# Midnight Rider **URL:** \ **Category:** The BBQ Pit\ **Created:** [February 27, 2014, 8:05am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/midnight-rider/682396 "2014-02-27T08:05:26Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 2
**Author:** ![GrandWino](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/grandwino/32/67_2.png) [@GrandWino](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/GrandWino)\ **Post date:** [February 27, 2014, 8:59pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/midnight-rider/682396/21 "2014-02-27T20:59:58Z")
This happens far too often, especially in rural areas where local wedding/family photographers constantly use train tracks as settings for their shoots. [A Las Vegas musician was just killed in January by a train near Seattle during a photoshoot on some tracks.](http://www.lasvegassun.com/blogs/kats-report/2014/jan/19/jeff-ray-member-jersey-boys-band-killed-after-bein/) ---
**Author:** ![Count\_Blucher](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/c5a1d2/32.png) [@Count\_Blucher](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Count_Blucher)\ **Post date:** [February 28, 2014, 2:42pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/midnight-rider/682396/22 "2014-02-28T14:42:01Z")
> [@The\_Other\_Jeffrey\_Lebowski](#): > > No problem. Apologies for snapping at you. > This is a death that hits very close to home. Check out the Facebook link from the op - you’ll see tributes to Sarah from around the globe. I’m sorry for your loss. * * * I think a good way of addressing this is something that you mentioned though: 'Forgiveness Doctrine". Its used across multiple industries by management that never seems to be ever held accountable. Its even idolized and taught as something to emulate: pushing the envelope. Its horrible that she died, but its even more horrible to know that if she had been told the risk and objected to being there then, she would have been ridiculed publicly in front of the crew and fired on the spot. Also, if she reported unsafe working conditions, whistle blower laws or not, she Still would have been fired (hacking abounds in your industry, as you probably know) and likely never hired by another production company ever. America has back-peddled completely on protecting whistle blowers (Snowden is a recent example) and retaliation has become both a science and a policy. When people remember her on the carpet, I wonder if any of them will realize that? If some metaphysical “Donny Darko” bunny had popped up in front her and said, “You’ll get up on that bridge and accept your death or you’ll never work for another production company and will likely wait tables at a diner until you die of cancer in 30 years”, is that really a reasonable choice? It’s not a reasonable choice. We’re better than that. We owe it to our families, to our coworkers, and to our friends to be better than that… to insist on keeping it better than that. Its what we inherited when the baton of this country was passed and feigning ignorance with a smirk is a piss-poor legacy to leave to who we’ll pass that baton on to someday. ---
**Author:** ![Really\_Not\_All\_That\_Bright](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/e8c25b/32.png) [@Really\_Not\_All\_That\_Bright](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Really_Not_All_That_Bright)\ **Post date:** [February 28, 2014, 2:54pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/midnight-rider/682396/23 "2014-02-28T14:54:19Z")
> [@Voyager](#): > > Does the insurance cover problems from trespassing? What sort of insurance? You mean would CSX’s cover this? Or the production company’s? ---
**Author:** ![The\_Other\_Jeffrey\_Lebowski](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/the_other_jeffrey_lebowski/32/215_2.png) [@The\_Other\_Jeffrey\_Lebowski](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/The_Other_Jeffrey_Lebowski)\ **Post date:** [February 28, 2014, 4:17pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/midnight-rider/682396/24 "2014-02-28T16:17:23Z")
Really well said, **Count Blucher**. Below the line crew in production is practically completely freelance, with no real job security. Jobs can last from just a few days (known as day playing) to 3 or 4 months, usually. A television show will go 8 or 9 months, and some people, those that work in tent pole movies (9 figure budgets) can work for more than a year. We can be out of work for weeks or months at a time (I worked a single week between the middle of April and the beginning of July last year). As a result, when we do get work, there’s an eagerness to impress, to not rock the boat, to go above and beyond, if asked. As far as insurance goes, **RNATB** , the production company has insurance. Every time that I make a deal with anyone, I have to sign them on as an additionally insured. From the looks of it, the production company had no deal in place with CSX, and no insurance covering them in the event of any accident. ---
**Author:** ![Really\_Not\_All\_That\_Bright](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/e8c25b/32.png) [@Really\_Not\_All\_That\_Bright](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Really_Not_All_That_Bright)\ **Post date:** [February 28, 2014, 4:26pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/midnight-rider/682396/25 "2014-02-28T16:26:11Z")
It doesn’t necessarily matter if the production company “had a deal” with them or not. Liability insurance covers places. Now, if they were actually trespassing, there’s no liability and insurance is irrelevant. ---
**Author:** ![The\_Other\_Jeffrey\_Lebowski](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/the_other_jeffrey_lebowski/32/215_2.png) [@The\_Other\_Jeffrey\_Lebowski](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/The_Other_Jeffrey_Lebowski)\ **Post date:** [February 28, 2014, 5:07pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/midnight-rider/682396/26 "2014-02-28T17:07:28Z")
True. ---
**Author:** ![zoid](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/zoid/32/336_2.png) [@zoid](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/zoid)\ **Post date:** [February 28, 2014, 5:24pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/midnight-rider/682396/27 "2014-02-28T17:24:57Z")
> [@Bob Ducca](#): > > This happens far too often, especially in rural areas where local wedding/family photographers constantly use train tracks as settings for their shoots. I’d never heard of this. Is there some kind of romantic association with trains? ---
**Author:** ![The\_Other\_Jeffrey\_Lebowski](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/the_other_jeffrey_lebowski/32/215_2.png) [@The\_Other\_Jeffrey\_Lebowski](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/The_Other_Jeffrey_Lebowski)\ **Post date:** [February 28, 2014, 5:43pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/midnight-rider/682396/28 "2014-02-28T17:43:05Z")
[NPR story from 2005 on the romance of train travel.](http://www.npr.org/templates/story/story.php?storyId=4982130) [Romantic photos with train tracks.](http://tr.pinterest.com/pin/57139488995111980/) ---
**Author:** ![Voyager](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/voyager/32/133_2.png) [@Voyager](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Voyager)\ **Post date:** [February 28, 2014, 8:40pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/midnight-rider/682396/29 "2014-02-28T20:40:21Z")
> [@Really\_Not\_All\_That\_Bright](#): > > What sort of insurance? You mean would CSX’s cover this? Or the production company’s? Production company. I think they’d have a problem successfully suing CSX. ---
**Author:** ![The\_Other\_Jeffrey\_Lebowski](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/the_other_jeffrey_lebowski/32/215_2.png) [@The\_Other\_Jeffrey\_Lebowski](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/The_Other_Jeffrey_Lebowski)\ **Post date:** [March 3, 2014, 7:17am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/midnight-rider/682396/30 "2014-03-03T07:17:23Z")
[A nice tribute Sarah.](http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-2571915/Crew-member-Sarah-Jones-17-killed-pre-production.html) ---
**Author:** ![Banquet\_Bear](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/banquet_bear/32/373_2.png) [@Banquet\_Bear](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Banquet_Bear)\ **Post date:** [March 5, 2014, 9:13pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/midnight-rider/682396/31 "2014-03-05T21:13:35Z")
…the more we find out about this, the angrier I get. People better go to jail over this. > **[A Train, a Narrow Trestle and 60 Seconds to Escape: How ‘Midnight Rider’...](https://www.hollywoodreporter.com/news/general-news/midnight-rider-accident-sarah-jones-death-gregg-allman-685976/)** > > The parents of the young camera assistant killed in the train accident on the Georgia set of "Midnight Rider," as well as an injured hairstylist who survived it, reveal harrowing and graphic new details. "I saw my life, my kids, my family, all of it... ---
**Author:** ![GrandWino](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/grandwino/32/67_2.png) [@GrandWino](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/GrandWino)\ **Post date:** [March 5, 2014, 9:19pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/midnight-rider/682396/32 "2014-03-05T21:19:55Z")
> [@zoid](#): > > I’d never heard of this. Is there some kind of romantic association with trains? No, just unimaginative photographers that can’t come up with any other ideas than what they saw online once. [Here’s a good blogpost I’d read about the problem.](http://http://theonlinephotographer.typepad.com/the_online_photographer/2013/10/union-pacific.html) ---
**Author:** ![bucketybuck](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/898d66/32.png) [@bucketybuck](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/bucketybuck)\ **Post date:** [March 5, 2014, 9:32pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/midnight-rider/682396/33 "2014-03-05T21:32:09Z")
I’m curious about something. If the production did have permission to be on the bridge would anything have been different? Would permission also have come with a scheduled window where no trains would be coming? It just seems that the question about permission is a minor matter compared to the actual safety precautions taken on the bridge itself? ---
**Author:** ![Banquet\_Bear](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/banquet_bear/32/373_2.png) [@Banquet\_Bear](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Banquet_Bear)\ **Post date:** [March 5, 2014, 9:40pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/midnight-rider/682396/34 "2014-03-05T21:40:38Z")
> [@bucketybuck](#): > > I’m curious about something. If the production did have permission to be on the bridge would anything have been different? Would permission also have come with a scheduled window where no trains would be coming? > > It just seems that the question about permission is a minor matter compared to the actual safety precautions taken on the bridge itself? …if they had permission there would have been a team of people from the train company on site, with radios, and hard hats. Trains would have been ordered to travel slowly within a certain distance. There would have been constant radio communication between the train dispatcher, the train and the set. The train companies don’t let people “just take safety precautions.” Because they know that people have a tendency to underestimate how quickly a train can creep up on you. There was a world of difference with permission and without. ---
**Author:** ![buddha\_david](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/ee7513/32.png) [@buddha\_david](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/buddha_david)\ **Post date:** [March 5, 2014, 10:13pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/midnight-rider/682396/35 "2014-03-05T22:13:16Z")
> [@The\_Other\_Jeffrey\_Lebowski](#): > > The director, Randall Miller, and the Unit Production Manager, Jay Sedrish, should both serve time for this completely avoidable tragedy. Why so extreme? There should certainly be repercussions, but it’s not as if the director shoved her in front of the fucking train. And count me in on those who mistook “second camera assistant” as meaning multiple deaths, as opposed to Film Industry Jargon. ---
**Author:** ![Banquet\_Bear](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/banquet_bear/32/373_2.png) [@Banquet\_Bear](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Banquet_Bear)\ **Post date:** [March 5, 2014, 10:32pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/midnight-rider/682396/36 "2014-03-05T22:32:01Z")
> [@buddha\_david](#): > > Why so extreme? There should certainly be repercussions, but it’s not as if the director shoved her in front of the fucking train. …I don’t consider putting people in jail who did a negligent job that resulted in people dying to be extreme. ---
**Author:** ![The\_Other\_Jeffrey\_Lebowski](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/the_other_jeffrey_lebowski/32/215_2.png) [@The\_Other\_Jeffrey\_Lebowski](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/The_Other_Jeffrey_Lebowski)\ **Post date:** [March 5, 2014, 11:28pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/midnight-rider/682396/37 "2014-03-05T23:28:21Z")
> [@buddha\_david](#): > > Why so extreme? There should certainly be repercussions, but it’s not as if the director shoved her in front of the fucking train. I am so extreme because I am a below the line person, like the deceased, and the 7 other injured crew members. I have worked with and for people like these 2 (Miller and Sedrish), and they, IMNSHO, deserve some time locked up for their willful disregard of the safety of the entire crew. ---
**Author:** ![Ferret\_Herder](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/f/e47774/32.png) [@Ferret\_Herder](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Ferret_Herder)\ **Post date:** [March 5, 2014, 11:28pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/midnight-rider/682396/38 "2014-03-05T23:28:33Z")
Agreed - this was like telling hazmat workers to do their work without any protective gear. **buddha\_david** , go read that last-linked article: it’s short and a terrifying eye-opener. ---
**Author:** ![Count\_Blucher](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/c5a1d2/32.png) [@Count\_Blucher](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Count_Blucher)\ **Post date:** [March 6, 2014, 5:31pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/midnight-rider/682396/39 "2014-03-06T17:31:56Z")
> [@The\_Other\_Jeffrey\_Lebowski](#): > > I am so extreme because I am a below the line person, like the deceased, and the 7 other injured crew members. I have worked with and for people like these 2 (Miller and Sedrish), and they, IMNSHO, deserve some time locked up for their willful disregard of the safety of the entire crew. Hey. A slight hijack because, well, its needed. You do the work. You take the risks. You do the living and the dying in that town, not some gold-encrusted smirking Asshat in $1000 Itallian shoes. They take every credit, with names in 24 point font while you’re lucky to even be mentioned as part of a team. But… Every good movie out there… every one… had you or a counter part in it somewhere. _ **Thank You!** _ Ellen DeGeneres may never order you pizza, but somebody ought to thank you. If no one higher up or better respected will thank you and it falls down this far to reach the likes of me, then I’LL thank you. Every Damn One Of You! [/hijack] ---
**Author:** ![Banquet\_Bear](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/banquet_bear/32/373_2.png) [@Banquet\_Bear](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Banquet_Bear)\ **Post date:** [March 6, 2014, 8:33pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/midnight-rider/682396/40 "2014-03-06T20:33:06Z")
> [@Count\_Blucher](#): > > Hey. A slight hijack because, well, its needed. > > You do the work. You take the risks. You do the living and the dying in that town, not some gold-encrusted smirking Asshat in $1000 Itallian shoes. They take every credit, with names in 24 point font > while you’re lucky to even be mentioned as part of a team. But… > > Every good movie out there… every one… had you or a counter part in it somewhere. > > _ **Thank You!** _ > > Ellen DeGeneres may never order you pizza, but somebody ought to thank you. > If no one higher up or better respected will thank you and it falls down this far to reach the likes of me, then I’LL thank you. Every Damn One Of You! > > [/hijack] …so say we all. :: raises a glass to all those below the line :: [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/midnight-rider/682396.md?page=1) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/midnight-rider/682396.md?page=3)