# Moderators are clearly using thier power as mods to shut down debates that they are losing. **URL:** \ **Category:** About This Message Board\ **Created:** [November 7, 2015, 9:34pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/moderators-are-clearly-using-thier-power-as-mods-to-shut-down-debates-that-they-are-losing/736964 "2015-11-07T21:34:48Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 2
**Author:** ![Hank\_Beecher](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/hank_beecher/32/7275_2.png) [@Hank\_Beecher](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Hank_Beecher)\ **Post date:** [November 7, 2015, 10:35pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/moderators-are-clearly-using-thier-power-as-mods-to-shut-down-debates-that-they-are-losing/736964/21 "2015-11-07T22:35:10Z")
> [@Morgenstern](#): > > Be fair. > > JC said this when he closed the thread; > > \*The Moderator Speaks > That’s enough. > > Time out. Separate corners. Take a few days off and come back with better debating skills.\* > > He said take a few days off, not forever silence yourself in Islamic issues. Right, we can openly discuss it, except and until the side favored by the mods is getting trounced in the debate, at which point the opposing side must wait days to post. ---
**Author:** ![Jonathan\_Chance](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/jonathan_chance/32/701_2.png) [@Jonathan\_Chance](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Jonathan_Chance)\ **Post date:** [November 7, 2015, 10:38pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/moderators-are-clearly-using-thier-power-as-mods-to-shut-down-debates-that-they-are-losing/736964/22 "2015-11-07T22:38:05Z")
Well, that’s just not true. I’m assuming - as indicated above - that you’re talking about Tom. But I can assure you that Tom and I have had no contact about the thread at all. ---
**Author:** ![Ethilrist](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/ethilrist/32/4604_2.png) [@Ethilrist](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Ethilrist)\ **Post date:** [November 7, 2015, 10:39pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/moderators-are-clearly-using-thier-power-as-mods-to-shut-down-debates-that-they-are-losing/736964/23 "2015-11-07T22:39:55Z")
> [@Hank Beecher](#): > > What is clear is that there is no place anywhere on this forum for one of the greatest debates of our day, and that coddling the sensitivities of a particular minority to criticism of ideas sacred to them, and protecting the self-congratulatory ignorance of the regressive defenders of those ideas, is of a higher priority than a free and open exchange of ideas. “I’d like to have an argument, please.” ---
**Author:** ![Morgenstern](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/f9ae1b/32.png) [@Morgenstern](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Morgenstern)\ **Post date:** [November 7, 2015, 10:41pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/moderators-are-clearly-using-thier-power-as-mods-to-shut-down-debates-that-they-are-losing/736964/24 "2015-11-07T22:41:49Z")
> [@Hank\_Beecher](#): > > Right, we can openly discuss it, except and until the side favored by the mods is getting trounced in the debate, at which point the opposing side must wait days to post. No. I’m going to guess what happened here because IANAM. Several months ago there was a thread that went sideways and turned into a trainwreck. The mods tried to tame the participants to no avail and warnings flew. Of course, an ATMB thread followed where many people opined that it would be better to close threads, let the participants refocus on the debate, and then reopen it when emotions were not so high. It appears to me that what JC did was try a little proactive modding designed to get the thread back within the rules instead of spending his mod time babysitting a thread. YMMV of course. ---
**Author:** ![Hank\_Beecher](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/hank_beecher/32/7275_2.png) [@Hank\_Beecher](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Hank_Beecher)\ **Post date:** [November 7, 2015, 10:46pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/moderators-are-clearly-using-thier-power-as-mods-to-shut-down-debates-that-they-are-losing/736964/25 "2015-11-07T22:46:56Z")
Closing threads for the purpose of stifling debate stifle is bad form, and it is terrible moderation. The [latest thread that was closed](http://boards.straightdope.com/sdmb/showthread.php?t=687508&page=5) is one in which the side favored by the moderators [clearly lost](http://boards.straightdope.com/sdmb/showpost.php?p=16204133&postcount=250). These are the precise methods used by [Stormfront.org](http://Stormfront.org) to cultivate an image that they allow open debate by those who oppose their views, while still “proving” that the Holocaust did not happen and “proving” that blacks are inferior to them. It’s the same lopsided governance, and they pour out the same style of stupid jokey self-congratulatory nonsense when the discussions are limited and shut down, as they are here. The similarities are quite telling. ---
**Author:** ![Hank\_Beecher](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/hank_beecher/32/7275_2.png) [@Hank\_Beecher](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Hank_Beecher)\ **Post date:** [November 7, 2015, 10:49pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/moderators-are-clearly-using-thier-power-as-mods-to-shut-down-debates-that-they-are-losing/736964/26 "2015-11-07T22:49:38Z")
> [@Jonathan\_Chance](#): > > Well, that’s just not true. > > I’m assuming - as indicated above - that you’re talking about Tom. But I can assure you that Tom and I have had no contact about the thread at all. OK, fair enough. Then why exactly are you closing the threads? ---
**Author:** ![Colibri](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/colibri/32/1841_2.png) [@Colibri](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Colibri)\ **Post date:** [November 7, 2015, 10:51pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/moderators-are-clearly-using-thier-power-as-mods-to-shut-down-debates-that-they-are-losing/736964/27 "2015-11-07T22:51:32Z")
> [@Hank\_Beecher](#): > > The [latest thread that was closed](http://boards.straightdope.com/sdmb/showthread.php?t=687508&page=5) is one in which the side favored by the moderators [clearly lost](http://boards.straightdope.com/sdmb/showpost.php?p=16204133&postcount=250) That was an 18-month-old zombie thread you bumped in order to continue the debate in the closed threads. ---
**Author:** ![Bryan\_Ekers](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/bryan_ekers/32/183_2.png) [@Bryan\_Ekers](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Bryan_Ekers)\ **Post date:** [November 7, 2015, 10:55pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/moderators-are-clearly-using-thier-power-as-mods-to-shut-down-debates-that-they-are-losing/736964/28 "2015-11-07T22:55:59Z")
> [@Hank\_Beecher](#): > > Closing threads for the purpose of stifling debate stifle is bad form, and it is terrible moderation. > > The [latest thread that was closed](http://boards.straightdope.com/sdmb/showthread.php?t=687508&page=5) is one in which the side favored by the moderators [clearly lost](http://boards.straightdope.com/sdmb/showpost.php?p=16204133&postcount=250). > > These are the precise methods used by [Stormfront.org](http://Stormfront.org) to cultivate an image that they allow open debate by those who oppose their views, while still “proving” that the Holocaust did not happen and “proving” that blacks are inferior to them. It’s the same lopsided governance, and they pour out the same style of stupid jokey self-congratulatory nonsense when the discussions are limited and shut down, as they are here. The similarities are quite telling. It remains unclear to me what relevance Muhammad’s personal life has, let alone how it can win or lose anything of importance. ---
**Author:** ![Hank\_Beecher](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/hank_beecher/32/7275_2.png) [@Hank\_Beecher](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Hank_Beecher)\ **Post date:** [November 7, 2015, 11:00pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/moderators-are-clearly-using-thier-power-as-mods-to-shut-down-debates-that-they-are-losing/736964/29 "2015-11-07T23:00:49Z")
> [@Colibri](#): > > That was an 18-month-old zombie thread you bumped in order to continue the debate in the closed threads. No, it is a different debate. I came across the article that I posted to it recently, but refrained from adding it because there were, at the time, already two active threads about Islam in the forum. That is why you don’t see[this](http://www.patheos.com/blogs/friendlyatheist/2014/03/14/islamic-advisory-council-in-pakistan-says-girls-should-be-permitted-to-marry-at-any-age/) story posted in either of the other, now closed, threads. Once those discussions were terminated, that reason no longer existed. But it is now clear that the desired limit on the number of ongoing discussions containing strong, informed criticism of Islam is not one, or two, or three, but zero. ---
**Author:** ![Measure\_for\_Measure](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/measure_for_measure/32/557_2.png) [@Measure\_for\_Measure](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Measure_for_Measure)\ **Post date:** [November 7, 2015, 11:13pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/moderators-are-clearly-using-thier-power-as-mods-to-shut-down-debates-that-they-are-losing/736964/30 "2015-11-07T23:13:40Z")
> [@Morgenstern](#): > > You know, I’d really, really like to get behind this but, well, I’m guessing they close threads for the same reason the city sweeps the streets. Censorship? I must say I’m very disappointed at the quality of the current mod-villains. I mean I know they are afraid of dissenting views: that’s the only motivation I can _conceive_ of for closing a thread that had gone on for _30 pages_. That’s 1459 posts for those keeping count. > [@Morgenstern](#): > > Be fair. Oh and we’re suppose to be _fair_ now? Tyranny! ---
**Author:** ![Hank\_Beecher](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/hank_beecher/32/7275_2.png) [@Hank\_Beecher](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Hank_Beecher)\ **Post date:** [November 7, 2015, 11:25pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/moderators-are-clearly-using-thier-power-as-mods-to-shut-down-debates-that-they-are-losing/736964/31 "2015-11-07T23:25:10Z")
> [@Measure\_for\_Measure](#): > > Censorship? > > I must say I’m very disappointed at the quality of the current mod-villains. I mean I know they are afraid of dissenting views: that’s the only motivation I can _conceive_ of for closing a thread that had gone on for _30 pages_. That’s 1459 posts for those keeping count. That just shows the strength of their delusion that their positions could be supported using reason. I guess that much longer threads on Stormfront “debating” whether or not the Holocaust actually happened would convince you of their mod-villain’s tolerance for dissenting views… ---
**Author:** ![Bryan\_Ekers](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/bryan_ekers/32/183_2.png) [@Bryan\_Ekers](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Bryan_Ekers)\ **Post date:** [November 7, 2015, 11:30pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/moderators-are-clearly-using-thier-power-as-mods-to-shut-down-debates-that-they-are-losing/736964/32 "2015-11-07T23:30:55Z")
> [@Hank\_Beecher](#): > > I guess that much longer threads on Stormfront “debating” whether or not the Holocaust actually happened would convince you of their mod-villain’s tolerance for dissenting views… I didn’t realize Stormfront considered the matter debatable. Are the threads just an endless litany of variations on “of course not!” ? ---
**Author:** ![Hank\_Beecher](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/hank_beecher/32/7275_2.png) [@Hank\_Beecher](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Hank_Beecher)\ **Post date:** [November 7, 2015, 11:36pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/moderators-are-clearly-using-thier-power-as-mods-to-shut-down-debates-that-they-are-losing/736964/33 "2015-11-07T23:36:58Z")
> [@Colibri](#): > > **[Moderator Note]** > > Don’t use this forum to restart the debate in the thread that was closed. If you do so, this thread will be closed as well. > > **[Moderator Note]** > > ATMB is for civil discussion of moderation issues. Don’t make insulting personal remarks in this forum. Further remarks of this kind will be subject to a warning. You know, I tried to join a debate on Islam in the Great Debates forum: thread closed. I tried to have a discussion about that thread closing in this forum: thread closed. I joined another debate on Islam in the Great Debates forum: thread closed. I felt the moderators deserved insulting for such intolerance of the open discussion of ideas, so I went to the Pit, the one forum designated for insults: thread closed. Back to Great Debates to continue an old debate, since the other threads discussing similar topics were no more: thread closed. And here we are. ---
**Author:** ![Superdude](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/superdude/32/13450_2.png) [@Superdude](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Superdude)\ **Post date:** [November 7, 2015, 11:43pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/moderators-are-clearly-using-thier-power-as-mods-to-shut-down-debates-that-they-are-losing/736964/34 "2015-11-07T23:43:40Z")
**Hank** , I don’t have a dog in this fight, but it seems like you have a serious hard-on for Islam. You’re talking about arguments and threads that were started 2 years ago. I’m not Muslim, and I don’t claim to know a lot about it, but it seems like you’re obsessed with trying to get other people to agree with you on this, and you can’t handle someone having a differing opinion. ---
**Author:** ![Hank\_Beecher](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/hank_beecher/32/7275_2.png) [@Hank\_Beecher](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Hank_Beecher)\ **Post date:** [November 7, 2015, 11:45pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/moderators-are-clearly-using-thier-power-as-mods-to-shut-down-debates-that-they-are-losing/736964/35 "2015-11-07T23:45:55Z")
> [@Bryan\_Ekers](#): > > I didn’t realize Stormfront considered the matter debatable. Are the threads just an endless litany of variations on “of course not!” ? No, they are very similar to the threads on Islam here. They put a great deal of effort into cultivatnig an image of being open to debate, and of being able to defend their views. They allow a certain degree of discussion, but use their power to close threads and give warnings about “staying on topic” and “refusing to respond to the actual topic and only repeating yourself” when robust refutations of their denialist rhetoric are consistently provided. ---
**Author:** ![Superdude](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/superdude/32/13450_2.png) [@Superdude](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Superdude)\ **Post date:** [November 7, 2015, 11:46pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/moderators-are-clearly-using-thier-power-as-mods-to-shut-down-debates-that-they-are-losing/736964/36 "2015-11-07T23:46:48Z")
> [@Hank\_Beecher](#): > > You know, I tried to join a debate on Islam in the Great Debates forum: thread closed. > > I tried to have a discussion about that thread closing in this forum: thread closed. > > I joined another debate on Islam in the Great Debates forum: thread closed. > > I felt the moderators deserved insulting for such intolerance of the open discussion of ideas, so I went to the Pit, the one forum designated for insults: thread closed. > > Back to Great Debates to continue an old debate, since the other threads discussing similar topics were no more: thread closed. > > And here we are. This brings to mind an observation I once had about Elizabeth Taylor: if you’ve been married and divorced 8 times, it’s you. It’s not the other person. If you post in threads that are active about Islam, and all of them end up getting locked after you post, then the obvious deduction is that you’re the reason they’re getting closed. Perhaps you should take a good look at your posting style. ---
**Author:** ![Bryan\_Ekers](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/bryan_ekers/32/183_2.png) [@Bryan\_Ekers](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Bryan_Ekers)\ **Post date:** [November 7, 2015, 11:49pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/moderators-are-clearly-using-thier-power-as-mods-to-shut-down-debates-that-they-are-losing/736964/37 "2015-11-07T23:49:27Z")
Uh-Huh. Well, I’d ask how a bunch of cites of a historical case of what we’d now consider to be statutory rape proves anything about the modern practice of Islam, but that runs the risk of you telling me. ---
**Author:** ![Chronos](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/chronos/32/134_2.png) [@Chronos](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Chronos)\ **Post date:** [November 7, 2015, 11:53pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/moderators-are-clearly-using-thier-power-as-mods-to-shut-down-debates-that-they-are-losing/736964/38 "2015-11-07T23:53:01Z")
If the mods wanted to stifle debate, why would they let the thread run for _thirty pages_ before closing it? ---
**Author:** ![Hank\_Beecher](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/hank_beecher/32/7275_2.png) [@Hank\_Beecher](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Hank_Beecher)\ **Post date:** [November 8, 2015, 12:07am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/moderators-are-clearly-using-thier-power-as-mods-to-shut-down-debates-that-they-are-losing/736964/39 "2015-11-08T00:07:48Z")
> [@Superdude](#): > > **Hank** , I don’t have a dog in this fight, but it seems like you have a serious hard-on for Islam. You’re talking about arguments and threads that were started 2 years ago. I’m not Muslim, and I don’t claim to know a lot about it, but it seems like you’re obsessed with trying to get other people to agree with you on this, and you can’t handle someone having a differing opinion. I read this message board a lot, but do not post on a lot of topics. This is because there is not usually much that I could add that is not being provided by others. One exception is when the subject of Islam comes up, where the level of ignorance and apology is typically, with exceptions, sky high. Once the SDMB gets an ex-Muslim versed in classical Arabic as a regular poster, I will be glad to go back to lurking while she makes this place look like a room full of pre-schoolers. I am not holding my breath, however, as these people have there hands full [liberating themselves](https://www.reddit.com/r/exmuslim/comments/3qdvb6/what_an_islamophobe_amirite/) and trying to find ways to [help their counterparts](https://www.reddit.com/r/exmuslim/comments/3rraj5/exmuslim_your_help_needed/) avoid suicide and escape states where they could be killed or imprisoned for their beliefs. ---
**Author:** ![Hank\_Beecher](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/hank_beecher/32/7275_2.png) [@Hank\_Beecher](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Hank_Beecher)\ **Post date:** [November 8, 2015, 12:11am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/moderators-are-clearly-using-thier-power-as-mods-to-shut-down-debates-that-they-are-losing/736964/40 "2015-11-08T00:11:01Z")
> [@Superdude](#): > > This brings to mind an observation I once had about Elizabeth Taylor: if you’ve been married and divorced 8 times, it’s you. It’s not the other person. > > If you post in threads that are active about Islam, and all of them end up getting locked after you post, then the obvious deduction is that you’re the reason they’re getting closed. Perhaps you should take a good look at your posting style. No that’s not an obvious deduction at all. Another one, and the one that is obvious in this case, is that some people are just not tolerant of robust criticism of Islam. Like, if you think about it, this chain of logic you are using could be used to claim some pretty ridiculous stuff. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/moderators-are-clearly-using-thier-power-as-mods-to-shut-down-debates-that-they-are-losing/736964.md?page=1) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/moderators-are-clearly-using-thier-power-as-mods-to-shut-down-debates-that-they-are-losing/736964.md?page=3)