# Mistakes in classic literature
**URL:** https://boards.straightdope.com/t/mistakes-in-classic-literature/244227
**Category:** Cafe Society
**Created:** [May 8, 2004, 9:43pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/mistakes-in-classic-literature/244227 "2004-05-08T21:43:29Z")
**Posts on this page:** 20
**Page:** 6
### Author:  [@Manatee](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Manatee)
#### Post date: [February 10, 2006, 11:21pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/mistakes-in-classic-literature/244227/101 "2006-02-10T23:21:36Z")
> [@Annie-Xmas](#):
>
> Robert Lewis Stevenson’s “Dr. Jeckyl and Mr. Hyde” starts out at 3:00 a.m. in February. Mr. Hyde knocks down a child and a crowd gathers.
>
> Why all these people were out on the street at 3:00 a.m. in February is never explained.
I seem to recall that the girl was sent out to fetch a doctor (or medicine). A little odd, yes, but not totally perplexing.
The crowd is drawn to her cries after she’s trampled by Hyde. I’m even more willing to buy this one.
---
### Author:  [@Tracy\_Lord](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Tracy_Lord)
#### Post date: [February 10, 2006, 11:23pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/mistakes-in-classic-literature/244227/102 "2006-02-10T23:23:26Z")
Y’all realize this thread is almost two years old, right?
---
### Author:  [@NAF1138](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/NAF1138)
#### Post date: [February 10, 2006, 11:59pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/mistakes-in-classic-literature/244227/103 "2006-02-10T23:59:28Z")
Well, since this thread has already been zombied:
It annoys me to no end that there are whole chapters in Moby Dick dedicated to “proving” that whales are fish.
---
### Author:  [@commasense](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/commasense)
#### Post date: [February 11, 2006, 5:29am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/mistakes-in-classic-literature/244227/104 "2006-02-11T05:29:43Z")
I just read Conan Doyle’s first Sherlock Holmes story, _A Study in Scarlet_, last nght. The second part, which takes place during the Mormon migration to Utah, starts:
> [@Arthur Conan Doyle](#):
>
> In the central portion of the great North American Continent there lies an arid and repulsive desert, which for many a long year served as a barrier against the advance of civilization. From the Sierra Nevada to Nebraska and from the Yellowstone River in the north to the Colorado upon the south, is a region of desolation and silence.
He goes on to describe a region consisting of the entire states of Nevada, Utah, Wyoming, and Colorado as a completely barren and empty alkali desert.
He also says some fairly unpleasant things about the Mormons, for which he later apologized, according to the notes to my edition.
---
### Author:  [@Walloon](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Walloon)
#### Post date: [February 11, 2006, 7:41am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/mistakes-in-classic-literature/244227/105 "2006-02-11T07:41:08Z")
> [@Annie-Xmas](#):
>
> Robert Lewis Stevenson’s “Dr. Jeckyl and Mr. Hyde” starts out at 3:00 a.m. in February. Mr. Hyde knocks down a child and a crowd gathers.
>
> Why all these people were out on the street at 3:00 a.m. in February is never explained.
[Robert Louis Stevenson](http://www.bibliomania.com/0/0/46/86/frameset.html):
> [@](#):
>
> The people who had turned out were the girl’s own family . . .
He never mentions what month it was, just that it was winter.
---
### Author:  [@crowmanyclouds](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/crowmanyclouds)
#### Post date: [February 11, 2006, 10:12am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/mistakes-in-classic-literature/244227/106 "2006-02-11T10:12:46Z")
> [@DiggitCamara](#):
>
> or… they could turn them around…
You got a magnifying glass that doesn’t magnifying when ya flip it over? 🆒
---
### Author:  [@Chronos](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Chronos)
#### Post date: [February 12, 2006, 11:02pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/mistakes-in-classic-literature/244227/107 "2006-02-12T23:02:41Z")
Quoth **Biffy the Elephant Shrew** :
> [@](#):
>
> Nah. “Or like Balboa” would have scanned just fine in place of “Or like stout Cortez.”
Maybe I’m just mispronouncing my conquistadors, but it seems to me that those two lines would have the stresses in different places, which if anything is more important than just the count of syllables. I would put the stress on the second syllable in “Balboa”, but on the last syllable in “Cortez”. Can any Spanish speakers confirm?
---
### Author:  [@Tyrrell\_McAllister](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Tyrrell_McAllister)
#### Post date: [February 13, 2006, 3:00am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/mistakes-in-classic-literature/244227/108 "2006-02-13T03:00:31Z")
Samual Butler pointed out an error in his translation of Homer’s _Iliad_. When Odysseus and Diomed are returning to the Achaean camp with the stolen horses at the end of Book X, Odysseus gives an incorrect count of the number of soldiers they killed. Butler writes, “The greater a poet is the more certainly will he dispise small inaccuracies.”
---
### Author:  [@Biffy\_the\_Elephant\_Shrew](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Biffy_the_Elephant_Shrew)
#### Post date: [February 14, 2006, 2:38pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/mistakes-in-classic-literature/244227/109 "2006-02-14T14:38:26Z")
> [@Chronos](#):
>
> Maybe I’m just mispronouncing my conquistadors, but it seems to me that those two lines would have the stresses in different places, which if anything is more important than just the count of syllables. I would put the stress on the second syllable in “Balboa”, but on the last syllable in “Cortez”. Can any Spanish speakers confirm?
Correct or not, the meter of the poem clearly places the stress on the first syllable of “Cortez”: “Or **like** stout **Cor** tez **when** with **ea** gle **eye** …”
---
### Author:  [@pseudotriton\_ruber\_ruber](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/pseudotriton_ruber_ruber)
#### Post date: [February 15, 2006, 12:02am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/mistakes-in-classic-literature/244227/110 "2006-02-15T00:02:46Z")
You’ve got some further understanding of metrics to do, I’m afraid. That makes almost no sense.
---
### Author:  [@saoirse](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/saoirse)
#### Post date: [February 15, 2006, 12:11am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/mistakes-in-classic-literature/244227/111 "2006-02-15T00:11:02Z")
> [@Peter Morris](#):
>
> Not at all. His wife calls him James. Now, We know that his name is John H. Watson, and he has Scottish ancestry, so obviously his middle name is Hamish, which is equivalent to James.
Or perhaps James is the name of the Coal Man. Holmes notices, of course, but does not wish to say anything to Watson.
---
### Author:  [@Biffy\_the\_Elephant\_Shrew](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Biffy_the_Elephant_Shrew)
#### Post date: [February 15, 2006, 1:10am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/mistakes-in-classic-literature/244227/112 "2006-02-15T01:10:52Z")
> [@pseudotriton ruber ruber](#):
>
> You’ve got some further understanding of metrics to do, I’m afraid. That makes almost no sense.
Ever heard of iambic pentameter, **prr**?
---
### Author:  [@pseudotriton\_ruber\_ruber](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/pseudotriton_ruber_ruber)
#### Post date: [February 15, 2006, 1:30am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/mistakes-in-classic-literature/244227/113 "2006-02-15T01:30:16Z")
Somewhere in the course of my thirty years as a published poet, I’ve come across the term, yes. I don’t want to give a course in metrics here and now, although I’ve done it in the past, but I did mean what I said about your need to understand metrics much better before spouting off on them.
Simply, iambic pentameter is NOT simply five unstressed/stressed feet. It’s much more subtle, and much less mechanical than that. Your reading of Keats’s metrics makes him out to be an untaught baboon, metrically speaking, and he was anything but that.
If you want to find out about metrics, I’d be glad to tell you where to start, but this isn’t the thread about that, and I suspect you’re satisfied with your “knowledge” and won’t be craving any further learning for a while. If you start another thread on metrics, I’ll be glad to participate.
---
### Author:  [@Biffy\_the\_Elephant\_Shrew](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Biffy_the_Elephant_Shrew)
#### Post date: [February 15, 2006, 2:02am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/mistakes-in-classic-literature/244227/114 "2006-02-15T02:02:58Z")
Newt-boy, your condescension is insulting and unhelpful, so stuff it. If you have something to say that’s relevant to the words in question, try saying it instead of just posturing. It is obvious from the poem where Keats had the name stressed–on the first syllable.
As for the “correct” pronunciation of the name, my dictionary lists both cor-tez’ and cor’-tez as pronunciations, and Cortés and Cortez as spellings . The rule of thumb in modern Spanish–I know, not that relevant in the case of a guy who lived 500 years ago–is that words ending in consonants other than n or s are stressed on the last syllable, but some of the most common surnames in Spanish, such as López, Gómez, and González (all commonly spelled without accent marks) are exceptions. FWIW, I have usually heard it as Cor-TEZ.
---
### Author:  [@pseudotriton\_ruber\_ruber](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/pseudotriton_ruber_ruber)
#### Post date: [February 15, 2006, 2:06am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/mistakes-in-classic-literature/244227/115 "2006-02-15T02:06:55Z")
As I said, when you’re ready to learn, you’ll learn. You’re not ready.
---
### Author:  [@betenoir](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/betenoir)
#### Post date: [February 15, 2006, 5:53pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/mistakes-in-classic-literature/244227/116 "2006-02-15T17:53:54Z")
> [@Peter Morris](#):
>
> Talking of Shakespeare, the scene where Hamlet meets the ghost of his father starts at midnight, there’s a few minutes of dialog, and ends as dawn is breaking.
To be honest that one that always got me about Hamlet is he agonzes over what happenes after death…after seeing his father and having him explain what happens after death!!!
“From whose bourne no traveler returnes?” Ummm…
---
### Author:  [@DocCathode](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/DocCathode)
#### Post date: [February 15, 2006, 6:06pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/mistakes-in-classic-literature/244227/117 "2006-02-15T18:06:35Z")
> [@Biffy the Elephant Shrew](#):
>
> As for the “correct” pronunciation of the name, my dictionary lists both cor-tez’ and cor’-tez as pronunciations, and Cortés and Cortez as spellings . The rule of thumb in modern Spanish–I know, not that relevant in the case of a guy who lived 500 years ago–is that words ending in consonants other than n or s are stressed on the last syllable, but some of the most common surnames in Spanish, such as López, Gómez, and González (all commonly spelled without accent marks) are exceptions. FWIW, I have usually heard it as Cor-TEZ.
OTTOMH Didn’t Byron write a poem which requires Don Juan to be pronounced as Don Joo-ahn? Modern or proper pronunciation is utterly irrelevant.
---
### Author:  [@betenoir](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/betenoir)
#### Post date: [February 15, 2006, 10:44pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/mistakes-in-classic-literature/244227/118 "2006-02-15T22:44:59Z")
> [@betenoir](#):
>
> To be honest that one that always got me about Hamlet is he agonzes over what happenes after death…after seeing his father and having him explain what happens after death!!!
> “From whose bourne no traveler returnes?” Ummm…
Oh for the the love of… :smack: . I Just realized not only did someone make this comment in this thread before…IT WAS MADE BY ME!
Well give me a break, it was two years ago.
And I still think it’s a relavent point, dammit.
---
### Author:  [@pseudotriton\_ruber\_ruber](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/pseudotriton_ruber_ruber)
#### Post date: [February 16, 2006, 1:08am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/mistakes-in-classic-literature/244227/119 "2006-02-16T01:08:16Z")
> [@DocCathode](#):
>
> OTTOMH Didn’t Byron write a poem which requires Don Juan to be pronounced as Don Joo-ahn? Modern or proper pronunciation is utterly irrelevant.
Yes, the poem is called “Don Juan,” and Byron rhymes it with “true one” and “new one” very early, so there’s no mistake. He also rhymes “Guadalquivir” with “river,” so it’s no use to apply modern Spanish pronunciation here. It’s also perhaps my favorite poem, ever.
---
### Author:  [@C\_K\_Dexter\_Haven](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/C_K_Dexter_Haven)
#### Post date: [February 16, 2006, 11:28am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/mistakes-in-classic-literature/244227/120 "2006-02-16T11:28:07Z")
**pseudotriton** and **Biffy** : this is official Moderator Order to cease and desist. Personal insults are NOT permitted in Cafe Society. **Pseudo** , it looks like you started it, but I don’t really care who started it. You’re both stopping it, as of … 5 …4…3…2…1 NOW.
We clear on this?
[Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/mistakes-in-classic-literature/244227.md?page=5)
[Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/mistakes-in-classic-literature/244227.md?page=7)