoy the ride. Ditto for Atlantis and Greek myths when that swims into your ken.
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### Author:  [@Mahaloth](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Mahaloth)
#### Post date: [December 11, 2013, 8:57pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/merlin-british-tv-show/676088/5 "2013-12-11T20:57:03Z")
I’m about 4 episodes to finishing the series, twick.
I really think seasons 3, 4, and 5 were vastly superior to the things that came before it. Especially starting at the end of 3.
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### Author:  [@twickster](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/twickster)
#### Post date: [December 11, 2013, 9:29pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/merlin-british-tv-show/676088/6 "2013-12-11T21:29:00Z")
Yeah, it’s a lot of fun. I liked the eps in S2 when Uther ended up married to the troll.
And yeah, it’s clear that there’s only sketchy connections to the standard Arthurian canon – but it’s fun spotting the discrepancies. I just wasn’t sure if Uther (who I consider a secondary character) was one of them or not.
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### Author:  [@What\_Exit](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/What_Exit)
#### Post date: [December 11, 2013, 9:34pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/merlin-british-tv-show/676088/7 "2013-12-11T21:34:32Z")
My kids love the show. I find it a little underwhelming but I think it hurts that I know too much off the Arthurian legends. It didn’t work for me.
I am so far enjoying Atlantis, which feels a lot like Merlin. Hopefully it lasts.
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### Author:  [@twickster](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/twickster)
#### Post date: [December 12, 2013, 1:02am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/merlin-british-tv-show/676088/8 "2013-12-12T01:02:18Z")
It was originally aired as a kids show, right? The first version of the Arthurian legend I encountered was the Disney _[Sword in the Stone](http://www.imdb.com/title/tt0057546/reference)_, about which I – 50! years later – recall nothing but that I enjoyed it, so presumably it won’t prevent their getting into more authentic renditions later.
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### Author:  [@Captain\_Amazing](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Captain_Amazing)
#### Post date: [December 12, 2013, 1:29am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/merlin-british-tv-show/676088/9 "2013-12-12T01:29:50Z")
> [@twickster](#):
>
> One question, though, on Uther – is his character traditionally so anti-magic, or is that something they cooked up to provide the dramatic tension in the series?
In traditional Arthurian canon, Uther doesn’t really show up much. He wins a bunch of victories against the Saxons, then Uther falls in love with Ingraine, the wife of Gorlois of Cornwall. Gorlois sees this and sends Ingraine to his castle of Tintagel, which is impregnable. Then he revolts. Uther besieges him in another town, but he’s still obsessed with Ingraine. So Merlin transforms him, using magic so that he takes the form of Gorlois. Thinking that the disguised Uther is her husband, Ingraine sleeps with him and conceives Arthur. Then, the next morning, news comes that the real Gorlois was killed in the siege. Uther marries Ingraine, and when Arthur is born (either to hide his sin of sleeping with another man’s wife, or because Merlin demanded Arthur as part of the deal), Uther gives Arthur to Merlin, who gives him to the knight Sir Hector to raise, keeping Sir Hector ignorant of Arthur’s parentage.
:Later, Uther wins a battle against the Saxons, and then is killed when a Saxon poisons his drink. And that’s basically the story of Uther in the legend.
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### Author:  [@twickster](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/twickster)
#### Post date: [December 12, 2013, 1:30pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/merlin-british-tv-show/676088/10 "2013-12-12T13:30:49Z")
Oh, right, Sir Hector – I’d forgotten that whole element of the story, just knew I didn’t know much about Uther.
(And last night, BTW, I watched the ep in this version that finally dealt with Morgana’s paternity.)
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### Author:  [@BrokenBriton](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/BrokenBriton)
#### Post date: [December 12, 2013, 4:09pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/merlin-british-tv-show/676088/11 "2013-12-12T16:09:24Z")
> [@twickster](#):
>
> It was originally aired as a kids show, right?
Iirc, it airs in roughly the same slot as Dr Who (obv. when Dr Who isn’t) - very early Saturday evening stuff.
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### Author:  [@twickster](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/twickster)
#### Post date: [December 15, 2013, 3:04am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/merlin-british-tv-show/676088/12 "2013-12-15T03:04:18Z")
Just finished Season 3, a two-part finale that includes the founding of the round table, Arthur plunging Excalibur into the stone, and all kinds of other excellent stuff. Must say I’m enjoying the heck out of this.
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### Author:  [@twickster](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/twickster)
#### Post date: [December 17, 2013, 3:43pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/merlin-british-tv-show/676088/13 "2013-12-17T15:43:25Z")
> [@twickster](#):
>
> It was originally aired as a kids show, right? The first version of the Arthurian legend I encountered was the Disney _[Sword in the Stone](http://www.imdb.com/title/tt0057546/reference)_, about which I – 50! years later – recall nothing but that I enjoyed it, so presumably it won’t prevent their getting into more authentic renditions later.
I was too fried to watch any _Merlin_ tonight (seriously – _that_ fried), so I watched _The Sword in the Stone_, which is also on Netflix.
Man, pretty insubstantial.
I also remember liking _The Once and Future King_ when I was a kid – would that stand up to rereading or should I not waste my time?
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### Author:  [@What\_Exit](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/What_Exit)
#### Post date: [December 17, 2013, 4:52pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/merlin-british-tv-show/676088/14 "2013-12-17T16:52:36Z")
> [@twickster](#):
>
> I was too fried to watch any _Merlin_ tonight (seriously – _that_ fried), so I watched _The Sword in the Stone_, which is also on Netflix.
>
> Man, pretty insubstantial.
>
> I also remember liking _The Once and Future King_ when I was a kid – would that stand up to rereading or should I not waste my time?
The book is better than the Disney movie or for that matter the Musical. (Camelot was based on _The Once and Future King_ also). I think overall it holds up to re-reading. Though treat it as reading a young adult novel of course.
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### Author:  [@Mahaloth](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Mahaloth)
#### Post date: [December 18, 2013, 9:08pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/merlin-british-tv-show/676088/15 "2013-12-18T21:08:25Z")
I just watched the finale of Merlin. I have to say, it was genuinely moving and very well done.
Stick with it, twick.
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### Author:  [@Honey](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Honey)
#### Post date: [December 19, 2013, 5:15am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/merlin-british-tv-show/676088/16 "2013-12-19T05:15:11Z")
It’s funny how many people I’ve known who think that King Arthur was a real person.
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### Author:  [@BrokenBriton](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/BrokenBriton)
#### Post date: [December 19, 2013, 10:26am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/merlin-british-tv-show/676088/17 "2013-12-19T10:26:29Z")
> [@Honey](#):
>
> It’s funny how many people I’ve known who think that King Arthur was a real person.
King Arthur did live and rule. The gap, however, between folklore and reality is probably … not insignificant:
> **[King Arthur](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/King_Arthur)**
>
> King Arthur (Welsh: Brenin Arthur, Cornish: Arthur Gernow, Breton: Roue Arzhur, French: Roi Arthur), according to legends, was a king of Britain. He is a folk hero and a central figure in the medieval literary tradition known as the Matter of Britain.
> In Welsh sources, Arthur is portrayed as a leader of the post-Roman Britons in battles against the Anglo-Saxons in the late 5th and early 6th centuries. He first appears in two early medieval historical sources, the Annales Cambriae and the H...
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### Author:  [@madmonk28](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/madmonk28)
#### Post date: [December 19, 2013, 10:42am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/merlin-british-tv-show/676088/18 "2013-12-19T10:42:34Z")
The article you linked to makes it clear that the existence of a historical King Arthur is far from decided.
> [@](#):
>
> The details of Arthur’s story are mainly composed of folklore and literary invention, and his historical existence is debated and disputed by modern historians.
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### Author:  [@GuanoLad](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/GuanoLad)
#### Post date: [December 19, 2013, 11:05am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/merlin-british-tv-show/676088/19 "2013-12-19T11:05:55Z")
I have recently fallen on the side of believing there was a King that was the source of the legends. I hadn’t realised how little is known about the Dark Ages, and it seems conceivable to me that somewhere during that period there were events and people of significance that could’ve been King Arthur’s inspiration.
Same with Robin Hood.
On the other hand, I also tend not to believe Jesus really existed, so my opinions probably aren’t worth listening to.
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### Author:  [@BrokenBriton](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/BrokenBriton)
#### Post date: [December 19, 2013, 12:49pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/merlin-british-tv-show/676088/20 "2013-12-19T12:49:51Z")
> [@madmonk28](#):
>
> The article you linked to makes it clear that the existence of a historical King Arthur is far from decided.
No it doesn’t. The half sentence you quote refers to (what was) a $100 book from 2002. In 11 years the book in question has garnered two reviews. It doesn’t even directly consider the fact (or otherwise) of Arthur:
> [@](#):
>
> This is a scholarly work about the Arthurian legend that does not seek to “prove” that Arthur, the man, actually existed. This book is about whence came the IDEA of Arthur.
By ‘idea’, the author is talking about the folklore legends and whose interests those served through the centuries.
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