# Michael Moore **URL:** \ **Category:** Cafe Society\ **Created:** [December 4, 2003, 11:02am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/michael-moore/216913 "2003-12-04T11:02:18Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 3
**Author:** ![Tars\_Tarkas](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/6a8cbe/32.png) [@Tars\_Tarkas](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Tars_Tarkas)\ **Post date:** [December 5, 2003, 12:33am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/michael-moore/216913/41 "2003-12-05T00:33:48Z")
> [@](#): > > \*Originally posted by Bruce\_Daddy \* > \*\*No. > > > [@](#): > > > > …The audience never sees the process whereby the bank requires Moore to produce photo identification, then contacts the FBI for a criminal records check on Moore, before he is allowed to take possession of the rifle. Moments later, Moore is handed his new rifle in the North Country Bank & Trust lobby, at which point he asks another unnamed bank employee, “Do you think it’s a little dangerous handing out guns in a bank?” > > [http://www.bowlingfortruth.com/bowlingforcolumbine/scenes/bank.htm](http://www.bowlingfortruth.com/bowlingforcolumbine/scenes/bank.htm) > > And for the record, I _was_ wrong above. I only skimmed the artice above. \*\* OMG, they didn’t show Micheal Moore being born, so he must be FAKE! They didn’t show the cameraman, so how do we know he filmed it? IT’s FAKE!! All cartoons! They didn’t show the gun being manufactured, so IT’S FAKE!! Really. Let’s watch an hour of background checking. What an exciting documentary. When i open a bank account, i have to show a photo ID, whether or not they give me a gun. You don’t have to waste the audience’s time filming every last detail to give satisfaction to a few nutballs who can program html between worshipping Reagan and Dubya. ---
**Author:** ![Coldfire](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/a587f6/32.png) [@Coldfire](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Coldfire)\ **Post date:** [December 5, 2003, 1:18am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/michael-moore/216913/42 "2003-12-05T01:18:43Z")
Off to Cafe Society. And people, _please_ behave - we’re not in the Pit. ---
**Author:** ![Miller](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/miller/32/481_2.png) [@Miller](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Miller)\ **Post date:** [December 5, 2003, 2:12am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/michael-moore/216913/43 "2003-12-05T02:12:34Z")
It’s also worth mentioning that, whatever else it might be, _Bowling for Columbine_ is most emphatically not anti-gun. Moore himself is an NRA member and champion sharpshooter. I mention this because it seems to be the chief misconception about this film among people who haven’t seen it, and there seem to be a lot of them in this thread. ---
**Author:** ![RikWriter](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/49beb7/32.png) [@RikWriter](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/RikWriter)\ **Post date:** [December 5, 2003, 2:43am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/michael-moore/216913/44 "2003-12-05T02:43:30Z")
> [@](#): > > \*Originally posted by green\_bladder \* > **He’s just trying to make this world a better place** Yes. He’s trying to make this world a better place for Michael Moore by filling his wallet with cash. But he won’t be getting any of mine. ---
**Author:** ![Eternal](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/ecb155/32.png) [@Eternal](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Eternal)\ **Post date:** [December 5, 2003, 4:15am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/michael-moore/216913/45 "2003-12-05T04:15:44Z")
> [@](#): > > \*Originally posted by RikWriter \* > \*\*Yes. He’s trying to make this world a better place for Michael Moore by filling his wallet with cash. But he won’t be getting any of mine. \*\* The people who Moore thrives on are the sort of immature “rebels” that would buy his books just because they have observed how much so many people hate him. And they refer to everyone as a “tool.” Don’t worry, it’s only a phase -but at any time there’s always enough in the phase to make money off it. ---
**Author:** ![Lear\_s\_fool](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/l/df788c/32.png) [@Lear\_s\_fool](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Lear_s_fool)\ **Post date:** [December 5, 2003, 5:24am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/michael-moore/216913/46 "2003-12-05T05:24:40Z")
> [@](#): > > \*Originally posted by Bruce\_Daddy \* > \*\*I thought the point was how easy it was for Mike to walk into a bank, deposit money and get handed a rifle. After being confronted, he admits he had to take out a _twenty_ year CD, fill out the federally required paperwork, get an FBI background check. > > Was that in the movie? > > And don’t roll your eyes at me young man! \*\* You miss the point, either that your don’t see something absurd about getting a gun from a bank ---
**Author:** ![HoldenCaulfield](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/h/22d042/32.png) [@HoldenCaulfield](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/HoldenCaulfield)\ **Post date:** [December 5, 2003, 5:25am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/michael-moore/216913/47 "2003-12-05T05:25:47Z")
> [@](#): > > _Originally posted by Lucki Chaarms \* > \*\*I dunno. Moore is really entertaining, I’ll give him that, and he makes some good points, but he can’t expect to be taken seriously by anyone who doesn’t already agree with him. He’s sort of a liberal Michael Savage in that his views are far more extreme than most and he does more to stir sh_t up/enrage the other side than to actually initiate important dialogue. > > I’ve seen him speak and met him, and he is a very charismatic and likeable guy. He’s also very funny, and it’s easy to see why he has the fan base he does (including me). I would just say to confirm anything you hear from him with an independent source before you make decisions based on it or pass it on as truth. > > LC \*\* You just summed up my feelings on Moore perfectly. ---
**Author:** ![wolf\_meister](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/wolf_meister/32/15202_2.png) [@wolf\_meister](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/wolf_meister)\ **Post date:** [December 5, 2003, 5:41am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/michael-moore/216913/48 "2003-12-05T05:41:46Z")
**jellen92** You say Michael Moore’s words have become “gospel” and this makes him pompous. As you said this is a free country. If people think his words are “gospel”, _they_ were the ones that made that choice. On the other side of the political spectrum, there were and are _many_ people who think the words of **Ronald Reagan and John Wayne** are “gospel”. The sword cuts both ways. ---
**Author:** ![Lear\_s\_fool](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/l/df788c/32.png) [@Lear\_s\_fool](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Lear_s_fool)\ **Post date:** [December 5, 2003, 5:47am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/michael-moore/216913/49 "2003-12-05T05:47:55Z")
> [@](#): > > \*Originally posted by Eternal \* > \*\*The people who Moore thrives on are the sort of immature “rebels” that would buy his books just because they have observed how much so many people hate him. And they refer to everyone as a “tool.” Don’t worry, it’s only a phase -but at any time there’s always enough in the phase to make money off it. \*\* Is that a haste generalization or a personal attach I always have a hard time telling the difference Honestly one of the saddest things I’ve noticed is that the lot of criticism that Bowling for Columbine receives are attaches on Moore and the people who agree with him. I have let to see take up arms against the culture of fear theory he presented in his film or make claims that Canada has higher rates of violent crime than the U.S. ---
**Author:** ![Doomtrain](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/0ea827/32.png) [@Doomtrain](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Doomtrain)\ **Post date:** [December 5, 2003, 6:27am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/michael-moore/216913/50 "2003-12-05T06:27:06Z")
Yea, yea, there’s all these objections to _Bowling For Columbine_… But it made me THINK, which is a damn sight more than most movies nowadays. ---
**Author:** ![BrandyFine](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/82dd89/32.png) [@BrandyFine](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/BrandyFine)\ **Post date:** [December 5, 2003, 6:46am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/michael-moore/216913/51 "2003-12-05T06:46:52Z")
Lear it might be easier to take the “culture of fear” problem seriously if the entire movie hadn’t been dedicated to whipping up a state of intense fear. Just a bit hypocritical. Well, that and the whole, as someone said, making stuff up thing. Heh, so long, I have a feeling most people have their minds made up about the man (and his message, or lack thereof) by this point in time anyway. ---
**Author:** ![E.T.Bass](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/9fc29f/32.png) [@E.T.Bass](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/E.T.Bass)\ **Post date:** [December 5, 2003, 6:56am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/michael-moore/216913/52 "2003-12-05T06:56:07Z")
He’s a cross between Chris Farley and Alan Alda. ---
**Author:** ![rjung](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/45deac/32.png) [@rjung](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/rjung)\ **Post date:** [December 5, 2003, 8:58am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/michael-moore/216913/53 "2003-12-05T08:58:58Z")
My own feelings on Michael Moore have been morphing recently: [ul] [li]First saw him via **TV Nation** – wicked, brilliant stuff, wish it was on the air more.[/li][li]Read **Adventures In a TV Nation** for behind-the-scenes fun. Good stuff, especially the material that didn’t get on the air.[/li][li]Read **Downsize This!** and found it enjoyable, though a bit odd in parts.[/li][li]Watched **Bowling For Columbine** and found it slightly uneven. I agree about the “culture of fear” point he was trying to make, but some of his other points got lost in the shuffle. While I understood that parts of the documentary were staged for dramatic effect, I was also disappointed to learn that some of the stuff in the movie was flat-out wrong. ☹ Good as a thought-provoking movie, bad as a portrayal of accuracy.[/li][li]Hesitated on buying **Stupid White Men** and **Dude, Where’s My Country?** because of the problems with **Bowling.** Still haven’t bought either book, just because I’m under the impression he’s no longer interested in accuracy, which IMO puts him in the same league as Ann Coulter or Rush Limbaugh.[/li][/ul] I guess I’m a slightly-disappointed former fan who’s sad to see Moore place sensationalism over truth. I appreciate that he brings up points that _should_ be brought up, but the way he’s doing things today is not something I can support in good conscience. (At least there’s now Al Franken to take up the slot – I still haven’t seen anyone demonstrate a factual error in his latest book, so I can enjoy it with a clear conscience.) ---
**Author:** ![Joachim\_Pieper](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/j/91b2a8/32.png) [@Joachim\_Pieper](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Joachim_Pieper)\ **Post date:** [December 5, 2003, 10:58am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/michael-moore/216913/54 "2003-12-05T10:58:00Z")
you can have my copy of dude, where’s my country? From now on I’ll be reading the no smoking signs on the bus to work… Cheers. ---
**Author:** ![sirtonyh](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/ad7895/32.png) [@sirtonyh](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/sirtonyh)\ **Post date:** [December 5, 2003, 11:42am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/michael-moore/216913/55 "2003-12-05T11:42:54Z")
> [@](#): > > \*Originally posted by GMRyujin \* > \*\*Yea, yea, there’s all these objections to _Bowling For Columbine_… > > But it made me THINK, which is a damn sight more than most movies nowadays. \*\* Bingo. The point of the movie was to create discussion on an important issue. It did that very well. ---
**Author:** ![Lear\_s\_fool](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/l/df788c/32.png) [@Lear\_s\_fool](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Lear_s_fool)\ **Post date:** [December 5, 2003, 11:45am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/michael-moore/216913/56 "2003-12-05T11:45:19Z")
> [@](#): > > \*Originally posted by BrandyFine \* > \*\*Lear it might be easier to take the “culture of fear” problem seriously if the entire movie hadn’t been dedicated to whipping up a state of intense fear. Just a bit hypocritical. Well, that and the whole, as someone said, making stuff up thing. Heh, so long, I have a feeling most people have their minds made up about the man (and his message, or lack thereof) by this point in time anyway. \*\* And I might be able to take the criticism that’s been directed at him and his film seriously if it had been an issue before his speech at the Oskars ---
**Author:** ![RikWriter](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/49beb7/32.png) [@RikWriter](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/RikWriter)\ **Post date:** [December 5, 2003, 12:03pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/michael-moore/216913/57 "2003-12-05T12:03:16Z")
> [@](#): > > \*Originally posted by Lear’s\_fool \* > \*\*And I might be able to take the criticism that’s been directed at him and his film seriously if it had been an issue before his speech at the Oskars \*\* Actually it WAS an issue before his spittal-filled raving rant at the Oscars…some people simply weren’t paying attention to those raising the issue before that time. ---
**Author:** ![Evil\_Captor](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/f17d59/32.png) [@Evil\_Captor](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Evil_Captor)\ **Post date:** [December 5, 2003, 12:27pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/michael-moore/216913/58 "2003-12-05T12:27:38Z")
> [@](#): > > \*Originally posted by jellen92 \* > \*\*He is pompous, trust me. He has a right to his opinion of course (that is what makes this a free country) but when people’s opinions somehow become “gospel”, that makes you pompous. He has the right to move out of this country if he is so unhappy. \*\* YOU have the right to move out of the country if you don’t like all the free speech we have here. Feel free to do so. Take Jerry Falwell with you while you’re at it. ---
**Author:** ![Bill\_H](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/a5b964/32.png) [@Bill\_H](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Bill_H)\ **Post date:** [December 5, 2003, 1:01pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/michael-moore/216913/59 "2003-12-05T13:01:46Z")
He’s an idiot, and I refuse to watch or read any of his drivel on moral grounds. ---
**Author:** ![RikWriter](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/49beb7/32.png) [@RikWriter](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/RikWriter)\ **Post date:** [December 5, 2003, 1:16pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/michael-moore/216913/60 "2003-12-05T13:16:41Z")
> [@](#): > > \*Originally posted by Evil Captor \* > \*\*YOU have the right to move out of the country if you don’t like all the free speech we have here. Feel free to do so. Take Jerry Falwell with you while you’re at it. \*\* Seems you skipped right over the part where jellen said “He has a right to his opinion of course (that is what makes this a free country).” [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/michael-moore/216913.md?page=2) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/michael-moore/216913.md?page=4)