# More Sterling Performance From The TSA **URL:** \ **Category:** The BBQ Pit\ **Created:** [March 2, 2011, 8:06pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/more-sterling-performance-from-the-tsa/573258 "2011-03-02T20:06:25Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 2
**Author:** ![Scuba\_Ben](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/278dde/32.png) [@Scuba\_Ben](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Scuba_Ben)\ **Post date:** [March 4, 2011, 3:56pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/more-sterling-performance-from-the-tsa/573258/21 "2011-03-04T15:56:00Z")
**Weird One** , one of the most useful post-9/11 reforms was requiring strengthened cockpit doors. Forcing the door open is now very time-consuming, and leads into… A major useful change in mindset post-9/11 was a disruption in the paradigm. The paradigm among flight crews and passengers used to be “cooperate and survive to be ransomed / exchanged,” now it’s “they’re probably going to wreck the plane and kill us all, so FIGHT BACK!” ---
**Author:** ![Ferret\_Herder](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/f/e47774/32.png) [@Ferret\_Herder](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Ferret_Herder)\ **Post date:** [March 4, 2011, 4:01pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/more-sterling-performance-from-the-tsa/573258/22 "2011-03-04T16:01:18Z")
> [@anya\_marie](#): > > I took my shoes off in Chicago, and emptied my pockets of change, chapstick and an mp3 player in Sarasota. I had to take my sweater off both times, and for what i’m not sure. I had my luggage searched on the return flight and i’m not sure why they opened it just that i got the little tag that said they went through my luggage. I don’t want the plane I’m flying on to crash but there’s got to be a better way to do this… The sweater-off policy is, IIRC, due to a woman in Russia who had some kind of explosives strapped around her waist. My husband once had his checked bag searched. We didn’t mind that one because in addition to the “sorry we searched your bag” slip, the agent had also neatly folded all of my husband’s clothing. Not re-folded, but **folded** - he’d originally packed in a hurry and just kind of stuffed his bag full. ---
**Author:** ![fumster](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/f/e9c0ed/32.png) [@fumster](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/fumster)\ **Post date:** [March 4, 2011, 4:30pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/more-sterling-performance-from-the-tsa/573258/23 "2011-03-04T16:30:16Z")
> [@anya\_marie](#): > > I don’t know how they grade threats but I’d like to see how i score as a 32 year old, atheist in blue jeans who wears glasses, who seems to look like a librarian to some people. How _you_ doin’. ---
**Author:** ![shiftless](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/e9c0ed/32.png) [@shiftless](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/shiftless)\ **Post date:** [March 4, 2011, 4:34pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/more-sterling-performance-from-the-tsa/573258/24 "2011-03-04T16:34:51Z")
> [@Wheelz](#): > > Eh, maybe I just don’t fly enough to find it so “awful,” but this seems like an overstatement. > > It isn’t glamourous or exciting, I’ll give you that, but my experience is usually something like: Stand in a couple of lines; put my stuff on a conveyer belt; walk through a metal detector; sit around bored at the gate for a while; and then sit in a somewhat cramped seat for a few hours. > > And for that bit of inconvenience, I’m where I wanted to go, relatively quickly and easily. I’ll take that over 40-plus hours of driving to Florida and back every time. I guess you have a lower threshold of awfulness. I wish it were as quick and easy as you describe, and I guess it can be sometimes. Last time I flew it took over 8 hours to get from New York to DC, airport to airport with not a word of explanation for the airline. Drive time, door-to-door, is something like 5 hours. I do have a low threshold of awfulness though, I know. Still, I wonder at anyone who doesn’t mind sitting in a plane for an hour or more with no information about when the thing is going to start. I have a hard time accepting that once I board a plane they own me until released, no matter how long that takes. It makes me claustrophobic. Part of that, to get back on topic, is the threat of being treated like a terrorist if I don’t like the situation enough to make a fuss. ---
**Author:** ![Steve\_MB](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/steve_mb/32/5339_2.png) [@Steve\_MB](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Steve_MB)\ **Post date:** [March 4, 2011, 4:39pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/more-sterling-performance-from-the-tsa/573258/25 "2011-03-04T16:39:05Z")
> [@CannyDan](#): > > We put all the passengers for a flight, with their luggage and carry-ons, into a closed room. They challenge each other-- “Hey, what you got in that box?” “I’ll let you paw through my bag if you show me what’s under that thick, lumpy jacket.” “I’m not flying anywhere with _that guy_ until he strips down to his shorts!” > > When everybody is comfortable with everybody else, they get on the airplane. > > 😃 “I read somewhere that they have micro-think explosive sheets that can be molded to line the insides of bras and panties… I’m going to have to insist you take them off…” 😃 ---
**Author:** ![CannyDan](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/cannydan/32/548_2.png) [@CannyDan](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/CannyDan)\ **Post date:** [March 4, 2011, 5:11pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/more-sterling-performance-from-the-tsa/573258/26 "2011-03-04T17:11:02Z")
> [@Steve\_MB](#): > > “I read somewhere that they have micro-think explosive sheets that can be molded to line the insides of bras and panties… I’m going to have to insist you take them off…” 😃 I thought about simply suggesting that everyone had to fly naked. But then I glanced in the mirror and remembered that there are way too many people who really need to keep their clothes on. Thus my advocacy for “inspection by challenge”. Just in the interests of public safety, you understand. ---
**Author:** ![The\_Weird\_One](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/7bcc69/32.png) [@The\_Weird\_One](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/The_Weird_One)\ **Post date:** [March 4, 2011, 5:45pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/more-sterling-performance-from-the-tsa/573258/27 "2011-03-04T17:45:40Z")
> [@Scuba\_Ben](#): > > **Weird One** , one of the most useful post-9/11 reforms was requiring strengthened cockpit doors. Forcing the door open is now very time-consuming, and leads into… > > A major useful change in mindset post-9/11 was a disruption in the paradigm. The paradigm among flight crews and passengers used to be “cooperate and survive to be ransomed / exchanged,” now it’s “they’re probably going to wreck the plane and kill us all, so FIGHT BACK!” That’s good to hear, and also explains why every attempted attack (that I’ve heard of) since 9/11 was explosives-based rather than hijack-based. ---
**Author:** ![phouka](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/p/c5a1d2/32.png) [@phouka](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/phouka)\ **Post date:** [March 4, 2011, 6:11pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/more-sterling-performance-from-the-tsa/573258/28 "2011-03-04T18:11:45Z")
Last time I flew, from San Diego to Seattle, and then Dallas to San Diego, I forgot to check all the pockets of my purse and ended up taking my Swiss Army Knife through security. Twice. I feel so safe. ---
**Author:** ![Wheelz](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/wheelz/32/5718_2.png) [@Wheelz](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Wheelz)\ **Post date:** [March 4, 2011, 6:30pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/more-sterling-performance-from-the-tsa/573258/29 "2011-03-04T18:30:29Z")
> [@shiftless](#): > > I wish it were as quick and easy as you describe, and I guess it can be sometimes. Last time I flew it took over 8 hours to get from New York to DC, airport to airport with not a word of explanation for the airline. Drive time, door-to-door, is something like 5 hours. I do have a low threshold of awfulness though, I know. Still, I wonder at anyone who doesn’t mind sitting in a plane for an hour or more with no information about when the thing is going to start. I have a hard time accepting that once I board a plane they own me until released, no matter how long that takes. It makes me claustrophobic. Part of that, to get back on topic, is the threat of being treated like a terrorist if I don’t like the situation enough to make a fuss. This does sound pretty awful, I agree. Still, I have to believe that this kind of thing doesn’t happen very often. When I’ve experienced delays, it seems the crews are usually pretty forthcoming about what’s going on. YMMV. Anyhow, this has nothing to do with TSA, and I’m not wading into _that_ quagmire, so I’ll be returning my seatback to its full upright position, stowing my tray table, gathering all my personal belongings and exiting the thread now. We know you have a choice of message boards and we thank you for choosing the Straight Dope. 🙂 ---
**Author:** ![Projammer](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/projammer/32/559_2.png) [@Projammer](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Projammer)\ **Post date:** [March 4, 2011, 6:51pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/more-sterling-performance-from-the-tsa/573258/30 "2011-03-04T18:51:11Z")
> [@markdash](#): > > Serious question: What level of TSA screening is “appropriate”? As **Shiftless** stated and others agreed. Walkthru metal detectors and chem sniffers. Anybody wanting to eyeball the boys gets to spring for dinner and a movie first. There are no reported cases of the TSA ever having stopped an attack and [they won’t say](http://www.techdirt.com/articles/20101119/18284511954/whether-not-tsa-has-ever-caught-terrorist-is-apparently-state-secret.shtml) that they have. Personally I’m betting not. OTOH there are many reported cases where someone has gotten on board with ill intent, and every time the TSA just adds another screening requirement. Shoe bomber? Everyone take off your shoes! What’s going to happen when someone boards with a bit of C4 or Semtex surgically implanted in their abdomen? Laproscopically, it would be a minor procedure. Sorry ma’am. You’ve been randomly selected for exploratory surgery. Sealed cockpits are the best solution against hijacking. They just don’t support an unending revenue stream. ---
**Author:** ![fachverwirrt](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/f/94ad74/32.png) [@fachverwirrt](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/fachverwirrt)\ **Post date:** [March 4, 2011, 7:19pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/more-sterling-performance-from-the-tsa/573258/31 "2011-03-04T19:19:29Z")
> [@rayman5321](#): > > Disembark, not debark. Believe it or not, sometimes the English language has more than one word for the same concept. [Debark](http://dictionary.reference.com/browse/debark). ---
**Author:** ![Ravenman](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/ravenman/32/2929_2.png) [@Ravenman](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Ravenman)\ **Post date:** [March 4, 2011, 7:49pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/more-sterling-performance-from-the-tsa/573258/32 "2011-03-04T19:49:42Z")
> [@markdash](#): > > Serious question: What level of TSA screening is “appropriate”? It is very simple. If you listen to everyone on the Internet, all anyone wants is a completely effective system of catching people with contraband that causes no inconvenience whatsoever to any traveler. Also, the system should be run by highly educated professionals who are not only impeccably trained on the machinery, but who are also as suave and personable as Cary Grant in order to make every flier feel like a king. And they should be volunteers, because nobody likes how much it costs to run the TSA. Is that so much to ask for? The vast number of security experts on the Internet think it should be pretty easy to do. ---
**Author:** ![Max\_Torque](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/e9bcb4/32.png) [@Max\_Torque](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Max_Torque)\ **Post date:** [March 4, 2011, 9:26pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/more-sterling-performance-from-the-tsa/573258/33 "2011-03-04T21:26:54Z")
> [@Steve\_MB](#): > > “I read somewhere that they have micro-think explosive sheets that can be molded to line the insides of bras and panties… I’m going to have to insist you take them off…” 😃 Rob Schneider, airport security screener, to passenger Sharon Stone: “Arch your back…for more security.” ---
**Author:** ![running\_coach](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/running_coach/32/15836_2.png) [@running\_coach](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/running_coach)\ **Post date:** [March 4, 2011, 9:34pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/more-sterling-performance-from-the-tsa/573258/34 "2011-03-04T21:34:04Z")
> [@markdash](#): > > Serious question: What level of TSA screening is “appropriate”? > > There are a lot of critics of the TSA and their searching/scanning procedures on this board. I’m curious just how much searching would be proper. I would assume scanning passenger luggage for explosives and metal detection would be OK, but that a lot of the patdowns and such is unnecessary. But I’ll let you guys speak for yourselves. How about more competence and professionalism and less theft for starters. ---
**Author:** ![mundylion](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/mundylion/32/3604_2.png) [@mundylion](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/mundylion)\ **Post date:** [March 4, 2011, 9:43pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/more-sterling-performance-from-the-tsa/573258/35 "2011-03-04T21:43:53Z")
> [@Ravenman](#): > > It is very simple. If you listen to everyone on the Internet, all anyone wants is a completely effective system of catching people with contraband that causes no inconvenience whatsoever to any traveler. Nonsense. Did anyone in this thread suggest what you are saying? We all know that TSA is largely security theater, not needed to safeguard air travel. But our elected representatives think we need them and they sure provide lots of jobs. So we have them and, what bugs me no end, are all very afraid of them. No one in his right mind dares say anything at all to a TSA agent except, Yes Sir, Yes Ma’am, Thank you Sir, lest you get strip searched and jailed. If terrorists want to blow up a plane, they will do it. TSA can only catch the stupid ones and that does not need such heavily intrusive screening as they do now. And all intelligent people know that this is true, and also know that the odds of any successful attempt affecting any specific individual are infinitesimal. We could save more lives in a year by outlawing left turns on our highways but we don’t do that, we accept the losses to avoid all the pain. We need the same outlook on air travel. ---
**Author:** ![Ravenman](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/ravenman/32/2929_2.png) [@Ravenman](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Ravenman)\ **Post date:** [March 4, 2011, 10:13pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/more-sterling-performance-from-the-tsa/573258/36 "2011-03-04T22:13:47Z")
nm ---
**Author:** ![Moirai](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/96bed5/32.png) [@Moirai](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Moirai)\ **Post date:** [March 5, 2011, 12:51am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/more-sterling-performance-from-the-tsa/573258/37 "2011-03-05T00:51:15Z")
> [@Scuba\_Ben](#): > > **Weird One** , one of the most useful post-9/11 reforms was requiring strengthened cockpit doors. Forcing the door open is now very time-consuming… Is the bulkhead “wall” between the lavatory and the cockpit reinforced as well? Cuz it looks pretty flimsy… My kids are both competitive saber fencers. I’ve probably told this story before, but due to the high cost of the equipment, we take everything except the sabers themselves in carry on bags (the sabers are in hard plastic golf travel bags). Only ONCE has a screener even batted an eye at seeing a stainless steel mesh face mask and a stainless steel conductive jacket with wires coming out all over the place. I even said one time, “Wow, you must know fencing!”. Blank look- she hadn’t noticed that was in the bag as it went through the X-ray. :rolleyes: ---
**Author:** ![anya\_marie](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/ebca7d/32.png) [@anya\_marie](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/anya_marie)\ **Post date:** [March 5, 2011, 9:26am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/more-sterling-performance-from-the-tsa/573258/38 "2011-03-05T09:26:42Z")
I’m ok Having flown recently, i just have questions… So, I packed my luggage and came in just under the 50 pound limit, and had a bunch of random stuff of mine squished in together, a suit, a gown, photo albums, cross-stitch projects, souvenirs, CD wallet, yearbook… plus the usual toiletries and clothes. Did my luggage fulfill some randomness requirement? ---
**Author:** ![HookerChemical](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/h/278dde/32.png) [@HookerChemical](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/HookerChemical)\ **Post date:** [March 5, 2011, 3:44pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/more-sterling-performance-from-the-tsa/573258/39 "2011-03-05T15:44:06Z")
> [@markdash](#): > > Serious question: What level of TSA screening is “appropriate”? This is a question I’m not sure the TSA has asked themselves. Their procedures area almost always geared to catch yesterdays threat, no matter the inconvenience, intrusion, threat, or effectiveness. This results in lots of procedures that are a tiny bit effective and a lot invasive. ---
**Author:** ![aruvqan](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/aruvqan/32/2891_2.png) [@aruvqan](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/aruvqan)\ **Post date:** [March 5, 2011, 10:23pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/more-sterling-performance-from-the-tsa/573258/40 "2011-03-05T22:23:47Z")
I would be down with a chemicals sniffer, and I am OK with being wanded, or if they can come up with totally wooden crutches walking through the metal detector. I really do not like the fact that others can go through the pornoscan and I have to get groped. I really do not like being touched, frequently I am in enough background pain that even the light bouncing of someone else pushing a wheelchair with me in it is excruciating, so being poked and prodded is annoyingly painful. Christ on a pogo stick. I have had multiple security clearances for 30+ fucking years. I have had the FBI do everything except crawl up my ass, I really doubt that I am any sort of security problem. I would love to have some sort of damned card so I can avoid the whole mess. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/more-sterling-performance-from-the-tsa/573258.md?page=1) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/more-sterling-performance-from-the-tsa/573258.md?page=3)