# MJ Lied about Preventing Isiah Thomas Being on the Dream Team **URL:** \ **Category:** The Game Room\ **Created:** [May 27, 2020, 11:31am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/mj-lied-about-preventing-isiah-thomas-being-on-the-dream-team/854536 "2020-05-27T11:31:15Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 1
**Author:** ![MortSahlFan](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/3bc359/32.png) [@MortSahlFan](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/MortSahlFan)\ **Post date:** [May 27, 2020, 11:31am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/mj-lied-about-preventing-isiah-thomas-being-on-the-dream-team/854536/1 "2020-05-27T11:31:15Z")
So much for that “Last Dance” interview. There was audio just released of him specifically saying that, speaking to Rod Thorn (who also drafted MJ). But I doubt the media pushes back against MJ - they know where the bread and butter is at. I highly doubt MJ even replies to this lie, even though he’s on audio. ---
**Author:** ![Chronos](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/chronos/32/134_2.png) [@Chronos](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Chronos)\ **Post date:** [May 27, 2020, 12:37pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/mj-lied-about-preventing-isiah-thomas-being-on-the-dream-team/854536/2 "2020-05-27T12:37:57Z")
“MJ” is Michael Jordan? And what was the lie that he told, and what, so far as we can tell, is the truth? What was the “Last Dance” interview? He specifically said what? Is there any link we can follow for more information? C’mon, give us something to work with, here. ---
**Author:** ![MortSahlFan](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/3bc359/32.png) [@MortSahlFan](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/MortSahlFan)\ **Post date:** [May 27, 2020, 12:55pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/mj-lied-about-preventing-isiah-thomas-being-on-the-dream-team/854536/3 "2020-05-27T12:55:49Z")
> [@Chronos](#): > > “MJ” is Michael Jordan? And what was the lie that he told, and what, so far as we can tell, is the truth? What was the “Last Dance” interview? He specifically said what? Is there any link we can follow for more information? > > C’mon, give us something to work with, here. I thought anyone who watched the NBA knew all that… “The Last Dance” was a documentary on Michael Jordan. For 30 years, MJ has said he never had anything to do with Isiah Thomas not being selected to the Dream Team, 1992 Olympics. Every few years he (MJ) says the same thing, and he did on the documentary again. Jack McCallum had a 2011 tape of Jordan (just heard it again on ESPN) specifically saying "I talked to Rod (Thorn) and said “I’m not going to play if Isiah is on the team”, and still gets a free pass. Rod Thorn was in charge of the Player Selection Committee, but he also drafted Michael Jordan when he was the General Manager of the Chicago Bulls. ---
**Author:** ![Snarky\_Kong](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/a183cd/32.png) [@Snarky\_Kong](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Snarky_Kong)\ **Post date:** [May 27, 2020, 1:03pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/mj-lied-about-preventing-isiah-thomas-being-on-the-dream-team/854536/4 "2020-05-27T13:03:54Z")
The media won’t go against Jordan, but you heard it on ESPN? Hmm. ---
**Author:** ![MortSahlFan](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/3bc359/32.png) [@MortSahlFan](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/MortSahlFan)\ **Post date:** [May 27, 2020, 1:15pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/mj-lied-about-preventing-isiah-thomas-being-on-the-dream-team/854536/5 "2020-05-27T13:15:23Z")
> [@Snarky\_Kong](#): > > The media won’t go against Jordan, but you heard it on ESPN? Hmm. Yes, they played the audio clip of MJ, but then ignored most of it, and put the trash on Isiah, without explaining a few things. The host, Greenburg, said “This bad blood starts out with MJ’s rookie year when Isiah froze him out from the all-star game.” – not true, but to a casual fan listening, you’d think it was. Then they go on and on about the Pistons not shaking hands with the Bulls, but they don’t say how MJ called them “undeserving champions” before Game 4, and how the Pistons were bad for basketball, and criticizing the city of Detroit… They didn’t mention the Celtics walking off without shaking hands. Hell, the Pistons (Adrian Dantley) was on the FT line when the Celtics walked off. ---
**Author:** ![Bullitt](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/bullitt/32/5725_2.png) [@Bullitt](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Bullitt)\ **Post date:** [May 27, 2020, 2:33pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/mj-lied-about-preventing-isiah-thomas-being-on-the-dream-team/854536/6 "2020-05-27T14:33:44Z")
The documentary was great. Yes of course MJ said he wouldn’t play if Isiah Thomas was on the team. Also, the 30-for-30 show about the 1992 Dream Team was excellent. (I believe it was a 30-for-30) ---
**Author:** ![BeagleJesus](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/5daacb/32.png) [@BeagleJesus](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/BeagleJesus)\ **Post date:** [May 27, 2020, 3:37pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/mj-lied-about-preventing-isiah-thomas-being-on-the-dream-team/854536/7 "2020-05-27T15:37:00Z")
I was under the impression that everyone knew MJ was the reason Isiah didn’t make The Dream Team. Isiah and the Bad Boys literally beat the shit out of Mike in the late 80s/early 90s. And that is _not_ an exaggeration. THEY.BEAT.HIS.ASS over the course of 3-4 years. According to John Salley their goal was to put him on the floor before he had an opportunity to jump, because if you let him jump “he ain’t human.” I don’t care if he implied it, hinted at it, stated it explicitly or remained silent. Jordan _was_ the reason Isiah didn’t make the team and _everyone_ on the team and within USA basketball was cool with that decision and no one has regretted since. ---
**Author:** ![BeagleJesus](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/5daacb/32.png) [@BeagleJesus](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/BeagleJesus)\ **Post date:** [May 27, 2020, 3:40pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/mj-lied-about-preventing-isiah-thomas-being-on-the-dream-team/854536/8 "2020-05-27T15:40:05Z")
> [@Bullitt](#): > > The documentary was great. Yes of course MJ said he wouldn’t play if Isiah Thomas was on the team. > > Also, the 30-for-30 show about the 1992 Dream Team was excellent. (I believe it was a 30-for-30) The Last Dance was an excellent trip down memory lane. Highly recommended for basketball fans and (IMHO) required watching for any and everyone who mistakenly thinks Lebron belongs in the debate over who is the GOAT. ---
**Author:** ![MortSahlFan](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/3bc359/32.png) [@MortSahlFan](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/MortSahlFan)\ **Post date:** [May 27, 2020, 4:26pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/mj-lied-about-preventing-isiah-thomas-being-on-the-dream-team/854536/9 "2020-05-27T16:26:06Z")
> [@BeagleJesus](#): > > and _everyone_ on the team and within USA basketball was cool with that decision and no one has regretted since. If anyone wasn’t cool with it, they would never dare to say it, in fear of MJ’s power… But also, it would be counter-productive to them. Isiah not having a spot gave them a spot. ---
**Author:** ![BeagleJesus](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/5daacb/32.png) [@BeagleJesus](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/BeagleJesus)\ **Post date:** [May 27, 2020, 5:00pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/mj-lied-about-preventing-isiah-thomas-being-on-the-dream-team/854536/10 "2020-05-27T17:00:40Z")
> [@MortSahlFan](#): > > If anyone wasn’t cool with it, they would never dare to say it, in fear of MJ’s power… But also, it would be counter-productive to them. Isiah not having a spot gave them a spot. Yeah, that and the fact that most of the guys just didn’t like Isiah. The Pistons made a lot of enemies on their way to 2 championships. ---
**Author:** ![Chronos](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/chronos/32/134_2.png) [@Chronos](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Chronos)\ **Post date:** [May 27, 2020, 5:21pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/mj-lied-about-preventing-isiah-thomas-being-on-the-dream-team/854536/11 "2020-05-27T17:21:36Z")
Could it be that Jordan really did say that, but that enough other folks also said similar things that, even without Jordan’s say, Thomas still wouldn’t have made the team? If that’s the case, then Jordan could truthfully say that he didn’t prevent Thomas from being on the team. ---
**Author:** ![MortSahlFan](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/3bc359/32.png) [@MortSahlFan](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/MortSahlFan)\ **Post date:** [May 27, 2020, 5:33pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/mj-lied-about-preventing-isiah-thomas-being-on-the-dream-team/854536/12 "2020-05-27T17:33:02Z")
> [@BeagleJesus](#): > > Yeah, that and the fact that most of the guys just didn’t like Isiah. The Pistons made a lot of enemies on their way to 2 championships. “Most of the guys didn’t like Isiah”. That is straight from Wilbon’s reporting, which he had to retract less than 24 hours later after he said how players called him to say that wasn’t true… The media seems to nit-pick. Even with MJ’s own voice, his own audio, saying the exact OPPOSITE thing he said compared to the latest documentary, no one called him a liar and piled on… The best the media could say is, “Well, we all assumed this”, but even in the past, media personalities wouldn’t say that. I like that ESPN have a few players talk, but they’re all from this era. There are many articular guys who played in the 80s… Speaking of the 80s, they have replayed a ton of old games, including many Pistons games, and I didn’t see anything out of the norm. People only seem shocked now because the NBA is so soft, and you know they capitalize on a few highlights over and over. James Worthy said if any team was dirty, it was the Celtics. There were a lot of teams that played tough. Laimbeer went over the line a few times - that shouldn’t be Isiah’s fault. Magic retired, and Larry;s last year was 91-92… I watched the to shows on ESPN. Again, someone mentions “hand-shake” but they don’t mention why they didn’t (and it wasn’t revealed until the Bad Boys 30 for 30 that LAIMBEER orchestrated that)… They don’t mention the Celtics not shaking hands. And if anyone ever mentions it, they never say “Larry Bird didn’t shake hands with Isiah Thomas”… No mention of the MJ disrespecting the Pistons right before Game 4, calling Detroit a bad team, city, the Pistons as undeserving champions. I don’t care about the Dream Team that much (and sports isn’t life or death), but I do care about the hypocrisy, and the lack of journalistic integrity, as well as sports-talk. Why not mention that Isiah beat MJ, Magic, and Bird more than they beat him? If you have so-called experts on TV, then have them make the proper points, instead of bringing on guys who have a bias, or guys who know the “right” side and the “wrong” side. The Establishment. The Pistons beat the Bulls, Celtics, and Lakers in their first championship. By the time the Bulls won, the Lakers, Celtics, and Pistons were done, and Jordan didn’t have to go through that same competition. They even changed the rules for MJ! Now, the league is so soft, you can’t even breathe on a guy, and the flopper is constantly rewarded (Jim Harden). Here’s another thing they should have mentioned. Why was Isiah Thomas the players’ President (unanimously) from 1988-1994. He won most of the battles, including more revenue for the players, and a 3% reduction from agent to player that MJ and every other player enjoyed. MJ’s own teammates talked about MJ’s short-comings as a teammate and a person. All of Isiah’s teammates love him. ---
**Author:** ![BeagleJesus](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/5daacb/32.png) [@BeagleJesus](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/BeagleJesus)\ **Post date:** [May 27, 2020, 5:33pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/mj-lied-about-preventing-isiah-thomas-being-on-the-dream-team/854536/13 "2020-05-27T17:33:24Z")
> [@Chronos](#): > > Could it be that Jordan really did say that, but that enough other folks also said similar things that, even without Jordan’s say, Thomas still wouldn’t have made the team? If that’s the case, then Jordan could truthfully say that he didn’t prevent Thomas from being on the team. That sounds pretty close to the story Jordan has told over the past couple of decades. _He_ didn’t say Isiah’s name but somebody obviously did for him to get snubbed. ---
**Author:** ![BlankSlate](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/blankslate/32/80_2.png) [@BlankSlate](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/BlankSlate)\ **Post date:** [May 27, 2020, 6:14pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/mj-lied-about-preventing-isiah-thomas-being-on-the-dream-team/854536/14 "2020-05-27T18:14:28Z")
You know what else is interesting? Michael Jordan, who is reportedly worth $2.1 billion, ‘only’ earned around $93 million in salary over the course of his NBA career. ---
**Author:** ![gdave](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/gdave/32/3683_2.png) [@gdave](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/gdave)\ **Post date:** [May 27, 2020, 6:49pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/mj-lied-about-preventing-isiah-thomas-being-on-the-dream-team/854536/15 "2020-05-27T18:49:56Z")
As to the media “pushing back” against Michael Jordan: I don’t have ESPN, so I can’t comment on what commentators have said on their programming. But Horace Grant’s claim that MJ lied in “Last Dance” was all over my news feed for days. Sam Smith’s claim that MJ lied in “Last Dance” was all over my news feed for days. Reporting about MJ apparently lying about keeping IT off of the “Dream Team” has been all over my news feed for days. This is a _28 year old_ beef between players who’ve both been retired for over _20 years_, and it’s still a top story for many sports news outlets. From my perspective, there’s been a _lot_ of media pushback against MJ. This would be like a 2020 documentary on the 49ers of the 80s and early 90s resulting in extensive media coverage re-examining claims of Joe Montana undermining Steve Young. It’s a fairly ridiculous amount of coverage of a dispute that’s utterly irrelevant to current sports, except that there are no current sports, and there’s a lot of column inches and airtime to fill, so here we are. ---
**Author:** ![MortSahlFan](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/3bc359/32.png) [@MortSahlFan](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/MortSahlFan)\ **Post date:** [May 27, 2020, 7:03pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/mj-lied-about-preventing-isiah-thomas-being-on-the-dream-team/854536/16 "2020-05-27T19:03:12Z")
> [@BlankSlate](#): > > You know what else is interesting? Michael Jordan, who is reportedly worth $2.1 billion, ‘only’ earned around $93 million in salary over the course of his NBA career. That is very remarkable. I’m guessing a majority came from Nike. ---
**Author:** ![Loach](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/loach/32/350_2.png) [@Loach](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Loach)\ **Post date:** [May 27, 2020, 8:04pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/mj-lied-about-preventing-isiah-thomas-being-on-the-dream-team/854536/17 "2020-05-27T20:04:05Z")
> [@BeagleJesus](#): > > The Last Dance was an excellent trip down memory lane. Highly recommended for basketball fans and (IMHO) required watching for any and everyone who mistakenly thinks Lebron belongs in the debate over who is the GOAT. Since Jordan controlled what was in the show it’s not exactly surprising that’s the conclusion. > [@gdave](#): > > This is a _28 year old_ beef between players who’ve both been retired for over _20 years_, and it’s still a top story for many sports news outlets. What other news stories are there? ---
**Author:** ![Loach](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/loach/32/350_2.png) [@Loach](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Loach)\ **Post date:** [May 27, 2020, 8:08pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/mj-lied-about-preventing-isiah-thomas-being-on-the-dream-team/854536/18 "2020-05-27T20:08:07Z")
> [@MortSahlFan](#): > > That is very remarkable. I’m guessing a majority came from Nike. He made $1.3 billion from Nike. The sneaker culture did not exist before Air Jordan’s so he was given a piece of the action that no one thought would be worth what it was. > **[Michael Jordan has made $1.3 billion from his 36-year partnership with Nike....](https://www.businessinsider.com/michael-jordan-nike-billions-wanted-adidas-deal-2020-5?amp)** > > "You're going to go listen. You may not like it, but you're going to go listen," Jordan's mother said, according to the star. ---
**Author:** ![Bullitt](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/bullitt/32/5725_2.png) [@Bullitt](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Bullitt)\ **Post date:** [May 28, 2020, 8:20am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/mj-lied-about-preventing-isiah-thomas-being-on-the-dream-team/854536/19 "2020-05-28T08:20:27Z")
> [@MortSahlFan](#): > > Why not mention that Isiah beat MJ, Magic, and Bird more than they beat him? Really? How do you figure that? Are you including the regular season? In the playoffs, here is how I count it: 1985 NBA playoffs: Larry beat Isiah 1987 NBA playoffs: Larry beat Isiah 1988 NBA playoffs: Isiah beat Larry, Magic beat Isiah 1989 NBA playoffs: Isiah beat Larry, Isiah beat Michael, Isiah beat Magic 1990 NBA playoffs: Isiah beat Michael 1991 NBA playoffs: Michael beat Isiah 1992 NBA playoffs: (Patrick beat Isiah) Isiah vs Larry: 2-2 Isiah vs Michael: 2-1 Isiah vs Magic: 1-1 Not exactly one-sided. ---
**Author:** ![MortSahlFan](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/3bc359/32.png) [@MortSahlFan](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/MortSahlFan)\ **Post date:** [May 28, 2020, 11:50am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/mj-lied-about-preventing-isiah-thomas-being-on-the-dream-team/854536/20 "2020-05-28T11:50:34Z")
> [@Bullitt](#): > > Really? How do you figure that? Are you including the regular season? > > In the playoffs, here is how I count it: > > 1985 NBA playoffs: Larry beat Isiah > 1987 NBA playoffs: Larry beat Isiah > 1988 NBA playoffs: Isiah beat Larry, Magic beat Isiah > 1989 NBA playoffs: Isiah beat Larry, Isiah beat Michael, Isiah beat Magic > 1990 NBA playoffs: Isiah beat Michael > 1991 NBA playoffs: Michael beat Isiah > 1992 NBA playoffs: (Patrick beat Isiah) > > Isiah vs Larry: 2-2 > Isiah vs Michael: 2-1 > Isiah vs Magic: 1-1 > > Not exactly one-sided. Yes, I counted the regular season, too. I also counted the playoff game wins vs. losses… We lost some crazy Game 7s, we had injuries (always Isiah), but I guess everyone does. But I never saw anyone do what Isiah did on a bad back, wrist injury, and a severely sprained ankle, shooting off the wrong foot, and giving the Lakers 42, including 25 in that 3rd quarter, with the current Defensive Player of the Year (MIchael Cooper) guarding, since Magic couldn’t defend anyone, and was always put on a non-scorer, Rodman in our case. You threw the Knicks in, but the Pistons beat them, too. I didn’t see that above. [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/mj-lied-about-preventing-isiah-thomas-being-on-the-dream-team/854536.md?page=2)