# Mom's "Apology" To Friends Without Kids **URL:** \ **Category:** The BBQ Pit\ **Created:** [May 28, 2014, 6:50pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/moms-apology-to-friends-without-kids/689487 "2014-05-28T18:50:27Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 7
**Author:** ![Malthus](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/85f322/32.png) [@Malthus](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Malthus)\ **Post date:** [May 29, 2014, 2:00pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/moms-apology-to-friends-without-kids/689487/121 "2014-05-29T14:00:14Z")
> [@Living\_Well\_Is\_Best\_Revenge](#): > > Got to agree here. This is a major red flag you’ve steered off into crazy land. +2. Video was intended to be a humorous exaggeration of a real phenom (that working parents with toddlers have very little time for a social life) for comedic effect. Getting upset about it enough to pit it? That’s crazy-land. ---
**Author:** ![Malthus](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/85f322/32.png) [@Malthus](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Malthus)\ **Post date:** [May 29, 2014, 2:06pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/moms-apology-to-friends-without-kids/689487/122 "2014-05-29T14:06:23Z")
> [@andros](#): > > My only problem is that it’s not particularly funny. Except maybe to newish parents in the throes of toddlerbrain, I guess. > > And **Leaf** , no offence . . . but you actually find her hot? Seriously? I do. She’s totally hot. ---
**Author:** ![GrandWino](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/grandwino/32/67_2.png) [@GrandWino](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/GrandWino)\ **Post date:** [May 29, 2014, 2:10pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/moms-apology-to-friends-without-kids/689487/123 "2014-05-29T14:10:08Z")
What’s funny is that people don’t realize that it’s not that parents don’t have time for friends… it’s that they don’t have time for YOU. Parents make time for the people they really like to spend time with. ---
**Author:** ![Bone](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/bone/32/407_2.png) [@Bone](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Bone)\ **Post date:** [May 29, 2014, 2:23pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/moms-apology-to-friends-without-kids/689487/124 "2014-05-29T14:23:17Z")
> [@BrightNShiny](#): > > I actually think my friends and relatives see these communal outings or parties as kind of a relief, since there’s always someone you can hand your kid off to for a few moments or some teenager who’s at that stage where they think babies are so adorable and are willing to entertain them for hours. Sometimes I find myself holding a baby or a toddler when their parents have handed them off to me to go do something. Sometimes yes, and sometimes no. A lot of times kids and parents are both on a schedule. Schedules and routines can help keep chaos down to a minimum. If this is what works for people, then deviations from the schedule can have a big impact. And while parents of young children at gatherings may have a good time, it’s the aftermath that can be the hardest part. Sometimes those ripples could last days - so each outing you have to decide if it’s worth it to endure that. A lot of times it’s not. ---
**Author:** ![andros](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/e480ec/32.png) [@andros](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/andros)\ **Post date:** [May 29, 2014, 2:39pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/moms-apology-to-friends-without-kids/689487/125 "2014-05-29T14:39:17Z")
**Leaffan** , **pulykamell** , **Malthus** : my apologies if I sounded judgmental. I didn’t mean to. Different strokes and all that. Y’all feel free to find her as hot as you find her. Don’t let being wrong get in your way. 😃 ---
**Author:** ![Malthus](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/85f322/32.png) [@Malthus](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Malthus)\ **Post date:** [May 29, 2014, 2:48pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/moms-apology-to-friends-without-kids/689487/126 "2014-05-29T14:48:26Z")
> [@andros](#): > > **Leaffan** , **pulykamell** , **Malthus** : my apologies if I sounded judgmental. I didn’t mean to. Different strokes and all that. Y’all feel free to find her as hot as you find her. > > Don’t let being wrong get in your way. > > 😃 I’m happy in my wrongness. 😃 Fortunately, I find my wife even hotter. I can only attribute her attraction to me as a form of insanity on her part. 😉 ---
**Author:** ![andros](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/e480ec/32.png) [@andros](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/andros)\ **Post date:** [May 29, 2014, 2:51pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/moms-apology-to-friends-without-kids/689487/127 "2014-05-29T14:51:34Z")
> [@Malthus](#): > > I can only attribute her attraction to me as a form of insanity on her part. 😉 Oh by all of Vishnu’s tiny toes, I am _so_ right there with you. . ---
**Author:** ![AnthonyElite](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/b487fb/32.png) [@AnthonyElite](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/AnthonyElite)\ **Post date:** [May 29, 2014, 3:03pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/moms-apology-to-friends-without-kids/689487/128 "2014-05-29T15:03:09Z")
> [@Inner\_Stickler](#): > > Cool. > > But if you literally can’t sit at the table and chat with me for half an hour without constantly interacting with your toddler because I didn’t bring over my own crotch spawn to play with yours, then I’m not going to bother, frankly. You were a “crotch spawn” at one point too. You may not realize it, but you have the benefit of making posts because someone prioritized you in their life. Decent parents take care of their kids and don’t shuffle them off to a baby sitter as often as they can. No one will care for your kids like you will, like it or not. It’s a shame we don’t have more parents willing to forgo their social lives to fulfill their responsibilities as parents. Instead they shove em off on society and then balk when they become little monsters and exclaim “I don’t know what happened! The babysitter said he used to be such a nice boy!” ---
**Author:** ![andros](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/e480ec/32.png) [@andros](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/andros)\ **Post date:** [May 29, 2014, 3:28pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/moms-apology-to-friends-without-kids/689487/129 "2014-05-29T15:28:16Z")
> [@AnthonyElite](#): > > Decent parents take care of their kids and don’t shuffle them off to a baby sitter as often as they can Aww. That poor middle. Always being so excluded. ---
**Author:** ![AnthonyElite](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/b487fb/32.png) [@AnthonyElite](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/AnthonyElite)\ **Post date:** [May 29, 2014, 3:29pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/moms-apology-to-friends-without-kids/689487/130 "2014-05-29T15:29:24Z")
> [@andros](#): > > Aww. That poor middle. Always being so excluded. I’m not quite sure what that has to do with the middle…I’m assuming middle class? ---
**Author:** ![Eutychus](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/a3d4f5/32.png) [@Eutychus](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Eutychus)\ **Post date:** [May 29, 2014, 3:47pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/moms-apology-to-friends-without-kids/689487/131 "2014-05-29T15:47:29Z")
> [@AnthonyElite](#): > > I’m not quite sure what that has to do with the middle…I’m assuming middle class? I think he’s referring to the fact that “decent parents who take care of their kids” and “parents who ship them off to a babysitter as often as they can” are two extremes on a continuum and that the middle ground is the much more common experience …decent parents who take care of their kids but every now and then need a babysitter. ---
**Author:** ![Kimballkid](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/k/b5a626/32.png) [@Kimballkid](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Kimballkid)\ **Post date:** [May 29, 2014, 4:11pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/moms-apology-to-friends-without-kids/689487/132 "2014-05-29T16:11:24Z")
> [@Leaffan](#): > > And she’s hot too. I wish there was a common term for hot internet mothers. > [@Dave\_Hartwick](#): > > iMILF. New from Apple. 😃 I thought it was kind of disturbing(?) how much someone or something was attached to her breast. ---
**Author:** ![even\_sven](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/dfb087/32.png) [@even\_sven](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/even_sven)\ **Post date:** [May 29, 2014, 4:17pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/moms-apology-to-friends-without-kids/689487/133 "2014-05-29T16:17:55Z")
> [@Kimballkid](#): > > New from Apple. > > 😃 > > I thought it was kind of disturbing(?) how much someone or something was attached to her breast. You do realize that the mom of a newborn has “someone or something” attached to her breast about 30 minutes out of every two or three hours, right? ---
**Author:** ![Kimstu](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/k/ecd19e/32.png) [@Kimstu](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Kimstu)\ **Post date:** [May 29, 2014, 4:32pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/moms-apology-to-friends-without-kids/689487/134 "2014-05-29T16:32:37Z")
> [@even\_sven](#): > > You do realize that the mom of a newborn has “someone or something” attached to her breast about 30 minutes out of every two or three hours, right? I think **Kimballkid** ’s point was just that this situation does not usually form part of assessing some internet stranger’s fapworthiness. ---
**Author:** ![Dread\_Pirate\_Jimbo](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/dread_pirate_jimbo/32/3897_2.png) [@Dread\_Pirate\_Jimbo](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Dread_Pirate_Jimbo)\ **Post date:** [May 29, 2014, 5:17pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/moms-apology-to-friends-without-kids/689487/135 "2014-05-29T17:17:22Z")
> [@pulykamell](#): > > I would say yes. To me, it’s normal for friends to disappear for years at a time while they’re taking care of their own thing (school, kids, work, whatever). When we pick up afterwards, it’s without skipping a beat. Sometimes it’s me being involved in my own thing; sometimes it’s them. My strongest and oldest friendships are ones where this sort of ebb and flow has occurred. I’ve known my best friend since grade 5 (that’s 36 years for those who are counting) and we’ve never gone more than a few weeks without touching base—and that was when we were living on different sides of the country. I also have several friends I’ve known since 1986 when my family moved back to Calgary. Again, we’ve not gone years without speaking because, IME, friends don’t fuck off and ignore each other for years at a time. Your mileage obviously varies. 🙂 > [@Urbanredneck](#): > > I call it “relationship evolution”. > > When your single you mostly hang out with your single friends. Why? Because your experiences, trials, and issues in your life are similar plus you have the time to stay out late. > > When in a relationship you hang out with others in a relationship or married. Why? Nobody likes to be a “3rd wheel” and bring their spouse to an event where all the single people have their own focus. > > When you have kids, you switch to that group because no way does a single person want you to bring their kids to their non-childproof house and single people quickly tire about talking about diapers and child raising. > > Gradually as your kids get older you spend time with other people with kids who have similar interests like the fine arts parents or soccer parents. > > It happens. Child-free people do actually get this. It’s the sanctimonous, “We have far more important things to do than anything you’ll ever get involved in and therefore haven’t got the time to spend with anyone but our precious, screaming brood” attitude of so many parents that gets my goat. Those people can fuck right off. > [@Sateryn76](#): > > This, totally. > > I mean, duh, of course you’re going to have less time once you have kids. But whoever mentioned balance above hits it on the head. Too many parents are so completely up their kids asses’ all the time, it’s stupid. > > When my father in law died, we were gathered at my mother in laws house after the evening funeral, and we were drinking and carrying on, and some people do after funerals. My kids were 3 and 10, and the toddler was asleep upstairs, and the 10 year old was playing with her cousin and watching TV. My 8 year old niece kept coming downstairs and nagging at her mom. Having just lost her father, she needed some time to just be with her friends and family, and blow off steam, but this kid kept coming down to bother her. I finally looked at Niece and said, in my stern mommy voice “Go upstairs - this is grown up time”. Niece looked at me, and went upstairs and stayed there. My sister in law looked at me and said “Grown up time”. What a good idea - I never thought of that!" > > How does that happen? With both of our kids, starting at the baby stage, we made sure they learned how to play alone, how to entertain themselves, and that Grown Up time is a thing. Why don’t more parents make sure they teach their kids that? I can only imagine that when their kid is 16 or 18 and hating them and spending all of their time away from them, these parents have a pretty crappy life - they’ve sacrificed their own interest and relationships on the altar of their children, which is a fleeting 18 years in an 80 year life span. > > Kids are challenging and time consuming and an absolute joy, but they’re nothing special in the greater world. There’s no honor in being a martyr. There’s really no honor in declaring yourself a martyr because you’ve done what 7 billion other people have done throughout history. Having a baby doesn’t make you special. In fact, it’s the exact opposite; it makes you average. > [@GrandWino](#): > > What’s funny is that people don’t realize that it’s not that parents don’t have time for friends… it’s that they don’t have time for YOU. Parents make time for the people they really like to spend time with. Parents who want to spend their time exclusively with like-minded parents and don’t want to spend time with me are no loss whatsoever. Chances are, I wasn’t hanging around with people so myopic to begin with, so I certainly won’t lose any sleep by not being around them in the future. But they can also shove their campaign for sainthood right up their ass 'cuz I’m really not interested. > [@Eutychus](#): > > I think he’s referring to the fact that “decent parents who take care of their kids” and “parents who ship them off to a babysitter as often as they can” are two extremes on a continuum and that the middle ground is the much more common experience …decent parents who take care of their kids but every now and then need a babysitter. This really gets to the heart of the matter. The parents who act as if there is only a single priority in their lives and that there is no way they could ever abandon their kids for even half a second are completely missing the point. It’s not a black-or-white situation and acting like it is—usually to generate sympathy—is just the rantings of an asshole. ---
**Author:** ![Malthus](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/85f322/32.png) [@Malthus](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Malthus)\ **Post date:** [May 29, 2014, 5:48pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/moms-apology-to-friends-without-kids/689487/136 "2014-05-29T17:48:49Z")
> [@Dread\_Pirate\_Jimbo](#): > > I’ve known my best friend since grade 5 (that’s 36 years for those who are counting) and we’ve never gone more than a few weeks without touching base—and that was when we were living on different sides of the country. I also have several friends I’ve known since 1986 when my family moved back to Calgary. Again, we’ve not gone years without speaking because, IME, friends don’t fuck off and ignore each other for years at a time. Your mileage obviously varies. 🙂 > > Child-free people do actually get this. It’s the sanctimonous, “We have far more important things to do than anything you’ll ever get involved in and therefore haven’t got the time to spend with anyone but our precious, screaming brood” attitude of so many parents that gets my goat. Those people can fuck right off. > > There’s really no honor in declaring yourself a martyr because you’ve done what 7 billion other people have done throughout history. Having a baby doesn’t make you special. In fact, it’s the exact opposite; it makes you average. > > Parents who want to spend their time exclusively with like-minded parents and don’t want to spend time with me are no loss whatsoever. Chances are, I wasn’t hanging around with people so myopic to begin with, so I certainly won’t lose any sleep by not being around them in the future. But they can also shove their campaign for sainthood right up their ass 'cuz I’m really not interested. > > This really gets to the heart of the matter. The parents who act as if there is only a single priority in their lives and that there is no way they could ever abandon their kids for even half a second are completely missing the point. It’s not a black-or-white situation and acting like it is—usually to generate sympathy—is just the rantings of an asshole. Um, did you actually watch the video? It’s intended to be a mildly humourous exaggeration, supposed to elicit a weary “heh” from those who have had the experience of being tired working parents of babies and toddlers. No “martyrdom”. No “sainthood”. These effusions - from the OP, from you - are like a bunch of child-free Don Quixotes tilting at windmills. Find a proper target for your outrage, because right now, responding with such venom to something so very innocuous makes you look mildly deranged. 😃 ---
**Author:** ![SmellMyWort](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/ea5d25/32.png) [@SmellMyWort](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/SmellMyWort)\ **Post date:** [May 29, 2014, 7:12pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/moms-apology-to-friends-without-kids/689487/137 "2014-05-29T19:12:57Z")
> [@Eliahna](#): > > So what keeps her busy is her job, is that your point? Why won’t you refer to it as _her job_? If she says it’s the kids that interfere with her social life, not her job, why won’t you believe her? Wouldn’t she be in a better position to know than you? If she’s worked her entire adult life AND maintained friendships right up to the point that she had kids, and then her social life went on the backburner, wouldn’t it be fair to say it was children, not work, that changed her availability? > > And just because I’m curious, have you ever suggested a man shouldn’t say he doesn’t have time for socializing because he chooses to go to work, and if he wasn’t spending all his time building his business, he’d have plenty of time for friends? Yeah, I bet sleeping keeps her busy, too. If she wasn’t busy sleeping she’d have plenty of time to hang out, yet she blames it all on her kids.:dubious: ---
**Author:** ![Inner\_Stickler](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/inner_stickler/32/318_2.png) [@Inner\_Stickler](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Inner_Stickler)\ **Post date:** [May 29, 2014, 7:33pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/moms-apology-to-friends-without-kids/689487/138 "2014-05-29T19:33:21Z")
> [@Malthus](#): > > Um, did you actually watch the video? It’s intended to be a mildly humourous exaggeration, supposed to elicit a weary “heh” from those who have had the experience of being tired working parents of babies and toddlers. Then she should have directed it at them instead of at her childless friends. ---
**Author:** ![Labrador\_Deceiver](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/l/7c8e57/32.png) [@Labrador\_Deceiver](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Labrador_Deceiver)\ **Post date:** [May 29, 2014, 7:36pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/moms-apology-to-friends-without-kids/689487/139 "2014-05-29T19:36:38Z")
She did. The narrative is directed at fictional childless friends, but the target audience of the video is other parents. That’s who follows her blog. ---
**Author:** ![Left\_Hand\_of\_Dorkness](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/left_hand_of_dorkness/32/7156_2.png) [@Left\_Hand\_of\_Dorkness](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Left_Hand_of_Dorkness)\ **Post date:** [May 29, 2014, 7:39pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/moms-apology-to-friends-without-kids/689487/140 "2014-05-29T19:39:33Z")
> [@SmellMyWort](#): > > Yeah, I bet sleeping keeps her busy, too. If she wasn’t busy sleeping she’d have plenty of time to hang out, yet she blames it all on her kids.:dubious: Childless person: works. Mom: works. Childless person: sleeps. Mom: sleeps. Childless person: hangs out with friends a lot. Mom: takes care of kids a lot. Seriously, folks, how is this complicated? [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/moms-apology-to-friends-without-kids/689487.md?page=6) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/moms-apology-to-friends-without-kids/689487.md?page=8)