# Mormon and Catholic doctrines on sexuality pretty much the same? **URL:** \ **Category:** Factual Questions\ **Created:** [January 6, 2006, 5:47am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/mormon-and-catholic-doctrines-on-sexuality-pretty-much-the-same/338710 "2006-01-06T05:47:05Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 1
**Author:** ![Elendil\_s\_Heir](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/7cd45c/32.png) [@Elendil\_s\_Heir](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Elendil_s_Heir)\ **Post date:** [January 6, 2006, 5:47am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/mormon-and-catholic-doctrines-on-sexuality-pretty-much-the-same/338710/1 "2006-01-06T05:47:05Z")
From what I’ve read, both churches have pretty much the same outlook on the big contemporary issues of human sexuality: - abortion prohibited - contraception prohibited - human stem-cell and cloning research condemned (although Sen. Orrin Hatch has parted ways with the LDS over the former) - IVF and most high-tech means of conception prohibited - premarital sex strongly discouraged - homosexuality strongly discouraged - unmarried cohabitation strongly discouraged - marriage strongly encouraged - big families strongly encouraged Do I have this right? And do you think American Mormons are more likely than American Catholics to obey their churches’ teaching on these points? FWIW, I’m neither Mormon nor Catholic. I’m not looking for a debate on the wisdom or foolishness of either church’s doctrine, I’d just like to have a comparison. ---
**Author:** ![Monty](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/monty/32/47_2.png) [@Monty](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Monty)\ **Post date:** [January 6, 2006, 6:24am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/mormon-and-catholic-doctrines-on-sexuality-pretty-much-the-same/338710/2 "2006-01-06T06:24:33Z")
As an LDS, I’ll give you my take on a few items in your list as regards my Church: > [@Elendil's Heir](#): > > - contraception prohibited Actually, that’s left up to the couple. > [@](#): > > - IVF and most high-tech means of conception prohibited From what I understand, those means of conception are not prohibited for a married couple if the sperm and ovum are both from the married couple. > [@](#): > > - premarital sex strongly discouraged Prohibited. > [@](#): > > - homosexuality strongly discouraged Just homosexual activity is prohibited. > [@](#): > > - unmarried cohabitation strongly discouraged Prohibited. > [@](#): > > - marriage strongly encouraged Yes. > [@](#): > > - big families strongly encouraged That’s not Church policy but rather what’s called Cultural Mormonism that strongly encourages large families. AFAIK, the Church recommends having the number of children whom the couple can support. > [@](#): > > And do you think American Mormons are more likely than American Catholics to obey their churches’ teaching on these points? That’s a tough one to answer. I’d say that fully practicing Catholics and active Mormons are both likely to follow their church’s teachings on these matters. ---
**Author:** ![Cunctator](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/43a26b/32.png) [@Cunctator](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Cunctator)\ **Post date:** [January 6, 2006, 6:54am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/mormon-and-catholic-doctrines-on-sexuality-pretty-much-the-same/338710/3 "2006-01-06T06:54:22Z")
There are a couple of corrections needed from the Catholic point of view too: Premarital sex is prohibited, not merely strongly discouraged. Ditto for homosexual activity. I’m not sure what you mean by “unmarried cohabitation”. The Catholic Church has no problems with an unmarried couple physically living together as long as they are not having sexual relations. If you mean “living together” = “having sex like a married couple without benefit of the sacrament of marriage”, then that’s prohibited. Marriage is strongly encouraged, since it’s likely to be the vocation that best fits the majority of Catholics. However, alternative vocations (the priesthood, the religious life, the celibate single life) are also strongly supported. As for the question of big families - I don’t think they’re actively encouraged nowadays _per se,_ although they have historically resulted from the prohibition of contraception. I can’t comment on the relative fidelity of Catholics and Mormons to their respective churches’ teachings other than to echo what \*\*Monty \*\* said. Fully practising members of both churches will accept all of these teachings. ---
**Author:** ![treis](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/bc79bd/32.png) [@treis](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/treis)\ **Post date:** [January 6, 2006, 7:59am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/mormon-and-catholic-doctrines-on-sexuality-pretty-much-the-same/338710/4 "2006-01-06T07:59:31Z")
> [@Monty](#): > > Just homosexual activity is prohibited. What do you mean by just homosexual activity? Does that mean its ok to bugger a man on the side if you are married to a woman? Or is it a hate the sin not the sinner deal? ---
**Author:** ![Monty](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/monty/32/47_2.png) [@Monty](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Monty)\ **Post date:** [January 6, 2006, 8:07am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/mormon-and-catholic-doctrines-on-sexuality-pretty-much-the-same/338710/5 "2006-01-06T08:07:52Z")
> [@treis](#): > > What do you mean by just homosexual activity? Sexual activity involving two (or more) members of the same gender. > [@](#): > > Does that mean its ok to bugger a man on the side if you are married to a woman? Where would you get that from my posting? Anyway, for two reasons it’s not okay as far as the Church is concerned: (1) it’s homosexual activity and (2) it’s being unfaithful to the wife. > [@](#): > > Or is it a hate the sin not the sinner deal? Yes, I think that’s the official stance. ---
**Author:** ![Monty](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/monty/32/47_2.png) [@Monty](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Monty)\ **Post date:** [January 6, 2006, 8:09am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/mormon-and-catholic-doctrines-on-sexuality-pretty-much-the-same/338710/6 "2006-01-06T08:09:20Z")
Ah! I just realized you’re referring to the word _just_ in my posting. Got it. I meant that it’s the homosexual activity that’s prohibited, not the mere fact of being homosexual. ---
**Author:** ![treis](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/bc79bd/32.png) [@treis](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/treis)\ **Post date:** [January 6, 2006, 8:17am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/mormon-and-catholic-doctrines-on-sexuality-pretty-much-the-same/338710/7 "2006-01-06T08:17:33Z")
> [@Monty](#): > > Ah! I just realized you’re referring to the word _just_ in my posting. Got it. I meant that it’s the homosexual activity that’s prohibited, not the mere fact of being homosexual. No problem and thanks for the answer. ---
**Author:** ![Monty](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/monty/32/47_2.png) [@Monty](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Monty)\ **Post date:** [January 6, 2006, 11:24am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/mormon-and-catholic-doctrines-on-sexuality-pretty-much-the-same/338710/8 "2006-01-06T11:24:15Z")
Coolness, treis. ---
**Author:** ![Monty](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/monty/32/47_2.png) [@Monty](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Monty)\ **Post date:** [January 6, 2006, 11:26am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/mormon-and-catholic-doctrines-on-sexuality-pretty-much-the-same/338710/9 "2006-01-06T11:26:01Z")
BTW, do you find it as funny as I do that in a thread specifically about Catholics and Mormons, one of the ads at the bottom is about preparing for the Hajj? ---
**Author:** ![Excalibre](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/898d66/32.png) [@Excalibre](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Excalibre)\ **Post date:** [January 6, 2006, 12:23pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/mormon-and-catholic-doctrines-on-sexuality-pretty-much-the-same/338710/10 "2006-01-06T12:23:26Z")
I don’t know how it is worldwide, but in the United States, at least according to surveys I’ve heard, most practicing Catholics don’t hold to the Church’s doctrine on contraception. ---
**Author:** ![CalMeacham](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/calmeacham/32/35_2.png) [@CalMeacham](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/CalMeacham)\ **Post date:** [January 6, 2006, 1:43pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/mormon-and-catholic-doctrines-on-sexuality-pretty-much-the-same/338710/11 "2006-01-06T13:43:51Z")
I think **Monty’s** right about the Big Family thing being “cultural Mormonism” rather than Chrch-mandated. Furthermore, I think “Cultural Catholicism” never encouraged large familiees. They were, I think (and as **Cunctator** has claimed) a result of the anti-contraceptive stance. On the other hand, I notice that families of my generation were pretty small - one or two kids, usually, which tells me that all those Catholic parents were abstaining, unlucky at conceiving , or (most likely) really using birth control when they weren’t supposed to be. LDS are more vocal and active in pro-family activities. I get the impression that they’re more into organizing family activities than catholics are. That Family Home Evening probably spurs a lot of that. I definitely got the impression when I lived in SLC that, although Catholics are perceived as very conservative in the rest of the U.S. 9at least the parts where I’ve lived), they seem positively Liberal compared to the LDS in Salt Lake. ---
**Author:** ![Balthisar](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/balthisar/32/2825_2.png) [@Balthisar](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Balthisar)\ **Post date:** [January 6, 2006, 1:49pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/mormon-and-catholic-doctrines-on-sexuality-pretty-much-the-same/338710/12 "2006-01-06T13:49:02Z")
> [@Excalibre](#): > > I don’t know how it is worldwide, but in the United States, at least according to surveys I’ve heard, most practicing Catholics don’t hold to the Church’s doctrine on contraception. The cynical reply would be that they’re not truly practicing Catholics, then. “Practice” is kind of one of the key words there. Maybe lip-service-paying Catholics is a better term, but then you’d be down to maybe 1% of the population that counts as “practicing.” ---
**Author:** ![Excalibre](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/898d66/32.png) [@Excalibre](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Excalibre)\ **Post date:** [January 6, 2006, 2:09pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/mormon-and-catholic-doctrines-on-sexuality-pretty-much-the-same/338710/13 "2006-01-06T14:09:59Z")
> [@Balthisar](#): > > The cynical reply would be that they’re not truly practicing Catholics, then. “Practice” is kind of one of the key words there. Maybe lip-service-paying Catholics is a better term, but then you’d be down to maybe 1% of the population that counts as “practicing.” Yeah, I get all that. But isn’t it the case that the Catholic Church recognizes that some things are matters of dogma (like the Virgin Birth and stuff) that you have to believe, and other things you can disbelieve as the result of conscientious consideration? ---
**Author:** ![Reloy3](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/c68b51/32.png) [@Reloy3](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Reloy3)\ **Post date:** [January 6, 2006, 8:01pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/mormon-and-catholic-doctrines-on-sexuality-pretty-much-the-same/338710/14 "2006-01-06T20:01:14Z")
> [@Elendil's Heir](#): > > From what I’ve read, both churches have pretty much the same outlook on the big contemporary issues of human sexuality: > > - human stem-cell and cloning research condemned (although Sen. Orrin Hatch has parted ways with the LDS over the former) > Do I have this right? The LDS (Mormon) Church has never taken a stand on either issue. From the LDS Church’s website for news reporters found [here.](http://www.lds.org/newsroom/issues/answer/0,19491,6056-1-181-16-181,00.html) > [@](#): > > The First Presidency of The Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-day Saints has not taken a position regarding the use of embryonic stem cells for research purposes. The absence of a position should not be interpreted as support for or opposition to any other statement made by Church members, whether they are for or against embryonic stem cell research. Also, on abortion, there are exceptions to the absolute “no-abortion” rule. From the same [website.](http://www.lds.org/newsroom/issues/answer/0,19491,6056-1-201-10-201,00.html) > [@](#): > > The Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-day Saints believes in the sanctity of human life. Therefore, the Church opposes elective abortion for personal or social convenience, and counsels its members not to submit to, perform, encourage, pay for, or arrange for such abortions. > > The Church allows for possible exceptions for its members when: > > • Pregnancy results from rape or incest, or > > • A competent physician determines that the life or health of the mother is in serious jeopardy, or > > • A competent physician determines that the fetus has severe defects that will not allow the baby to survive beyond birth. > > The Church teaches its members that even these rare exceptions do not justify abortion automatically. Abortion is a most serious matter and should be considered only after the persons involved have consulted with their local church leaders and feel through personal prayer that their decision is correct. > > The Church has not favored or opposed legislative proposals or public demonstrations concerning abortion. Finally, the thread title refers to church **doctrine** regarding sex, rather than just policy. My understanding is that Catholics and Mormons differ significantly on doctrine, for example, LDS Church doctrine does not believe in original sin, priesthood celebacy, or the perpetual virginity or immaculate conception of Mary, the mother of Jesus (meaning mary’s immaculate conception, LDS doctrine does endorse the virgin birth). Hope that helps. ---
**Author:** ![smiling\_bandit](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/e9a140/32.png) [@smiling\_bandit](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/smiling_bandit)\ **Post date:** [January 6, 2006, 8:08pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/mormon-and-catholic-doctrines-on-sexuality-pretty-much-the-same/338710/15 "2006-01-06T20:08:57Z")
Just a note here: Sexual sins are not terribly, terribly serious in the Catholic Church, albeit definitely frowned upon. They probably get more attention than other sins of the same caliber. That doesn’t mean it’s OK to do them, but it’s more or less recognized that a fair portion of the population will regardless. ---
**Author:** ![Guinastasia](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/guinastasia/32/5751_2.png) [@Guinastasia](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Guinastasia)\ **Post date:** [January 7, 2006, 12:42am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/mormon-and-catholic-doctrines-on-sexuality-pretty-much-the-same/338710/16 "2006-01-07T00:42:04Z")
And Catholicism has NO exceptions for abortion-supposedly the life of the mother is one, but even then it’s very iffy. ---
**Author:** ![Cunctator](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/43a26b/32.png) [@Cunctator](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Cunctator)\ **Post date:** [January 7, 2006, 12:49am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/mormon-and-catholic-doctrines-on-sexuality-pretty-much-the-same/338710/17 "2006-01-07T00:49:31Z")
> [@Guinastasia](#): > > And Catholicism has NO exceptions for abortion-supposedly the life of the mother is one, but even then it’s very iffy. I’ve never even seen “saving the life of the mother” given as a justification in Catholic theology, since this (possible) good still involves the (definite) harm of the killing of the baby. ---
**Author:** ![Guinastasia](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/guinastasia/32/5751_2.png) [@Guinastasia](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Guinastasia)\ **Post date:** [January 7, 2006, 1:19am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/mormon-and-catholic-doctrines-on-sexuality-pretty-much-the-same/338710/18 "2006-01-07T01:19:26Z")
Well, occassionally you’ll see a woman given life-saving treatment with the acknowledgment that it MIGHT harm the fetus, but only indirectly (in other words, if your main goal is to save the woman’s life, anything that happens is just casualties.) Strangely, I’ve even heard of Catholic hospitals denying a woman with a ectopic pregnancy an abortion. ---
**Author:** ![Jennshark](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/j/8e8cbc/32.png) [@Jennshark](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Jennshark)\ **Post date:** [January 7, 2006, 2:49am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/mormon-and-catholic-doctrines-on-sexuality-pretty-much-the-same/338710/19 "2006-01-07T02:49:23Z")
I was born and raised in Utah as a Mormon (been out of the faith for years) but growing up in the '70s I remember families being strongly encouraged to keep popping kids out. The rhetoric was that there are “little spirits waiting up in heaven” to come down to their families. Desperately poor families in my neighborhood churned out 12, 13, and 14 kids as a commitment to make sure that everyone waiting in heaven got a chance to come to earth and live in Provo! Sure, they lived in shittacious squalor, but God sent 'em for some reason . . . I have noticed that many of my faithful cousins, however, have kept their brood down to a more manageable four or so kidlets. Maybe there has been a cultural change. ---
**Author:** ![even\_sven](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/dfb087/32.png) [@even\_sven](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/even_sven)\ **Post date:** [January 7, 2006, 4:34am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/mormon-and-catholic-doctrines-on-sexuality-pretty-much-the-same/338710/20 "2006-01-07T04:34:40Z")
Although the beliefs looks similar, they come from very different places. Mormons believe that [families remain together in the afterlife](http://www.mormon.org/learn/0,8672,1146-1,00.html). Furthermore, they believe that there are multiple levels of heaven, and that in order to reach the highest you must be married in a Mormon temple (something even Mormons can only do after a lengthy qualification process.) Marriage is one of the main points of life in Mormonism. Here is [some good reading](http://www.lightplanet.com/mormons/basic/family/marriage/index.htm). Catholicism isn’t so much in to marriage as much against sexual sin. And they aren’t so much in to children as much as in to life in general (hence their anti-death penalty stance.) Their stances end up being very pro-family, but they don’t have the same kind of strong religious beliefs about the actual nature of the family that the LDS church does. They like families, but ultimately they aren’t spiritually important. Upon death, families will no longer matter. It’s your walk with God that matters. Anyway, there isn’t really much of a way to be a “non-practicing” Mormon. If you aren’t a strongly practicing member, you won’t be allowed in the temple, you’ll be pretty uncomfortable in the meeting halls, and you won’t be promised the same salvation that practicing Mormons get. Mormon communities, even within larger communities, still have a small-town feel and your personal life will come up and if people disapprove of it you will face a “council of love” who will proscribe repentances, which may include banning you… It’s not like being a lapsed Catholic and showing up on Easter and Christmas and going to confession a couple times a year and nobody will ask you any questions. Furthermore, your average Joe doesn’t have a chance in hell of actually being excommunicated from the Catholic church, but LDS excommunicates all the time. [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/mormon-and-catholic-doctrines-on-sexuality-pretty-much-the-same/338710.md?page=2)