# Michael Schiavo: Hero **URL:** \ **Category:** Great Debates\ **Created:** [August 7, 2005, 12:32am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/michael-schiavo-hero/315933 "2005-08-07T00:32:26Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 7
**Author:** ![jayjay](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/jayjay/32/6765_2.png) [@jayjay](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/jayjay)\ **Post date:** [August 9, 2005, 1:25pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/michael-schiavo-hero/315933/121 "2005-08-09T13:25:57Z")
> [@lekatt](#): > > Your post is not relavant to the reality of the situation, there were doctors who said she wasn’t brain dead. I’m not sure I’d trust doctors who would diagnose someone via heavily-edited videotape to remove a wart, let alone provide an objective and accurate diagnosis for degree of brain damage… Then again, given your sustained and demonstrated level of credulity, it’s not such a stretch, I suppose. ---
**Author:** ![Scott\_Plaid](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/258eb7/32.png) [@Scott\_Plaid](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Scott_Plaid)\ **Post date:** [August 9, 2005, 1:27pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/michael-schiavo-hero/315933/122 "2005-08-09T13:27:28Z")
> [@lekatt](#): > > No they don’t, most people have more respect for their partner, and more faith in God. I worked in hospice care for a few years and saw dozens of them, then I worked in a hospital for several more years and saw a lot more. How much experience have you had with dead and dying people? No, the vast majority of people /autopsies agree that Terri was indeed dead. However, I personally never saw her body in person. Neither did you. I should take your uninformed opinion… why, again? Also, what does faith in god have to do with anything, re: this topic? ---
**Author:** ![David\_Simmons](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/9de053/32.png) [@David\_Simmons](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/David_Simmons)\ **Post date:** [August 9, 2005, 1:32pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/michael-schiavo-hero/315933/123 "2005-08-09T13:32:42Z")
> [@lekatt](#): > > Whatever Michael’s part in this sad situation was He will know when his time comes whether or not it was acceptable. If you are confident of that then you can be sure that he will get whatever he has coming to him. So why do you and others have to work so hard to try to increase his misery here? Don’t you have enough other things to do? ---
**Author:** ![Monty](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/monty/32/47_2.png) [@Monty](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Monty)\ **Post date:** [August 9, 2005, 1:53pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/michael-schiavo-hero/315933/124 "2005-08-09T13:53:55Z")
> [@lekatt](#): > > Well, now you know, He just has a hundred different names, but still just one God. Cite? ---
**Author:** ![Kalhoun](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/k/3bc359/32.png) [@Kalhoun](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Kalhoun)\ **Post date:** [August 9, 2005, 1:54pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/michael-schiavo-hero/315933/125 "2005-08-09T13:54:31Z")
> [@lekatt](#): > > No they don’t, most people have more respect for their partner, and more faith in God. I worked in hospice care for a few years and saw dozens of them, then I worked in a hospital for several more years and saw a lot more. How much experience have you had with dead and dying people? Plenty. And everyone I know would have honored their partner’s wish to _end their life_ if it didn’t mean going to jail. This misplaced idea of “life” as you define it is all about a science project. As long as those cells are alive (even though the essence of the person is long gone), you’ll hang on to some ridiculous notion that the afflicted person gives a shit, actively participates in the marriage, or that the mate is somehow sentenced to dragging the mound of cells around with them for eternity. You know, even though I’m pro-choice, I can understand the dilemma there. But for the life of me I’ll never understand how a person could put themselves or their family through the charade of plugging in the shell of a person’s being – a person who will never EVER exist again – and pretend they are anything more than a machine. ---
**Author:** ![Kalhoun](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/k/3bc359/32.png) [@Kalhoun](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Kalhoun)\ **Post date:** [August 9, 2005, 1:58pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/michael-schiavo-hero/315933/126 "2005-08-09T13:58:08Z")
> [@lekatt](#): > > Your post is not relavant to the reality of the situation, there were doctors who said she wasn’t brain dead. There are those that would say that monkeys might fly out of my butt as well, but somehow, the notion that that will actually happen is preposterous to most thinking people. ---
**Author:** ![jayjay](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/jayjay/32/6765_2.png) [@jayjay](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/jayjay)\ **Post date:** [August 9, 2005, 1:58pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/michael-schiavo-hero/315933/127 "2005-08-09T13:58:48Z")
> [@David Simmons](#): > > If you are confident of that then you can be sure that he will get whatever he has coming to him. > > So why do you and others have to work so hard to try to increase his misery here? Don’t you have enough other things to do? Because they don’t trust God to take care of the punishment in the afterlife. The inflated sense of self-importance and self-righteousness makes them doubt that ENOUGH is going to happen to the “sinner” after death, so they have to make him miserable here. ---
**Author:** ![Monty](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/monty/32/47_2.png) [@Monty](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Monty)\ **Post date:** [August 9, 2005, 1:58pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/michael-schiavo-hero/315933/128 "2005-08-09T13:58:50Z")
> [@Kalhoun](#): > > […] or that the mate is somehow sentenced to dragging the mound of cells around with them for eternity. Wasn’t the character, “Mrs. 'Aversham,” in _Methusalah’s Children_ a mound of chicken liver cells that apparently were living forever? Your posting reminded me of that story and also that’s pretty much what some people evidently wanted Mr. Schiavo to do: cart around a mindless (I firmly believe there is no mind where there is no functioning brain) lump of flesh. ---
**Author:** ![Kalhoun](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/k/3bc359/32.png) [@Kalhoun](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Kalhoun)\ **Post date:** [August 9, 2005, 2:12pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/michael-schiavo-hero/315933/129 "2005-08-09T14:12:59Z")
> [@Monty](#): > > Wasn’t the character, “Mrs. 'Aversham,” in _Methusalah’s Children_ a mound of chicken liver cells that apparently were living forever? > > Your posting reminded me of that story and also that’s pretty much what some people evidently wanted Mr. Schiavo to do: cart around a mindless (I firmly believe there is no mind where there is no functioning brain) lump of flesh. I’m not familiar with that work, but _sheesh!_ That’s a freekin’ _horror story!_ ---
**Author:** ![Kalhoun](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/k/3bc359/32.png) [@Kalhoun](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Kalhoun)\ **Post date:** [August 9, 2005, 2:14pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/michael-schiavo-hero/315933/130 "2005-08-09T14:14:15Z")
[Tom Petty] …_stop draggin’ my corpse around_… [/Tom Petty] ---
**Author:** ![lekatt](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/lekatt/32/7269_2.png) [@lekatt](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/lekatt)\ **Post date:** [August 9, 2005, 2:21pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/michael-schiavo-hero/315933/131 "2005-08-09T14:21:34Z")
> [@Kalhoun](#): > > Plenty. And everyone I know would have honored their partner’s wish to _end their life_ if it didn’t mean going to jail. This misplaced idea of “life” as you define it is all about a science project. As long as those cells are alive (even though the essence of the person is long gone), you’ll hang on to some ridiculous notion that the afflicted person gives a shit, actively participates in the marriage, or that the mate is somehow sentenced to dragging the mound of cells around with them for eternity. > > You know, even though I’m pro-choice, I can understand the dilemma there. But for the life of me I’ll never understand how a person could put themselves or their family through the charade of plugging in the shell of a person’s being – a person who will never EVER exist again – and pretend they are anything more than a machine. Your post is also not relavant to the reality of the situation. Just a rant. ---
**Author:** ![Scott\_Plaid](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/258eb7/32.png) [@Scott\_Plaid](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Scott_Plaid)\ **Post date:** [August 9, 2005, 2:23pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/michael-schiavo-hero/315933/132 "2005-08-09T14:23:12Z")
> [@lekatt](#): > > Your post is also not relavant to the reality of the situation. Just a rant. Cite? ---
**Author:** ![Monty](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/monty/32/47_2.png) [@Monty](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Monty)\ **Post date:** [August 9, 2005, 2:23pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/michael-schiavo-hero/315933/133 "2005-08-09T14:23:41Z")
It’s one of the stories in Heinlein’s “Future History” series. I don’t think he ever mentioned, nor did he have any of the other characters mention, why the chicken liver was so named. Here’s what I don’t get about those who are blasting Mr. Schiavo: the man put forth what was really superhuman efforts to care for his ailing wife. Regardless of the morality (and I’m not impugning the man on that account) of his other actions, what really counted was how he cared for his wife. ---
**Author:** ![jayjay](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/jayjay/32/6765_2.png) [@jayjay](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/jayjay)\ **Post date:** [August 9, 2005, 2:26pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/michael-schiavo-hero/315933/134 "2005-08-09T14:26:37Z")
> [@Monty](#): > > It’s one of the stories in Heinlein’s “Future History” series. I don’t think he ever mentioned, nor did he have any of the other characters mention, why the chicken liver was so named. I’m thinking some connection to Dickens’ Mrs. Haversham, and her combined longevity and stasis. ---
**Author:** ![lekatt](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/lekatt/32/7269_2.png) [@lekatt](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/lekatt)\ **Post date:** [August 9, 2005, 2:31pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/michael-schiavo-hero/315933/135 "2005-08-09T14:31:08Z")
> [@cricetus](#): > > Cite? On the off chance you might really want to know: read the books of Elisabeth Keubler-Ross, she wrote the book on death and dying. She devoted her life to the research of death and dying, starting out as a skeptical scientist and ending up a believer in God and the afterlife. Along the way she interviewed many hundreds of people about their experiences and had some experiences of her own. The experience that turned her around was the mining accident she investigated. [http://www.edconrad.com/lifeafterdeath/index.html](http://www.edconrad.com/lifeafterdeath/index.html) The details of it are at the link. She died about a year ago, finishing her life working with AIDS babies. she was a grand lady of science who followed the clues until she found the truth. ---
**Author:** ![tnetennba](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/7993a0/32.png) [@tnetennba](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/tnetennba)\ **Post date:** [August 9, 2005, 2:32pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/michael-schiavo-hero/315933/136 "2005-08-09T14:32:47Z")
> [@lekatt](#): > > She died about a year ago Which means she didn’t report anything about having seen Terri Schiavo. ---
**Author:** ![lekatt](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/lekatt/32/7269_2.png) [@lekatt](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/lekatt)\ **Post date:** [August 9, 2005, 2:33pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/michael-schiavo-hero/315933/137 "2005-08-09T14:33:34Z")
> [@Kalhoun](#): > > There are those that would say that monkeys might fly out of my butt as well, but somehow, the notion that that will actually happen is preposterous to most thinking people. Gee, I didn’t know you were a doctor? If you have nothing to add don’t post. ---
**Author:** ![lekatt](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/lekatt/32/7269_2.png) [@lekatt](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/lekatt)\ **Post date:** [August 9, 2005, 2:36pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/michael-schiavo-hero/315933/138 "2005-08-09T14:36:45Z")
> [@cricetus](#): > > Which means she didn’t report anything about having seen Terri Schiavo. What’s that got to do with your post. We are talking here about God and the afterlife. Get on the same page. ---
**Author:** ![lekatt](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/lekatt/32/7269_2.png) [@lekatt](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/lekatt)\ **Post date:** [August 9, 2005, 2:38pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/michael-schiavo-hero/315933/139 "2005-08-09T14:38:28Z")
> [@Scott Plaid](#): > > Cite? No need to repost the post, just read it from the original. ---
**Author:** ![lekatt](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/lekatt/32/7269_2.png) [@lekatt](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/lekatt)\ **Post date:** [August 9, 2005, 2:40pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/michael-schiavo-hero/315933/140 "2005-08-09T14:40:28Z")
> [@Monty](#): > > Cite? Names of God: God, Creator, All-That-Is, Source, Force, Yama, Bhagwan, Shiva, Elohim, Jehovah, El-Shaddai, Adonai, Immanuel, Hosanna, Brahma, Great Spirit, Khuddah, Hashem, Allah, Yahweh, Ormazd, A’tma, Surya, Deva, Akash, Vasu, Narayana, Chandra, Buddha, Shakra, Ketu, Bandhu, Pita, Mata, Guru, Aja, Satya, Lakshmi, Virat, Agni, Vishwa, Hiranyagarbha, Vayu, Taijas, A’ditya, Prajna, Aum, Mitra, Varuna, Aryama, Indra, Vrihaspati, Vishnu, Urukrama, Bhumi, etc, etc, etc. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/michael-schiavo-hero/315933.md?page=6) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/michael-schiavo-hero/315933.md?page=8)