# MLB rules question (scoring on a force) **URL:** \ **Category:** The Game Room\ **Created:** [August 18, 2013, 5:42pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/mlb-rules-question-scoring-on-a-force/666574 "2013-08-18T17:42:21Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 8\ **Page:** 1
**Author:** ![antonio107](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/7ea924/32.png) [@antonio107](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/antonio107)\ **Post date:** [August 18, 2013, 5:42pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/mlb-rules-question-scoring-on-a-force/666574/1 "2013-08-18T17:42:21Z")
Came up in a softball game today. 1 out, here’s the order of events: Force out at second; Runner touches plate; Force at first. I thought because they were both force outs, it would be no run scored. But I heard otherwise. Anyone care to clarify, and provide a relevant cite to MLB rules? 🙂 Many thanks in advance! ---
**Author:** ![RickJay](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/bb73d2/32.png) [@RickJay](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/RickJay)\ **Post date:** [August 18, 2013, 8:43pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/mlb-rules-question-scoring-on-a-force/666574/2 "2013-08-18T20:43:01Z")
Rule 4.09. [QUOTE=Official Rules, Rule 4.09] One run shall be scored each time a runner legally advances to and touches first, second, third and home base before three men are put out to end the inning. EXCEPTION: A run is not scored if the runner advances to home base during a play in which the third out is made (1) by the batter-runner before he touches first base; (2) by any runner being forced out; or (3) by a preceding runner who is declared out because he failed to touch one of the bases. [/QUOTE] There is no form of baseball or softball I have ever heard of in my entire life where a run should have scored in that circumstance. A run cannot score on a play where the third out is a force out. That’s not possible. ---
**Author:** ![OldGuy](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/o/3bc359/32.png) [@OldGuy](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/OldGuy)\ **Post date:** [August 18, 2013, 8:49pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/mlb-rules-question-scoring-on-a-force/666574/3 "2013-08-18T20:49:18Z")
I concur with RickJay. The only exception which might confuse sometimes is that a runner returning to a base after a fly ball is caught can be “forced out” by tagging the base before he returns. But this force out as a third out does not negate a run previously scored on the play. ---
**Author:** ![crucible](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/5f8ce5/32.png) [@crucible](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/crucible)\ **Post date:** [August 18, 2013, 9:30pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/mlb-rules-question-scoring-on-a-force/666574/4 "2013-08-18T21:30:18Z")
I once saw 5 runs score on one hit. took 15 minutes to figure out what happened. ---
**Author:** ![OldGuy](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/o/3bc359/32.png) [@OldGuy](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/OldGuy)\ **Post date:** [August 19, 2013, 1:34am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/mlb-rules-question-scoring-on-a-force/666574/5 "2013-08-19T01:34:45Z")
> [@crucible](#): > > I once saw 5 runs score on one hit. took 15 minutes to figure out what happened. Could you explain or give a link to a description. ---
**Author:** ![Yorikke](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/yorikke/32/4335_2.png) [@Yorikke](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Yorikke)\ **Post date:** [August 19, 2013, 2:47am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/mlb-rules-question-scoring-on-a-force/666574/6 "2013-08-19T02:47:35Z")
> [@RickJay](#): > > Rule 4.09. > There is no form of baseball or softball I have ever heard of in my entire life where a run should have scored in that circumstance. A run cannot score on a play where the third out is a force out. That’s not possible. And yet here we are. ---
**Author:** ![RickJay](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/bb73d2/32.png) [@RickJay](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/RickJay)\ **Post date:** [August 19, 2013, 3:15am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/mlb-rules-question-scoring-on-a-force/666574/7 "2013-08-19T03:15:10Z")
> [@Yorikke](#): > > And yet here we are. Evidently the ump in the OP’s game was a doofus. ---
**Author:** ![antonio107](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/7ea924/32.png) [@antonio107](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/antonio107)\ **Post date:** [August 19, 2013, 4:46am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/mlb-rules-question-scoring-on-a-force/666574/8 "2013-08-19T04:46:12Z")
It was a pickup softball game that we’ve been doing for some ten odd years, every Sunday in the summer. We ended up not counting the run (it is a friendly, after all) but someone said they _swore_ they’ve seen it where a play like that went down, and the run counted. The only thing I can think of would be if the batter turns the wrong way at first, gets tagged out, it…might?..look like that on the TV with the sound off. Anyways, thanks for chiming in, guys.