# Mexico The Narco-State **URL:** \ **Category:** Great Debates\ **Created:** [January 18, 2009, 3:25pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/mexico-the-narco-state/481860 "2009-01-18T15:25:53Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 18\ **Page:** 3
**Author:** ![gonzomax](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/g/e8c25b/32.png) [@gonzomax](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/gonzomax)\ **Post date:** [January 21, 2009, 2:40pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/mexico-the-narco-state/481860/41 "2009-01-21T14:40:45Z")
One of the biggest drug states is Colombia. They are not our neighbor. Iraq is growing huge supplies of poppies and are involved deeply in drug trade. You over rate propinquity. Most drugs come from far away. As long as profit can be made, they will get in.The market is here. ---
**Author:** ![gonzomax](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/g/e8c25b/32.png) [@gonzomax](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/gonzomax)\ **Post date:** [January 21, 2009, 2:45pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/mexico-the-narco-state/481860/42 "2009-01-21T14:45:59Z")
> **[MORE THAN 1,000,000 DRUG USERS IN U.S.; Country Consumes from Ten to Sixty...](https://www.nytimes.com/1919/06/13/archives/more-than-1000000-drug-users-in-us-country-consumes-from-ten-to.html)** > > report of sub-com of Treasury Com on investigation reveals heavy smuggling traffic and shows more than 1,000,000 addicts It does not take much effort to find how much drugs are used in the US. We are number 1. But if you include over the counter drugs, prescription drugs, alcohol and weed, we are a drugged up society. ---
**Author:** ![daksya](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/dc4da7/32.png) [@daksya](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/daksya)\ **Post date:** [January 21, 2009, 3:17pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/mexico-the-narco-state/481860/43 "2009-01-21T15:17:10Z")
> [@gonzomax](#): > > One of the biggest drug states is Colombia. They are not our neighbor. Iraq is growing huge supplies of poppies and are involved deeply in drug trade. You over rate propinquity. Most drugs come from far away. As long as profit can be made, they will get in.The market is here. When did I ever say anything about producers being nearby? Read my comment again; I was talking of trafficking. From the DEA > [@](#): > > Law enforcement and intelligence community sources estimate **65 percent** of the cocaine shipped to the United States moves **through the Central America-Mexico** corridor, primarily by vessels operating in the eastern Pacific. Colombian traffickers utilize fishing vessels to transport bulk shipments of cocaine from Colombia to the west coast of Mexico and, to a lesser extent, the Yucatan Peninsula. The cocaine is off-loaded to go-fast vessels for the final shipment to the Mexican coast. The loads are subsequently broken down into smaller quantities to be moved across the Southwest border. > … > Marijuana smuggled into the United States, whether **grown in Mexico or transshipped from** other Latin American source areas, accounts for most of the marijuana available in the United States. Marijuana produced in Mexico remains the most widely available. * * * Cite on “Iraq is growing huge supplies of poppies”? ---
**Author:** ![BrainGlutton](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/82dd89/32.png) [@BrainGlutton](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/BrainGlutton)\ **Post date:** [January 21, 2009, 3:56pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/mexico-the-narco-state/481860/44 "2009-01-21T15:56:11Z")
> [@gonzomax](#): > > Iraq is growing huge supplies of poppies and are involved deeply in drug trade. I don’t think so, but Afghanistan is. ---
**Author:** ![hellpaso](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/h/ecae2f/32.png) [@hellpaso](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/hellpaso)\ **Post date:** [January 21, 2009, 6:25pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/mexico-the-narco-state/481860/45 "2009-01-21T18:25:52Z")
I can’t really add anything meaningful to this debate other than to comment that I appreciate the links to the articles ya’ll have provided. I lived in El Paso for many years and now live in a different border city. I think the local media is somewhat afraid to provide too much information regarding what is going on across the border. Most of what I learn about the situation is on the internet. There have been several instances of journalists being killed for reporting the facts. There wasn’t much drug-related crime in El Paso, but where I live now there are kidnappings and drug-related murders starting to increase. ---
**Author:** ![mswas](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/e99b99/32.png) [@mswas](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/mswas)\ **Post date:** [January 21, 2009, 6:27pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/mexico-the-narco-state/481860/46 "2009-01-21T18:27:15Z")
**hellpaso** Have you read: Down by the River - by Charles Bowden? ---
**Author:** ![griffin1977](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/g/977dab/32.png) [@griffin1977](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/griffin1977)\ **Post date:** [January 21, 2009, 6:49pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/mexico-the-narco-state/481860/47 "2009-01-21T18:49:07Z")
> [@Tijuana\_Golds](#): > > These people aren’t just going to settle down and compete legally with pharmaceutical companies. But they we be crippled. Currently they have an income that is comparable to the entire GDP of Mexico. If drugs were legalized in the US that disappears at a stroke, nothing they can do will change that. > [@Tijuana\_Golds](#): > > The cartels have to be eliminated not legalized if Mexico is going to see this through.. But legalization is prerequisite to doing that, without it you are not eliminating anything, you are just creating a gap in the market for other cartels to fill. Additionally the key point is you are NOT legalizing the cartels activity. Illicit drug smuggling would be just as illegal as distilling moonshine is now, but, just like distilling moonshine on the repeal of prohibition, it changes overnight from a major criminal income source (and hence a major source of instability and violence in society) to a quaint back-woods misdemeanor. > [@Tijuana\_Golds](#): > > Anyway, the idea of legalization _is not_ going to get done. I don’t get this. How bad does it have to get before the obvious solution is broached. Personally I just think its a matter of time. ---
**Author:** ![mswas](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/e99b99/32.png) [@mswas](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/mswas)\ **Post date:** [January 21, 2009, 6:52pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/mexico-the-narco-state/481860/48 "2009-01-21T18:52:19Z")
> [@griffin1977](#): > > But they we be crippled. Currently they have an income that is comparable to the entire GDP of Mexico. If drugs were legalized in the US that disappears at a stroke, nothing they can do will change that. Exactly, he’s not recognizing that people need the power to be the mercenary killers that they are. Deprive them of their money supply and they will be reduced in power. > [@](#): > > But legalization is prerequisite to doing that, without it you are not eliminating anything, you are just creating a gap in the market for other cartels to fill. Right. If you legalize it then the cartels who can make the transition to corporations will win out. This is more likely to be done in Colombia than Mexico where the cartels already are essentially corporations with shareholders. > [@](#): > > I don’t get this. How bad does it have to get before the obvious solution is broached. Personally I just think its a matter of time. From your lips to God’s ears. ---
**Author:** ![hellpaso](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/h/ecae2f/32.png) [@hellpaso](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/hellpaso)\ **Post date:** [January 21, 2009, 7:26pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/mexico-the-narco-state/481860/49 "2009-01-21T19:26:48Z")
> [@mswas](#): > > **hellpaso** Have you read: Down by the River - by Charles Bowden? I did when it first came out–thanks! ---
**Author:** ![An\_Gadai](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/d6d6ee/32.png) [@An\_Gadai](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/An_Gadai)\ **Post date:** [January 21, 2009, 7:30pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/mexico-the-narco-state/481860/50 "2009-01-21T19:30:49Z")
The Guardian (UK) ran an [article on the Mexican drug war](http://www.guardian.co.uk/world/2008/nov/02/mexico-drugs-trade-tijuana-cocaine) that I found illuminating. ---
**Author:** ![hellpaso](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/h/ecae2f/32.png) [@hellpaso](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/hellpaso)\ **Post date:** [January 21, 2009, 7:47pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/mexico-the-narco-state/481860/51 "2009-01-21T19:47:04Z")
The local paper, [themonitor.com](http://themonitor.com), is reporting today that three more heads were found in an ice chest just south of Juarez. ---
**Author:** ![mswas](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/e99b99/32.png) [@mswas](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/mswas)\ **Post date:** [January 21, 2009, 8:21pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/mexico-the-narco-state/481860/52 "2009-01-21T20:21:17Z")
> [@hellpaso](#): > > I did when it first came out–thanks! It’s a good book. I got it from my Mother in-Law who lives in Marfa. ---
**Author:** ![gonzomax](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/g/e8c25b/32.png) [@gonzomax](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/gonzomax)\ **Post date:** [January 22, 2009, 5:44am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/mexico-the-narco-state/481860/53 "2009-01-22T05:44:23Z")
> [@BrainGlutton](#): > > I don’t think so, but Afghanistan is. [http://www.independent.co.uk/news/world/middle-east/opium-iraqs-deadly-new-export-449962.html](http://www.independent.co.uk/news/world/middle-east/opium-iraqs-deadly-new-export-449962.html) I think so. ---
**Author:** ![An\_Gadai](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/d6d6ee/32.png) [@An\_Gadai](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/An_Gadai)\ **Post date:** [January 22, 2009, 10:02am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/mexico-the-narco-state/481860/54 "2009-01-22T10:02:23Z")
> [@gonzomax](#): > > [http://www.independent.co.uk/news/world/middle-east/opium-iraqs-deadly-new-export-449962.html](http://www.independent.co.uk/news/world/middle-east/opium-iraqs-deadly-new-export-449962.html) I think so. Strictly speaking your cite speaks of a nascent poppy growing industry in Iraq and doesn’t tally with your statement that “Iraq is growing huge supplies of poppies and are involved deeply in drug trade”. The first line of your cite is: “Farmers in southern Iraq have started to grow opium poppies in their fields for the first time, sparking fears that Iraq might become a serious drugs producer along the lines of Afghanistan” ---
**Author:** ![flood](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/f/bbe5ce/32.png) [@flood](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/flood)\ **Post date:** [January 22, 2009, 4:07pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/mexico-the-narco-state/481860/55 "2009-01-22T16:07:39Z")
The violence has already spilled over. I’m sometimes amazed at how the Mexican drug war has gone largely unnoticed by the majority of Americans. Most people just don’t realize how dangerous some parts of Mexico really are right now (or, should I say, have been for the past decade at least). Yes, the cartels are armed as well, if not better, than local and federal law enforcement agencies (hell, some of those guys are even ex-special ops guy that decided the pay was better on the other side). ---
**Author:** ![mswas](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/e99b99/32.png) [@mswas](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/mswas)\ **Post date:** [January 22, 2009, 5:00pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/mexico-the-narco-state/481860/56 "2009-01-22T17:00:13Z")
The Crystal Meth trade dominates in New Mexico amongst Mexican gangs. ---
**Author:** ![BrainGlutton](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/82dd89/32.png) [@BrainGlutton](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/BrainGlutton)\ **Post date:** [January 22, 2009, 6:08pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/mexico-the-narco-state/481860/57 "2009-01-22T18:08:23Z")
Is there any politician or political party or movement in Mexico that is seriously trying to do something about all this drug-war/narcostate stuff? I don’t recall it being an issue in the [2006 election,](http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Mexican_general_election,_2006) but I didn’t follow it that closely. ---
**Author:** ![mswas](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/e99b99/32.png) [@mswas](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/mswas)\ **Post date:** [January 22, 2009, 6:19pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/mexico-the-narco-state/481860/58 "2009-01-22T18:19:54Z")
> [@BrainGlutton](#): > > Is there any politician or political party or movement in Mexico that is seriously trying to do something about all this drug-war/narcostate stuff? I don’t recall it being an issue in the [2006 election,](http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Mexican_general_election,_2006) but I didn’t follow it that closely. Well there is Calderon. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/mexico-the-narco-state/481860.md?page=2)