# Michael Moore is a Dishonest Hack **URL:** \ **Category:** The BBQ Pit\ **Created:** [June 4, 2010, 1:18pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/michael-moore-is-a-dishonest-hack/541915 "2010-06-04T13:18:24Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 12
**Author:** ![RTFirefly](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/c77e96/32.png) [@RTFirefly](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/RTFirefly)\ **Post date:** [June 19, 2010, 10:38am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/michael-moore-is-a-dishonest-hack/541915/221 "2010-06-19T10:38:33Z")
> [@Zeriel](#): > > See, that strikes me as a great bit of marketing for exactly the reason you described. It’s a cultural thing–my born-rural ass sees nothing out of place there. While I’m thinking more of, if he changes his mind after they’re married, he’s already got the gun to shoot her with. A perfect twofer in a very twisted (but still not uncommon) sort of way. ---
**Author:** ![ivan\_astikov](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/i/58f4c7/32.png) [@ivan\_astikov](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/ivan_astikov)\ **Post date:** [June 19, 2010, 11:45am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/michael-moore-is-a-dishonest-hack/541915/222 "2010-06-19T11:45:11Z")
> [@Zeriel](#): > > See, that strikes me as a great bit of marketing for exactly the reason you described. It’s a cultural thing–my born-rural ass sees nothing out of place there. And people like you are allowed to vote! No wonder your country is fucked up. It’s the likes of you who give hillbillies a bad name. ---
**Author:** ![Zeriel](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/z/58956e/32.png) [@Zeriel](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Zeriel)\ **Post date:** [June 19, 2010, 4:37pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/michael-moore-is-a-dishonest-hack/541915/223 "2010-06-19T16:37:36Z")
> [@RTFirefly](#): > > While I’m thinking more of, if he changes his mind after they’re married, he’s already got the gun to shoot her with. A perfect twofer in a very twisted (but still not uncommon) sort of way. How many times does something have to happen before it’s “uncommon” rather than “rare” or “almost never” per thousand population? Especially the infrequency of long guns being used as murder weapons in any context? > [@ivan\_astikov](#): > > And people like you are allowed to vote! No wonder your country is fucked up. It’s the likes of you who give hillbillies a bad name. Considering you’re an anti-semetic ex-con, your judgement isn’t exactly an exemplar. Why don’t you go rob another house, get caught, and whine about it from jail where I don’t have to hear you? ---
**Author:** ![pulykamell](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/pulykamell/32/3166_2.png) [@pulykamell](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/pulykamell)\ **Post date:** [June 19, 2010, 4:57pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/michael-moore-is-a-dishonest-hack/541915/224 "2010-06-19T16:57:19Z")
> [@Zeriel](#): > > See, that strikes me as a great bit of marketing for exactly the reason you described. It’s a cultural thing–my born-rural ass sees nothing out of place there. No, I completely understand the marketing behind this. However, I’m sure you can see how this might play as a bit odd to some folks. [QUOTE=RTFirefly] While I’m thinking more of, if he changes his mind after they’re married, he’s already got the gun to shoot her with. A perfect twofer in a very twisted (but still not uncommon) sort of way. [/quote] That’s exactly why I find the juxtaposition amusing. Not that I really think anybody is going to mow down their wife or fiance with the free shotgun they got from the jewelry store, it’s just the marketing of these two items together. Just like “Go to the bank, get a gun.” To be fair, I also found “go to the bank, get a toaster” to be bizarre, too. What the fuck do toasters have to do with banks? ---
**Author:** ![elucidator](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/8edcca/32.png) [@elucidator](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/elucidator)\ **Post date:** [June 19, 2010, 5:35pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/michael-moore-is-a-dishonest-hack/541915/225 "2010-06-19T17:35:51Z")
Go to the bank, get an adjustable rate mortgage. You’re toast. ---
**Author:** ![Zeriel](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/z/58956e/32.png) [@Zeriel](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Zeriel)\ **Post date:** [June 19, 2010, 5:46pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/michael-moore-is-a-dishonest-hack/541915/226 "2010-06-19T17:46:35Z")
> [@pulykamell](#): > > No, I completely understand the marketing behind this. However, I’m sure you can see how this might play as a bit odd to some folks. I can absolutely see that it plays as odd anywhere hunting culture is not as prevalent. It’s not even really “gun culture” now that I think about it. There’s a question–I’ve never seen these kinds of offers with anything other than hunting weapons–that is, it’s always “tool” guns (if fancy ones) rather than purely target-shooting or self-defense guns that I see being given away. I don’t see them for military-styled rifles and I don’t see them for small handguns (I DO see them for the kind of large-bore revolvers you use to hunt bear and wild pig, granted). Anyone seen otherwise? > [@](#): > > That’s exactly why I find the juxtaposition amusing. Not that I really think anybody is going to mow down their wife or fiance with the free shotgun they got from the jewelry store, it’s just the marketing of these two items together. Just like “Go to the bank, get a gun.” To be fair, I also found “go to the bank, get a toaster” to be bizarre, too. What the fuck do toasters have to do with banks? It’s along the lines of the “gift” thing–people subconsciously overvalue stuff when it’s A) free, B) non-essential, and C) something they want that they wouldn’t pay for normally. I bet the guy who came up with the gun as a freebie with engagement ring thing had or knew someone who had a girlfriend who wanted the typical X months of salary ring but got pissy with him when he wanted to spend money on a new rifle. I bet, given how long the latter promotion has been stereotypical, let alone going on in some places, that the exact opposite conversation happened in the 50s–“yes, we need a savings account. No, woman, you can’t buy a toaster, do you think I’m made of money?” ---
**Author:** ![The\_Second\_Stone](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/bbe5ce/32.png) [@The\_Second\_Stone](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/The_Second_Stone)\ **Post date:** [June 19, 2010, 6:34pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/michael-moore-is-a-dishonest-hack/541915/227 "2010-06-19T18:34:54Z")
Count me among those liberals who think that Moore is irresponsible. He got his interview with Heston through fraud, and once he found Heston had Alzheimer’s, he should have cut the interview out of the film, assuming he knew before release. While I find Moore entertaining, I check out everything he says. ---
**Author:** ![ivan\_astikov](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/i/58f4c7/32.png) [@ivan\_astikov](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/ivan_astikov)\ **Post date:** [June 19, 2010, 6:38pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/michael-moore-is-a-dishonest-hack/541915/228 "2010-06-19T18:38:06Z")
Charlton Heston’s response after seeing Michael Moore’s stitch-up job. **"Hey, I may have a fucking serious case of Alzheimer’s, but at least I don’t have Alzheimer’s. What was the question again?"** ---
**Author:** ![RTFirefly](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/c77e96/32.png) [@RTFirefly](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/RTFirefly)\ **Post date:** [June 19, 2010, 11:45pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/michael-moore-is-a-dishonest-hack/541915/229 "2010-06-19T23:45:20Z")
> [@Zeriel](#): > > How many times does something have to happen before it’s “uncommon” rather than “rare” or “almost never” per thousand population? Especially the infrequency of long guns being used as murder weapons in any context? Well, you’ve got me dead to rights there, pal! I confess that I said “X reminds me of Y,” in the same off-the-top-of-my-head manner that you did, without actually doing any more research than you did! Are you always this pedantic, or just when talking about guns? ---
**Author:** ![RTFirefly](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/c77e96/32.png) [@RTFirefly](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/RTFirefly)\ **Post date:** [June 19, 2010, 11:46pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/michael-moore-is-a-dishonest-hack/541915/230 "2010-06-19T23:46:25Z")
> [@ivan\_astikov](#): > > Charlton Heston’s response after seeing Michael Moore’s stitch-up job. > > **“Hey, I may have a fucking serious case of Alzheimer’s, but at least I don’t have Alzheimer’s. What was the question again?”** Question for those still hanging around: when Moore interviewed the Alzheimer’s-afflicted Heston, was he still president of the NRA? ---
**Author:** ![Zeriel](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/z/58956e/32.png) [@Zeriel](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Zeriel)\ **Post date:** [June 20, 2010, 12:44am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/michael-moore-is-a-dishonest-hack/541915/231 "2010-06-20T00:44:47Z")
> [@RTFirefly](#): > > Well, you’ve got me dead to rights there, pal! I confess that I said “X reminds me of Y,” in the same off-the-top-of-my-head manner that you did, without actually doing any more research than you did! > > Are you always this pedantic, or just when talking about guns? I do get pedantic about guns, because I’m sick of the level of unadulterated bull that is out there about them. So what? ---
**Author:** ![gonzomax](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/g/e8c25b/32.png) [@gonzomax](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/gonzomax)\ **Post date:** [June 20, 2010, 12:57am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/michael-moore-is-a-dishonest-hack/541915/232 "2010-06-20T00:57:46Z")
Moore is not anti-gun. He owns guns. Gun nuts are so hyper-sensitive that anything about guns makes them howl. ---
**Author:** ![RTFirefly](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/c77e96/32.png) [@RTFirefly](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/RTFirefly)\ **Post date:** [June 20, 2010, 7:42pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/michael-moore-is-a-dishonest-hack/541915/233 "2010-06-20T19:42:50Z")
> [@Zeriel](#): > > I do get pedantic about guns, because I’m sick of the level of unadulterated bull that is out there about them. So what? Because so what if it’s handguns rather than long guns that guys use to shoot their wives with? It’s not like it somehow makes it any less the “perfect twofer in a very twisted sort of way” unless you’re a hell of a nitpicker. Congratulations. ---
**Author:** ![Zeriel](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/z/58956e/32.png) [@Zeriel](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Zeriel)\ **Post date:** [June 21, 2010, 3:25am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/michael-moore-is-a-dishonest-hack/541915/234 "2010-06-21T03:25:26Z")
> [@RTFirefly](#): > > Because so what if it’s handguns rather than long guns that guys use to shoot their wives with? It’s not like it somehow makes it any less the “perfect twofer in a very twisted sort of way” unless you’re a hell of a nitpicker. > > Congratulations. I’m sorry, I thought bringing some actual information might be nice in among all the sniping. Carry on with whatever it is you’re doing then. ---
**Author:** ![RTFirefly](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/c77e96/32.png) [@RTFirefly](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/RTFirefly)\ **Post date:** [June 21, 2010, 9:27am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/michael-moore-is-a-dishonest-hack/541915/235 "2010-06-21T09:27:44Z")
I was saying why I found humor in something. You’re telling me that I’m wrong to have found humor in it because of some factual details. Whatever. ---
**Author:** ![Zeriel](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/z/58956e/32.png) [@Zeriel](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Zeriel)\ **Post date:** [June 21, 2010, 12:11pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/michael-moore-is-a-dishonest-hack/541915/236 "2010-06-21T12:11:28Z")
> [@RTFirefly](#): > > I was saying why I found humor in something. You’re telling me that I’m wrong to have found humor in it because of some factual details. Whatever. If you find humor in people dying, man, that’s on you. ---
**Author:** ![Bryan\_Ekers](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/bryan_ekers/32/183_2.png) [@Bryan\_Ekers](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Bryan_Ekers)\ **Post date:** [June 21, 2010, 7:16pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/michael-moore-is-a-dishonest-hack/541915/237 "2010-06-21T19:16:02Z")
> [@gonzomax](#): > > Moore is not anti-gun. He owns guns. Gun nuts are so hyper-sensitive that anything about guns makes them howl. I never got the impression _Bowling for Columbine_ was about guns - I always figured it was about fear. Trouble is, Moore gets easily sidetracked on irrelevancies like a savings plan that gives out guns or the operations of Lockheed-Martin or in confronting Dick Clark or Charlton Heston, undercutting his own message. ---
**Author:** ![RTFirefly](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/c77e96/32.png) [@RTFirefly](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/RTFirefly)\ **Post date:** [June 21, 2010, 9:48pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/michael-moore-is-a-dishonest-hack/541915/238 "2010-06-21T21:48:28Z")
> [@Zeriel](#): > > If you find humor in people dying, man, that’s on you. Good thing you missed [this thread](http://boards.straightdope.com/sdmb/showthread.php?t=560474), then. This being the Pit, feel free to express your outrage about people finding humor in everything from child molesting to the Holocaust. ---
**Author:** ![Zeriel](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/z/58956e/32.png) [@Zeriel](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Zeriel)\ **Post date:** [June 21, 2010, 10:10pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/michael-moore-is-a-dishonest-hack/541915/239 "2010-06-21T22:10:43Z")
> [@RTFirefly](#): > > Good thing you missed [this thread](http://boards.straightdope.com/sdmb/showthread.php?t=560474), then. This being the Pit, feel free to express your outrage about people finding humor in everything from child molesting to the Holocaust. Thanks, I think I will. The difference, as you well know, is that people use statements similar to yours as actual serious arguments. ---
**Author:** ![RTFirefly](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/c77e96/32.png) [@RTFirefly](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/RTFirefly)\ **Post date:** [June 22, 2010, 3:09am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/michael-moore-is-a-dishonest-hack/541915/240 "2010-06-22T03:09:53Z")
> [@Zeriel](#): > > Thanks, I think I will. The difference, as you well know, is that people use statements similar to yours as actual serious arguments. Glad to hear that. Now, in the absence of any evidence that I was one of those people, could you kindly stop behaving as if I was, and get the fuck over yourself and your silly pedantic games? Good. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/michael-moore-is-a-dishonest-hack/541915.md?page=11) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/michael-moore-is-a-dishonest-hack/541915.md?page=13)