# Most degrading or humiliating scene for an actress/actor **URL:** \ **Category:** Cafe Society\ **Created:** [July 22, 2003, 7:24am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/most-degrading-or-humiliating-scene-for-an-actress-actor/190102 "2003-07-22T07:24:07Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 5
**Author:** ![Heloise](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/h/e36b37/32.png) [@Heloise](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Heloise)\ **Post date:** [July 25, 2003, 6:11am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/most-degrading-or-humiliating-scene-for-an-actress-actor/190102/81 "2003-07-25T06:11:41Z")
> [@](#): > > For some odd reason, his daughter withdrew his Oscar from an auction today even though it would have fetched her a considerable six figure sum at least. She had no choice. The Academy always has the option of buying back an Oscar for the princely sum of one dollar, if someone tries to sell it. Although this option wasn’t valid at the time Orson won his Oscar, they were still able to use it. Therefore, she lost the Oscar for a buck. ---
**Author:** ![Miller](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/miller/32/481_2.png) [@Miller](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Miller)\ **Post date:** [July 25, 2003, 8:03am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/most-degrading-or-humiliating-scene-for-an-actress-actor/190102/82 "2003-07-25T08:03:56Z")
> [@](#): > > I agree, it’s fairly normal. But why the need to depict it so graphically? I’m still wondering what Chloe Sevigny would say to her parents, friends, relatives (or whoever): “No, I didn’t do a blowjob to Vincent… I was only faking it. It’s my job.” Yeah, sure. Haven’t seen it, but I thought the general consensus was that Sevigny wasn’t faking it in _Brown Bunny_. And I think you’re making the mistake of assuming that everyone shares your sexual mores. I’d personally draw the line at performing an actual sex act on camera: for one thing, the film cartridge keeps poking me in the back. \ Ahem. Sorry. I’d personally draw the line at performing an actual sex act on camera, but a simulated sex act? Who cares? If I pretend to kill someone in a movie, I don’t worry about people I know seeing and thinking I’m a real murderer. No offence, and correct me if I’m wrong, but it seems like you’re operating from the assumption that sex is always “dirty” to some degree, and being seen having even pretend sex must be embarassing. A lot of people don’t feel the same way about it, and most of them probably live in Hollywood. ---
**Author:** ![Kalt](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/k/b9e5f3/32.png) [@Kalt](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Kalt)\ **Post date:** [July 25, 2003, 9:49am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/most-degrading-or-humiliating-scene-for-an-actress-actor/190102/83 "2003-07-25T09:49:02Z")
Has anyone mentioned the 10-minute rape scene in “Irreversible”? By far the most disturbing thing I’ve yet to see on film. Also the worst movie I’ve ever seen, but not because of that. [http://us.imdb.com/Title?0290673](http://us.imdb.com/Title?0290673) ---
**Author:** ![Evil\_Captor](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/f17d59/32.png) [@Evil\_Captor](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Evil_Captor)\ **Post date:** [July 25, 2003, 11:36am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/most-degrading-or-humiliating-scene-for-an-actress-actor/190102/84 "2003-07-25T11:36:03Z")
> [@](#): > > \*Originally posted by wolf\_meister \* > **Evil Captor > So there is a difference between acting and real life? I agree that there _should_ be but some folks tend to blur that line.** My point was a little more complex than that. If I see Chloe Sevigny giving some guy a blowjob in a movie, I tend to assume she’s doing it because she’s an actress, not because she is a generic person who gives guys blowjobs for money. I will not be offering her $50 in exchange for oral sex next time I see her. **John Wayne … Susan Lucci … etc …** Yes, some people confuse actors with their roles alrighty. They generally are not considered the most sophisticated elements of fandom, to put it mildly. And I would suggest that the subject of this thread constitutes a species of that activity, though it’s a much more subtle species of mistaking illusion for reality than is usually the case. ---
**Author:** ![elf6c](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/c57346/32.png) [@elf6c](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/elf6c)\ **Post date:** [July 25, 2003, 12:57pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/most-degrading-or-humiliating-scene-for-an-actress-actor/190102/85 "2003-07-25T12:57:33Z")
> [@](#): > > \*Originally posted by Ukulele Ike \* > \*\*You got a problem with the thread? Funny, I haven’t seen an e-mail from you. \*\* Email sent. Sorry. ☹ ---
**Author:** ![elf6c](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/c57346/32.png) [@elf6c](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/elf6c)\ **Post date:** [July 25, 2003, 1:16pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/most-degrading-or-humiliating-scene-for-an-actress-actor/190102/86 "2003-07-25T13:16:42Z")
> [@](#): > > \*Originally posted by Miller \* > \*\*Well, how do you mean, “degrading?” Degrading for having to film it, or degrading for having people watch it in theaters? Ned Beatty’s rape scene was degrading from the standpoint of the character, and uncomfortable to watch for the audience, but I doubt it was a degrading experience for the actor in any real way. It’s been years since I’ve seen it, but I don’t think there’s any nudity: mostly, I remember his close-up reaction shot, which he could have done just as convincingly with his pants on. > > It was a good role in a good film that received strong popular and critical acclaim and gave Beatty a permanent place in movie history. Being raped up the ass is certainly degrading, but I don’t think it necessarily follows that _pretending_ to be raped up the ass is degrading in any measure. \*\* Point taken, but given the situation of a man getting anally raped in front of his friends by the dirty, stinking backwoods fellow, while be forced to “squeel like a pig” given the time it was filmed and the incessant jokes and unfortunate single note highlight to his career to me makes it by far the “winner”. No matter what he has done “squeel like a pig” is the first thing that comes to mind when Ned Beatty is mentioned. [http://us.imdb.com/Name?Beatty,+Ned](http://us.imdb.com/Name?Beatty,+Ned) 120+ appearances in films and TV, and is he remembered for that scene. Pretty humiliating if you ask me. ---
**Author:** ![Profane](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/p/e47774/32.png) [@Profane](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Profane)\ **Post date:** [July 25, 2003, 4:13pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/most-degrading-or-humiliating-scene-for-an-actress-actor/190102/87 "2003-07-25T16:13:56Z")
**Belle de Jour** in its entirety. [http://us.imdb.com/Title?0061395](http://us.imdb.com/Title?0061395) ---
**Author:** ![Cervaise](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/cervaise/32/16693_2.png) [@Cervaise](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Cervaise)\ **Post date:** [July 25, 2003, 6:18pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/most-degrading-or-humiliating-scene-for-an-actress-actor/190102/88 "2003-07-25T18:18:17Z")
> [@](#): > > \*Originally posted by Kalt \* > **Has anyone mentioned the 10-minute rape scene in “Irreversible”?** Interestingly, Monica Bellucci — who played the victim of the rape — directed that scene herself. The director of the film told her more or less what he wanted, and let her take a camera and a couple of technicians off to shoot it. As I understand it, she did two and possibly three takes, because she didn’t think the first one was brutal and nasty enough. I would argue that it isn’t degrading if, as an artist, you have control over your own choices. I’m surprised nobody’s commented on my “background stripper in a Michael Bay movie” example above. As an actor myself, I think it’s _much_ more emotionally abusive, and therefore humiliating and degrading, to treat somebody as a piece of disposable, manipulable meat than it is to respect an actor’s craft while sensitively guiding them to do something difficult. ---
**Author:** ![Moirai](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/96bed5/32.png) [@Moirai](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Moirai)\ **Post date:** [July 25, 2003, 7:04pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/most-degrading-or-humiliating-scene-for-an-actress-actor/190102/89 "2003-07-25T19:04:40Z")
Hey **Sampiro** , ease up on Bela Lugosi. He was a morphine addict due to being in terrible physical pain for the last few years of his life. He was perhaps not the most fiscally responsible actor of his day, but few of them are. I really didn’t like seeing the young boy raped in _The Prince of Tides_. Yuck-O. ---
**Author:** ![Chronos](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/chronos/32/134_2.png) [@Chronos](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Chronos)\ **Post date:** [July 25, 2003, 8:24pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/most-degrading-or-humiliating-scene-for-an-actress-actor/190102/90 "2003-07-25T20:24:18Z")
Quoth **Sampiro** : > [@](#): > > He didn’t want to become another Christopher Lee style window dressing for schlock (though Lee survived nicely to re-emerge in two of the most successful trilogies of all time). Does anyone else see the irony in this? I presume that one of the “most successful trilogies of all time” you’re referring to there is _Star Wars_, the very same series that Guiness was reluctant to be in. ---
**Author:** ![Kalt](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/k/b9e5f3/32.png) [@Kalt](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Kalt)\ **Post date:** [July 25, 2003, 9:30pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/most-degrading-or-humiliating-scene-for-an-actress-actor/190102/91 "2003-07-25T21:30:49Z")
> [@](#): > > \*Originally posted by Cervaise \* > \*\*Interestingly, Monica Bellucci — who played the victim of the rape — directed that scene herself. The director of the film told her more or less what he wanted, and let her take a camera and a couple of technicians off to shoot it. As I understand it, she did two and possibly three takes, because she didn’t think the first one was brutal and nasty enough. I would argue that it isn’t degrading if, as an artist, you have control over your own choices. > \*\* That’s an interesting point. I would point out, though, that not a single artist we’ve thus talked about was ‘forced’ to do any of these movies. They all had the choice to do it or not. They read the script beforehand and knew what scenes they were going to have to do for the film. So in that sense, they all have ‘control over their choices.’ Is the answer to the OP’s question what film has a degrading scene that differs most from that depicted in the script the actors read? Come to think of it, though, being in that horrible Matrix: Reloaded movie [Bellucci played ‘Persephone’] is objectively more degrading than being anally raped for 10 minutes on screen in Irreversible. They were both horrible movies, in fact Irreversible was worse, but at least _something_ different and memorable (albeit in a disturbing way) happened in Irreversible. Can’t say the same about Matrix2. ---
**Author:** ![Grousser](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/g/9d8465/32.png) [@Grousser](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Grousser)\ **Post date:** [July 25, 2003, 10:20pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/most-degrading-or-humiliating-scene-for-an-actress-actor/190102/92 "2003-07-25T22:20:58Z")
Yeap, yeap. I’m willing to be degraded playing some role in any Matrix sequel. Please, Wachowsky Bros., degrade me! 🆒 ---
**Author:** ![Grousser](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/g/9d8465/32.png) [@Grousser](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Grousser)\ **Post date:** [July 25, 2003, 10:28pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/most-degrading-or-humiliating-scene-for-an-actress-actor/190102/93 "2003-07-25T22:28:02Z")
> [@](#): > > \*Originally posted by Miller \* > **Haven’t seen it, but I thought the general consensus was that Sevigny wasn’t faking it in _Brown Bunny_. And I think you’re making the mistake of assuming that everyone shares your sexual mores (…) No offence, and correct me if I’m wrong, but it seems like you’re operating from the assumption that sex is always “dirty” to some degree, and being seen having even pretend sex must be embarassing.** I’m correcting you. I have sexual mores, but I’m not a moralist and don’t think sex is dirty nor embarrasing in any level. I don’t consider all movies do it bad; let’s say, **Basic Instinct** , whose sexual scenes are very fair and justified. But I said before that **Hollow Man** lacks of this distinction. And I’m not talking about sexual embarrassment. Even the most decent wife may do a _fellatio_ but she doesn’t need to tout it, nor the husband. Don’t misunderstand me. I am open-minded, I agree mainstream actresses and actors must be open-minded, but I don’t think any of them would like people think they’ve done a porno clip. They wouldn’t like her open-minded scene to be freely circulating in the internet. Not even Traci Lords. ---
**Author:** ![ArrMatey](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/arrmatey/32/3522_2.png) [@ArrMatey](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/ArrMatey)\ **Post date:** [July 26, 2003, 12:14am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/most-degrading-or-humiliating-scene-for-an-actress-actor/190102/94 "2003-07-26T00:14:13Z")
> [@](#): > > \*Originally posted by EJsGirl \* > \*\*I really didn’t like seeing the young boy raped in _The Prince of Tides_. Yuck-O. \*\* Read the book. Not only better than the movie, but the pay-off / justice / revenge for that is much more… Brutal? Satisfying if you like brutal? ---
**Author:** ![HelenGawn](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/h/a88e4f/32.png) [@HelenGawn](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/HelenGawn)\ **Post date:** [July 26, 2003, 1:03am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/most-degrading-or-humiliating-scene-for-an-actress-actor/190102/95 "2003-07-26T01:03:58Z")
> [@](#): > > No matter what he has done “squeel like a pig” is the first thing that comes to mind when Ned Beatty is mentioned. > > 120+ appearances in films and TV, and is he remembered for that scene. Pretty humiliating if you ask me. But have you asked Beatty? That scene made his career as a known and respected A-list character actor. It turned him from a “Hey, it’s that guy!” to a household name. And he’s hardly been typecast as a rape victim. Plus it was a scene that took a _lot_ of courage to make at the time. I imagine Ned is proud of that work, as he should be. ---
**Author:** ![Moirai](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/96bed5/32.png) [@Moirai](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Moirai)\ **Post date:** [July 26, 2003, 1:49am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/most-degrading-or-humiliating-scene-for-an-actress-actor/190102/96 "2003-07-26T01:49:44Z")
I suppose that Kim Basinger would pick the movie she refused to make- _Boxing Helena_. She was willing to fight a lawsuit rather than play the part after backing out when she saw the shooting script. ---
**Author:** ![schplebordnik](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/91b2a8/32.png) [@schplebordnik](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/schplebordnik)\ **Post date:** [July 26, 2003, 3:31am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/most-degrading-or-humiliating-scene-for-an-actress-actor/190102/97 "2003-07-26T03:31:38Z")
"She had no choice. The Academy always has the option of buying back an Oscar for the princely sum of one dollar, if someone tries to sell it. " I really question the enforceability of that “option.” Also, after they give you the statuette, what if you refuse to sign the option? If it were me, I’d get my lawyer to negotiate a “fair market value, right of first refusal” clause, and see the Academy try to revoke the Oscar. ---
**Author:** ![Moirai](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/96bed5/32.png) [@Moirai](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Moirai)\ **Post date:** [July 26, 2003, 3:37am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/most-degrading-or-humiliating-scene-for-an-actress-actor/190102/98 "2003-07-26T03:37:08Z")
Um, was that post supposed to be in another thread? Or did I miss something? FYI, I think that clause is a UL. Oscars are sold frequently, without the Academy getting a shot at them first. (end hijack!) ---
**Author:** ![Dewey\_Cheatem\_Undhow](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/13edae/32.png) [@Dewey\_Cheatem\_Undhow](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Dewey_Cheatem_Undhow)\ **Post date:** [July 26, 2003, 3:40am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/most-degrading-or-humiliating-scene-for-an-actress-actor/190102/99 "2003-07-26T03:40:36Z")
> [@](#): > > \*Originally posted by schplebordnik \* > \*\*I really question the enforceability of that “option.” Also, after they give you the statuette, what if you refuse to sign the option? If it were me, I’d get my lawyer to negotiate a “fair market value, right of first refusal” clause, and see the Academy try to revoke the Oscar. \*\* They make all the nominees sign well before the ceremony. If you don’t sign, you don’t get the statue. No one needs to revoke anything because refusing to sign means you’ll never have the statue in the first place. Simple as that. Incidentally, this came up in another thread – Welles’ Oscar predated the $1 buyback agreement, so she _could’ve_ sold it, but Welles’ original Oscar was misplaced. To get a replacement, the Acadamy required Welles to sign a buyback agreement that included both the replacement Oscar and the original Oscar in the event it was later found (and it was, IIRC). ---
**Author:** ![Dewey\_Cheatem\_Undhow](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/13edae/32.png) [@Dewey\_Cheatem\_Undhow](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Dewey_Cheatem_Undhow)\ **Post date:** [July 26, 2003, 3:43am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/most-degrading-or-humiliating-scene-for-an-actress-actor/190102/100 "2003-07-26T03:43:23Z")
> [@](#): > > \*Originally posted by EJsGirl \* > \*\*FYI, I think that clause is a UL. Oscars are sold frequently, without the Academy getting a shot at them first. \*\* The Academy didn’t start using the buyback clause until the early fifties. Oscars presented before then can be bought and sold. In that other thread, someone noted that Kevin Spacey and Steven Speilberg have amassed a pretty formidable collection of pre-agreement awards. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/most-degrading-or-humiliating-scene-for-an-actress-actor/190102.md?page=4) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/most-degrading-or-humiliating-scene-for-an-actress-actor/190102.md?page=6)