# Milwaukee County Sheriff David Clarke harasses, threatens Packer fan. **URL:** \ **Category:** The BBQ Pit\ **Created:** [January 20, 2017, 4:31pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/milwaukee-county-sheriff-david-clarke-harasses-threatens-packer-fan/777636 "2017-01-20T16:31:52Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 3
**Author:** ![elucidator](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/8edcca/32.png) [@elucidator](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/elucidator)\ **Post date:** [January 20, 2017, 8:59pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/milwaukee-county-sheriff-david-clarke-harasses-threatens-packer-fan/777636/41 "2017-01-20T20:59:35Z")
He’s installed a standard **Bricker** trap-door, that word, “credible”. Which cannot be explicitly defined and therefore cannot be rebutted. Try, and he’ll take you to the dictionary, if that don’t do it, he’ll drag out the law books. He’s one of the few advocates I know who has mastered the art of boring you into submission. ---
**Author:** ![Chisquirrel](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/6bbea6/32.png) [@Chisquirrel](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Chisquirrel)\ **Post date:** [January 20, 2017, 9:00pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/milwaukee-county-sheriff-david-clarke-harasses-threatens-packer-fan/777636/42 "2017-01-20T21:00:28Z")
> [@Bricker](#): > > Sorry, but that’s not “appropriate.” If the guy credibly threatened violence, then you send multiple officers. I thought Clarke was perfectly able and willing to knock someone out on the plane. I still haven’t seen any charges against Black, which would seem appropriate if he actually threatened the Sheriff. But then, there could be a possibility of a legal investigation into the event, not just a “hurr hurr I’ll knock you out” Facebook post. The mind, it boggles. ---
**Author:** ![Chisquirrel](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/6bbea6/32.png) [@Chisquirrel](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Chisquirrel)\ **Post date:** [January 20, 2017, 9:01pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/milwaukee-county-sheriff-david-clarke-harasses-threatens-packer-fan/777636/43 "2017-01-20T21:01:54Z")
> [@CarnalK](#): > > And two K-9 units? Not generally. Hell, one can tear a leg up pretty well if you let him at it for a minute or two. Then they can yell “STOP RESISTING!” as he thrashes on the ground. ---
**Author:** ![Bricker](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/977dab/32.png) [@Bricker](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Bricker)\ **Post date:** [January 20, 2017, 9:32pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/milwaukee-county-sheriff-david-clarke-harasses-threatens-packer-fan/777636/44 "2017-01-20T21:32:34Z")
> [@August\_West](#): > > And then you arrest him. The fact that this guy was apparently not arrested, charged, or cited, hints strongly that this was pure intimidation. Yes, that’s evidence, but it’s not strong evidence; if Black denied any threats, then the additional officers would have had only the word of the sheriff. Unless I were to learn that they had an opportunity to interview the other passengers, and still did not arrest or cite Black. ---
**Author:** ![CarnalK](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/carnalk/32/486_2.png) [@CarnalK](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/CarnalK)\ **Post date:** [January 20, 2017, 9:42pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/milwaukee-county-sheriff-david-clarke-harasses-threatens-packer-fan/777636/45 "2017-01-20T21:42:06Z")
So you’re saying they wouldn’t act on the word of their Sheriff? You’re also suggesting it’s reasonable to think they might have lacked the oppurtunity to interview other passengers filing off the plane? ---
**Author:** ![August\_West](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/august_west/32/18069_2.png) [@August\_West](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/August_West)\ **Post date:** [January 20, 2017, 10:00pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/milwaukee-county-sheriff-david-clarke-harasses-threatens-packer-fan/777636/46 "2017-01-20T22:00:45Z")
> [@Bricker](#): > > Yes, that’s evidence, but it’s not strong evidence; if Black denied any threats, then the additional officers would have had only the word of the sheriff. > > Unless I were to learn that they had an opportunity to interview the other passengers, and still did not arrest or cite Black. Right. For the sake of argument, let’s agree that this happened. Now Black goes to the press and gives his (fictitious) side of the story. Obviously, the proper response is to publicly threaten to knock out the next person who looks at you funny, then search social media for a picture of Black and post it on an official website with an insult and a threat of violence/death. Will you admit that response was inappropriate? ---
**Author:** ![Bricker](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/977dab/32.png) [@Bricker](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Bricker)\ **Post date:** [January 20, 2017, 10:03pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/milwaukee-county-sheriff-david-clarke-harasses-threatens-packer-fan/777636/47 "2017-01-20T22:03:06Z")
> [@CarnalK](#): > > Yes, if he credibly threatened violence then he should have been placed under arrest. What’s your theory on that, Bricker? Right now I have no idea, since I have only heard one side of the story. So my view is that if you say Black committed a crime by threatening the sheriff, I’d say there’s not enough evidence I’m aware of to support that claim. And if you say that the sheriff committed a crime of abuse of his office, I’d say there’s not enough evidence I’m aware of to support that claim. ---
**Author:** ![Bricker](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/977dab/32.png) [@Bricker](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Bricker)\ **Post date:** [January 20, 2017, 10:04pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/milwaukee-county-sheriff-david-clarke-harasses-threatens-packer-fan/777636/48 "2017-01-20T22:04:54Z")
> [@August\_West](#): > > Right. For the sake of argument, let’s agree that this happened. > > Now Black goes to the press and gives his (fictitious) side of the story. Obviously, the proper response is to publicly threaten to knock out the next person who looks at you funny, then search social media for a picture of Black and post it on an official website with an insult and a threat of violence/death. > > Will you admit that response was inappropriate? I’m saying that my opinion on the propriety is utterly irrelevant. I’d also say that your summary is flawed. I don’t agree that the Facebook posting threatens violence or death. ---
**Author:** ![August\_West](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/august_west/32/18069_2.png) [@August\_West](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/August_West)\ **Post date:** [January 20, 2017, 10:15pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/milwaukee-county-sheriff-david-clarke-harasses-threatens-packer-fan/777636/49 "2017-01-20T22:15:32Z")
It may be irrelevant, but you have an opinion, right? What is your opinion of the online reponse? The only other interpretation I can think of for “you wouldn’t be around” is imprisonment. Is it your view that Sheriff Clarke is saying he can “harass” people by imprisoning them? ---
**Author:** ![Thudlow\_Boink](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/thudlow_boink/32/320_2.png) [@Thudlow\_Boink](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Thudlow_Boink)\ **Post date:** [January 20, 2017, 10:17pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/milwaukee-county-sheriff-david-clarke-harasses-threatens-packer-fan/777636/50 "2017-01-20T22:17:59Z")
> [@Bricker](#): > > I don’t agree that the Facebook posting threatens violence or death. Not in a legal sense, it doesn’t. Neither, in a legal sense, does a comment like “That’s a nice \_\_\_\_ you’ve got there. It’d be a shame if something were to happen to him/her/it (wink wink).” ---
**Author:** ![kayT](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/kayt/32/3633_2.png) [@kayT](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/kayT)\ **Post date:** [January 20, 2017, 10:19pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/milwaukee-county-sheriff-david-clarke-harasses-threatens-packer-fan/777636/51 "2017-01-20T22:19:43Z")
NM ---
**Author:** ![Steve\_MB](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/steve_mb/32/5339_2.png) [@Steve\_MB](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Steve_MB)\ **Post date:** [January 20, 2017, 10:43pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/milwaukee-county-sheriff-david-clarke-harasses-threatens-packer-fan/777636/52 "2017-01-20T22:43:23Z")
> [@Bricker](#): > > The OP alleged that the sheriff abused the legal power granted to him by his office. I pointed out that in order to determine that, we need to know what took place on the plane. We know that the sheriff has failed to provide an explanation of what allegedly took place on the plane such that the alleged events would justify his subsequent actions. This is quite sufficient, given that he has had more than sufficient time to provide such an explanation. > [@](#): > > It depends. Suppose you were to learn that Back said to Clarke, “When we get to the airport, I am going to take the gun I have in checked baggage and shoot you through the head.” Certainly that would qualify as an imminent threat, and justify the response of deputies. The admission of open-ended hypotheticals without any requirement that the involved persons actually asserted them opens up all sorts of fascinating possibilities. For instance, suppose we were to learn that the prostitutes hacked up by Jack the Ripper were shapeshifting aliens scouting the planet for invasion. Certainly that would qualify as an imminent threat, and justify a few regrettably messy acts in defense of humanity. ---
**Author:** ![CarnalK](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/carnalk/32/486_2.png) [@CarnalK](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/CarnalK)\ **Post date:** [January 20, 2017, 11:04pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/milwaukee-county-sheriff-david-clarke-harasses-threatens-packer-fan/777636/53 "2017-01-20T23:04:34Z")
> [@Bricker](#): > > Right now I have no idea, since I have only heard one side of the story. So my view is that if you say Black committed a crime by threatening the sheriff, I’d say there’s not enough evidence I’m aware of to support that claim. > > And if you say that the sheriff committed a crime of abuse of his office, I’d say there’s not enough evidence I’m aware of to support that claim. The thing is, none of your caveats and hypotheticals are reasonable. It’s not realistic to suggest Black wouldn’t have been arrested if he had uttered credible threats. It’s not reasonable to suggest the officers were perhaps unable to gather witness statements. It defies all my experience that an elected Sheriff wouldn’t have released some official statement clarifying the events if he had a leg to stand on. What we do know is that they had some sort of confrontation on the plane, the Sheriff called in a big backup squad but no arrest was made. Then the Sheriff takes to the official county facebook page with childish taunts. Without further evidence, it seems clear Clarke abused his position even if it doesn’t meet some criminal standard. ---
**Author:** ![octopus](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/octopus/32/3716_2.png) [@octopus](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/octopus)\ **Post date:** [January 20, 2017, 11:12pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/milwaukee-county-sheriff-david-clarke-harasses-threatens-packer-fan/777636/54 "2017-01-20T23:12:53Z")
As we have all been lectured before, freedom of speech doesn’t mean freedom from consequences. ---
**Author:** ![AlsoNamedBort](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/alsonamedbort/32/3213_2.png) [@AlsoNamedBort](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/AlsoNamedBort)\ **Post date:** [January 20, 2017, 11:17pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/milwaukee-county-sheriff-david-clarke-harasses-threatens-packer-fan/777636/55 "2017-01-20T23:17:19Z")
> [@Bricker](#): > > Right now I have no idea, since I have only heard one side of the story. So my view is that if you say Black committed a crime by threatening the sheriff, I’d say there’s not enough evidence I’m aware of to support that claim. > > And if you say that the sheriff committed a crime of abuse of his office, I’d say there’s not enough evidence I’m aware of to support that claim. Threatening the sheriff would be considered assault correct? Well the sheriff specifically stated he was not assaulted: > [@](#): > > The Sheriff said he does not have to wait for some goof to assault him. He reserves the reasonable right to pre-empt a possible assault." ---
**Author:** ![Steve\_MB](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/steve_mb/32/5339_2.png) [@Steve\_MB](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Steve_MB)\ **Post date:** [January 20, 2017, 11:29pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/milwaukee-county-sheriff-david-clarke-harasses-threatens-packer-fan/777636/56 "2017-01-20T23:29:46Z")
> [@octopus](#): > > As we have all been lectured before, freedom of speech doesn’t mean freedom from consequences. Wow, this plumbs a whole new level of absurdity even for you. By definition, “freedom of speech” refers to freedom from consequences imposed by government. ---
**Author:** ![Euphonious\_Polemic](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/euphonious_polemic/32/3002_2.png) [@Euphonious\_Polemic](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Euphonious_Polemic)\ **Post date:** [January 20, 2017, 11:40pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/milwaukee-county-sheriff-david-clarke-harasses-threatens-packer-fan/777636/57 "2017-01-20T23:40:36Z")
> [@octopus](#): > > As we have all been lectured before, freedom of speech doesn’t mean freedom from consequences. so… If you, for example, post something that says the government of the day is promoting a bad policy, and the next day the police come to your door and beat the living crap out of you… Well, that’s just tough shit for you, because … hey, consequences. That is what you’re saying. ---
**Author:** ![SteveG1](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/bb73d2/32.png) [@SteveG1](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/SteveG1)\ **Post date:** [January 20, 2017, 11:50pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/milwaukee-county-sheriff-david-clarke-harasses-threatens-packer-fan/777636/58 "2017-01-20T23:50:45Z")
> [@Euphonious\_Polemic](#): > > so… If you, for example, post something that says the government of the day is promoting a bad policy, and the next day the police come to your door and beat the living crap out of you… > > Well, that’s just tough shit for you, because … hey, consequences. > That is what you’re saying. That’s right. Consequences. And if he talks trash about the Mets or the Dodgers and gets beat into a coma for it, consequences. ---
**Author:** ![SteveG1](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/bb73d2/32.png) [@SteveG1](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/SteveG1)\ **Post date:** [January 20, 2017, 11:54pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/milwaukee-county-sheriff-david-clarke-harasses-threatens-packer-fan/777636/59 "2017-01-20T23:54:39Z")
> [@August\_West](#): > > And then you arrest him. The fact that this guy was apparently not arrested, charged, or cited, hints strongly that this was pure intimidation. Sure seems so, doesn’t it. ---
**Author:** ![CarnalK](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/carnalk/32/486_2.png) [@CarnalK](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/CarnalK)\ **Post date:** [January 20, 2017, 11:57pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/milwaukee-county-sheriff-david-clarke-harasses-threatens-packer-fan/777636/60 "2017-01-20T23:57:29Z")
> [@SteveG1](#): > > That’s right. Consequences. And if he talks trash about the Mets or the Dodgers and gets beat into a coma for it, consequences. No, you are yanking the example in the wrong direction. octopus was giving a pass to an elected law enforcement official to mete out “consequences” for speech he doesn’t like. That is in direct opposition to the right of free speech. Getting beat up at a bar for being a loudmouth at the wrong sports fans weakens the point. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/milwaukee-county-sheriff-david-clarke-harasses-threatens-packer-fan/777636.md?page=2) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/milwaukee-county-sheriff-david-clarke-harasses-threatens-packer-fan/777636.md?page=4)