# Mod communication/biased modding **URL:** \ **Category:** About This Message Board\ **Created:** [January 31, 2025, 11:31pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/mod-communication-biased-modding/1013696 "2025-01-31T23:31:43Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 6
**Author:** ![crowmanyclouds](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/crowmanyclouds/32/19884_2.png) [@crowmanyclouds](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/crowmanyclouds)\ **Post date:** [February 4, 2025, 12:05am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/mod-communication-biased-modding/1013696/101 "2025-02-04T00:05:20Z")
> [@Dr.Strangelove](#): > > No one denies the existence of people who _claim_ to be Christian, just like no one denies the existence of people that claim to be trans. And (almost) no one denies the existence of people who really _believe_ in their own Christian identity, just as almost no one denies the existence of people that really _believe_ in their trans identity. > > The issue at hand is whether is ok for others to say that this identity isn’t actually a legitimate thing. “Jesus never existed, and if he did he certainly wasn’t the son of god” isn’t an attack on the internal state of the believer, their identity, it’s an attack on historic claims. ---
**Author:** ![Atamasama](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/atamasama/32/12961_2.png) [@Atamasama](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Atamasama)\ **Post date:** [February 4, 2025, 12:16am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/mod-communication-biased-modding/1013696/102 "2025-02-04T00:16:22Z")
> [@crowmanyclouds](#): > > “Jesus never existed, and if he did he certainly wasn’t the son of god” isn’t an attack on the internal state of the believer, their identity, it’s an attack on historic claims. Correct. And I don’t get offended when people deny the existence of Jesus, or God, or anything about my faith. It’s fine. Now, I’ve been offended and gotten into some nasty fights in the Pit when people have characterized “all Christians are like this” and called them out. There’s a **visceral** difference that I can attest to as a member of that group. If you said, “All Christians are liars and don’t believe in a deity, it’s just an excuse to be a pedophile, just look at the Catholics.” Now you’re getting into what I’d consider hate speech. ---
**Author:** ![Dr.Strangelove](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/dr.strangelove/32/6613_2.png) [@Dr.Strangelove](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Dr.Strangelove)\ **Post date:** [February 4, 2025, 12:16am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/mod-communication-biased-modding/1013696/103 "2025-02-04T00:16:58Z")
> [@crowmanyclouds](#): > > “Jesus never existed, and if he did he certainly wasn’t the son of god” isn’t an attack on the internal state of the believer It is absolutely an attack on their internal state. It’s saying that their feelings of religious ecstasy, or numinousness, or feeling that Jesus is looking over them and cares about them, is just a delusion. It isn’t calling them liars for having those feelings, but it does say that they aren’t based on reality. ---
**Author:** ![Atamasama](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/atamasama/32/12961_2.png) [@Atamasama](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Atamasama)\ **Post date:** [February 4, 2025, 12:23am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/mod-communication-biased-modding/1013696/104 "2025-02-04T00:23:48Z")
> [@Dr.Strangelove](#): > > It is absolutely an attack on their internal state. I can tell you as a Christian it’s absolutely not. I can tell you **authoritatively** that it’s not. Saying I should be offended by this is no different than saying I shouldn’t be offended by a slur. There is a huge difference between what I _believe_ and what I _am_. When you deny a person’s gender, you’re not attacking their belief in their own gender, you’re denying their core of what they _are_. ---
**Author:** ![crowmanyclouds](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/crowmanyclouds/32/19884_2.png) [@crowmanyclouds](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/crowmanyclouds)\ **Post date:** [February 4, 2025, 12:24am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/mod-communication-biased-modding/1013696/105 "2025-02-04T00:24:17Z")
If they were based on reality then “_Jesus never existed, and if he did he certainly wasn’t the son of god_” would be received the same way “_George Washington never existed, and if he did he certainly wasn’t the President of The United States_” is. ---
**Author:** ![Dr.Strangelove](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/dr.strangelove/32/6613_2.png) [@Dr.Strangelove](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Dr.Strangelove)\ **Post date:** [February 4, 2025, 12:29am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/mod-communication-biased-modding/1013696/106 "2025-02-04T00:29:07Z")
> [@Atamasama](#): > > I can tell you as a Christian it’s absolutely not. It’s not up to you. It’s up to me–I’m the one that said it. In another context, where I wasn’t speaking hypothetically, it would absolutely be meant as an attack. Whether you receive it as such is irrelevant. Just to be clear, you recognize the distinction between saying someone is lying about their feelings vs. saying their feelings are based on a delusion, right? ---
**Author:** ![Atamasama](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/atamasama/32/12961_2.png) [@Atamasama](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Atamasama)\ **Post date:** [February 4, 2025, 12:29am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/mod-communication-biased-modding/1013696/107 "2025-02-04T00:29:45Z")
> [@Dr.Strangelove](#): > > Just to be clear, you recognize the distinction between saying someone is lying about their feelings vs. saying their feelings are based on a delusion, right? I also recognize the irrelevance. ---
**Author:** ![Dr.Strangelove](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/dr.strangelove/32/6613_2.png) [@Dr.Strangelove](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Dr.Strangelove)\ **Post date:** [February 4, 2025, 12:32am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/mod-communication-biased-modding/1013696/108 "2025-02-04T00:32:00Z")
> [@Atamasama](#): > > I also recognize the irrelevance Well ok, I guess there is no possible meeting of minds on this topic then. ---
**Author:** ![Dr.Strangelove](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/dr.strangelove/32/6613_2.png) [@Dr.Strangelove](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Dr.Strangelove)\ **Post date:** [February 4, 2025, 12:33am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/mod-communication-biased-modding/1013696/109 "2025-02-04T00:33:13Z")
> [@crowmanyclouds](#): > > If they were based on reality then If a bunch of people had a really strong, core part of their identity tied up in whether George Washington was real, then I’d agree there was some similarity. ---
**Author:** ![Zoobi](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/z/13edae/32.png) [@Zoobi](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Zoobi)\ **Post date:** [February 4, 2025, 12:33am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/mod-communication-biased-modding/1013696/110 "2025-02-04T00:33:25Z")
I don’t get it. There are probably hundreds of other message boards where you can say transgender people are lying just so they can win sports or molest children. There are hundreds where you can say Black people don’t have the brain capacity to be a safe airline pilot. You just can’t here. I am sure there are things on those boards you couldn’t say that you can here. Just post where you feel comfortable that you can. ---
**Author:** ![Atamasama](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/atamasama/32/12961_2.png) [@Atamasama](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Atamasama)\ **Post date:** [February 4, 2025, 12:33am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/mod-communication-biased-modding/1013696/111 "2025-02-04T00:33:51Z")
> [@Dr.Strangelove](#): > > Well ok, I guess there is no possible meeting of minds on this topic then. I don’t think there is to be honest. And I don’t mean that to disparage you at all. I just don’t think there’s any way to find common ground here. ---
**Author:** ![Miller](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/miller/32/481_2.png) [@Miller](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Miller)\ **Post date:** [February 4, 2025, 12:34am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/mod-communication-biased-modding/1013696/112 "2025-02-04T00:34:18Z")
> [@Dr.Strangelove](#): > > It’s not up to you. It’s up to me–I’m the one that said it. I genuinely don’t think that’s how that works. ---
**Author:** ![crowmanyclouds](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/crowmanyclouds/32/19884_2.png) [@crowmanyclouds](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/crowmanyclouds)\ **Post date:** [February 4, 2025, 12:35am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/mod-communication-biased-modding/1013696/113 "2025-02-04T00:35:10Z")
> [@Dr.Strangelove](#): > > > [@crowmanyclouds](#): > > > > If they were based on reality then > > If a bunch of people had a really strong, core part of their identity tied up in whether George Washington was real, then I’d agree there was some similarity. American’s don’t count I guess… ---
**Author:** ![Dr.Strangelove](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/dr.strangelove/32/6613_2.png) [@Dr.Strangelove](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Dr.Strangelove)\ **Post date:** [February 4, 2025, 12:38am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/mod-communication-biased-modding/1013696/114 "2025-02-04T00:38:36Z")
> [@Miller](#): > > I genuinely don’t think that’s how that works Some people think we should judge a message based on how it was received. Others think it should be judged based on intent. I tend to favor the latter, but tastes differ. ---
**Author:** ![Der\_Trihs](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/der_trihs/32/233_2.png) [@Der\_Trihs](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Der_Trihs)\ **Post date:** [February 4, 2025, 12:40am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/mod-communication-biased-modding/1013696/115 "2025-02-04T00:40:26Z")
> [@Zoobi](#): > > I don’t get it. There are probably hundreds of other message boards where you can say transgender people are lying just so they can win sports or molest children. There are hundreds where you can say Black people don’t have the brain capacity to be a safe airline pilot. You just can’t here. Which _is_ the problem; the Right will not tolerate the existence of anything but the Right. The fact that people here are _allowed_ to disagree with the Right is intolerable to it. ---
**Author:** ![Dr.Strangelove](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/dr.strangelove/32/6613_2.png) [@Dr.Strangelove](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Dr.Strangelove)\ **Post date:** [February 4, 2025, 12:42am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/mod-communication-biased-modding/1013696/116 "2025-02-04T00:42:34Z")
> [@Atamasama](#): > > And I don’t mean that to disparage you at all. I just don’t think there’s any way to find common ground here. Likewise, which is why I phrased that as neutrally as I could. Sometimes common ground is impossible. ---
**Author:** ![Atamasama](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/atamasama/32/12961_2.png) [@Atamasama](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Atamasama)\ **Post date:** [February 4, 2025, 12:53am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/mod-communication-biased-modding/1013696/117 "2025-02-04T00:53:36Z")
> [@Dr.Strangelove](#): > > Likewise, which is why I phrased that as neutrally as I could. I appreciate that. 🙂 ---
**Author:** ![Miller](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/miller/32/481_2.png) [@Miller](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Miller)\ **Post date:** [February 4, 2025, 1:00am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/mod-communication-biased-modding/1013696/118 "2025-02-04T01:00:31Z")
> [@Dr.Strangelove](#): > > Some people think we should judge a message based on how it was received. Others think it should be judged based on intent. I tend to favor the latter, but tastes differ. So, if _you_ say “Jesus never existed, and if he did he certainly wasn’t the son of god,” that’s an attack on a Christian’s identity, because that’s how you mean it. But If _I_ say “Jesus never existed, and if he did he certainly wasn’t the son of god,” that’s _not_ an attack on a Christian’s identity, because that’s _not_ how I mean it? ---
**Author:** ![Thing.Fish](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/thing.fish/32/9168_2.png) [@Thing.Fish](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Thing.Fish)\ **Post date:** [February 4, 2025, 1:01am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/mod-communication-biased-modding/1013696/119 "2025-02-04T01:01:46Z")
> [@WalterBishop](#): > > It is impossible for someone who doesn’t think transgender women are women to reply honestly to this post without breaking the rules of the board. I don’t understand how this could be. Can’t you simply refer to the people in question as “transgender women”? Then, if you want to argue that society, as a general rule or WRT to some specific scenario, should treat transgender women differently than cisgender women, you can do so. If you feel you simply can’t discuss these issues without using terms that others find insulting, then it’s reasonable that others won’t want to have discussions with such a boorish person. ---
**Author:** ![Dr.Strangelove](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/dr.strangelove/32/6613_2.png) [@Dr.Strangelove](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Dr.Strangelove)\ **Post date:** [February 4, 2025, 1:10am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/mod-communication-biased-modding/1013696/120 "2025-02-04T01:10:43Z")
> [@Miller](#): > > But If _I_ say “Jesus never existed, and if he did he certainly wasn’t the son of god,” that’s _not_ an attack on a Christian’s identity, because that’s _not_ how I mean it? If you say that’s not what you meant, then sure. I’m not sure what you _do_ mean in that case, because for me the attack is a direct logical consequence of the claim, but if it came up in a discussion we could probably figure out where the actual difference lies. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/mod-communication-biased-modding/1013696.md?page=5) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/mod-communication-biased-modding/1013696.md?page=7)