# Michigan speeding tickets in Feb **URL:** \ **Category:** Great Debates\ **Created:** [January 24, 2008, 4:55pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/michigan-speeding-tickets-in-feb/434828 "2008-01-24T16:55:59Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 1
**Author:** ![gonzomax](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/g/e8c25b/32.png) [@gonzomax](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/gonzomax)\ **Post date:** [January 24, 2008, 4:55pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/michigan-speeding-tickets-in-feb/434828/1 "2008-01-24T16:55:59Z")
The newspapers ran a story lately about a speeding crackdown on Michigan Xways. They will write for 5 over. seat belts anything hanging from the mirror windshield cracks turn signal usage They will have 50 police cars on duty. They will be expected to write a ticket every 10 minutes. They have 30 new Crown Vics unmarked . What is onerous is it is being done for revenue. They expect to generate 9 million dollars . I mill will go in police overtime. Generally police say they write tickets to make roads safer. That can be argued but can a crackdown like this be justified. ? ---
**Author:** ![myskepticsight](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/cc9497/32.png) [@myskepticsight](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/myskepticsight)\ **Post date:** [January 24, 2008, 5:12pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/michigan-speeding-tickets-in-feb/434828/2 "2008-01-24T17:12:44Z")
Well being pulled over for no seat belts and failing to use turn signals at least make sense - those do seem to make roads (and yourself) less safe. But if I got pulled over and got a ticket for going 70 in a 65, I’d be pissed. How do you pass anyone if you can’t go over the limit at all? ---
**Author:** ![drachillix](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/48db29/32.png) [@drachillix](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/drachillix)\ **Post date:** [January 24, 2008, 5:14pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/michigan-speeding-tickets-in-feb/434828/3 "2008-01-24T17:14:29Z")
[QUOTE=myskepticsight] How do you pass anyone if you can’t go over the limit at all? [/QUOTE] Legally if they are travelling at the speed limit there would be no reason to pass. ---
**Author:** ![Antinor01](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/ecae2f/32.png) [@Antinor01](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Antinor01)\ **Post date:** [January 24, 2008, 5:17pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/michigan-speeding-tickets-in-feb/434828/4 "2008-01-24T17:17:47Z")
I have no problem with it. To my knowledge all of those things are ticketable offenses. I didn’t know about the item hanging from the mirror one though. ---
**Author:** ![Eonwe](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/eonwe/32/240_2.png) [@Eonwe](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Eonwe)\ **Post date:** [January 24, 2008, 5:28pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/michigan-speeding-tickets-in-feb/434828/5 "2008-01-24T17:28:45Z")
A year or so ago there was a crack down on the interstate here, in response to a year with a dramatically high number of fatalities in the previous year. Didn’t have a problem with that. I actually think it’s good to do periodically; people get complacent and more and more sloppy and careless as drivers as time goes on. Having a little wake-up call periodically isn’t a bad thing. ---
**Author:** ![myskepticsight](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/cc9497/32.png) [@myskepticsight](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/myskepticsight)\ **Post date:** [January 24, 2008, 5:30pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/michigan-speeding-tickets-in-feb/434828/6 "2008-01-24T17:30:48Z")
[QUOTE=drachillix] Legally if they are travelling at the speed limit there would be no reason to pass. [/QUOTE] What if you needed to get around someone to get over to your exit? If everyone was going exactly 65, then there’d be no fluctuation in the distances cars are from one another. Guess you could go slower, but that’s just as bad as going faster for traffic, if not worse - you’d be making everyone else brake too when they wouldn’t have to if you sped up instead. ---
**Author:** ![silenus](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/silenus/32/166_2.png) [@silenus](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/silenus)\ **Post date:** [January 24, 2008, 5:36pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/michigan-speeding-tickets-in-feb/434828/7 "2008-01-24T17:36:21Z")
I wonder how much of the new revenue will go for overtime at the courthouses, which will be jammed by people fighting their tickets? ---
**Author:** ![Cheesesteak](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/cheesesteak/32/3694_2.png) [@Cheesesteak](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Cheesesteak)\ **Post date:** [January 24, 2008, 5:47pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/michigan-speeding-tickets-in-feb/434828/8 "2008-01-24T17:47:32Z")
The problem with it is not that they’re enforcing the law, it’s that they’ve spent umpteen years specifically NOT enforcing the law and are choosing to change their minds only because they can squeeze millions of dollars out of it. ---
**Author:** ![Gfactor](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/g/9de053/32.png) [@Gfactor](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Gfactor)\ **Post date:** [January 24, 2008, 5:51pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/michigan-speeding-tickets-in-feb/434828/9 "2008-01-24T17:51:00Z")
This is an urban legend: > [@](#): > > Only the gullible could believe something so farfetched. [http://www.freep.com/apps/pbcs.dll/article?AID=/20080117/BLOG13/80117012/1004/NEWS](http://www.freep.com/apps/pbcs.dll/article?AID=/20080117/BLOG13/80117012/1004/NEWS) Debunked by snopes last time the same email myth circulated here: [About Those 'Speeding Ticket Frenzy' Alerts | Snopes.com](http://www.snopes.com/politics/traffic/speeding.asp) ---
**Author:** ![ZenBeam](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/z/3ab097/32.png) [@ZenBeam](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/ZenBeam)\ **Post date:** [January 24, 2008, 5:51pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/michigan-speeding-tickets-in-feb/434828/10 "2008-01-24T17:51:13Z")
**gonzomax** , can you post a link? ---
**Author:** ![gonzomax](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/g/e8c25b/32.png) [@gonzomax](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/gonzomax)\ **Post date:** [January 24, 2008, 5:57pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/michigan-speeding-tickets-in-feb/434828/11 "2008-01-24T17:57:22Z")
I was sent an email. Then the Free press ran a story saying pretty much the same thing. We will find out in a couple weeks for sure. I searched the Freep but yesterday was garbage day. It is gonee. ---
**Author:** ![ZenBeam](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/z/3ab097/32.png) [@ZenBeam](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/ZenBeam)\ **Post date:** [January 24, 2008, 6:17pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/michigan-speeding-tickets-in-feb/434828/12 "2008-01-24T18:17:29Z")
I searched the Free Press online, and got [to this page](http://search.freep.com/sp?aff=117&keywords=police+ticket&submit=Go), with an article from the 16th titled “E-mail alert about ticket blitz is bogus”, but you have to buy the article. We _might_ still have that issue, I’ll check tonight if I remember. ETA: And if I had looked at the simulpost above my first post, this might be relevent… ---
**Author:** ![Gfactor](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/g/9de053/32.png) [@Gfactor](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Gfactor)\ **Post date:** [January 24, 2008, 6:33pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/michigan-speeding-tickets-in-feb/434828/13 "2008-01-24T18:33:01Z")
[QUOTE=gonzomax] I was sent an email. Then the Free press ran a story saying pretty much the same thing. We will find out in a couple weeks for sure. I searched the Freep but yesterday was garbage day. It is gonee. [/QUOTE] The title of the article that I cited is: > [@](#): > > Massive crackdown on speeders! But first sentence, quoted above, tells the story. It’s about how the email you got was an urban legend. > [@](#): > > MSP spokeswoman Shanon Akans said other falsehoods are equally obvious. For one, the state police don’t have part-time troopers. She also said the department doesn’t use unmarked cars for traffic patrols or enforce traffic as a means to raise revenue. > > “That’s simply not how we operate,” Akans told me. “It wouldn’t be January if this thing didn’t make its rounds. This is actually the third year now, if I recall correctly, that this has come out in January or February. **It is completely false.”** > > So can we stop forwarding it along now, please? (Emphasis added.) Did you read the Free Press article, or just notice the headline? ---
**Author:** ![gonzomax](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/g/e8c25b/32.png) [@gonzomax](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/gonzomax)\ **Post date:** [January 24, 2008, 6:40pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/michigan-speeding-tickets-in-feb/434828/14 "2008-01-24T18:40:04Z")
[http://wcco.com/crime/speed.speeding.crackdown.2.370193.html](http://wcco.com/crime/speed.speeding.crackdown.2.370193.html) Heres an example. It does happen. I have a cop friend at racketball. i will ask him. ---
**Author:** ![Gfactor](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/g/9de053/32.png) [@Gfactor](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Gfactor)\ **Post date:** [January 24, 2008, 6:57pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/michigan-speeding-tickets-in-feb/434828/15 "2008-01-24T18:57:52Z")
[QUOTE=gonzomax] [http://wcco.com/crime/speed.speeding.crackdown.2.370193.html](http://wcco.com/crime/speed.speeding.crackdown.2.370193.html) Heres an example. It does happen. I have a cop friend at racketball. i will ask him. [/QUOTE] I don’t think anybody denies that police sometimes get aggressive about enforcement of traffic laws. This article, though, lacks the spurious claim of 30 new unmarked cruisers, which is common to the email urban legend and also the claim that the enforcement uptick is for the purpose of generating revenue. Instead this article cites safety as the key reason: > [@](#): > > The State Patrol said that every year, speed is a factor in about 150 traffic deaths and about 7,000 injuries. The scheme that the email describes, where 1 million dollars is earmarked for overtime simply doesn’t fit with the way Michigan distributes ticket revenue: [http://www.house.mi.gov/hfa/PDFs/traf.pdf](http://www.house.mi.gov/hfa/PDFs/traf.pdf) Also the fact that the identical email has circulated in Michigan in previous years, and in other jurisdictions (all are buying the same number of cruisers, setting the same $9M objective, and planning to use $1M for overtime? Really?) marks this particular story as a fake. Especially when the only newspaper story anybody can find says it’s a fake and quotes a representative of the Michigan State Police as calling it one. ---
**Author:** ![Least\_Original\_User\_Name\_Ever](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/l/e480ec/32.png) [@Least\_Original\_User\_Name\_Ever](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Least_Original_User_Name_Ever)\ **Post date:** [January 24, 2008, 7:05pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/michigan-speeding-tickets-in-feb/434828/16 "2008-01-24T19:05:24Z")
Dad, learn to post stuff like this in MPSIMS. ---
**Author:** ![gonzomax](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/g/e8c25b/32.png) [@gonzomax](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/gonzomax)\ **Post date:** [January 24, 2008, 7:58pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/michigan-speeding-tickets-in-feb/434828/17 "2008-01-24T19:58:24Z")
I figured it was a possible debate about whether tickets are designed to make roads safer or to gather revenue. ---
**Author:** ![Gfactor](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/g/9de053/32.png) [@Gfactor](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Gfactor)\ **Post date:** [January 24, 2008, 8:25pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/michigan-speeding-tickets-in-feb/434828/18 "2008-01-24T20:25:04Z")
One more nail in the coffin: > [@](#): > > “Speeding Ticket Frenzy” is a Hoax > > Contact: Shanon Akans, MSP Public Affairs, (517) 336-6364 > > The Michigan State Police (MSP) is announcing that a widely distributed e-mail message about a “30-day speeding ticket frenzy” to be conducted by the MSP is completely false. There is no such effort underway at this time, or any time in the future, to generate revenue through the issuance of traffic citations. Citizens should regard the warning as nothing more than an urban legend. > > Versions of this e-mail have been circulating in cyberspace for a few years. Several other states including New Jersey, Hawaii, Pennsylvania, South Carolina and Oklahoma have also been targeted in this hoax. [http://www.michigan.gov/som/0,1607,7-192-29941-183747--,00.html](http://www.michigan.gov/som/0,1607,7-192-29941-183747--,00.html) As far as the debate, [QUOTE=gonzomax] I figured it was a possible debate about whether tickets are designed to make roads safer or to gather revenue. [/QUOTE] Do you see these objectives as mutually exclusive? Aren’t they making the roads safer \*and \* generating revenue? ---
**Author:** ![Airman\_Doors\_USAF](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/e36b37/32.png) [@Airman\_Doors\_USAF](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Airman_Doors_USAF)\ **Post date:** [January 24, 2008, 8:42pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/michigan-speeding-tickets-in-feb/434828/19 "2008-01-24T20:42:43Z")
[QUOTE=Gfactor] Aren’t they making the roads safer \*and \* generating revenue? [/QUOTE] No. What is safe about packing people together on the road moving in one big pack? For those of us that watch auto racing, this bears an eerie similarity to “restrictor-plate” racing, i.e., Daytona and Talladega, tracks that are known for their monstrous crashes, a direct result of everybody going the same speed in close proximity to each other. It is far more beneficial to let people go by and break the pack up a little bit. Lots of traffic leads to nervous drivers, panic stops, multi-car accidents, and traffic jams. Breaking it up lets people out of the logjams and allows them to find more open space, which dramatically increases the comfort level (and by extension, the level of safety) of the average driver. The problem with “traffic enforcement” during high-volume times is that when people see police officers they slow down, hit the brakes, or take their eyes off the road for a split-second to check their speed. That is the formula for disaster, and the cause of many thousands of reactionary traffic jams and accidents. Therefore, they cause the very thing they purport to prevent, unsafe driving conditions. With the exception of egregious speeding and weaving through traffic and drunk driving enforcement, traffic enforcement is nothing but revenue generation. Look at the laws of your vicinity and tell me that some of them aren’t written to extract max dollars out of the public over the most petty of things. ---
**Author:** ![Tastes\_of\_Chocolate](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/tastes_of_chocolate/32/3232_2.png) [@Tastes\_of\_Chocolate](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Tastes_of_Chocolate)\ **Post date:** [January 24, 2008, 9:59pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/michigan-speeding-tickets-in-feb/434828/20 "2008-01-24T21:59:16Z")
[QUOTE=Airman Doors, USAF] With the exception of egregious speeding and weaving through traffic and drunk driving enforcement, traffic enforcement is nothing but revenue generation. Look at the laws of your vicinity and tell me that some of them aren’t written to extract max dollars out of the public over the most petty of things. [/QUOTE] No passing stopped school busses, 35mph through town (where all the pedestrians are), kids must be buckled in, stopping at stop signs, working equipment on your car, no passing in “no passing” zone, pedestrian right of way. By Jove, I think he’s got it!! You’re right, they are all nothing buy revenue generators. [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/michigan-speeding-tickets-in-feb/434828.md?page=2)