# Michael Flynn's Shining City on the Hill - For Christians Only **URL:** \ **Category:** The BBQ Pit\ **Created:** [November 15, 2021, 4:09pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/michael-flynns-shining-city-on-the-hill-for-christians-only/954397 "2021-11-15T16:09:19Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 6
**Author:** ![RitterSport](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/rittersport/32/6326_2.png) [@RitterSport](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/RitterSport)\ **Post date:** [December 1, 2021, 3:21pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/michael-flynns-shining-city-on-the-hill-for-christians-only/954397/101 "2021-12-01T15:21:14Z")
A fine service you’ve provided. Thanks! ---
**Author:** ![Gyrate](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/gyrate/32/3588_2.png) [@Gyrate](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Gyrate)\ **Post date:** [December 1, 2021, 3:25pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/michael-flynns-shining-city-on-the-hill-for-christians-only/954397/102 "2021-12-01T15:25:39Z")
> [@Love\_Rhombus](#): > > Obviously a hijack-but do people really do this? I certainly do. I mean, it’s in the Alps, it’s on the Swiss franc, it’s traditionally been a tax haven for shady billionaires, and they gave women the right to vote ridiculously late - all the actual differences are trivial. ---
**Author:** ![Telemark](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/telemark/32/372_2.png) [@Telemark](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Telemark)\ **Post date:** [December 1, 2021, 3:26pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/michael-flynns-shining-city-on-the-hill-for-christians-only/954397/103 "2021-12-01T15:26:31Z")
> [@webwarrior](#): > > Catholic, Protestant, and Jewish. One nation, under God. Don’t lump me in with those bible thumpers, thank you very much. Not my God. ---
**Author:** ![Love\_Rhombus](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/love_rhombus/32/10694_2.png) [@Love\_Rhombus](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Love_Rhombus)\ **Post date:** [December 1, 2021, 3:27pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/michael-flynns-shining-city-on-the-hill-for-christians-only/954397/104 "2021-12-01T15:27:07Z")
Huh. Thank you for the reply! ---
**Author:** ![kaylasdad99](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/kaylasdad99/32/3398_2.png) [@kaylasdad99](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/kaylasdad99)\ **Post date:** [December 1, 2021, 3:36pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/michael-flynns-shining-city-on-the-hill-for-christians-only/954397/105 "2021-12-01T15:36:26Z")
> [@webwarrior](#): > > You guys are making things way more complicated than they need to be. Welcome to CNN, Mr. Flynn. Of course. Why choose to discuss matters of complexity in complex terms when it’s so much more simple to be simplistic? /s ---
**Author:** ![webwarrior](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/webwarrior/32/9529_2.png) [@webwarrior](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/webwarrior)\ **Post date:** [December 1, 2021, 3:41pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/michael-flynns-shining-city-on-the-hill-for-christians-only/954397/106 "2021-12-01T15:41:01Z")
Poke 'em and eventually the truth comes out of 'em. Take that up with the DHS. ---
**Author:** ![webwarrior](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/webwarrior/32/9529_2.png) [@webwarrior](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/webwarrior)\ **Post date:** [December 1, 2021, 3:42pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/michael-flynns-shining-city-on-the-hill-for-christians-only/954397/107 "2021-12-01T15:42:03Z")
And often much closer to the truth. ---
**Author:** ![kaylasdad99](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/kaylasdad99/32/3398_2.png) [@kaylasdad99](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/kaylasdad99)\ **Post date:** [December 1, 2021, 3:42pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/michael-flynns-shining-city-on-the-hill-for-christians-only/954397/108 "2021-12-01T15:42:24Z")
> [@Czarcasm](#): > > > [@webwarrior](#): > > > > Allah is not Jehovah. > > [Is Allah the same as God?](https://amazingdiscoveries.org/blog/allah-god-jehovah/) > > You guys are making things way more complicated than they need to be. Welcome to CNN, Mr. Flynn. > > Are you actually using “Amazing Discoveries” as a cite?? > What a maroon. 🙄 Is that where the link goes? I guess I just lost a bet with myself. I would have thought Jack Chick ---
**Author:** ![webwarrior](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/webwarrior/32/9529_2.png) [@webwarrior](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/webwarrior)\ **Post date:** [December 1, 2021, 3:43pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/michael-flynns-shining-city-on-the-hill-for-christians-only/954397/109 "2021-12-01T15:43:30Z")
Again, Gen. Flynn’s comment before it was redacted by CNN and parroted by straightdopers. _Flynn argued that religion “is the foundation of this country,” which was “created as a Judeo-Christian country with the beautiful set of values and principles that we have.”_ ---
**Author:** ![ParallelLines](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/parallellines/32/3575_2.png) [@ParallelLines](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/ParallelLines)\ **Post date:** [December 1, 2021, 3:52pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/michael-flynns-shining-city-on-the-hill-for-christians-only/954397/110 "2021-12-01T15:52:00Z")
For the 4th? 5th? time, you haven’t provided any cites for your version of Michael Flynn’s statements or ‘thoughts.’ ---
**Author:** ![Broomstick](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/broomstick/32/246_2.png) [@Broomstick](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Broomstick)\ **Post date:** [December 1, 2021, 4:01pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/michael-flynns-shining-city-on-the-hill-for-christians-only/954397/111 "2021-12-01T16:01:14Z")
> [@webwarrior](#): > > Catholic, Protestant, and Jewish. One nation, under God. OK. But that statement does not reconcile with “one religion” from the reputed quote by Michael Flynn. They are very much not the same religion. It also leaves out all the other faiths, which I personally take issue with but I’d rather not fly off on that tangent. > [@webwarrior](#): > > Christians are the most loyal supporters of Israel. Only those Christians for whom the Jews figure into their tales of Armageddon. And frankly, I’m am continually baffled why support of a foreign country has anything to do with the United States, much less a nation that didn’t exist at the founding of the Republic and the legitimacy of its founding is debatable within the global Jewish community. If an American wants to support Israel more power to them. And if an American does not want to support Israel that is just as much their right. Supporting a foreign nation should not be some sort of badge of honor or checkbox for “good citizen”. Also > [@Alessan](#): > > Leave us the fuck out of this, asshole. ^ What he said (one of our Israeli members, which you may not know being new around here). ---
**Author:** ![ParallelLines](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/parallellines/32/3575_2.png) [@ParallelLines](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/ParallelLines)\ **Post date:** [December 1, 2021, 4:02pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/michael-flynns-shining-city-on-the-hill-for-christians-only/954397/112 "2021-12-01T16:02:58Z")
Okay, you don’t deserve this @webwarrior but for any one else that comes in and feels you may have been treated unfairly, here’s an article from a Christian (Baptist) website that includes a transcript of the relevant parts of the speech: > **[Michael Flynn says America needs ‘one religion under God’ – Baptist News Global](https://baptistnews.com/article/michael-flynn-says-america-needs-one-religion-under-god/)** > > Former Trump national security adviser Lt. Gen. Michael Flynn told a group of evangelical Christians Nov. 13 that America needs only “one religion under God.” Flynn spoke at a three-day church-based political rally in San Antonio, Texas, at the... > And then Ronald Reagan a couple of hundred years later again talked about it as the _shining_ city on the hill. _And they’re talking about the United States of America. Talking about the United States of America. ‘Cause when Matthew mentioned it in the Bible, he wasn’t talking about the physical ground that he was on; he was talking about something in the distance. So, if we are going to have one nation under God, which we must, we have to have one religion, one, one, one nation under God and one religion under God. Right? All of us together. Working together._ I don’t care what your ecumenical service is or what you are. I quoted a bit before and after, but a larger portion is in the original. So yeah, he’s open to all sects of Christians (he throws the valueless term Judeo-Christian of course). And I can’t help but notice the piece you quoted comes up moments previous to this section. So you’ve been obviously cherry picking quotes while ignoring he did indeed directly indicate one religion, you just are dancing around it. ---
**Author:** ![Gyrate](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/gyrate/32/3588_2.png) [@Gyrate](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Gyrate)\ **Post date:** [December 1, 2021, 4:05pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/michael-flynns-shining-city-on-the-hill-for-christians-only/954397/113 "2021-12-01T16:05:08Z")
> [@kaylasdad99](#): > > Is that where the link goes? I guess I just lost a bet with myself. I would have thought Jack Chick My guess was “religionofpeace”. Is that still a thing? > [@webwarrior](#): > > Again, Gen. Flynn’s comment before it was redacted by CNN and parroted by straightdopers. > > _Flynn argued that religion “is the foundation of this country,” which was “created as a Judeo-Christian country with the beautiful set of values and principles that we have.”_ Again, simply uttering the word “CNN” does not magically transform your statements into a coherent argument. I note that even you have selectively quoted Flynn as sentence fragments - now who’s “redacting” things? (Also: “Judeo-Christian” continues to not be a “church” or “religion”.) But why quibble? Here’s the statement in full: > [@](#): > > FLYNN: So, I think I just heard one of the best phrases that I’ve ever heard. Honestly. And comin’ out here, it was just, you know whether — you know — this — what he said because we were back there talking about religion and the religious community. ‘Cause I actually think we’ve got a(n) issue in the religious community (crowd cheers) and because it’s not together. **But if we can have one nation under God, we should have one church under God. Right?** And I think that that’s really, really a powerful, powerful statement. And uh … Because the religious community and these pastors out there around this country, they know, because I’ve spoken to many of them. **We have to take (sic) not just about religion.** ‘Cause the religion is the founder, is the foundation of this country. It really is. I mean if you really study the 1500s, the 1600s, the 1700s, and how we were created as a Judeo-Christian country with the you know beautiful, beautiful set of values and principles that we have. But now we’ve lost sight of that. We’ve lost sight of that. And many of the churches are — they’re split, and they’re doin’ their own thing. And somethin’s not right. Somethin’s not workin’. And so, you know, when we think about, when we think about our own faith, and this is what you’ve heard a lot about from different people today I think, when we talk about faith, there’s something shaking. OK? The ground underneath us is shaking. And it’s shaking because, you know what I mean? There is a time, and you have to believe this: that God Almighty is like involved in this country because this is it. This is it. This is the last place on Earth. This is, this is the shining city on the hill. This is the city on the hill. The city on the hill. The city on the hill was mentioned in Matthew. OK? It was mentioned in Matthew. And then a guy by the name of Winthrop mentioned it again in 1630. In 1630, OK, before the country was formed. And he also coined the term _New England._ “We’re going to go to this _New_ England” — this new world he was talking about. And he talked to the people there about this thing called the city on the hill. And then Ronald Reagan a couple of hundred years later again talked about it as the _shining_ city on the hill. _And they’re talking about the United States of America. Talking about the United States of America. ‘Cause when Matthew mentioned it in the Bible, he wasn’t talking about the physical ground that he was on; he was talking about something in the distance. **So, if we are going to have one nation under God, which we must, we have to have one religion, one, one, one nation under God and one religion under God.** Right? All of us together. Working together._ I don’t care what your ecumenical service is or what you are. We have to believe that this is a moment in time where this is good versus evil. So, ladies and gentlemen, I’m going to turn this over to this beautiful man — Josh — and let him take it from here. So, God bless you and enjoy. (Crowd cheers.) (Bolding mine) If he’d just been talking about an ecumenical approach this might have been a perfectly reasonable statement about Christian unity, but he explicitly places it in the context of America past, present and political. When he says “we have to take [sic] not just about religion” and immediately segues into a discussion about the country, how else should we take it, particularly when Dominionism is an increasingly strong strain in American right-wing politics? What message do you think he’s intending to convey, and why do you think that? Ultimately, of course, this is an irrelevance - Flynn is a corrupt has-been struggling to remain relevant. His previous hits include support for the “Pizzagate” conspiracy and he was a convicted felon who worked for foreign powers and lied to the FBI about it before his crony Donald pardoned him. Honestly, we shouldn’t have to care any more about what Flynn says than what Trump says. ---
**Author:** ![Czarcasm](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/czarcasm/32/4050_2.png) [@Czarcasm](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Czarcasm)\ **Post date:** [December 1, 2021, 4:21pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/michael-flynns-shining-city-on-the-hill-for-christians-only/954397/114 "2021-12-01T16:21:36Z")
Why do you care so much about what a corrupt has-been says? ---
**Author:** ![Miller](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/miller/32/481_2.png) [@Miller](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Miller)\ **Post date:** [December 1, 2021, 4:28pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/michael-flynns-shining-city-on-the-hill-for-christians-only/954397/115 "2021-12-01T16:28:05Z")
> [@webwarrior](#): > > Again, Gen. Flynn’s comment before it was redacted by CNN and parroted by straightdopers. > > _Flynn argued that religion “is the foundation of this country,” which was “created as a Judeo-Christian country with the beautiful set of values and principles that we have.”_ You keep talking about this “redacted” quote, but here’s the thing: I can’t find anywhere in this thread, or the linked CNN article, that features this allegedly redacted quote. The only time the article mentions the phrase “Judeo-Christian,” it’s in reference to another Republican, Josh Mandel, agreeing with Flynn. They’re not quoting Flynn at all, they’re actually quoting Mandel from an editorial he wrote last April; the phrase “Judeo Christian values” in the CNN article is a hyperlink to Mandel’s article. Nobody in this thread had said anything about his use of the term “Judeo-Christian,” either, until you showed up here, correcting a mistake that literally nobody, in this thread or at CNN, appears to have made. Am I wrong? Can you show me where this “redacted” quote you’re so worked up about appears, in either the original CNN article or in this thread? > [@webwarrior](#): > > What was obvious? Your bias or your agenda? Or both? Oh, I’m pretty open about those. I’m a queer liberal atheist who believes in freedom of religion, democratic government, and a multi-racial, multi-ethnic society. Or to paraphrase Josh Mandel, everything Republicans hate. ---
**Author:** ![Folacin](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/folacin/32/3195_2.png) [@Folacin](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Folacin)\ **Post date:** [December 1, 2021, 4:31pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/michael-flynns-shining-city-on-the-hill-for-christians-only/954397/116 "2021-12-01T16:31:55Z")
> [@webwarrior](#): > > Catholic, Protestant, and Jewish. One nation, under God. Aren’t there large swathes of non-Catholic Christians who don’t consider themselves Protestants (I think maybe the Baptists actually fall into that sub-set)? ---
**Author:** ![Love\_Rhombus](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/love_rhombus/32/10694_2.png) [@Love\_Rhombus](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Love_Rhombus)\ **Post date:** [December 1, 2021, 4:36pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/michael-flynns-shining-city-on-the-hill-for-christians-only/954397/117 "2021-12-01T16:36:47Z")
> [@webwarrior](#): > > Poke 'em and eventually the truth comes out of 'em. I believe the Geneva Convention forbids this. ---
**Author:** ![Miller](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/miller/32/481_2.png) [@Miller](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Miller)\ **Post date:** [December 1, 2021, 4:36pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/michael-flynns-shining-city-on-the-hill-for-christians-only/954397/118 "2021-12-01T16:36:59Z")
No, Baptists are absolutely Protestant. ---
**Author:** ![Pazu](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/pazu/32/15522_2.png) [@Pazu](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Pazu)\ **Post date:** [December 1, 2021, 4:40pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/michael-flynns-shining-city-on-the-hill-for-christians-only/954397/119 "2021-12-01T16:40:26Z")
> [@Folacin](#): > > Aren’t there large swathes of non-Catholic Christians who don’t consider themselves Protestants (I think maybe the Baptists actually fall into that sub-set)? Coptics, Russian Orthodox, and Greek Orthodox, among others, just off the top of my head… ---
**Author:** ![DocCathode](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/doccathode/32/18773_2.png) [@DocCathode](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/DocCathode)\ **Post date:** [December 1, 2021, 4:53pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/michael-flynns-shining-city-on-the-hill-for-christians-only/954397/120 "2021-12-01T16:53:03Z")
I’d like to weigh in as a Jew (I wear a yarmulke. I thank the Lord when things are good and turn to Him for strength when things are bad. I keep covenant with the G-d of Abraham. He keeps covenant with me). Speaking of Abrahamic faiths makes sense. Judaism, Christianity and Islam all cite Abraham as their first member. Speaking of JudeoChristian things makes no sense. It is a polite fiction. I am aware that many American Christians are diehard supporters of Israel. This is not because they love or care about Jews. This is because in their eschatological view, Israel must exist and at least a majority of Jews must gather there before the Second Coming can happen. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/michael-flynns-shining-city-on-the-hill-for-christians-only/954397.md?page=5) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/michael-flynns-shining-city-on-the-hill-for-christians-only/954397.md?page=7)