# Moral Dilemma: How Can We Eat Without Killing Anything For Food? **URL:** \ **Category:** Great Debates\ **Created:** [October 26, 2012, 1:45pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/moral-dilemma-how-can-we-eat-without-killing-anything-for-food/638929 "2012-10-26T13:45:24Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 5
**Author:** ![Boyo\_Jim](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/87869e/32.png) [@Boyo\_Jim](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Boyo_Jim)\ **Post date:** [October 26, 2012, 6:33pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/moral-dilemma-how-can-we-eat-without-killing-anything-for-food/638929/81 "2012-10-26T18:33:41Z")
This is a serious question, OP? Why are you still alive? How could you have survived without eating loving things? As to your “point” about only eating things that have “fallen off” plants, do you not realize that most of that material is offspring? You are killing and eating the fetuses of plants. And regarding your comments about “lab grown dead” things, if we decided today to may that our goal, every human being would be dead before it is possible. What you’re saying is that for a human being to be alive is unethical, yet you still are around here giving us grief. ---
**Author:** ![Cheshire\_Human](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/5f8ce5/32.png) [@Cheshire\_Human](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Cheshire_Human)\ **Post date:** [October 26, 2012, 6:52pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/moral-dilemma-how-can-we-eat-without-killing-anything-for-food/638929/82 "2012-10-26T18:52:25Z")
> [@Sr\_Siete](#): > > My God, OP, you are right. It’s impossible to live without killing living things, therefore morality doesn’t exist and killing and eating babies or our neoghbours is completely OK! I’m going to do that right away! Only if you eat what you kill. Mmmmm… Baby Back Ribs! ---
**Author:** ![silenus](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/silenus/32/166_2.png) [@silenus](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/silenus)\ **Post date:** [October 26, 2012, 7:10pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/moral-dilemma-how-can-we-eat-without-killing-anything-for-food/638929/83 "2012-10-26T19:10:57Z")
> [@JellyBeanz](#): > > That’s your choice and I am not going to get on my high horse about it. I went through the rite of passage of hunting with my father as well when I was a child, but I didn’t know any better at that age. Now I feel like I would have to kill something inside myself to embrace killing other animals, no matter how much I would enjoy the meat afterward. I respect that hunters like their hunting activities, but I think that however much part of you enjoys killing, at least some part of you must dislike it to be considered human. Tasty, tasty meat. Double cheeseburger with bacon, so I can kill two animals for the same sandwich. 😛 ---
**Author:** ![John\_Mace](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/john_mace/32/185_2.png) [@John\_Mace](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/John_Mace)\ **Post date:** [October 26, 2012, 7:18pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/moral-dilemma-how-can-we-eat-without-killing-anything-for-food/638929/84 "2012-10-26T19:18:20Z")
The OP also needs to look up the definition of murder. That word only applies to humans. It is a legal term. ---
**Author:** ![Marley23](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/45deac/32.png) [@Marley23](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Marley23)\ **Post date:** [October 26, 2012, 7:26pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/moral-dilemma-how-can-we-eat-without-killing-anything-for-food/638929/85 "2012-10-26T19:26:25Z")
> [@John\_Mace](#): > > The OP also needs to look up the definition of murder. That word only applies to humans. It is a legal term. He’s not using it in a legal sense. He’s arguing that it’s equivalent to killing a human, which he hasn’t established at all. This fails for any number of reasons, so I don’t think it’s necessary to fall back on a dictionary definition here. ---
**Author:** ![JellyBeanz](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/j/ed8c4c/32.png) [@JellyBeanz](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/JellyBeanz)\ **Post date:** [October 26, 2012, 7:31pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/moral-dilemma-how-can-we-eat-without-killing-anything-for-food/638929/86 "2012-10-26T19:31:57Z")
> [@silenus](#): > > Tasty, tasty meat. Double cheeseburger with bacon, so I can kill two animals for the same sandwich. 😛 OMG what is wrong with you? Why are you so ignorant about suffering you’re causing to these animals and justify having two wonderful creatures killed for the sake of one sandwich? I mean where is your moral position? Just because it might taste good does not make it right. I like Coca Cola but I don’t drink it because I know they murdered at least 3 union leaders in Colombia a few years back. If I gave money to them I would be giving money to a company that murdered people, that is true regardless of whether I knew I was doing so or not. ---
**Author:** ![AtomicDog](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/ac91a4/32.png) [@AtomicDog](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/AtomicDog)\ **Post date:** [October 26, 2012, 7:32pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/moral-dilemma-how-can-we-eat-without-killing-anything-for-food/638929/87 "2012-10-26T19:32:25Z")
Solution : invent the Star Trek replicator. ---
**Author:** ![Marley23](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/45deac/32.png) [@Marley23](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Marley23)\ **Post date:** [October 26, 2012, 7:39pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/moral-dilemma-how-can-we-eat-without-killing-anything-for-food/638929/88 "2012-10-26T19:39:43Z")
> [@JellyBeanz](#): > > OMG what is wrong with you? Why are you so ignorant about suffering you’re causing to these animals and justify having two wonderful creatures killed for the sake of one sandwich? **JellyBeanz** , you need to learn the rules of this forum: you can’t insult other users, and making personal comments like ‘you are ignorant’ is not wanted. Everybody else in the thread should know that already. Argue the facts instead of discussing the failings of the people you are talking to. And I’m pretty sure you are overreacting to a joke. ---
**Author:** ![Mangetout](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/mangetout/32/19_2.png) [@Mangetout](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Mangetout)\ **Post date:** [October 26, 2012, 7:41pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/moral-dilemma-how-can-we-eat-without-killing-anything-for-food/638929/89 "2012-10-26T19:41:27Z")
> [@JellyBeanz](#): > > OMG what is wrong with you? Why are you so ignorant about suffering you’re causing to these animals and justify having two wonderful creatures killed for the sake of one sandwich? I mean where is your moral position? Just because it might taste good does not make it right. I like Coca Cola but I don’t drink it because I know they murdered at least 3 union leaders in Colombia a few years back. If I gave money to them I would be giving money to a company that murdered people, that is true regardless of whether I knew I was doing so or not. I imagine pretty much any large company can be shown to have deliberately, accidentally, negligently, etc caused the death of people or animals\* (\*after all you seem to equate the two) in the past. The solution, for you, to all of your moral anguish, appears to be: become a hermit and starve yourself to death. ---
**Author:** ![Telemark](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/telemark/32/372_2.png) [@Telemark](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Telemark)\ **Post date:** [October 26, 2012, 7:46pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/moral-dilemma-how-can-we-eat-without-killing-anything-for-food/638929/90 "2012-10-26T19:46:08Z")
> [@JellyBeanz](#): > > Why are you so ignorant about suffering you’re causing to these animals and justify having two wonderful creatures killed for the sake of one sandwich? Who trusted God was love indeed And love Creation’s final law Tho’ Nature, red in tooth and claw With ravine, shriek’d against his creed ---
**Author:** ![DrDeth](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/b487fb/32.png) [@DrDeth](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/DrDeth)\ **Post date:** [October 26, 2012, 7:46pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/moral-dilemma-how-can-we-eat-without-killing-anything-for-food/638929/91 "2012-10-26T19:46:39Z")
I suggest Breatharianism. > **[Inedia](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Breatharian)** > > Reportedly haunted locations: > Inedia (Latin for 'fasting') or breatharianism (/brɛˈθɛəriənɪzəm/) is the claimed ability for a person to live without consuming food, and in some cases water. It is a pseudoscientific practice and several adherents of these practices have died from starvation or dehydration. Multiple cases where this practice was attempted have resulted in failure or death. > Breatharians claim that food (and sometimes water) is not necessary for survival. The terms breatharianism... Let me know how that works, eh? PS, I’ll be monitoring you by Ouija board, the code phrase is “Rosabelle believe”. ---
**Author:** ![JellyBeanz](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/j/ed8c4c/32.png) [@JellyBeanz](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/JellyBeanz)\ **Post date:** [October 26, 2012, 7:47pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/moral-dilemma-how-can-we-eat-without-killing-anything-for-food/638929/92 "2012-10-26T19:47:39Z")
> [@Marley23](#): > > **JellyBeanz** , you need to learn the rules of this forum: you can’t insult other users, and making personal comments like ‘you are ignorant’ is not wanted. Everybody else in the thread should know that already. Argue the facts instead of discussing the failings of the people you are talking to. And I’m pretty sure you are overreacting to a joke. Sorry Marley23, I went a bit mad… > [@Mangetout](#): > > I imagine pretty much any large company can be shown to have deliberately, accidentally, negligently, etc caused the death of people or animals\* (\*after all you seem to equate the two) in the past. The solution, for you, to all of your moral anguish, appears to be: become a hermit and starve yourself to death. There is a slight difference between accidents and negligent death and sending out hitmen to murder union leaders. > [@](#): > > A lawsuit filed in U.S. District Court in Florida accuses the Coca-Cola Company, its Colombian subsidiary and business affiliates of using paramilitary death squads to murder, torture, kidnap and threaten union leaders at the multinational soft drink manufacturer’s Colombian bottling plants. The suit was filed on July 20 by the United Steelworkers of America and the International Labor Rights Fund on behalf of SINALTRAINAL, the Colombian union that represents workers at Coca-Cola’s Colombian bottling plants; the estate of a murdered union leader; and five other unionists who worked for Coca-Cola and were threatened, kidnapped or tortured by paramilitaries. [http://colombiajournal.org/colombia73.htm](http://colombiajournal.org/colombia73.htm) ---
**Author:** ![Chimera](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/8e8cbc/32.png) [@Chimera](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Chimera)\ **Post date:** [October 26, 2012, 7:48pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/moral-dilemma-how-can-we-eat-without-killing-anything-for-food/638929/93 "2012-10-26T19:48:23Z")
Pretty sure at this point that the OP is not interested in arguments contrary to his position. ---
**Author:** ![destineal](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/5f9b8f/32.png) [@destineal](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/destineal)\ **Post date:** [October 26, 2012, 7:53pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/moral-dilemma-how-can-we-eat-without-killing-anything-for-food/638929/94 "2012-10-26T19:53:40Z")
You could eat stone crab only. The fishermen rip their arms off with no anesthesia. But they don’t kill them. ---
**Author:** ![JellyBeanz](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/j/ed8c4c/32.png) [@JellyBeanz](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/JellyBeanz)\ **Post date:** [October 26, 2012, 8:13pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/moral-dilemma-how-can-we-eat-without-killing-anything-for-food/638929/95 "2012-10-26T20:13:50Z")
> [@destineal](#): > > You could eat stone crab only. The fishermen rip their arms off with no anesthesia. But they don’t kill them. But eating the crab is killing the crab. :rolleyes: ---
**Author:** ![destineal](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/5f9b8f/32.png) [@destineal](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/destineal)\ **Post date:** [October 26, 2012, 8:24pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/moral-dilemma-how-can-we-eat-without-killing-anything-for-food/638929/96 "2012-10-26T20:24:33Z")
Nope. They pull off one claw and throw the crab back. The claw grows back. I’m sure the crabs aren’t very happy about it but they don’t die. ---
**Author:** ![Mangetout](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/mangetout/32/19_2.png) [@Mangetout](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Mangetout)\ **Post date:** [October 26, 2012, 8:27pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/moral-dilemma-how-can-we-eat-without-killing-anything-for-food/638929/97 "2012-10-26T20:27:49Z")
> [@JellyBeanz](#): > > There is a slight difference between accidents and negligent death and sending out hitmen to murder union leaders. Sure, but you’ve already described the killing of animals (and plants, I think) as ‘murder’. I imagine there are not many large organisations who have not at one point or another deliberately brought about the death of a living organism. So your logical choices appear to be: Take a deep breath and concede that being alive requires other things to die (and try to make sure that the things that die for your life are not the ones you really care about) or Go live in a cave and only eat dead leaves that fall off plants of their own accord ---
**Author:** ![Mangetout](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/mangetout/32/19_2.png) [@Mangetout](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Mangetout)\ **Post date:** [October 26, 2012, 8:28pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/moral-dilemma-how-can-we-eat-without-killing-anything-for-food/638929/98 "2012-10-26T20:28:50Z")
> [@destineal](#): > > Nope. They pull off one claw and throw the crab back. The claw grows back. I’m sure the crabs aren’t very happy about it but they don’t die. Actually, I imagine a lot of them do die - crabs have claws because they need them. ---
**Author:** ![XT](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/xt/32/456_2.png) [@XT](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/XT)\ **Post date:** [October 26, 2012, 8:37pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/moral-dilemma-how-can-we-eat-without-killing-anything-for-food/638929/99 "2012-10-26T20:37:41Z")
> [@Mangetout](#): > > Sure, but you’ve already described the killing of animals (and plants, I think) as ‘murder’. I imagine there are not many large organisations who have not at one point or another deliberately brought about the death of a living organism. So your logical choices appear to be: > > Take a deep breath and concede that being alive requires other things to die (and try to make sure that the things that die for your life are not the ones you really care about) > > or > > Go live in a cave and only eat dead leaves that fall off plants of their own accord Except even living in a cave and eating only dead plants will have a non-zero death toll. You can’t move or live in cave without killing something, sometime. Plus, if the OP persists in posting on the Internet s/he is killing something somewhere. The OP claims to enjoy Coke bit won’t drink it because the company had some folks allegedly murdered, but the production of ANY refined or even unrefined product is going to kill many, many organisms. Basically holding the stance the OP is trying to portray is ridiculous AND hypocritical. ---
**Author:** ![XT](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/xt/32/456_2.png) [@XT](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/XT)\ **Post date:** [October 26, 2012, 8:39pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/moral-dilemma-how-can-we-eat-without-killing-anything-for-food/638929/100 "2012-10-26T20:39:14Z")
> [@Mangetout](#): > > Actually, I imagine a lot of them do die - crabs have claws because they need them. They only take one claw and most survive. It’s called one of the most sustainable meals out there. Damn tasty too, but afaik you can only get it in some parts of Florida. Least that’s the only place I’ve seen it on a menu. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/moral-dilemma-how-can-we-eat-without-killing-anything-for-food/638929.md?page=4) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/moral-dilemma-how-can-we-eat-without-killing-anything-for-food/638929.md?page=6)