# Most blatant COVID-19 related government overreach in the US so far **URL:** \ **Category:** Politics & Elections\ **Created:** [April 10, 2020, 6:02pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/most-blatant-covid-19-related-government-overreach-in-the-us-so-far/851519 "2020-04-10T18:02:45Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 2
**Author:** ![Senegoid](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/senegoid/32/6606_2.png) [@Senegoid](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Senegoid)\ **Post date:** [April 11, 2020, 5:42am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/most-blatant-covid-19-related-government-overreach-in-the-us-so-far/851519/21 "2020-04-11T05:42:28Z")
> [@Darth\_Sensitive](#): > > There were 149 recorded tornadoes in OK last year (most on record); 103 weak, 13 strong, 0 violent, and 33 unrateable (because they didn’t hit anything). Out of those, 4 died and 48 were injured. 2 deaths and 29 injuries came from one tornado that came essentially out of nowhere; [side-track] 😕 What does a tornado have to do, to be called “violent”? [/side-track] ---
**Author:** ![Senegoid](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/senegoid/32/6606_2.png) [@Senegoid](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Senegoid)\ **Post date:** [April 11, 2020, 5:52am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/most-blatant-covid-19-related-government-overreach-in-the-us-so-far/851519/22 "2020-04-11T05:52:35Z")
Just in the thinking-about-it stage (AFAIK): Mandated use of tracking apps to follow known positive peeps, that will warn other nearby users that someone positive is nearby. I’m not aware that this is actually happening anywhere. Fear that such apps will inevitably lead to privacy violations and building of a (possibly clandestine) registry of positive people and their movements. (Too much paranoia maybe?) In a similar vein: Talk of widespread antibody testing, with some kind of government-issued certificate to antibody-positive people, certifying that they are “safe” to be out in public, go back to work or school, and in general participate in re-starting the economy. (ETA: I think Dr. Fauci was talking about this idea.) Fear that this, likewise, will lead to some kind of government mandate to get tested, and a registry (IINM, Rand Paul expressed a concern like that), and also concern that this will lead to a two-tier caste system. These are the kinds of things that may just be really important in controlling a dangerous epidemic, but will certainly be massively controversial. ---
**Author:** ![septimus](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/septimus/32/410_2.png) [@septimus](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/septimus)\ **Post date:** [April 11, 2020, 9:28am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/most-blatant-covid-19-related-government-overreach-in-the-us-so-far/851519/23 "2020-04-11T09:28:24Z")
> [@Senegoid](#): > > Just in the thinking-about-it stage (AFAIK): Mandated use of tracking apps to follow known positive peeps, that will warn other nearby users that someone positive is nearby. I’m not aware that this is actually happening anywhere. Fear that such apps will inevitably lead to privacy violations and building of a (possibly clandestine) registry of positive people and their movements. > … > In a similar vein: Talk of widespread antibody testing, with some kind of government-issued certificate to antibody-positive people, certifying that they are “safe” to be out in public, go back to work or school, and in general participate in re-starting the economy… Isn’t much of this already operating in China and Taiwan? (Though I’ve not heard of the “warning” app. And presumably Chinese can make trips while leaving their cell-phone tracker at home.) I’ve heard that the use of such tracking is a big reason why China has contained the virus successfully. And presumably the world will want to resume its 2019 ways but with such apps available to decrease danger when the next such virus strikes. Many young people seem unfazed by the loss of privacy associated with smartphones. I’m an old-timer not over-fond of modern high-tech, but mitigating pandemics does seem appropriate. Many (older?) Americans seem bitter about “loss of rights”, and unconcerned that measures might save a million lives. Are people in other countries reacting similarly, or is this primarily an American thing? ---
**Author:** ![russian\_heel](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/f05b48/32.png) [@russian\_heel](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/russian_heel)\ **Post date:** [April 11, 2020, 10:11am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/most-blatant-covid-19-related-government-overreach-in-the-us-so-far/851519/24 "2020-04-11T10:11:29Z")
> [@Eonwe](#): > > How about [suspending Democracy in Wisconsin](https://www.nytimes.com/2020/04/09/opinion/wisconsin-primary-supreme-court.html)? As the old saying goes at times “the law is a Ass”. Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk ---
**Author:** ![Smapti](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/smapti/32/17938_2.png) [@Smapti](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Smapti)\ **Post date:** [April 11, 2020, 10:17am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/most-blatant-covid-19-related-government-overreach-in-the-us-so-far/851519/25 "2020-04-11T10:17:37Z")
> [@Sigene](#): > > I’ve wondered how these rules and laws can ultimately pass muster with the first amendment with the right to peaceably assemble. Spreading a highly contagious and potentially fatal disease doesn’t sound very “peaceable” to me. ---
**Author:** ![russian\_heel](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/f05b48/32.png) [@russian\_heel](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/russian_heel)\ **Post date:** [April 11, 2020, 10:21am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/most-blatant-covid-19-related-government-overreach-in-the-us-so-far/851519/26 "2020-04-11T10:21:29Z")
> [@MEBuckner](#): > > Yes, obviously no one is going to be running down to the gun store _as someone is kicking in the front door of their house_, pandemic or no pandemic. But, someone could be facing a threat–an angry neighbor or an ex-boyfriend–which isn’t imminent enough to make calling the police feasible, but is potentially sufficiently imminent that action can’t wait for who knows how many weeks or months. “You used the court’s new emergency web-based system to file for a restraining order already? OK, well, call us if he actually shows up at your house. We’ll get there as quick as we can.” Of course _most_ of the increase in gun purchases right now is related to fears over COVID-19, and as such, those fears are somewhat inchoate–though, hey, it’s still people wanting to exercise a constitutional right–but even in a pandemic, life goes on, for both good and ill. > > Also, restrictions on public gatherings that are genuinely motivated by attempts to stop the spread of the virus–and _only_ to stop the spread of the virus–might warrant restrictions on gun shops–along with everything else–though there might be ways to accommodate people’s needs and desires short of closing down gun ships completely, like rules restricting (even sharply restricting) the number of customers who can be in the store at any moment. That could make gun purchases inconvenient and even difficult, especially if general demand is spiking, but at least it’s not making them impossible. > > But as **Asuka** alluded to, at least some of the desire to close down gun shops seems to be motivated by agendas unrelated to the need to combat the pandemic. (As are, of course, many if not most of the restrictions on abortion clinics.) From the _Slate_ article [“Why Some Democratic Governors Are Avoiding Closing Gun Stores During the Pandemic”](https://slate.com/news-and-politics/2020/04/constitutional-closing-gun-stores-coronavirus.html) from a few days ago: > > There are already laws prohibiting felons, domestic abusers, drug addicts, or people who’ve been involuntarily committed from having guns. But it’s not constitutional to prevent people from buying guns for the defense of themselves and their families simply based on a generalized fear of “unprecedented economic pressure and social isolation”. How is purchasing firearms essential? It’s 4/11 and so far I do not see roving bands of brigands outside my house roaming around in search of personal possessions and thanks to shelter in place laws I doubt there are any in cities as well and I have heard of very few crimes on other affected countries as well. (Oh that’s right—- they have fun control in almost every other Western country!) So far, I see little or no reason to purchase firearms during this crisis, other than to use them to rob essentials from others. Stay at home, and take the money you were going to spend on that useless assault rifle to feed your family or donate it to a good cause. Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk ---
**Author:** ![RTFirefly](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/c77e96/32.png) [@RTFirefly](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/RTFirefly)\ **Post date:** [April 11, 2020, 10:49am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/most-blatant-covid-19-related-government-overreach-in-the-us-so-far/851519/27 "2020-04-11T10:49:18Z")
> [@MEBuckner](#): > > Yes, obviously no one is going to be running down to the gun store _as someone is kicking in the front door of their house_, pandemic or no pandemic. But, someone could be facing a threat–an angry neighbor or an ex-boyfriend–which isn’t imminent enough to make calling the police feasible, but is potentially sufficiently imminent that action can’t wait for who knows how many weeks or months. This is a situation where universal gun registration would be a plus: they could be allowed to sell one handgun to any person who doesn’t already have one, but any transactions beyond that would be nonessential. ---
**Author:** ![Babale](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/babale/32/15666_2.png) [@Babale](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Babale)\ **Post date:** [April 11, 2020, 10:53am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/most-blatant-covid-19-related-government-overreach-in-the-us-so-far/851519/28 "2020-04-11T10:53:41Z")
> [@AHunter3](#): > > I think if you ever need a handgun Nobody NEEDS a handgun. No, seriously, no one does. ---
**Author:** ![Lord\_Feldon](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/lord_feldon/32/341_2.png) [@Lord\_Feldon](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Lord_Feldon)\ **Post date:** [April 11, 2020, 11:34am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/most-blatant-covid-19-related-government-overreach-in-the-us-so-far/851519/29 "2020-04-11T11:34:20Z")
> [@Senegoid](#): > > [side-track] > 😕 What does a tornado have to do, to be called “violent”? > [/side-track] Violent means EF4 or EF5. ---
**Author:** ![kayaker](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/kayaker/32/441_2.png) [@kayaker](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/kayaker)\ **Post date:** [April 11, 2020, 1:47pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/most-blatant-covid-19-related-government-overreach-in-the-us-so-far/851519/30 "2020-04-11T13:47:38Z")
> [@jtur88](#): > > However, the countries with the highest death rates are those where people have the greatest freedom to ignore orders to protect public safety. More people will die if they are allowed to party through the storm. [Silveria Jacobs, the prime minister of Sint Maarten, isn’t accepting any of your excuses for leaving your house.](https://www.buzzfeednews.com/article/emmanuelfelton/coronavirus-viral-caribbean-video-message-sint-maarten)“If you do not have bread, eat crackers”. I met Ms Jacobs a few months ago, before all of this, and she impressed the hell outa me. Her speech inspires confidence. Compare that with, “people should be praising me for what I’ve done”. ---
**Author:** ![The\_Vorlon](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/d07c76/32.png) [@The\_Vorlon](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/The_Vorlon)\ **Post date:** [April 11, 2020, 3:47pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/most-blatant-covid-19-related-government-overreach-in-the-us-so-far/851519/31 "2020-04-11T15:47:48Z")
The RI governor has gone into full goosestep mode. The MI governor has taken leave of common sense also. Charlie Parker, er, Baker, in MA somehow thinks the second amendment, both federal and state, is optional. ---
**Author:** ![Senegoid](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/senegoid/32/6606_2.png) [@Senegoid](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Senegoid)\ **Post date:** [April 11, 2020, 7:07pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/most-blatant-covid-19-related-government-overreach-in-the-us-so-far/851519/32 "2020-04-11T19:07:35Z")
> [@russian\_heel](#): > > (Oh that’s right—- they have fun control in almost every other Western country!) This is why we can’t have nice things! 😉 ---
**Author:** ![RioRico](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/f04885/32.png) [@RioRico](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/RioRico)\ **Post date:** [April 11, 2020, 7:15pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/most-blatant-covid-19-related-government-overreach-in-the-us-so-far/851519/33 "2020-04-11T19:15:22Z")
Personal firearms are needed to shoot rattlesnakes and divert stampeding cattle (though my Doberman did a good job with the latter). But I digress. I’ve not personally witnessed any local or state government overr-each but I do notice stupendous federal under-reach because of a totally incompetent impeached executive. I foresee criminal negligence prosecutions in a best-case scenario. ---
**Author:** ![D\_Anconia](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/67e7ee/32.png) [@D\_Anconia](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/D_Anconia)\ **Post date:** [April 12, 2020, 1:13am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/most-blatant-covid-19-related-government-overreach-in-the-us-so-far/851519/34 "2020-04-12T01:13:01Z")
> [@Babale](#): > > Nobody NEEDS a handgun. No, seriously, no one does. Not even LEOs? ---
**Author:** ![RioRico](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/f04885/32.png) [@RioRico](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/RioRico)\ **Post date:** [April 12, 2020, 1:29am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/most-blatant-covid-19-related-government-overreach-in-the-us-so-far/851519/35 "2020-04-12T01:29:12Z")
> [@D\_Anconia](#): > > Not even LEOs? I’m sure some Brits can answer that. But this is USA, where lax concealed-carry regs mean cops and civilians alike MUST assume that non-nudes are carrying. Everyone is potentially armed and dangerous. If someone looks at you or a cop funny, they’re a potential attacker, so be ready to shoot first. Failure is suicidal. You just stand there, looking cute. And if someone moves, you shoot! For federal overreach, look at SCOTUS deciding corporations are persons, money is speech, firearms are personal and fuck a well-regulated militia, states can limit voting rights, and LEOs can confiscate property without a court order. How’s THEM apples? COVID overreach at any level of government is probably less deadly than neglect. Your survival may vary. ---
**Author:** ![jtur88](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/j/e9c0ed/32.png) [@jtur88](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/jtur88)\ **Post date:** [April 12, 2020, 1:30am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/most-blatant-covid-19-related-government-overreach-in-the-us-so-far/851519/36 "2020-04-12T01:30:25Z")
> [@D\_Anconia](#): > > Not even LEOs? Not even LEOs. Police on the beat, into the 70s or 80s, did not carry guns in most British cities and some in Canada. By the way, here’s a thought. Every covid death was caused by somebody breaking the quarantine rules. ---
**Author:** ![running\_coach](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/running_coach/32/15836_2.png) [@running\_coach](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/running_coach)\ **Post date:** [April 12, 2020, 1:31am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/most-blatant-covid-19-related-government-overreach-in-the-us-so-far/851519/37 "2020-04-12T01:31:34Z")
> [@D\_Anconia](#): > > Not even LEOs? They already have 'em. Don’t most departments have stock to issue to new officers or replacements? ---
**Author:** ![purplehorseshoe](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/purplehorseshoe/32/2996_2.png) [@purplehorseshoe](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/purplehorseshoe)\ **Post date:** [April 12, 2020, 3:19am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/most-blatant-covid-19-related-government-overreach-in-the-us-so-far/851519/38 "2020-04-12T03:19:02Z")
> [@jtur88](#): > > Not even LEOs. Police on the beat, into the 70s or 80s, did not carry guns in most British cities and some in Canada. > > By the way, here’s a thought. Every covid death was caused by somebody breaking the quarantine rules. Or by government inaction, or by governmental truth-bending, or by governmental budget cuts to relevant federal departments. Also, by civilian hoarders ensuring shortages of respiratory masks and hand sanitizer supplies. ---
**Author:** ![Dale\_Sams](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/779978/32.png) [@Dale\_Sams](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Dale_Sams)\ **Post date:** [April 12, 2020, 3:27am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/most-blatant-covid-19-related-government-overreach-in-the-us-so-far/851519/39 "2020-04-12T03:27:41Z")
A mayor telling a private corporation what they can and cannot sell is an overreach A _Sheriff_ threatening to arrest people for not wearing a mask without even any federal or state or even city order (iF that is true) to do so, is an overreach. ---
**Author:** ![Dale\_Sams](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/779978/32.png) [@Dale\_Sams](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Dale_Sams)\ **Post date:** [April 12, 2020, 3:28am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/most-blatant-covid-19-related-government-overreach-in-the-us-so-far/851519/40 "2020-04-12T03:28:49Z")
> [@jtur88](#): > > Not even LEOs. Police on the beat, into the 70s or 80s, did not carry guns in most British cities and some in Canada. > > By the way, here’s a thought. Every covid death was caused by somebody breaking the quarantine rules. Illogical. Quarantine rules permit grocery shopping and NO mask is 100% effective [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/most-blatant-covid-19-related-government-overreach-in-the-us-so-far/851519.md?page=1) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/most-blatant-covid-19-related-government-overreach-in-the-us-so-far/851519.md?page=3)