# Mirror Mirror (TOS)...the immediate aftermath. **URL:** \ **Category:** Cafe Society\ **Created:** [December 28, 2019, 5:55am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/mirror-mirror-tos-the-immediate-aftermath/845502 "2019-12-28T05:55:53Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 10\ **Page:** 1
**Author:** ![Dale\_Sams](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/779978/32.png) [@Dale\_Sams](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Dale_Sams)\ **Post date:** [December 28, 2019, 5:55am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/mirror-mirror-tos-the-immediate-aftermath/845502/1 "2019-12-28T05:55:53Z")
I assume there’s a novel that covers this. There’s one for everything. Mirror Spock needs to have killed Sulu upon exiting sickbay…and if he didn’t, he had him locked up and now he needs to kill him. There are a few loose ends from Mirror Spocks perpective. Not only do he and Marlena need to move VERY fast. They should probably move quickly in whatever Empire toppling plans they have. Unfortunatly for Marlena, I don’t see Spock\* as “A man of integrity in every universe”. He’s just ruthlessly logical. And a factor like Marlena shouldn’t…CAN’T…be allowed to exist any longer than she is useful to him. \*On the flip side…whatever Mirror Spock does…it doesn’t last. So maybe MS was too nice. Also, I liked how Mirror Spock reacts much more like a traditional Ship’s Commander/First Officer then our Spock does. ---
**Author:** ![terentii](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/terentii/32/212_2.png) [@terentii](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/terentii)\ **Post date:** [December 28, 2019, 6:11am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/mirror-mirror-tos-the-immediate-aftermath/845502/2 "2019-12-28T06:11:28Z")
I’ve always thought Evil Spock and his operatives would overthrow the Terran Empire and establish an even more ruthless Vulcan one, especially now that they have a weapon which makes them invincible. Marlena might be thrown a bone (so to speak) and kept on, so long as she proves herself useful in dealing with humans as a subjugated race. Not exactly the outcome you’d hoped for, eh Jimbo? 😉😃 ---
**Author:** ![outlierrn](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/outlierrn/32/3005_2.png) [@outlierrn](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/outlierrn)\ **Post date:** [December 28, 2019, 6:22am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/mirror-mirror-tos-the-immediate-aftermath/845502/3 "2019-12-28T06:22:13Z")
I dunno, Sulu’s behavior was predictable, legal, even logical in context, why wouldn’t Spock recruit him? He’ll need accomplices, and he can offer Sulu a lot more than command of the Enterprise. ---
**Author:** ![Quimby](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/q/22d042/32.png) [@Quimby](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Quimby)\ **Post date:** [December 28, 2019, 1:24pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/mirror-mirror-tos-the-immediate-aftermath/845502/4 "2019-12-28T13:24:57Z")
There was indeed a series of Novels about what happened and the short answer is it was a essentially like Foundation. Mirror Spock knew if the Empire disarmed its enemies would destroy it it so he created a proto Federation in secret which went underground. He used the Tantalus device to take over the Empire (and I think then destroyed it but I don’t remember). The Alliance then conquers the Empire (as seen in the DS9 follow-ups). The secret Proto Federation manipulates events to eventually drive everything towards new Federation type system that includes the former Alliance. Sorry my memory is vague. The books are several years old at this point. ---
**Author:** ![BigT](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/bigt/32/12044_2.png) [@BigT](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/BigT)\ **Post date:** [December 28, 2019, 6:13pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/mirror-mirror-tos-the-immediate-aftermath/845502/5 "2019-12-28T18:13:20Z")
The main thing we know from canon is that, by the 24th Century the Terrans get taken over by other groups and fight in a rebellion against them. Any success Mirror Spock has has to be short lived, as this would have happened in his lifetime (assuming he wasn’t killed). (This is from DS9, and when our Spock was still alive.) ---
**Author:** ![Dale\_Sams](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/779978/32.png) [@Dale\_Sams](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Dale_Sams)\ **Post date:** [December 28, 2019, 9:15pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/mirror-mirror-tos-the-immediate-aftermath/845502/6 "2019-12-28T21:15:12Z")
Also if interest…from DS9…we learn that the incursion into the Mirror Universe was not kept under wraps Not only that but Our Kirks off the cuff plan for Mirror Spock to follow was exposed. ---
**Author:** ![E-DUB](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/e-dub/32/403_2.png) [@E-DUB](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/E-DUB)\ **Post date:** [December 28, 2019, 9:44pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/mirror-mirror-tos-the-immediate-aftermath/845502/7 "2019-12-28T21:44:53Z")
The pivotal book in the series mentioned above is “Sorrows of Empire”. > **[The Sorrows of Empire](https://memory-alpha.fandom.com/wiki/The_Sorrows_of_Empire)** > > The Sorrows of Empire is a Star Trek: Mirror Universe novel – the fourth book in the series – written by David Mack. Published by Pocket Books, it was first released in December 2009. The novel is an expansion of Mack's story "The Sorrows of Empire",... ---
**Author:** ![Gatopescado](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/gatopescado/32/5711_2.png) [@Gatopescado](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Gatopescado)\ **Post date:** [December 28, 2019, 10:10pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/mirror-mirror-tos-the-immediate-aftermath/845502/8 "2019-12-28T22:10:20Z")
I just hope he doesn’t shave! ---
**Author:** ![burpo\_the\_wonder\_mutt](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/burpo_the_wonder_mutt/32/365_2.png) [@burpo\_the\_wonder\_mutt](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/burpo_the_wonder_mutt)\ **Post date:** [December 28, 2019, 10:14pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/mirror-mirror-tos-the-immediate-aftermath/845502/9 "2019-12-28T22:14:06Z")
Screw all that; whatever happened to Empress Hoshi Sato? (That’s an empire I could get behind.) ---
**Author:** ![Pavelb1](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/p/439d5e/32.png) [@Pavelb1](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Pavelb1)\ **Post date:** [March 19, 2024, 3:59am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/mirror-mirror-tos-the-immediate-aftermath/845502/10 "2024-03-19T03:59:12Z")
Bumping this cause i just saw it. One of many head canon bits that when a Trek series blows it up infuriates me cause there’s no other way to have it, (That said this hasn’t been blown up) The Mirror Tholians pulling TOS Defiant back in time absolutely creates a new timeline. There’s no way to square Mirror Mirror with ENT and Space Hitlers Empire. The Mirror Universe DISCO eps square much better with what we see in ENT. Let me simplify: Mirror Tholians pull Defiant back in time. Hoshi gets it, takes over the Empire squashing all dissent. By the time of DISCO, they have used the Defiant, along with the location of any number of undiscovered artifacts, to take over the galaxy…including The Borg and the Founders. Which were unknown to Defiant TOS. Quite a feat. I posit they leaned heavily on the ‘artifacts’ part. Including the Guardian of Forever. Back to the ep a bit…I find it interesting at the very end…a slightly different line reading from Lieutenant Marlena Moreau would imply its the Mirror one having escaped her universe. “I was just assigned here…last…week.” As it is, she just walks off kinda befuddled by Kirks interest in her.