# Moderation approves personal harassment by silence **URL:** \ **Category:** About This Message Board\ **Created:** [June 11, 2018, 1:49pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/moderation-approves-personal-harassment-by-silence/815870 "2018-06-11T13:49:28Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 4
**Author:** ![expectopatronum](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/expectopatronum/32/173_2.png) [@expectopatronum](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/expectopatronum)\ **Post date:** [June 11, 2018, 5:51pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/moderation-approves-personal-harassment-by-silence/815870/61 "2018-06-11T17:51:25Z")
> [@Left\_Hand\_of\_Dorkness](#): > > Whether or not he’s a good person is definitely relevant in terms of a personal hope that he’ll stay. (and I know that’s what you were talking about) > > But in terms of the broader discussion–whether behavior like what he’s talking about in the OP is okay–what kind of person he is is beside the point. > > The point is that building up a head of steam off-site to come attack people here is kind of shitty. And using the most painful periods of a person’s life to craft nasty things to say about a person is profoundly shitty behavior, like way-beyond-normal-usage-of-the-Pit behavior. And allowing folks to get away with these activities (especially the latter) is going to result in a worse board, as people will be less willing to post honestly about their own lives because they know anything they say can be used against them without repercussion. > > I’ve disagreed with Chimera a lot, but that has nothing at all to do with thinking that the behavior he’s talking about is terrible. I would say the same thing if it were directed at any other poster. I have to disagree with this characterization of GB and the snark thread. The entire reason GB exists and is still active to this day is because enough posters wanted the freedom to talk about anything they wanted, and you often can’t do that here. Want to talk about something offboard that’s SDMB related? Want to talk about previous notable posters/trainwrecks? You can’t here. Want to vent about Skald’s BS without being piled on because he’s a popular poster over here? We do all that over there because there’s no rules against it. And sometimes people do get carried away, and we’re the first ones to say “dude, not cool” when someone crosses a line, as many of us did when Morgenstern commented on Chimera’s divorce. And there’s been several times where a snark target has posted in the snark thread to defend themselves, and people are usually glad to engage with them and explain what they take issue with. It’s also not anonymous, and most of us use the same usernames in both places, so we’re not doing the whole snarkpit thing over there. There are no coordinated attacks. Some regulars in the snark thread post over here, some don’t. I personally usually comment on something if it’s really gotten under my skin, as is the case with sexism and misogyny, which is why I’ve been so vocal about the Skald controversy and the subsequent discussion about sexism on the board. But we’re not over there prodding each other to harass this person or that person. Some of us choose to post here, some don’t, but that’s down to personal choice, not running it by the GB crew first. ---
**Author:** ![Left\_Hand\_of\_Dorkness](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/left_hand_of_dorkness/32/7156_2.png) [@Left\_Hand\_of\_Dorkness](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Left_Hand_of_Dorkness)\ **Post date:** [June 11, 2018, 5:59pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/moderation-approves-personal-harassment-by-silence/815870/62 "2018-06-11T17:59:05Z")
> [@expectopatronum](#): > > I have to disagree with this characterization of GB and the snark thread. Is the sentence you’re disagreeing with this one? > [@me](#): > > The point is that building up a head of steam off-site to come attack people here is kind of shitty. If that’s the one you disagree with, I’m not really sure how to argue the issue. It certainly seems that folks over there egg each other on, and that a positive feedback loop of talking shit kicks in, and that some people whirl around that loop a few times before flying over here to put in a few kicks. Folks link to posts they find objectionable, and then folks read those links and come over en masse to respond to those posts that were linked to. None of this makes the board a better place, IMO. > [@](#): > > There are no coordinated attacks. Coordinated in the sense of “okay, you post first, then I’ll wait twenty minutes and post”? Sure, that doesn’t happen. But in the sense of, “Look at this fool at this link,” and then a half-dozen people come over to look and then dogpile? That sure seems to happen. Coordinated in the sense of, “Let’s socialize by talking shit about someone, and then compliment someone for going over to the Dope and saying something shitty to that person over on the Dope?” That happens too. Note that this is a bit separate from Morgenstern’s highly personalized attacks: while he’s alone in engaging in these extremely vitriolic attacks, it appears to me that the off-board behavior contributes to his motivation. ---
**Author:** ![expectopatronum](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/expectopatronum/32/173_2.png) [@expectopatronum](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/expectopatronum)\ **Post date:** [June 11, 2018, 6:01pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/moderation-approves-personal-harassment-by-silence/815870/63 "2018-06-11T18:01:26Z")
> [@Sunny\_Daze](#): > > This does not mean that his change of mind was not sincere. Quite a lot of people have indicated that their understanding has broadened as the discussion has continued, and I am glad to take them at their word. I have seen nothing from Chimera to indicate this isn’t the case. If I didn’t believe that people could reach a different understanding of the world around them, then there wouldn’t be much point to having discussions about diversity at all. Call me an optimist. I understand where you’re coming from. Agree to disagree? 🙂 ---
**Author:** ![Morgenstern](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/f9ae1b/32.png) [@Morgenstern](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Morgenstern)\ **Post date:** [June 11, 2018, 6:07pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/moderation-approves-personal-harassment-by-silence/815870/64 "2018-06-11T18:07:03Z")
> [@DrDeth](#): > > Oh, I dont think that is necessary at all, and you know why. If I did, I would not have asked. Please provide something for me, even by PM, of this conspiracy theory. Seriously, PM me if you’re not willing to post it. ---
**Author:** ![Scumpup](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/ce73a5/32.png) [@Scumpup](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Scumpup)\ **Post date:** [June 11, 2018, 6:24pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/moderation-approves-personal-harassment-by-silence/815870/65 "2018-06-11T18:24:58Z")
> [@Left\_Hand\_of\_Dorkness](#): > > All due respect, I don’t plan to get into a back-and-forth with Morgenstern here. That’ll inevitably go into Pit thread territory, and I don’t think there’s really a whole lot of confusion about what’s being discussed here such that a back-and-forth will do any good. You’re right. There isn’t. ---
**Author:** ![Scumpup](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/ce73a5/32.png) [@Scumpup](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Scumpup)\ **Post date:** [June 11, 2018, 6:30pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/moderation-approves-personal-harassment-by-silence/815870/66 "2018-06-11T18:30:09Z")
> [@expectopatronum](#): > > I have to disagree with this characterization of GB and the snark thread. The entire reason GB exists and is still active to this day is because enough posters wanted the freedom to talk about anything they wanted, and you often can’t do that here. Want to talk about something offboard that’s SDMB related? Want to talk about previous notable posters/trainwrecks? You can’t here. Want to vent about Skald’s BS without being piled on because he’s a popular poster over here? We do all that over there because there’s no rules against it. And sometimes people do get carried away, and we’re the first ones to say “dude, not cool” when someone crosses a line, as many of us did when Morgenstern commented on Chimera’s divorce. And there’s been several times where a snark target has posted in the snark thread to defend themselves, and people are usually glad to engage with them and explain what they take issue with. It’s also not anonymous, and most of us use the same usernames in both places, so we’re not doing the whole snarkpit thing over there. > > There are no coordinated attacks. Some regulars in the snark thread post over here, some don’t. I personally usually comment on something if it’s really gotten under my skin, as is the case with sexism and misogyny, which is why I’ve been so vocal about the Skald controversy and the subsequent discussion about sexism on the board. But we’re not over there prodding each other to harass this person or that person. Some of us choose to post here, some don’t, but that’s down to personal choice, not running it by the GB crew first. What is your opinion on people spending years of their lives, making thousands of posts, generating hundreds of pages all on the single topic of mocking members here and talking ugly about them? Please enlighten me on how this is not egregiously shitty behavior? The fact that those same people are now doing yeoman service trying to spin their behavior as innocent fun is telling. This isn’t a court of law. There is no presumption of innocence nor level of proof that has to be met. Anybody who wants can go to GB and see for themselves what that little group is all about. Edited to add: If you want to spend a few illustrative moments, search the post history of some of their key members both here and there. A majority of their posts are about other members, rather than about other topics. ---
**Author:** ![expectopatronum](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/expectopatronum/32/173_2.png) [@expectopatronum](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/expectopatronum)\ **Post date:** [June 11, 2018, 6:37pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/moderation-approves-personal-harassment-by-silence/815870/67 "2018-06-11T18:37:33Z")
> [@Left\_Hand\_of\_Dorkness](#): > > Is the sentence you’re disagreeing with this one? > > If that’s the one you disagree with, I’m not really sure how to argue the issue. It certainly seems that folks over there egg each other on, and that a positive feedback loop of talking shit kicks in, and that some people whirl around that loop a few times before flying over here to put in a few kicks. Folks link to posts they find objectionable, and then folks read those links and come over en masse to respond to those posts that were linked to. None of this makes the board a better place, IMO. > > Coordinated in the sense of “okay, you post first, then I’ll wait twenty minutes and post”? Sure, that doesn’t happen. But in the sense of, “Look at this fool at this link,” and then a half-dozen people come over to look and then dogpile? That sure seems to happen. Coordinated in the sense of, “Let’s socialize by talking shit about someone, and then compliment someone for going over to the Dope and saying something shitty to that person over on the Dope?” That happens too. > > Note that this is a bit separate from Morgenstern’s highly personalized attacks: while he’s alone in engaging in these extremely vitriolic attacks, it appears to me that the off-board behavior contributes to his motivation. I understand where you’re coming from, but as I pointed out, we’re just as likely to give each other negative feedback when it’s warranted. And there are certainly folks who poke at people who are seen as easy targets, or hide behind the more vocal posters saying essentially “Yeah! What they said!”. But I think that’s more an internet thing and not a GB thing specifically. Also, when the chips are down, Raffers are just as supportive as Dopers can be. When Broomstick’s (a fairly frequent snark target) husband passed, many people expressed their sympathy. There was even talk about starting a fund to cover funeral expenses. That doesn’t seem consistent with a group of bullies and harassers, as Raffers have been called quite a bit recently. ---
**Author:** ![Morgenstern](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/f9ae1b/32.png) [@Morgenstern](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Morgenstern)\ **Post date:** [June 11, 2018, 6:38pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/moderation-approves-personal-harassment-by-silence/815870/68 "2018-06-11T18:38:04Z")
I’ve waited 30 minutes now. No one has sent me a PM, or in any other way, proven any sort of a conspiracy, agenda or organized effort to tag-team any individual here. This makes me think that such a thing does not happen. ---
**Author:** ![raventhief](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/raventhief/32/4_2.png) [@raventhief](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/raventhief)\ **Post date:** [June 11, 2018, 6:55pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/moderation-approves-personal-harassment-by-silence/815870/70 "2018-06-11T18:55:48Z")
> [@lilmissdnbdj](#): > > cool What is? ---
**Author:** ![expectopatronum](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/expectopatronum/32/173_2.png) [@expectopatronum](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/expectopatronum)\ **Post date:** [June 11, 2018, 6:59pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/moderation-approves-personal-harassment-by-silence/815870/71 "2018-06-11T18:59:10Z")
I’m guessing it’s a spammer. He/she’s posted three times, two of which were one word responses, and one in the Doper picture thread posting a link to a myspace (!). I wouldn’t expect a response. ---
**Author:** ![Czarcasm](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/czarcasm/32/4050_2.png) [@Czarcasm](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Czarcasm)\ **Post date:** [June 11, 2018, 7:06pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/moderation-approves-personal-harassment-by-silence/815870/72 "2018-06-11T19:06:45Z")
> [@expectopatronum](#): > > I’m guessing it’s a spammer. He/she’s posted three times, two of which were one word responses, and one in the Doper picture thread posting a link to a myspace (!). I wouldn’t expect a response. Cool. ---
**Author:** ![Whiskey\_Dickens](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/w/9fc348/32.png) [@Whiskey\_Dickens](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Whiskey_Dickens)\ **Post date:** [June 11, 2018, 7:06pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/moderation-approves-personal-harassment-by-silence/815870/73 "2018-06-11T19:06:54Z")
> [@Left\_Hand\_of\_Dorkness](#): > > The snippery toward Chimera in this thread alone is pretty gross. Agreed. Disagree with a poster, but keep the personal stuff to the Pit. ---
**Author:** ![tnetennba](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/7993a0/32.png) [@tnetennba](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/tnetennba)\ **Post date:** [June 11, 2018, 7:10pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/moderation-approves-personal-harassment-by-silence/815870/74 "2018-06-11T19:10:26Z")
> [@DrDeth](#): > > You guys really need to get out of the idea that Internet Bullying, Stalking and Harassment is OK if it is in the PIT. That is totally false. I think we need a shared definition of “bullying, stalking, and harassment.” To have somebody call you a jerk in an Internet discussion board for things you said in that thread is none of those things. Even if a few extra people are driven from another website to comment that you’re a jerk, it is none of those things. ---
**Author:** ![CCitizen](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/4af34b/32.png) [@CCitizen](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/CCitizen)\ **Post date:** [June 11, 2018, 7:13pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/moderation-approves-personal-harassment-by-silence/815870/75 "2018-06-11T19:13:25Z")
> [@Chimera](#): > > Very shameful that pit rules allowing personal insults are being translated by weak moderation and a refusal to act into approval of harassing other posters. Between that and losing board admins and longtime members because of the refusal to moderate hate, I don’t see a future here. Thank you for bringing up this issue. Sadly, abusive behavior is officially permitted in a part of SDMB. In real life, such abuse is rare even among Junior High Students. I rarely attack first, but if I am insulted I usually respond in kind – thus I return the negative Psychological Energy to the insulter. ---
**Author:** ![Skywatcher](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/skywatcher/32/254_2.png) [@Skywatcher](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Skywatcher)\ **Post date:** [June 11, 2018, 7:17pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/moderation-approves-personal-harassment-by-silence/815870/76 "2018-06-11T19:17:37Z")
> [@expectopatronum](#): > > I’m guessing it’s a spammer. He/she’s posted three times, two of which were one word responses, and one in the Doper picture thread posting a link to a myspace (!). I wouldn’t expect a response. I went to the myspace page by entering the correct link. It would appear we have a new young lady on summer break, not a spammer. ---
**Author:** ![CCitizen](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/4af34b/32.png) [@CCitizen](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/CCitizen)\ **Post date:** [June 11, 2018, 7:21pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/moderation-approves-personal-harassment-by-silence/815870/77 "2018-06-11T19:21:35Z")
Some people may argue that Internet is not Real Life, but many of forum regulars are Homo Interneticus – most of their social life is online. Most people like a hospitable place for their social life. ---
**Author:** ![Tee](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/73ab20/32.png) [@Tee](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Tee)\ **Post date:** [June 11, 2018, 7:27pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/moderation-approves-personal-harassment-by-silence/815870/78 "2018-06-11T19:27:17Z")
> [@Scumpup](#): > > What is your opinion on people spending years of their lives, making thousands of posts, generating hundreds of pages all on the single topic of mocking members here and talking ugly about them? Please enlighten me on how this is not egregiously shitty behavior? The fact that those same people are now doing yeoman service trying to spin their behavior as innocent fun is telling. I think they’re preaching to the choir. But the case should be made against the behavior here, not there. ---
**Author:** ![DrDeth](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/b487fb/32.png) [@DrDeth](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/DrDeth)\ **Post date:** [June 11, 2018, 7:27pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/moderation-approves-personal-harassment-by-silence/815870/79 "2018-06-11T19:27:51Z")
> [@Morgenstern](#): > > I’ve waited 30 minutes now. No one has sent me a PM, or in any other way, proven any sort of a conspiracy, agenda or organized effort to tag-team any individual here. This makes me think that such a thing does not happen. It is to laugh. :rolleyes: ---
**Author:** ![Whiskey\_Dickens](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/w/9fc348/32.png) [@Whiskey\_Dickens](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Whiskey_Dickens)\ **Post date:** [June 11, 2018, 7:28pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/moderation-approves-personal-harassment-by-silence/815870/80 "2018-06-11T19:28:48Z")
> [@expectopatronum](#): > > Want to vent about Skald’s BS without being piled on because he’s a popular poster over here? We do all that over there because there’s no rules against it. Hey thanks for the invite! I tried being a “Raffer” for about 6 months, until I had the temerity to ask why it was OK to snark on certain targets but not others. I got piled on by people who claimed they were _taking the moral high ground_, and that I’m an idiot for not being able to tell which posters clearly deserved wishes that their house burnt down, and which were untouchable saints whose personal life was obviously off limits, you cretin how dare you. Sigh. ---
**Author:** ![raventhief](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/raventhief/32/4_2.png) [@raventhief](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/raventhief)\ **Post date:** [June 11, 2018, 7:31pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/moderation-approves-personal-harassment-by-silence/815870/81 "2018-06-11T19:31:54Z")
> [@CCitizen](#): > > Thank you for bringing up this issue. > > Sadly, abusive behavior is officially permitted in a part of SDMB. In real life, such abuse is rare even among Junior High Students. > > I rarely attack first, but if I am insulted I usually respond in kind – thus I return the negative Psychological Energy to the insulter. Is every issue always about you? [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/moderation-approves-personal-harassment-by-silence/815870.md?page=3) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/moderation-approves-personal-harassment-by-silence/815870.md?page=5)