# Michael Moore, you are a hypocritical lying sack of shit **URL:** \ **Category:** The BBQ Pit\ **Created:** [March 19, 2002, 10:04pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/michael-moore-you-are-a-hypocritical-lying-sack-of-shit/99112 "2002-03-19T22:04:01Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 7
**Author:** ![Crafter\_Man](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/crafter_man/32/458_2.png) [@Crafter\_Man](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Crafter_Man)\ **Post date:** [April 3, 2002, 11:38pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/michael-moore-you-are-a-hypocritical-lying-sack-of-shit/99112/121 "2002-04-03T23:38:14Z")
> [@](#): > > \*Originally posted by sailor \* > \*\*I always thought he was an asshole. \*\* Me too. ---
**Author:** ![rowrrbazzle](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/rowrrbazzle/32/414_2.png) [@rowrrbazzle](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/rowrrbazzle)\ **Post date:** [April 4, 2002, 1:11am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/michael-moore-you-are-a-hypocritical-lying-sack-of-shit/99112/122 "2002-04-04T01:11:51Z")
Here is Moore’s [response](http://www.salon.com/july97/moore970703.html) to the 1997 Salon article, and the author’s comments on Moore’s response. ---
**Author:** ![december](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/838e76/32.png) [@december](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/december)\ **Post date:** [April 4, 2002, 2:07am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/michael-moore-you-are-a-hypocritical-lying-sack-of-shit/99112/123 "2002-04-04T02:07:10Z")
> [@](#): > > \*Originally posted by Guinastasia \* > \*\*I’ve never seen Roger and Me, so I wouldn’t know… \*\* Although I don’t agree with MM’s politics (to say the least :eek: ) I do recommend _Roger and Me_. It’s definitely entertaining and somewhat informative. ---
**Author:** ![Dewey\_Cheatem\_Undhow](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/13edae/32.png) [@Dewey\_Cheatem\_Undhow](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Dewey_Cheatem_Undhow)\ **Post date:** [April 4, 2002, 3:50am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/michael-moore-you-are-a-hypocritical-lying-sack-of-shit/99112/124 "2002-04-04T03:50:05Z")
> [@](#): > > \*Originally posted by rowrrbazzle \* > \*\*Here is Moore’s [response](http://www.salon.com/july97/moore970703.html) to the 1997 Salon article, and the author’s comments on Moore’s response. \*\* Ah, that’s great, but the Salon article linked above is from 2002, not 1997. The author is Ben Fritz, not Daniel Radosh. ---
**Author:** ![Tazma](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/3be4f8/32.png) [@Tazma](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Tazma)\ **Post date:** [April 4, 2002, 4:23am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/michael-moore-you-are-a-hypocritical-lying-sack-of-shit/99112/125 "2002-04-04T04:23:55Z")
[A first-hand account of his speech at Cornell today](http://epundit.blogspot.com/?/2002_03_31_epundit_archive.html) ---
**Author:** ![bdgr](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/a87d85/32.png) [@bdgr](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/bdgr)\ **Post date:** [April 4, 2002, 1:55pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/michael-moore-you-are-a-hypocritical-lying-sack-of-shit/99112/126 "2002-04-04T13:55:05Z")
> [@](#): > > \*Originally posted by Dewey Cheatem Undhow \* > \*\*Ah, that’s great, but the Salon article linked above is from 2002, not 1997. The author is Ben Fritz, not Daniel Radosh. \*\* Are they still sponsered by borders? ---
**Author:** ![Sauron](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/ce7236/32.png) [@Sauron](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Sauron)\ **Post date:** [April 4, 2002, 2:25pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/michael-moore-you-are-a-hypocritical-lying-sack-of-shit/99112/127 "2002-04-04T14:25:49Z")
I think we’ve pretty well established that Michael Moore is determined to put his own spin on things, and lie if necessary to get his point across. (Based on the link by **Tazma** , he’s STILL spouting that business about Saudis being spirited out of the U.S. while all the other air traffic was grounded.) But geez, this is starting to sound like a witch-hunt, here. Let this thread die. ---
**Author:** ![Dewey\_Cheatem\_Undhow](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/13edae/32.png) [@Dewey\_Cheatem\_Undhow](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Dewey_Cheatem_Undhow)\ **Post date:** [April 4, 2002, 3:29pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/michael-moore-you-are-a-hypocritical-lying-sack-of-shit/99112/128 "2002-04-04T15:29:57Z")
**Sauron** , where’s the fun in that? 🙂 Besides, it’s not like we’re putting words in the man’s mouth. He hangs himself. ---
**Author:** ![Narile](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/n/71c47a/32.png) [@Narile](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Narile)\ **Post date:** [April 4, 2002, 4:00pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/michael-moore-you-are-a-hypocritical-lying-sack-of-shit/99112/129 "2002-04-04T16:00:20Z")
Michael Moore is the left wings Rush Limbaugh. The only difference is Moore is of the leftist spectrum. They are both large blowhards who feed on having their egos stroked. They both distort the facts to the point that even when they do have a valid point, (however rare that is.) people on the other side of the spectrum won’t admit it just on principle. ---
**Author:** ![MovieMogul](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/f08c70/32.png) [@MovieMogul](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/MovieMogul)\ **Post date:** [April 4, 2002, 7:47pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/michael-moore-you-are-a-hypocritical-lying-sack-of-shit/99112/130 "2002-04-04T19:47:21Z")
elucidator said > [@](#): > > And he provides cites for his statistics. and > [@](#): > > I read the book, it simply seethes with statistics (all cited, I note with approval) Yeah, well you may find [this](http://www.spinsanity.org/columns/20020403.html) interesting, then (from a fairly non-partisan site). ---
**Author:** ![apollo9](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/a3d4f5/32.png) [@apollo9](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/apollo9)\ **Post date:** [April 4, 2002, 8:11pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/michael-moore-you-are-a-hypocritical-lying-sack-of-shit/99112/131 "2002-04-04T20:11:31Z")
> [@](#): > > \*Originally posted by Johnny Angel \* > \*\*I think Michael Moore is a very funny guy who is worth paying attention to no matter what side of an issue you’re on. But he’s definitely funnier than he is credible. I don’t trust him to play fair or straight. He often relies on insinuation where proof is not available – and on the grounds that all he’s doing is making people laugh, I’m content to let that stand. > > He does also seem to have that _bourgeois quoque_ problem for which liberal commentators are often castigated. As much as I enjoyed the Rabbit Lady segment in _Roger and Me_, it’s clearly a freak show designed to appeal to the viewer’s desire to feel superior to someone who doesn’t hold with urbane middle class sensibilities. He makes spurious claims to the _vox populi_, but he also recognizes realistically that _hoi poloi_ are often good for a laugh because they’re not educated liberals. \*\* Sometimes I view Moore as the Leftist equivalent of Rush Limbaugh: -both entertain a sense of humor -both spew hyperbole -both are absolutists in their own way -both are incredibly biased -both seem to have an incredible amount of hot air stored up -both only hold my attention for a short period ---
**Author:** ![Sam\_Stone](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/ecccb3/32.png) [@Sam\_Stone](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Sam_Stone)\ **Post date:** [April 5, 2002, 9:11am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/michael-moore-you-are-a-hypocritical-lying-sack-of-shit/99112/132 "2002-04-05T09:11:22Z")
What I don’t understand is this continual claim that Moore is intelligent. I’ve never heard him utter a complex thought. His worldview is solidly rooted in simplistic, us-vs-them, big vs little rhetoric. Whenever I’ve heard him asked to give background on something, it invariably turns out that he doesn’t know what he’s talking about and is just firing slogans around. Take one of the major gaffes in “Stupid White Men” - Moore claims that 2/3 of the military budget is being used up for one military jet. Anyone who knows anything AT ALL about the military, the federal budget, or the fighter in question would instantly question that assertion. That Moore didn’t see the obvious flaw in his numbers is simply a sign that he doesn’t know what he’s talking about. His book is filled with stuff that is simply cut-and-pasted from various extreme lefty sites. There’s no original thought, no new analysis, nothing. He comes across about as badly as Oliver Stone. Aside from being plaigarism, it’s also a sign of extremely sloppy scholarship to use flaky internet web sites as primary sources in a major non-fiction book. Yes, it’s supposed to be humor, but it’s political humor, a genre in which you are supposed to get the basic facts right. ---
**Author:** ![Dewey\_Cheatem\_Undhow](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/13edae/32.png) [@Dewey\_Cheatem\_Undhow](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Dewey_Cheatem_Undhow)\ **Post date:** [April 5, 2002, 8:23pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/michael-moore-you-are-a-hypocritical-lying-sack-of-shit/99112/133 "2002-04-05T20:23:37Z")
The [Salon article is now available at Spinsanity](http://www.spinsanity.org/columns/20020403.html) for free for those who want to read it (I note that **ArchiveGuy** posted this same link a few posts up, but I wanted to let readers know it was the same as the premium Salon article). Also, apparently Moore’s message boards are back up and there’s a [discussion of the Salon piece](http://www.michaelmoore.com/cgi-bin/ultimatebb.cgi?ubb=get_topic&f=40&t=000036) for those who are interested. ---
**Author:** ![gobear](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/g/8dc957/32.png) [@gobear](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/gobear)\ **Post date:** [April 5, 2002, 8:48pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/michael-moore-you-are-a-hypocritical-lying-sack-of-shit/99112/134 "2002-04-05T20:48:13Z")
Reading the response from the unquestioningly loyal MM suppoerters on his message board only served to increase my already vast contempt for the hypocrisy and ignorance of the so-called progressives. ---
**Author:** ![elucidator](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/8edcca/32.png) [@elucidator](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/elucidator)\ **Post date:** [April 5, 2002, 9:53pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/michael-moore-you-are-a-hypocritical-lying-sack-of-shit/99112/135 "2002-04-05T21:53:41Z")
> [@](#): > > \*Originally posted by gobear \* > \*\*Reading the response from the unquestioningly loyal MM suppoerters on his message board only served to increase my already vast contempt for the hypocrisy and ignorance of the so-called progressives. \*\* Somehow, we’ll go on. It won’t be easy, of course, bearing such a burden, the contempt of one who combines the political acuity of G. Gordon Liddy with the warm humanism of Ayn Rand… But, somehow, we must. ---
**Author:** ![gobear](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/g/8dc957/32.png) [@gobear](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/gobear)\ **Post date:** [April 5, 2002, 10:05pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/michael-moore-you-are-a-hypocritical-lying-sack-of-shit/99112/136 "2002-04-05T22:05:29Z")
> [@](#): > > . It won’t be easy, of course, bearing such a burden, the contempt of one who combines the political acuity of G. Gordon Liddy with the warm humanism of Ayn Rand… see, now I know you don’t pay attention because I LOATHE Ayn Rand…and G. Gordon Liddy is a wacko… No, my contempt for “progressives” is that few of the people at MM’s bookisigning, and certainly few of the posters on his message board really gave a damn about the actual blue collar guys they purportedly support. Worse, they are every bit as blind to their leader’s faults as Buchanan supporters. I’m for clean air and clean water gay marriage strong defense civil liberties free markets health care reform Progressives are for whining about W and the Florida election. ---
**Author:** ![Hello\_Again](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/h/85e7bf/32.png) [@Hello\_Again](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Hello_Again)\ **Post date:** [April 5, 2002, 10:09pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/michael-moore-you-are-a-hypocritical-lying-sack-of-shit/99112/137 "2002-04-05T22:09:38Z")
Borders association with Salon ended around 1999. ---
**Author:** ![elucidator](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/8edcca/32.png) [@elucidator](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/elucidator)\ **Post date:** [April 6, 2002, 12:45am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/michael-moore-you-are-a-hypocritical-lying-sack-of-shit/99112/138 "2002-04-06T00:45:32Z")
On ponderment, gotta say (or “must admit”, if you prefer) a lot of MM’s stuff lacks substance. I read “SWM”, Will Rogers he ain’t. That bit about 2/3 of the budget for a plane, and his utterly irrational defense of OJ, things like that. On the other hand, we ain’t got much. I can name half a dozen decidedly conservative pundits more or less constantly benefiting from media exposure. Now, if the media is so awash in liberal bias, where are all the other MM’s? Molly Ivins is sharp, acerbic, doesn’t talk with a funny accent, and bona fide pure-D populist. So wheres her TV time? She sure as hell aint less telegenic than George F. Will! A Giant Oregonian Garden Slug isn’t less telegenic! So maybe MM will open the door for others? We’ll see. But lets take an example: that Goldberg guy, with his book about the liberal bias in the media. Think he had any trouble getting it in print? Are his book signings professionally managed and powers that be properly greased? (By sheer accident, Our Leader is photographed carrying his copy with the title page exposed with exquisite care. Uh huh. Sure. You bet.) Think he’s driving himself from book signing to campus gig in his own car, on his own **dime**? And he’s selling **less** books! As to “whining”: he got less votes than Algore. All in all, the “liberals” trounced the “conservatives”. And yet there he sits, as pleased as if he had actually won, governing as if the thundering mandate of the people had placed him there, crying with one voice for a autocratic reactionary regime to save us from the corrupting ooze of tolerance and compassion. Balderdash, sir! Tommyrot! (Reminded of Disraeli on Palmerston: “Its not the Ace of Trump up his sleeve I resent so much as his calm assurance that God Almighty placed it there”) So: let MM run his course, and, with luck, he might be replaced with half a dozen or so others, with sharper wits, sharper statistics, and sharper teeth. So let it be written, so let it be done. The we’ll _all_ be happy, huh guys? ---
**Author:** ![gobear](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/g/8dc957/32.png) [@gobear](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/gobear)\ **Post date:** [April 6, 2002, 12:56am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/michael-moore-you-are-a-hypocritical-lying-sack-of-shit/99112/139 "2002-04-06T00:56:38Z")
> [@](#): > > As to “whining”: he got less votes than Algore. All in all, the “liberals” trounced the “conservatives”. And yet there he sits, as pleased as if he had actually won, governing as if the thundering mandate of the people had placed him there, crying with one voice for a autocratic reactionary regime to save us from the corrupting ooze of tolerance and compassion. Nobody trounced anybody. It was statistically a dead heat. We are a divided nation. Gore could just have easily won those 500 + votes, and then the GOP people would be complaining about having an illegitimate president (more loudly, IMHO). You want to blame somebody, blame the drafters of the Constitution for establishing the Electoral College. The sad thing is that MM’s supernova-sized ego is obscuring the issues he supposedly cares about, and it would behoove people of good will on both sides of the aisle to stop bickering and make our nation strong. I read both MM’s book and Goldberg’s "Bias,"and I thought they were both special pleading and suppressing the facts. Sad. ---
**Author:** ![elucidator](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/8edcca/32.png) [@elucidator](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/elucidator)\ **Post date:** [April 6, 2002, 1:23am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/michael-moore-you-are-a-hypocritical-lying-sack-of-shit/99112/140 "2002-04-06T01:23:09Z")
Who **is** this guy? **Gobear** is channeling Alan Alda! How the hell can you pick a fight with a guy determined to be all tolerant and reasonable? Jeeeez. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/michael-moore-you-are-a-hypocritical-lying-sack-of-shit/99112.md?page=6) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/michael-moore-you-are-a-hypocritical-lying-sack-of-shit/99112.md?page=8)