# Milk transported in same tanks as petrochemicals/pesticides? **URL:** \ **Category:** Factual Questions\ **Created:** [April 16, 2008, 10:42am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/milk-transported-in-same-tanks-as-petrochemicals-pesticides/445574 "2008-04-16T10:42:39Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 10\ **Page:** 2
**Author:** ![A.R.Cane](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/ee7513/32.png) [@A.R.Cane](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/A.R.Cane)\ **Post date:** [April 18, 2008, 9:48pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/milk-transported-in-same-tanks-as-petrochemicals-pesticides/445574/21 "2008-04-18T21:48:43Z")
I’m no expert, but I did pull a tanker for about a month, back in the mid 90’s. It was a srartup operation, two partners. One was a guy, mid 40’s, who’s father owned a large dairy farm im Wa. and also owned a small tanker fleet to haul the milk for his and other local dairies. The son had been running the tankers for his dad until they had a falling out and sonny decided to start his own tanker co. The other partner was a freight broker out of so. Ca. Apparently these two had known each other for several year and had some dealings in the trucking business. Sonny turned out to be all big ideas, but not much business sense, which the partner and I found out the hard way. I had a signed contract for $xx dollars per mile, loaded or empty, which I eventually collected from the partner. Sonny left him holding the bag. I didn’t get too deep into it, but apparently at the time the state/federal regs. governing tankers was pretty loose. It seemed to pretty much regulated by the shippers and whether they would load their product on your truck. I’m sure there were pretty strict regs. on dangerous chemicals, but that still leaves a lot of room for abuse. On one run I hauled a load of used motor oil into SLC and then, after a half assed washout, hauled a load to tallow. Now tallow is pretty nasty stuff, but much of it was used by the fast food industry, in their deep fat friers. I think there was a big shakeup in the late 90’s and they’ve tightened up the cross contamination issue a lot. ---
**Author:** ![ftg](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/ftg/32/2801_2.png) [@ftg](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/ftg)\ **Post date:** [April 19, 2008, 4:42pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/milk-transported-in-same-tanks-as-petrochemicals-pesticides/445574/22 "2008-04-19T16:42:49Z")
[QUOTE=t-bonham@scc.net] Many of these urban legends can be exposed with just a bit of common sense, economically. Ask _How would they make more profits doing this?_ [/QUOTE] What? By not carrying an empty load on the return trip of course! A guy drives from NYC to rural PA with a load of GooGunk™. After unloading and a minimal wash he picks up a load of milk for the return to NYC. Lather, rinse, repeat. Note that the newspaper articles I read concerned longer haul shipping. The short trip stuff from farm to dairy is a whole 'nother thing. Dairies do indeed test the milk after it comes in from a farm, but that doesn’t matter when it gets shipped out. Will every factory of Mom’s Milk Biscuits™ chain test each batch that comes in, especially if there’s a wink-wink discount on shipping? ---
**Author:** ![Xema](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/x/9de053/32.png) [@Xema](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Xema)\ **Post date:** [April 19, 2008, 6:19pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/milk-transported-in-same-tanks-as-petrochemicals-pesticides/445574/23 "2008-04-19T18:19:39Z")
[QUOTE=t-bonham@scc.net] Yes, that’s why it is so damaging! If it was soluble it would just dissolve into the gas (petrol), and be burned up. Instead it stays as sugar, and clogs up the fuel filter, and fuel pump, and carburetor or fuel injectors, if it gets that far. And it stays as a sticky, sugary mess that is very hard to clean off those expensive parts – often they just have to be replaced. [/QUOTE] Not everyone agrees. Both [Snopes](http://www.snopes.com/autos/grace/sugar.asp) and [Car Talk](http://www.cartalk.com/content/columns/Archive/2001/February/02.html) say that it will clog filters but that’s about all, and will not be especially hard to clean up. ---
**Author:** ![Dewey\_Finn](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/dewey_finn/32/4222_2.png) [@Dewey\_Finn](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Dewey_Finn)\ **Post date:** [April 19, 2008, 6:23pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/milk-transported-in-same-tanks-as-petrochemicals-pesticides/445574/24 "2008-04-19T18:23:38Z")
[QUOTE=ftg] What? By not carrying an empty load on the return trip of course! A guy drives from NYC to rural PA with a load of GooGunk™. After unloading and a minimal wash he picks up a load of milk for the return to NYC. Lather, rinse, repeat. Note that the newspaper articles I read concerned longer haul shipping. The short trip stuff from farm to dairy is a whole 'nother thing. Dairies do indeed test the milk after it comes in from a farm, but that doesn’t matter when it gets shipped out. Will every factory of Mom’s Milk Biscuits™ chain test each batch that comes in, especially if there’s a wink-wink discount on shipping? [/QUOTE] Do you have links to any articles about someone carrying milk and anything else on the same truck? I’ve been looking on the free newspaper archive sites and haven’t found any instances of this so far. ---
**Author:** ![glilly](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/g/48db29/32.png) [@glilly](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/glilly)\ **Post date:** [April 19, 2008, 6:47pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/milk-transported-in-same-tanks-as-petrochemicals-pesticides/445574/25 "2008-04-19T18:47:41Z")
From my experience in the food industry, food manufacturers are very concerned with the transportation of bulk materials because the negative PR and recall costs from even a relatively inconsequential contamination issue can be devastating. Typical for the industries I’ve seen (not milk), before loading a tanker or hopper, the operators are to collect documentation of internal cleaning (maybe this was a receipt from a place that does the cleaning) if the cleaning wasn’t done on-site, an inspection of the truck’s paperwork to see what had been hauled in the truck the last load (or few loads), and a physical inspection of the innards. I’d been told of a couple cases where the previous load had been found to be incompatible with food, so the truck was rejected and the hauler removed from the list of approved companies. None of which is foolproof, of course. ---
**Author:** ![Rosentredere](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/0ea827/32.png) [@Rosentredere](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Rosentredere)\ **Post date:** [April 19, 2008, 7:01pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/milk-transported-in-same-tanks-as-petrochemicals-pesticides/445574/26 "2008-04-19T19:01:36Z")
[QUOTE=ftg] Will every factory of Mom’s Milk Biscuits™ chain test each batch that comes in, especially if there’s a wink-wink discount on shipping? [/QUOTE] In my experience, yes they will. Food producers are generally required (either by law or contract obligation) to be able to trace their products in both directions. That means they can tell where a particular stick of butter was bought and from which farm the milk came. ---
**Author:** ![ftg](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/ftg/32/2801_2.png) [@ftg](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/ftg)\ **Post date:** [April 19, 2008, 9:29pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/milk-transported-in-same-tanks-as-petrochemicals-pesticides/445574/27 "2008-04-19T21:29:24Z")
[QUOTE=Rosentredere] In my experience, yes they will. Food producers are generally required (either by law or contract obligation) to be able to trace their products in both directions. That means they can tell where a particular stick of butter was bought and from which farm the milk came. [/QUOTE] I don’t understand. What does this have to do with _testing_ an incoming shipment from a dairy? ---
**Author:** ![DesertDog](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/desertdog/32/11503_2.png) [@DesertDog](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/DesertDog)\ **Post date:** [April 19, 2008, 11:16pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/milk-transported-in-same-tanks-as-petrochemicals-pesticides/445574/28 "2008-04-19T23:16:15Z")
[QUOTE=El\_Kabong] Potentially hazardous chemicals have something called a [UN number](http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/UN_number), and tankers carrying them must, by DOT regulation, carry placards (those diamond-shaped graphics) displaying the UN number and a symbol indicating the hazard type. For example, UN 1203 is gasoline. I don’t think you’ll find a UN number for milk, and likewise, you are unlikely to even find the fittings for placards on a milk tanker, because the substance is not considered hazardous. [/QUOTE] Thank you, \*\* E K\*\*. I had prowled around the DOT site a while back because I wondered what code “1803” was. I didn’t find anything there that was useful, but I didn’t know the numbers were from the UN. Now I know it’s Phenolsulfonic acid, liquid (whatever that is). I live about five miles north of a big bunch of dairy farms – a light breeze from the south is occasionally redolent of cow. I work just two blocks from the Arizona Dairymen Association processing plant. Every day when I go back and forth I’m dodging milk semi-trailer tanks. When they’re going back to the farm they go like a bat outta hell so I doubt they’re hauling anything in the tank. I’ve never noticed any placards nor an empty rack for one but I have to think if I ever saw one with a big bunch of ADA decals on the side and a 1203 placard on the back, I’d be agog. ---
**Author:** ![Rosentredere](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/0ea827/32.png) [@Rosentredere](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Rosentredere)\ **Post date:** [April 20, 2008, 12:24am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/milk-transported-in-same-tanks-as-petrochemicals-pesticides/445574/29 "2008-04-20T00:24:10Z")
[QUOTE=ftg] I don’t understand. What does this have to do with _testing_ an incoming shipment from a dairy? [/QUOTE] Well, without testing, if a customer were to come to harm the company in question would have no way to prove that the product was not contaminated in their factory. It is of course possible to take samples of every incoming batch of milk and then only to test them in the case of a problem. This may enable you to blame the trucking company, but you have still to deal with a lot of angry customers and a damaged public image. ---
**Author:** ![Danalan](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/76d3ee/32.png) [@Danalan](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Danalan)\ **Post date:** [April 20, 2008, 1:23am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/milk-transported-in-same-tanks-as-petrochemicals-pesticides/445574/30 "2008-04-20T01:23:38Z")
From this New Yorker [article](http://www.newyorker.com/archive/2003/02/17/030217fa_fact4). This part is from page 4. > [@](#): > > Self-employed, Ainsworth has an agent in North Salt Lake. Ainsworth rarely knows where he will be going, or with what, until a day or two in advance. “I am in a very specialized portion of trucking,” he had once told me. “I have chemicals in a tanker. The whole game hinges on tank washings. Without tank washings, tankers would roll loaded one-way, then go back to origin to load again. In the old days, it was all dedicated runs. Now, due to the widespread existence of interior tank washes, we can move around, taking different things.” This is from page 5. > [@](#): > > Generally, the separation is distinct between food-grade and chemical tankers. You haul chemicals or you haul food. The vessels are different, the specs are different—mainly in protective devices against the aftermath of rollovers. Ainsworth used to haul wine, orange juice, and chocolate. He mentioned a load of concentrated cranberry juice worth five hundred thousand dollars, a load of chocolate worth seven hundred thousand. He said orange-juice haulers sometimes carry sizing agents on the return trip (sizing agents control shrinkage in textiles). Very few companies carry both foods and chemicals even in completely separate tankers. Ainsworth remembers a California carrier with a fleet of about twenty trucks who carried paint thinner, washed, and then picked up wine. He said, “Your brother better be F. Lee Bailey if you’re going to engage in practices like that.” It’s a good read, classic New Yorker magazine. I’m so glad their archive is online and searchable! Summary: Food grade and chemical tankers are set up differently. Milk is different still. Everything gets washed down between loads, at certified wash stations, monitored by Rabbis if it’s Kosher food being hauled. Do people cheat on these rules to save money? Sure, but it’s not worth it in the long run. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/milk-transported-in-same-tanks-as-petrochemicals-pesticides/445574.md?page=1)