# More insanity in the drug war... **URL:** \ **Category:** Great Debates\ **Created:** [June 20, 2001, 3:40pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/more-insanity-in-the-drug-war/69480 "2001-06-20T15:40:28Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 18\ **Page:** 1
**Author:** ![Demise](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/34f0e0/32.png) [@Demise](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Demise)\ **Post date:** [June 20, 2001, 3:40pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/more-insanity-in-the-drug-war/69480/1 "2001-06-20T15:40:28Z")
[Raves are evil, apparently.](http://www.salon.com/ent/music/feature/2001/06/20/rave_feature/index.html) Glow sticks are drug paraphernalia. Dance clubs are crack houses. Air conditioned rooms are dark holes that plumb the depths of human depravity. Choice quote from the linked article: > [@](#): > > When Eddie Jordan, the New Orleans district attorney, introduced the charges against the promoters, he cited a list of evidence that the promoters had been encouraging drug use. That “evidence” included not only glowsticks, bottled water and chill rooms… Bottled water! Oh, the horrors! … When will this freakin insanity end? ---
**Author:** ![Tomcat](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/8e8cbc/32.png) [@Tomcat](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Tomcat)\ **Post date:** [June 20, 2001, 5:18pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/more-insanity-in-the-drug-war/69480/2 "2001-06-20T17:18:42Z")
Fuck 'em! Throw them all in jail! Civil rights are only a skirt behind which evil drug users and their nefarious ilk hide behind. The only good drug user is a dead drug user. Prosecuting owners of establishments for their patrons activities is America’s GOD GIVEN RIGHT! Because, as a venue operator, I have the control of everyone in attendance. Glow sticks are only the beginning! You naysayers don’t understand the problems associated with dance parties! They are centers of sin! When I was younger, we read the Bible on Friday nights, and it was good enough! The only music we needed to listen to was Bob Roberts! ‘Freewheelin’ Bob says it like it is! Sing along everyone! "Drugs stink, they make me sick Those that sell 'em and those that do 'em String 'em up from the highest tree Without a trace of sympathy Drugs stink, drugs stink Be a clean livin’ man with a rope in your hand Drugs stink, drugs stink Hang ‘em high for a clean livin’ land Potheaded weirdos, sex deviates Dancin’ fools: your day is done It’s time to leave the face of this Earth Dope smokin’ morons, dirty hippie freaks Drugs stink, drugs stink Be a clean livin’ man with a rope in your hand Drugs stink, drugs stink Hang ‘em high for a clean livin’ land!" The war on drugs is just and pure. We answer to a higher power than the Constitution. ---
**Author:** ![ssj\_man2k](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/e9bcb4/32.png) [@ssj\_man2k](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/ssj_man2k)\ **Post date:** [June 21, 2001, 6:21am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/more-insanity-in-the-drug-war/69480/3 "2001-06-21T06:21:21Z")
I hope your being sarcastic. ---
**Author:** ![Tomcat](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/8e8cbc/32.png) [@Tomcat](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Tomcat)\ **Post date:** [June 21, 2001, 7:35am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/more-insanity-in-the-drug-war/69480/4 "2001-06-21T07:35:34Z")
> [@](#): > > \*Originally posted by ssj\_man2k \* > \*\*I hope your being sarcastic. \*\* :rolleyes: ---
**Author:** ![Vinnie\_Virginslayer](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/v/53a042/32.png) [@Vinnie\_Virginslayer](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Vinnie_Virginslayer)\ **Post date:** [June 21, 2001, 2:18pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/more-insanity-in-the-drug-war/69480/5 "2001-06-21T14:18:59Z")
Way to ruin a good joke, SSJ! Good job. :mad: ---
**Author:** ![nickc](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/n/47e85d/32.png) [@nickc](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/nickc)\ **Post date:** [June 22, 2001, 11:48am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/more-insanity-in-the-drug-war/69480/6 "2001-06-22T11:48:58Z")
> [@](#): > > \*Originally posted by Vinnie Virginslayer \* > \*\*Way to ruin a good joke, SSJ! Good job. :mad: \*\* I hope you’re being sarcastic. ---
**Author:** ![LateComer](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/l/b5ac83/32.png) [@LateComer](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/LateComer)\ **Post date:** [June 22, 2001, 12:54pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/more-insanity-in-the-drug-war/69480/7 "2001-06-22T12:54:56Z")
> [@](#): > > \*Originally posted by nickc \* > \*\* > > > [@](#): > > > > \*Originally posted by Vinnie Virginslayer \* > > \*\*Way to ruin a good joke, SSJ! Good job. :mad: \*\* > > I hope you’re being sarcastic. \*\* I hope _you’re_ being sarcastic. When bottled water becomes drug paraphernalia, our country has truly reached a new low in knee-jerkism. ---
**Author:** ![tracer](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/tracer/32/20578_2.png) [@tracer](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/tracer)\ **Post date:** [June 22, 2001, 9:22pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/more-insanity-in-the-drug-war/69480/8 "2001-06-22T21:22:40Z")
I notice one of the items listed as “drug paraphernalia” in the OP’s article are **dust masks**. And not “dust” as a euphemism for angel dust, either – the regular kind of mask you might wear to filter dust or pollen out of the air you breathe. Boy, I’d hate to come down with a dust or pollen allergy **now!** I might get thrown into Federal prison! ---
**Author:** ![Dreaming\_of\_Maria\_Callas](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/f14d63/32.png) [@Dreaming\_of\_Maria\_Callas](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Dreaming_of_Maria_Callas)\ **Post date:** [June 23, 2001, 8:20am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/more-insanity-in-the-drug-war/69480/9 "2001-06-23T08:20:38Z")
Making matters worse, the civil authorities don’t have a decent enough understanding of dance music culture to know where to target. I got really pissed off last month when Twilo, arguably the world’s best progressive house club, was shut down by Giuliani and his henchmen. Twilo was a wholesome environment, its patrons were for the most part music afficiandos who came to see the world-famous DJs the club flew in. Drug users were not respected people. Meanwhile, Tunnel and Limelight, two New York clubs which have been drug havens for years, are still in operation with only occasional short-term shutdowns. Isn’t this what the War on Drugs is all about? Clueless government going after the wrong people? But as far as that article in Salon goes, pleas for compassion from ravers aren’t moving me. I know from personal experience that most ravers are teenagers looking to get high, and think of the music as simply background sounds to their chemical journeys. Dance music in serious clubs I’ll defend ceaselessly, because I believe that house is just as valid a form of art as what you’d hear at the symphony hall, but a bunch of bored teenagers wanting drugs and not really caring about the quality of what they’re supposedly there for (the music) should be stopped both because of the law and for their own good. UnuMondo ---
**Author:** ![SPOOFE](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/c5a1d2/32.png) [@SPOOFE](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/SPOOFE)\ **Post date:** [June 23, 2001, 9:45am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/more-insanity-in-the-drug-war/69480/10 "2001-06-23T09:45:43Z")
I, for one, hate nightclubs/dance clubs, and avoid going there at all costs. I also avoid taking drugs (though I have no specific qualms about it… the opportunity just never arises), and am hardly fond of getting high/drunk/stoned/whatever you wanna call it. But, dammit, the whole War On Drugs irks me to no end. Irks me, I say! IRKS!! ---
**Author:** ![capacitor](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/e47774/32.png) [@capacitor](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/capacitor)\ **Post date:** [June 23, 2001, 10:12pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/more-insanity-in-the-drug-war/69480/11 "2001-06-23T22:12:15Z")
I believe that in Twilo, someone died of an overdose. With our law-and-order mayor, that will not win too many points for you. As for Tunnel, the guy who owns it is finally quitting the business. ---
**Author:** ![capacitor](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/e47774/32.png) [@capacitor](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/capacitor)\ **Post date:** [June 23, 2001, 10:16pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/more-insanity-in-the-drug-war/69480/12 "2001-06-23T22:16:51Z")
I happen to totally agree with the actions taken. More vigilance should be done in dance parties and raves. Sorry if you disagree, but I have 31 years of pain as a result of someone else’s drug abuse. ---
**Author:** ![nickc](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/n/47e85d/32.png) [@nickc](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/nickc)\ **Post date:** [June 24, 2001, 4:14am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/more-insanity-in-the-drug-war/69480/13 "2001-06-24T04:14:28Z")
> [@](#): > > \*Originally posted by capacitor \* > \*\*I happen to totally agree with the actions taken. More vigilance should be done in dance parties and raves. Sorry if you disagree, but I have 31 years of pain as a result of someone else’s drug abuse. \*\* Excuse me if I sound callous, but how does making ‘drug paraphernalia’ illegal help stop drug abuse? Glow sticks might be neat when you’re on LSD, but it sure as hell isn’t necessary to experience a full trip. If I was a heroin addict, I’m not sure where I would turn for help. I can’t go to the police, for the obvious legal reasons, and I can’t find an establishment that will help me with my addiction with out first getting caught! Once I do get caught, they’ll give me methadone. I get addicted to methadone. Great for the people treating me, because they can now profit from my addiction. Wonderful. I admit some drugs are very bad. Nicotine, for example. I have also had to experience years of pain due to another person’s drug abuse. It’s sad to watch the degradation of a person’s health due to such abuse. Unfortunately, I could not report these people to the police with the misguided intention of helping them, because their drug was legal. If we are going to vilify illegal drugs because of their potential for harm, then we must also include nicotine and alcohol. Obviously this isn’t being done; the illegal drugs are bad simply because they are illegal. Why does that not make a lot of sense to me? I think public places where alcohol is consumed should be condemned, and the proprietors should be thrown in jail. How many people die due to drunk driving per year? I don’t see a huge difference between this and shutting down dance parties. In fact, the government claims that the motivation for the drug war is to Protect the People; if we go by that logic, bars should be at the top of the list as potential death machines. Dance parties are comparatively harmless! ---
**Author:** ![Biggirl](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/biggirl/32/3294_2.png) [@Biggirl](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Biggirl)\ **Post date:** [June 24, 2001, 4:24am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/more-insanity-in-the-drug-war/69480/14 "2001-06-24T04:24:00Z")
Really, **capacitor**. Because of a bad personal experience you agree with calling bottled water, air conditioned rooms and dust masks _drug paraphenalia_? And, because of your bad experience dance parties should be watched viligently? If you don’t watch it you’ll soon have Kevin Bacon dancing in a barn near you. ---
**Author:** ![jayjay](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/jayjay/32/6765_2.png) [@jayjay](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/jayjay)\ **Post date:** [June 24, 2001, 5:22am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/more-insanity-in-the-drug-war/69480/15 "2001-06-24T05:22:02Z")
> [@](#): > > \*Originally posted by Biggirl \* > \*\*And, because of your bad experience dance parties should be watched viligently? If you don’t watch it you’ll soon have Kevin Bacon dancing in a barn near you. \*\* And _ **NOBODY** _ wants that. jayjay ---
**Author:** ![Cervaise](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/cervaise/32/16693_2.png) [@Cervaise](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Cervaise)\ **Post date:** [June 24, 2001, 7:44am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/more-insanity-in-the-drug-war/69480/16 "2001-06-24T07:44:12Z")
The fact that some people are perfectly willing to accept ludicrous developments like this is merely evidence that the propaganda is working. ---
**Author:** ![tracer](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/tracer/32/20578_2.png) [@tracer](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/tracer)\ **Post date:** [June 24, 2001, 9:19pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/more-insanity-in-the-drug-war/69480/17 "2001-06-24T21:19:10Z")
The only thing worse than the War On Drugs’s propaganda, is the stupid majority of the public. Your average Joe and Jane is still of the opinion that the War On Drugs is necessary in the first place, and would probably continue to believe this even if the propaganda were removed. People are stupid that way. ---
**Author:** ![Dreaming\_of\_Maria\_Callas](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/f14d63/32.png) [@Dreaming\_of\_Maria\_Callas](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Dreaming_of_Maria_Callas)\ **Post date:** [June 25, 2001, 4:50am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/more-insanity-in-the-drug-war/69480/18 "2001-06-25T04:50:45Z")
> [@](#): > > \*Originally posted by capacitor \* > \*\*I believe that in Twilo, someone died of an overdose. With our law-and-order mayor, that will not win too many points for you. > > As for Tunnel, the guy who owns it is finally quitting the business. \*\* But when that happened the community of fans who frequented Twilo came out in saying that drug use is not condoned by the majority. Twilo has had five thousand people through its doors in a single night, that’s like a small town. Just because drug use happens (as it happens in any community) does not mean that the owners of the club or its community of fans support it. And I’m happy Tunnel might be disappearing, although I guess its coked-up models and pushers will have to create some new crappy venue to give NY nightlife a bad name. UnuMondo