# Misogyny and pop culture: don't yuck my yum! (Spoilers for the movie Poor Things) **URL:** \ **Category:** The BBQ Pit\ **Created:** [February 4, 2024, 10:16pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/misogyny-and-pop-culture-dont-yuck-my-yum-spoilers-for-the-movie-poor-things/997107 "2024-02-04T22:16:36Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 8
**Author:** ![Cheesesteak](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/cheesesteak/32/3694_2.png) [@Cheesesteak](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Cheesesteak)\ **Post date:** [February 5, 2024, 6:54pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/misogyny-and-pop-culture-dont-yuck-my-yum-spoilers-for-the-movie-poor-things/997107/141 "2024-02-05T18:54:32Z")
> [@Riemann](#): > > all opinions are _necessarily_ equally valid. Not exactly, I intended to distinguish between opinions by saying that Eonwe’s opinion should be accepted “on that basis”. As in, we understand that the opinion is based on the trailer and reviews rather than personal viewing. It’s not identical to personal viewing, but it also is not baseless. Folks seem to want to dismiss her opinion entirely, which is unfair, opinions aren’t pay to play, though opinions based on personal experience can have greater weight. ---
**Author:** ![Whack-a-Mole](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/whack-a-mole/32/141_2.png) [@Whack-a-Mole](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Whack-a-Mole)\ **Post date:** [February 5, 2024, 6:56pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/misogyny-and-pop-culture-dont-yuck-my-yum-spoilers-for-the-movie-poor-things/997107/142 "2024-02-05T18:56:07Z")
> [@puzzlegal](#): > > And the only thing cringy about seeing it was that we saw it with my kids, and my son’s spouse had just told him they were leaving him, so some of the relationship stuff was cringy due to my family’s immediate circumstances. I understand that. I saw _American Beauty_ when my marriage was on the rocks and HATED it. It’s a very good movie but I saw it at the wrong time. ---
**Author:** ![puzzlegal](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/puzzlegal/32/3827_2.png) [@puzzlegal](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/puzzlegal)\ **Post date:** [February 5, 2024, 6:56pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/misogyny-and-pop-culture-dont-yuck-my-yum-spoilers-for-the-movie-poor-things/997107/143 "2024-02-05T18:56:40Z")
> [@Riemann](#): > > > [@puzzlegal](#): > > > > She was attacked for stating it. > > Can you link to a post or posts that you think constitute an “attack” rather than pushback? I’m not trying to be clever, I just can’t see anything like that. > [@Poor Things - movie. Open spoilers after first post](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/poor-things-movie-open-spoilers-after-first-post/996425/27): > > I didn’t realize filmmakers can only make movies about characters exactly like themselves. Don’t know why one person’s poor review “confirms” anything about this film. There are also hundreds of reviewers calling it one of the best films of the year. But I guess cause JohnT hated it, that confirms it’s crap. mis-states her opinion to mock it > [@Poor Things - movie. Open spoilers after first post](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/poor-things-movie-open-spoilers-after-first-post/996425/36): > > What is a bit much is for someone who has not seen it to have a strong opinion about it, based mostly on the fact that men are writing and directing the strong yes strong roles for women. And an opinion on a MB that “confirms” their suspicion about it. > > Have you gone ahead and review bombed it on Rotten Tomatoes? Objects to her having a “strong” opinion, and suggests she is engaged in review-bombing. ---
**Author:** ![Babale](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/babale/32/15666_2.png) [@Babale](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Babale)\ **Post date:** [February 5, 2024, 6:56pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/misogyny-and-pop-culture-dont-yuck-my-yum-spoilers-for-the-movie-poor-things/997107/144 "2024-02-05T18:56:56Z")
> [@Kimstu](#): > > Easily. For example, the strong connections between the porn industry and lots of dubiously legal forms of sex work, among other factors, mean that women working in porn are very often exploited and abused. Great, I agree with you, but _that is very clearly not why the poster we are discussing objects to porn_. If it was, they would have said something like “the porn industry is really shady and lots of women get hurt”, rather than “all porn is inherently harmful to all women”. > [@Kimstu](#): > > Condemning the production and consumption of porn on those grounds Is totally valid, but not what was done here. > [@Kimstu](#): > > doesn’t automatically mean that the critic in question believes that “sex is bad” or “women who like sex are bad” or “sex is inherently defiling to women” or any other of your “puritanical” caricatures. And yet, the poster in question did us the favor of clarifying that yes, that’s exactly what she meant: > [@Beckdawrek](#): > > Porn stars are not the same thing at all. All you men know this. It’s made for one thing. Common knowledge. We all know it. Clearly, her objection to porn stems from the fact that someone might… oh, the horror, _the horror_, I can’t bear to say it! Someone might (_egads!_) _pleasure themselves_ while watching the porn! 😮 and clearly that is evil and wrong. ---
**Author:** ![Riemann](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/riemann/32/3133_2.png) [@Riemann](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Riemann)\ **Post date:** [February 5, 2024, 6:57pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/misogyny-and-pop-culture-dont-yuck-my-yum-spoilers-for-the-movie-poor-things/997107/145 "2024-02-05T18:57:41Z")
> [@Beckdawrek](#): > > 5 men. Five. Responded to my post about **my** opinion pornography is a horrible thing for women. > That’s what mansplaining is. I’d have more sympathy for this perspective if your own opinion weren’t so dismissive and full of moral certainty. If it helps, it would take me about ten minutes to line up half a dozen women friends and relatives who would would explain to you in equally impolite terms why your view of this is full of shit. ---
**Author:** ![Kimstu](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/k/ecd19e/32.png) [@Kimstu](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Kimstu)\ **Post date:** [February 5, 2024, 6:59pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/misogyny-and-pop-culture-dont-yuck-my-yum-spoilers-for-the-movie-poor-things/997107/146 "2024-02-05T18:59:17Z")
> [@Babale](#): > > Clearly, her objection to porn stems from the fact that someone might… oh, the horror, _the horror_, I can’t bear to say it! Someone might (_egads!_) _pleasure themselves_ while watching the porn! 😮 and clearly that is evil and wrong. Wait a second. You think that Beck is saying that she opposes porn because she believes that masturbation, in and of itself, “is evil and wrong”? That wasn’t my impression. But I’ll leave it up to Beck to clarify that position, if she so chooses. ---
**Author:** ![Babale](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/babale/32/15666_2.png) [@Babale](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Babale)\ **Post date:** [February 5, 2024, 7:05pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/misogyny-and-pop-culture-dont-yuck-my-yum-spoilers-for-the-movie-poor-things/997107/147 "2024-02-05T19:05:11Z")
> [@Kimstu](#): > > Wait a second. You think that Beck is saying that she opposes porn because she believes that masturbation, in and of itself, “is evil and wrong”? Well, yes. Or no - I don’t know if she thinks _masturbation_ is evil and wrong, but she clearly thinks that if a woman allows video of her to be used for that purpose, she is doing something wrong, allowing herself to be defiled. I have no idea how else to interpret these parts of her post: > [@Beckdawrek](#): > > I believe all porn is bad. Men, women, gay, straight, group. All. > If they stopped making it today and forevermore, I promise you guys won’t run out of the crap to look at. So stop worrying. > [@Beckdawrek](#): > > Porn stars are not the same thing at all. All you men know this. **It’s made for one thing.** Common knowledge. We all know it. Emphasis mine. > [@Beckdawrek](#): > > I know for certain, absolutely certain I won’t be watching Only fans stuff. I think it’s a bad look for women and doesn’t help anyone but the people who own the website. It’s degrading and stupid. That is my opinion and I stand by it. > > **All porn is horrible for women as a whole.** Again, emphasis mine. I don’t know if Beck frowns upon a man masturbating to his own imagination, but she is clearly offended by the idea of a man masturbating to images of a real woman, and views this as harmful to the woman (and more than that, harmful in a way that makes it bad to make porn even if a woman says “I am willing to bear this cost in exchange for payment”). ---
**Author:** ![Hamlet](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/hamlet/32/2818_2.png) [@Hamlet](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Hamlet)\ **Post date:** [February 5, 2024, 7:10pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/misogyny-and-pop-culture-dont-yuck-my-yum-spoilers-for-the-movie-poor-things/997107/148 "2024-02-05T19:10:33Z")
> [@Eonwe](#): > > I don’t get why this is difficult, or why this idea that “you have to see it to express a thought about it” is so pervasive. Feel free to have an opinion on a film and express it. And I, and many others, are free to question the basis or completely dismiss said opinion, because you haven’t seen the fucking movie. The credibility I, or someone else, give your opinion will be based at least in part, on your basis of knowledge about the topic. And not seeing the movie makes your opinion of very little consequence to me. YMMV, of course. ---
**Author:** ![pulykamell](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/pulykamell/32/3166_2.png) [@pulykamell](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/pulykamell)\ **Post date:** [February 5, 2024, 7:10pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/misogyny-and-pop-culture-dont-yuck-my-yum-spoilers-for-the-movie-poor-things/997107/149 "2024-02-05T19:10:59Z")
Brazil is one of my absolute favorites. Stuff like that, Delicatessen, Man Bites Dog, Eraserhead, Being John Malkovich, anything by the Coens, Jarmush, Lynch, all good stuff. ---
**Author:** ![chela](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/chela/32/21582_2.png) [@chela](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/chela)\ **Post date:** [February 5, 2024, 7:11pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/misogyny-and-pop-culture-dont-yuck-my-yum-spoilers-for-the-movie-poor-things/997107/150 "2024-02-05T19:11:31Z")
I haven’t seen it. I understand the cinematography and costuming are excellent. But so far I get that it’s about a beautiful woman creature with the innocence and intellectual maturity of an infant who is pursued by men because they want to fuck her (because men prefer infantilized women?)and they fuck her over and over again until the woman child learns to like it a lot is not a movie theme that I would find appealing or empowering. What am I missing? ---
**Author:** ![Whack-a-Mole](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/whack-a-mole/32/141_2.png) [@Whack-a-Mole](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Whack-a-Mole)\ **Post date:** [February 5, 2024, 7:12pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/misogyny-and-pop-culture-dont-yuck-my-yum-spoilers-for-the-movie-poor-things/997107/151 "2024-02-05T19:12:22Z")
> [@chela](#): > > What am I missing? She fucks them because she likes it. She is not taught this by anyone. She likes fucking…so she does it. She also really likes lesbian sex. ---
**Author:** ![Hamlet](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/hamlet/32/2818_2.png) [@Hamlet](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Hamlet)\ **Post date:** [February 5, 2024, 7:12pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/misogyny-and-pop-culture-dont-yuck-my-yum-spoilers-for-the-movie-poor-things/997107/152 "2024-02-05T19:12:51Z")
> [@chela](#): > > What am I missing? The part where you say you haven’t seen it. ---
**Author:** ![Cheesesteak](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/cheesesteak/32/3694_2.png) [@Cheesesteak](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Cheesesteak)\ **Post date:** [February 5, 2024, 7:19pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/misogyny-and-pop-culture-dont-yuck-my-yum-spoilers-for-the-movie-poor-things/997107/153 "2024-02-05T19:19:43Z")
> [@Whack-a-Mole](#): > > She fucks them because she likes it. She is not taught this by anyone. She likes fucking…so she does it. She also really likes lesbian sex. This DOES sound like a thought provoking cinematic experience. ---
**Author:** ![Riemann](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/riemann/32/3133_2.png) [@Riemann](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Riemann)\ **Post date:** [February 5, 2024, 7:19pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/misogyny-and-pop-culture-dont-yuck-my-yum-spoilers-for-the-movie-poor-things/997107/154 "2024-02-05T19:19:49Z")
> [@puzzlegal](#): > > mis-states her opinion to mock it > > Objects to her having a “strong” opinion, and suggests she is engaged in review-bombing If the only substance here is that the tone of those replies constitutes an “attack”, I think this is a weak pitting. The only way I can see coming to that perspective would be if there were widespread consensus that the film is heavily misogynistic and should be boycotted. Looking around at other perspectives online, it’s controversial but I’m not getting that sense at all. I feel OP is viewing this through a lens of misogynists resisting her efforts to call out misogyny, but that’s assuming a conclusion that is neither in evidence nor widely held. When there _is_ no consensus, cherry-picking third party opinions without having seen it yourself does seem kind of weak to me. ---
**Author:** ![Whack-a-Mole](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/whack-a-mole/32/141_2.png) [@Whack-a-Mole](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Whack-a-Mole)\ **Post date:** [February 5, 2024, 7:20pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/misogyny-and-pop-culture-dont-yuck-my-yum-spoilers-for-the-movie-poor-things/997107/155 "2024-02-05T19:20:44Z")
Fair enough but a LOT of context is missing. ---
**Author:** ![Beckdawrek](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/beckdawrek/32/3647_2.png) [@Beckdawrek](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Beckdawrek)\ **Post date:** [February 5, 2024, 7:22pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/misogyny-and-pop-culture-dont-yuck-my-yum-spoilers-for-the-movie-poor-things/997107/156 "2024-02-05T19:22:02Z")
I dislike porn because it objectifies women(and people) of being the impossible sex toy. Real women can’t have sex for hours upon hours and just love it over and over and look so beautiful after 5 men have abused, fucked and done every imaginable thing to degrade her body. And then more men come in and do it to her. Rinse and Repeat. Pornography teaches young men this is how it’s gonna be. And it’s not that way in real life. We are all adults here. We know this. Don’t say you don’t. I **DO NOT** care if you masturbate to your hearts content. Go do you. ---
**Author:** ![Beckdawrek](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/beckdawrek/32/3647_2.png) [@Beckdawrek](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Beckdawrek)\ **Post date:** [February 5, 2024, 7:24pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/misogyny-and-pop-culture-dont-yuck-my-yum-spoilers-for-the-movie-poor-things/997107/157 "2024-02-05T19:24:47Z")
Oh, goody. My god Maybe I don’t wanna see this movie. ---
**Author:** ![DSeid](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/dseid/32/20194_2.png) [@DSeid](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/DSeid)\ **Post date:** [February 5, 2024, 7:24pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/misogyny-and-pop-culture-dont-yuck-my-yum-spoilers-for-the-movie-poor-things/997107/158 "2024-02-05T19:24:51Z")
The entirety of a very complicated movie. ---
**Author:** ![DSeid](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/dseid/32/20194_2.png) [@DSeid](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/DSeid)\ **Post date:** [February 5, 2024, 7:29pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/misogyny-and-pop-culture-dont-yuck-my-yum-spoilers-for-the-movie-poor-things/997107/159 "2024-02-05T19:29:51Z")
> [@Riemann](#): > > If the only substance here is that the tone of those replies constitutes an “attack”, Well I am weak at attacks. Yeah my understanding possibly misunderstanding of review bombing is post a negative review without having seen something because you have heard from others about it being against some cultural value you have. I created a separate thread to clarify my understanding on that but to me that is exactly what was happening. To me I was describing the behavior of declaring with confidence how sexist and misogynistic the movie was, in a very sarcastic manner, based on what she has heard. ---
**Author:** ![Babale](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/babale/32/15666_2.png) [@Babale](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Babale)\ **Post date:** [February 5, 2024, 7:34pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/misogyny-and-pop-culture-dont-yuck-my-yum-spoilers-for-the-movie-poor-things/997107/160 "2024-02-05T19:34:05Z")
> [@Beckdawrek](#): > > I dislike porn because it objectifies women(and people) of being the impossible sex toy. Real women can’t have sex for hours upon hours and just love it over and over and look so beautiful after 5 men have abused, fucked and done every imaginable thing to degrade her body. And then more men come in and do it to her. Rinse and Repeat. Awesome! These are real objections that we can discuss, unlike blanket statements like the ones you made earlier. So, porn thar depicts unrealistic sex is bad because it creates an unrealistic standard. But you said that _ALL_ porn is horrible for women. Are you aware that porn is _not_ all “six dudes take turns pounding the crap put of some girl for a couple hours”? Is porn that doesn’t fit into that category OK? [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/misogyny-and-pop-culture-dont-yuck-my-yum-spoilers-for-the-movie-poor-things/997107.md?page=7) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/misogyny-and-pop-culture-dont-yuck-my-yum-spoilers-for-the-movie-poor-things/997107.md?page=9)