# MLB: June 2011 **URL:** \ **Category:** The Game Room\ **Created:** [June 1, 2011, 11:16pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/mlb-june-2011/584018 "2011-06-01T23:16:09Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 3
**Author:** ![gonzomax](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/g/e8c25b/32.png) [@gonzomax](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/gonzomax)\ **Post date:** [June 5, 2011, 4:39pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/mlb-june-2011/584018/41 "2011-06-05T16:39:27Z")
Tigers are sneaking up on the Indians. The Indians were winning every close game early, now they are coming back to the field. The Tigers and White Sucks are starting to move. ---
**Author:** ![Jas09](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/j/d07c76/32.png) [@Jas09](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Jas09)\ **Post date:** [June 5, 2011, 9:10pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/mlb-june-2011/584018/42 "2011-06-05T21:10:52Z")
> [@Jas09](#): > > On another note… God bless Albert Pujols. That is all. And I must repeat myself… walk-off extra-innings homers against the Cubs two days in a row… Albert may just be heating up. ---
**Author:** ![etv78](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/d78d45/32.png) [@etv78](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/etv78)\ **Post date:** [June 5, 2011, 10:09pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/mlb-june-2011/584018/43 "2011-06-05T22:09:59Z")
> [@Paintcharge](#): > > OK, so this has nothing to do with specifically June baseball, but this is the baseball discussion. > > Why does the NL Central have 6 teams and the AL West have only 4? Stick Houston in the AL West, all divisions have 5 teams, automatic in-state rivalry. Seems like a no brainer. Franchise shifts I’d do: Colorado or Arizona to AL West, Houston to West. ---
**Author:** ![jsc1953](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/j/5daacb/32.png) [@jsc1953](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/jsc1953)\ **Post date:** [June 6, 2011, 4:49am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/mlb-june-2011/584018/44 "2011-06-06T04:49:17Z")
So, the Giants…have had 4 starters on the DL this year (Torres, Sandoval, Posey, Zito – plus Mark DeRosa and Mark Fontenot). The bats of Huff (.222), Tejada (.218) and Burrell (.227) are also apparently severely injured. And they played 32 of 56 games on the road. And yet somehow they’re in first place. I don’t understand how. OK, one reason how: Ryan Vogelsong has had 6 straight starts allowing 1 earned run or less. So don’t be shocked if Bochy names him to the All Star team. ---
**Author:** ![NAF1138](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/naf1138/32/3245_2.png) [@NAF1138](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/NAF1138)\ **Post date:** [June 6, 2011, 11:23am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/mlb-june-2011/584018/45 "2011-06-06T11:23:56Z")
> [@jsc1953](#): > > OK, one reason how: Ryan Vogelsong has had 6 straight starts allowing 1 earned run or less. So don’t be shocked if Bochy names him to the All Star team. Ryan Vogelsong has been amazing. I am wondering if Zito will get his job back once he comes of the DL. I don’t see how he can with Vogelsong pitching like this, but people are fond of vets. In Dodger land, Chad Billinglsy hit a home run and a double last night. He got three RBI in three consecutive plate appearances, the first Dodger pitcher to do that since 1976. ---
**Author:** ![Carmady](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/f04885/32.png) [@Carmady](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Carmady)\ **Post date:** [June 6, 2011, 12:29pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/mlb-june-2011/584018/46 "2011-06-06T12:29:35Z")
> [@spark240](#): > > Why should _this_ injury lead to policy changes that will change the feel of potential scoring plays in almost every game? I’ve seen this argument a lot, and it makes no sense. Yes, it is obvious a big deal is being made over this injury only because the player injured was becoming a big name. But that has nothing to do with whether or not a change should be made. An alternative view is that injuries to big name players are the only things that will get us to sit up and take notice of problems in the game, and that therefore we should take advantage of this injury to make the game better. Which is not to say that I have a solution. One idea would be not to let catchers block the plate with their body, and not allowing runners to go after the defender instead of the base. In this case, Posey was far enough off the base path that the runner could have easily slid in unobstructed, but the runner could not have known that would happen. If he had known Posey was not allowed to, for example, stick his leg out at the last second to block the plate, he would not have needed to go off the base path to crush Posey. ---
**Author:** ![Cliffy](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/59ef9b/32.png) [@Cliffy](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Cliffy)\ **Post date:** [June 6, 2011, 3:36pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/mlb-june-2011/584018/47 "2011-06-06T15:36:05Z")
I see the salary cap discussion has moved on and, frankly, this post is something of a drive-bvy since I won’t have a lot of chance to get back on the Dope this week. So feel free to ignore. But the primary thing a cap (whether it works for parity purposes or not, and the experinece of other sports suggests it works a little but not perfectly) does is prevent labor from being paid the market rate for their services. That’s outrageous. –Cliffy ---
**Author:** ![gonzomax](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/g/e8c25b/32.png) [@gonzomax](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/gonzomax)\ **Post date:** [June 7, 2011, 4:14am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/mlb-june-2011/584018/48 "2011-06-07T04:14:42Z")
Tough call. In the Tiger game a Tiger swung and missed with 2 strikes on him. It went through the catchers legs and the batter ran to first base. The call was "wild pitch’. I lean toward “passed ball” because it was close enough to swing at. ---
**Author:** ![Peremensoe](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/p/ce7236/32.png) [@Peremensoe](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Peremensoe)\ **Post date:** [June 7, 2011, 2:30pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/mlb-june-2011/584018/49 "2011-06-07T14:30:48Z")
> [@Carmady](#): > > But that has nothing to do with whether or not a change should be made. > > An alternative view is that injuries to big name players are the only things that will get us to sit up and take notice of problems in the game, and that therefore we should take advantage of this injury to make the game better. Fine. Convince me that a change _should_ be made–that the game would be _better_ with a smaller set of tactical choices and outcomes on potential scoring plays. ---
**Author:** ![gonzomax](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/g/e8c25b/32.png) [@gonzomax](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/gonzomax)\ **Post date:** [June 7, 2011, 7:10pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/mlb-june-2011/584018/50 "2011-06-07T19:10:12Z")
Catcher collisions have been a part of baseball forever. The same for a runner trying to take out the pivotman in double plays. That is how the game is played. It is not a violent game like football. But there are some plays that result in crashes. Most of them result in no injuries. ---
**Author:** ![jsc1953](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/j/5daacb/32.png) [@jsc1953](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/jsc1953)\ **Post date:** [June 7, 2011, 7:20pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/mlb-june-2011/584018/51 "2011-06-07T19:20:41Z")
> [@gonzomax](#): > > Catcher collisions have been a part of baseball forever. The same for a runner trying to take out the pivotman in double plays. That is how the game is played. > > It is not a violent game like football. But there are some plays that result in crashes. Most of them result in no injuries. Spitballs and intentionally spiking infielders were part of the game forever too, and nobody misses those. Some collisions are inevitable and unavoidable, but runner + catcher isn’t one of them. A simple rule saying that a runner must attempt to avoid the catcher when he’s fielding the throw or waiting to make the tag, would result in a game that looks 99.99% the same as it does now (in most cases the runner is already sliding anyway) – just with fewer devastating injuries. Taking out the pivotman on a DP is different, because the force is in order – the pivotman can just step on 2B and jump out of the way. The catcher doesn’t have that option. ---
**Author:** ![unwashed\_brain](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/u/a9adbd/32.png) [@unwashed\_brain](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/unwashed_brain)\ **Post date:** [June 7, 2011, 8:11pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/mlb-june-2011/584018/52 "2011-06-07T20:11:04Z")
Bah! The catchers are armored to their advantage in a collision. If they can’t take the hits, they shouldn’t get in the way. What happened was unfortunate. The alternative presented in post #51 involves a judgment call from an umpire that can’t be verified evidentially. Nobody wants that. ---
**Author:** ![NAF1138](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/naf1138/32/3245_2.png) [@NAF1138](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/NAF1138)\ **Post date:** [June 7, 2011, 8:28pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/mlb-june-2011/584018/53 "2011-06-07T20:28:07Z")
I know that this will probably not interest many of you, but both Dee Gordon and Rubby De La Rosa are going to be making their first MLB starts in the Dodgers/Phillies game tonight. They are both way too young and raw to be up right now, but injuries and general suckatude of the team have forced some things. Gordon is a lightning fast SS and can hit singles well but with little power and his fielding is a bit suspect, De La Rosa is projected as a #2 starter eventually and is considered a top 100 prospect right now (so is Gordon for that matter). People on the Dodgers think he is a star in the making. He has a ++ fastball that is MLB ready and his secondary stuff projects well but isn’t necessarily there yet. Should be an interesting game. ---
**Author:** ![unwashed\_brain](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/u/a9adbd/32.png) [@unwashed\_brain](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/unwashed_brain)\ **Post date:** [June 7, 2011, 8:42pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/mlb-june-2011/584018/54 "2011-06-07T20:42:08Z")
Hehe - earlier today I picked up Gordon in both fantasy leagues I’m in. ---
**Author:** ![jsc1953](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/j/5daacb/32.png) [@jsc1953](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/jsc1953)\ **Post date:** [June 7, 2011, 9:10pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/mlb-june-2011/584018/55 "2011-06-07T21:10:55Z")
> [@unwashed\_brain](#): > > Bah! The catchers are armored to their advantage in a collision. Posey’s armor did him a helluva lot of good. > [@](#): > > If they can’t take the hits, they shouldn’t get in the way. Posey wasn’t in the way – he was reaching out from in front of the plate to make the tag. Cousins plowed into him unnecessarily, trying to jar the ball loose. > [@](#): > > The alternative presented in post #51 involves a judgment call from an umpire… Just like every other call an umpire makes. ---
**Author:** ![mhendo](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/mhendo/32/3159_2.png) [@mhendo](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/mhendo)\ **Post date:** [June 7, 2011, 9:29pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/mlb-june-2011/584018/56 "2011-06-07T21:29:14Z")
> [@jsc1953](#): > > Taking out the pivotman on a DP is different, because the force is in order – the pivotman can just step on 2B and jump out of the way. The catcher doesn’t have that option. Actually, i’d also enforce the obstruction rule far more rigorously than is currently the case in pivot plays at second base. As it is, there are plenty of occasions where the runner not only makes an attempt to take out the fielder, but where, in doing so, he clearly goes out of his way to do it, and is making no effort at all to touch the base. Here’s an instance i posted when we discussed this issue last year. Watch this 5-4-3 double play by the Red Sox. Pedroia makes the turn and gets the out at first, but he gets cleaned up by David DeJesus. Watch, in particular, the last shot in the video, showing DeJesus running towards the camera. The runner is clearly running to one side of the bag, and then makes a sudden turn to his left in order to run straight at Pedroia. He knows he’s going to be out, he knows he has no chance to make the bag before the force, and his one and only aim is to run into the second baseman. [MP4 (4.7MB)](https://jshare.johnshopkins.edu/mhender4/public_html/gen_images/double_play_slide.mp4) [XVid AVI (15.2MB)](https://jshare.johnshopkins.edu/mhender4/public_html/gen_images/double_play_slide.avi) If a takeout is truly part of an attempt to make the base, i have no problem with it, but when it’s one and only purpose is to take out the player, and when it involves changing direction is such a dramatic fashion in order to do so, i think it should be called obstruction. ---
**Author:** ![Asimovian](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/asimovian/32/172_2.png) [@Asimovian](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Asimovian)\ **Post date:** [June 7, 2011, 9:37pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/mlb-june-2011/584018/57 "2011-06-07T21:37:23Z")
> [@NAF1138](#): > > I know that this will probably not interest many of you, but both Dee Gordon and Rubby De La Rosa are going to be making their first MLB starts in the Dodgers/Phillies game tonight. > > \ > > Should be an interesting game. De La Rosa versus Oswalt reminds me a little bit of how Edwin Jackson broke into the majors with us against Randy Johnson. I’d love to see the same outcome tonight, but I won’t be holding my breath. ---
**Author:** ![unwashed\_brain](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/u/a9adbd/32.png) [@unwashed\_brain](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/unwashed_brain)\ **Post date:** [June 8, 2011, 1:06am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/mlb-june-2011/584018/58 "2011-06-08T01:06:09Z")
> [@jsc1953](#): > > Posey’s armor did him a helluva lot of good. As I said, what happened was unfortunate. > [@jsc1953](#): > > Posey wasn’t in the way – he was reaching out from in front of the plate to make the tag. Cousins plowed into him unnecessarily, trying to jar the ball loose. Looked to me like he blindly put himself in the basepath in an attempt to make a spectacular play. > [@jsc1953](#): > > Just like every other call an umpire makes. It’s the qualifying part you elided that makes my point. Please don’t edit my posts when you quote me. ---
**Author:** ![ZipperJJ](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/zipperjj/32/211_2.png) [@ZipperJJ](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/ZipperJJ)\ **Post date:** [June 8, 2011, 4:36am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/mlb-june-2011/584018/59 "2011-06-08T04:36:47Z")
So what happened in that Dodgers game? I see in the box that Gordon went 3/5 and De La Rosa [del]had 5 pinch hitters![/del] oh, is the pitcher, who gave up 1 run. So will they be back? The Indians snapped a 7-game-home-losing streak and beat the Twins to stop their 5-game-winning-streak. All of the pigs returned back to the ground and Hell began to thaw ---
**Author:** ![Asimovian](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/asimovian/32/172_2.png) [@Asimovian](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Asimovian)\ **Post date:** [June 8, 2011, 4:54am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/mlb-june-2011/584018/60 "2011-06-08T04:54:52Z")
> [@ZipperJJ](#): > > So what happened in that Dodgers game? I see in the box that Gordon went 3/5 and De La Rosa [del]had 5 pinch hitters![/del] oh, is the pitcher, who gave up 1 run. > > So will they be back? \ Assuming they don’t get injured or that McCourt doesn’t sell them on the black market in order to make the June payroll. \ I only got to listen to the first few innings of the Tribe game tonight, but Hammy and Rosie seemed to be pretty pleased with the way Carrasco was attacking the strike zone tonight. Haven’t looked at the box yet to see how many innings he went. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/mlb-june-2011/584018.md?page=2) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/mlb-june-2011/584018.md?page=4)