# Most degrading performance by a woman in a movie? **URL:** \ **Category:** Cafe Society\ **Created:** [April 23, 2007, 9:01am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/most-degrading-performance-by-a-woman-in-a-movie/401286 "2007-04-23T09:01:28Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 3
**Author:** ![jovan](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/j/0ea827/32.png) [@jovan](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/jovan)\ **Post date:** [April 24, 2007, 3:56am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/most-degrading-performance-by-a-woman-in-a-movie/401286/41 "2007-04-24T03:56:36Z")
[QUOTE=lisacurl] What event? Are you saying Burgess knew someone to which something similar happened? Do you have a cite for this, because that sounds very apocryphal. [/QUOTE] It’s not apocryphal, but it’s a very distorted version of what actually happened. From an [Independent article](http://findarticles.com/p/articles/mi_qn4158/is_19991202/ai_n14271411) : > [@](#): > > Burgess had three stories to tell about the origins of A Clockwork Orange, and all three of them involve violence or the threat of death: > > Zheena: wife > > The first happened in 1944. Burgess, stationed with the British Army in Gibraltar, received a letter from Sonia Brownell (soon to marry George Orwell) in London, telling him that his wife, Lynne, had been set upon late one night by four GI deserters, who had punched and kicked her to unconsciousness. Lynne was pregnant, and aborted, and suffered from that time on with attacks of vaginal bleeding. The Burgesses would never have children. From [Burgess himself:](http://bu.univ-angers.fr/EXTRANET/AnthonyBURGESS/NL5Fletcher.htm) > [@](#): > > That was in April of 1944. I received a letter from Sonia Brownwell, later to become Sonia Orwell, who was an occasional drinking friend of Lynne’s. The letter was about Lynne, and Lynne was too ill to write it herself. Lynne had been working late at the Ministry of War Transport on the scales of victualling for the small craft of Operation Overlord. Leaving the office at midnight she had been set upon by four men who, though in civilian dress, were evidently GI deserters. Their accents were southern. The attack was not sexual but in the service of robbery. The four snatched her handbag and one of them tried to pull off her tight gold wedding ring. He was prepared to break or even cut the finger. Lynne screamed to no response of help. Her screams were stilled by blows. She remembered being kicked before losing consciousness. She was pregnant and she aborted. She was sick now with perpetual bleeding glossed as dysmenorrhoea. ---
**Author:** ![Biffy\_the\_Elephant\_Shrew](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/e47c2d/32.png) [@Biffy\_the\_Elephant\_Shrew](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Biffy_the_Elephant_Shrew)\ **Post date:** [April 24, 2007, 4:26am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/most-degrading-performance-by-a-woman-in-a-movie/401286/42 "2007-04-24T04:26:48Z")
[QUOTE=Cartooniverse] Then again, it might be a reference to the rape of the Cat Lady and her murder with the giant white phallus sculpture. I believe in both scenes, the victims died. [/QUOTE] I saw a reference this somewhere else recently and I don’t know where it comes from. What makes you think Alex raped the cat lady? There’s no indication of that in either the film or the book. ---
**Author:** ![AlwaysFresh](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/3be4f8/32.png) [@AlwaysFresh](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/AlwaysFresh)\ **Post date:** [April 24, 2007, 7:58am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/most-degrading-performance-by-a-woman-in-a-movie/401286/43 "2007-04-24T07:58:28Z")
Any of the female performances in the original Alfie with Michael Caine. Surprisingly, I liked the movie but the treatment of women was shocking. ---
**Author:** ![Eolbo](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/d07c76/32.png) [@Eolbo](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Eolbo)\ **Post date:** [April 24, 2007, 10:11am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/most-degrading-performance-by-a-woman-in-a-movie/401286/44 "2007-04-24T10:11:11Z")
[QUOTE=Survey1215] Not sure if this is what the OP is looking for but what about Chloe Sevigny’s actual oral acrobatics in ‘The Brown Bunny’? Especially with a cretin like Vincent Gallo. [/QUOTE] Gallo was her real life partner at the time though. ---
**Author:** ![Evil\_Captor](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/f17d59/32.png) [@Evil\_Captor](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Evil_Captor)\ **Post date:** [April 24, 2007, 11:28am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/most-degrading-performance-by-a-woman-in-a-movie/401286/45 "2007-04-24T11:28:07Z")
Well, I don’t know about degrading performance, but about the most degrading role I can think of offhand is from “Perils of Gwendolyne in the Land of the Yik-Yaks,” a French softcore film. Gwendolyne is a British college girl searching for her father, who has disappearned in pre-World War II China. They hook up with a hunky ex-pat who knows a guy who knows how to reach the land of the Yik-Yaks, who hangs out in an opium den/brothel. So they go to the brothel and find an old white guy lying in a stall with an opium pipe hanging out f his mouth and a naked Chinese woman lying on top of him, her face in his lap, her head bobbing up and down. So when guests arrives does the old white guy get up of shake hands or anything? No, he just continues to lie there sucking on his pipe while the Chinese woman sucks on his other pipe, while he has a conversation with Gwendolyne and hunky guy about where the Land of the Yik-Yaks is. He’s not one to stand on formalities, and she’s a woman who needs no introduction because she’s got some guy’s genitals in her mouth. Other people may have unimportant stuff to natter on about, but there’s an old why guy who needs some lip service, and she’ll not be distracted by, well, anything, apparently, while she’s on the job. So I nominate the Woman Who Needs No Introduction. Gotta be a great role for anyone: Woman Who Just Won’t Stop Giving Head. Could be worse. Could be the Third Woman From the Left Who Needs No Introduction. ---
**Author:** ![ElvisL1ves](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/5daacb/32.png) [@ElvisL1ves](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/ElvisL1ves)\ **Post date:** [April 24, 2007, 11:32am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/most-degrading-performance-by-a-woman-in-a-movie/401286/46 "2007-04-24T11:32:43Z")
Brllliant scientists whose role is to carry a nice rack of tits? Take Kelly McGillis as the PhD physicist and instructor in “Top Gun”, but who serves mainly to wear a sheer skirt in backlit scenes and get all gaga over Tom Cruise’s boyishness. Most degrading? Maggie Gyllenhall in “Secretary”. Of course, that’s what the movie was all _about_. Even if the character herself thought she was simply totally devoted to her boss. ---
**Author:** ![Menocchio](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/9de053/32.png) [@Menocchio](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Menocchio)\ **Post date:** [April 24, 2007, 1:51pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/most-degrading-performance-by-a-woman-in-a-movie/401286/47 "2007-04-24T13:51:15Z")
[QUOTE=Evil Captor] So I nominate the Woman Who Needs No Introduction. Gotta be a great role for anyone: Woman Who Just Won’t Stop Giving Head. Could be worse. Could be the Third Woman From the Left Who Needs No Introduction. [/QUOTE] You have point here. There’s plenty of horror or serious dramas where the women characters fared worse. But I’d bet that they were ok with it at the end since they were likely treated well in reality and made a positive contribution to the film. I’d bet it’s roles like “Stripper #3” and “Red-Haired Hooker” that actually feel degrading to the actress, even if the characters aren’t raped or sexually humiliated on screen. ---
**Author:** ![Cerowyn](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/82dd89/32.png) [@Cerowyn](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Cerowyn)\ **Post date:** [April 24, 2007, 2:54pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/most-degrading-performance-by-a-woman-in-a-movie/401286/48 "2007-04-24T14:54:21Z")
[QUOTE=Little Nemo] Any one of a thousand performances where an attractive young actress played a character who is desperately attracted to the main character who was being played by an unattractive actor twenty or thirty years older than her. [/QUOTE] Because an attractive woman can’t possibly be interested in an unattractive, older man. :rolleyes: ---
**Author:** ![Wee\_Bairn](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/w/90db22/32.png) [@Wee\_Bairn](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Wee_Bairn)\ **Post date:** [April 24, 2007, 2:58pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/most-degrading-performance-by-a-woman-in-a-movie/401286/49 "2007-04-24T14:58:14Z")
[QUOTE=Cerowyn] Because an attractive woman can’t possibly be interested in an unattractive, older man. :rolleyes: [/QUOTE] Possible, but as an example, Elizabeth Berkeley having sex with Woody Allen in either Small Time Crooks or Curse of Jade Diamond, highly dubious in real life, unless he’s giving her cash and or gifts. ---
**Author:** ![bordelond](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/bordelond/32/150_2.png) [@bordelond](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/bordelond)\ **Post date:** [April 24, 2007, 3:24pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/most-degrading-performance-by-a-woman-in-a-movie/401286/50 "2007-04-24T15:24:15Z")
Camille Keaton in _I Spit on Your Grave_, perhaps? ---
**Author:** ![Viridiana](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/v/ebca7d/32.png) [@Viridiana](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Viridiana)\ **Post date:** [April 24, 2007, 11:51pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/most-degrading-performance-by-a-woman-in-a-movie/401286/51 "2007-04-24T23:51:09Z")
[QUOTE=Dr. Rieux] Gina Gershon in _Showgirls_. [/QUOTE] Could you elaborate a bit? ---
**Author:** ![Scissorjack](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/c67d28/32.png) [@Scissorjack](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Scissorjack)\ **Post date:** [April 25, 2007, 12:10am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/most-degrading-performance-by-a-woman-in-a-movie/401286/52 "2007-04-25T00:10:56Z")
The most degrading performance by a woman ever? Audrie Neenan, who played the vicious and foulmouthed lesbian gang member “Ray” in the Dirty Harry movie **Sudden Impact**. She’s apparently only a lesbian because she can’t get a man: she gets drunk and hits on Clint Eastwood who tells her he only dates “humans”; she gets drunk and attempts to crawl into bed with one of her male accomplices, who violently rebuffs her, and she gloatingly presides over Sondra Locke’s violent rape, presumably out of jealousy and spite. Jesus, Clint. ---
**Author:** ![Typo\_Knig](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/cdc98d/32.png) [@Typo\_Knig](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Typo_Knig)\ **Post date:** [April 25, 2007, 2:56am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/most-degrading-performance-by-a-woman-in-a-movie/401286/53 "2007-04-25T02:56:08Z")
[QUOTE=ArchiveGuy] Was she as inarticulate and airheaded as Richards was in the film? Because it wasn’t her looks that destroyed her credibility; it was her complete failure in the acting department. [/QUOTE] I thought Richards’ acting was fine - it was a Bond film after all, not Shakespeare. I thought that she sounded perfectly comfortable with words like isotope. Your Bond Girl Mileage may vary. De Gustibus Non George Lazenby. Signing up for Verhoven’s Starship Troopers - **THAT’S** degrading, IMHO. My grad school friend could actually talk, was **not** an airhead, and was a very pleasant person. I imagine she’s still is all of those things, but it’s been years. ☹ ---
**Author:** ![descamisado](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/e480ec/32.png) [@descamisado](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/descamisado)\ **Post date:** [April 25, 2007, 4:37pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/most-degrading-performance-by-a-woman-in-a-movie/401286/54 "2007-04-25T16:37:41Z")
[QUOTE=ElvisL1ves] Brllliant scientists whose role is to carry a nice rack of tits? Take Kelly McGillis as the PhD physicist and instructor in “Top Gun”, but who serves mainly to wear a sheer skirt in backlit scenes and get all gaga over Tom Cruise’s boyishness. Most degrading? **Maggie Gyllenhall in “Secretary”. Of course, that’s what the movie was all _about_.** Even if the character herself thought she was simply totally devoted to her boss. [/QUOTE] I thought the same thing with the mention of Tra La La in Last Exit to Brooklyn (“Jennifer Jason Leigh’s performance in . . . is up there”). If, based on the OP’s outline, it involves choices made by the character herself rather than the leanings of the dialogue, direction, cinamatography, editing, etc., it gets my vote. ---
**Author:** ![Dan\_Norder](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/4af34b/32.png) [@Dan\_Norder](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Dan_Norder)\ **Post date:** [April 25, 2007, 6:16pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/most-degrading-performance-by-a-woman-in-a-movie/401286/55 "2007-04-25T18:16:19Z")
[QUOTE=Wee Bairn] Possible, but as an example, Elizabeth Berkeley having sex with Woody Allen in either Small Time Crooks or Curse of Jade Diamond, highly dubious in real life, unless he’s giving her cash and or gifts. [/QUOTE] Yeah, and in real life Woody Allen would never be able to have any success dating famous actresses or much younger women… Hello? ---
**Author:** ![RandMcnally](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/b782af/32.png) [@RandMcnally](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/RandMcnally)\ **Post date:** [April 25, 2007, 6:50pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/most-degrading-performance-by-a-woman-in-a-movie/401286/56 "2007-04-25T18:50:54Z")
[QUOTE=Dan Norder] Yeah, and in real life Woody Allen would never be able to have any success dating famous actresses or much younger women… [/QUOTE] He wouldn’t have if he wasn’t famous himself. ---
**Author:** ![Cat\_Fight](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/90ced4/32.png) [@Cat\_Fight](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Cat_Fight)\ **Post date:** [April 25, 2007, 6:56pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/most-degrading-performance-by-a-woman-in-a-movie/401286/57 "2007-04-25T18:56:59Z")
[QUOTE=RandMcnally] He wouldn’t have if he wasn’t famous himself. [/QUOTE] Good point. The characters in most of these movies are usually just regular old guys. Point me to the ‘18-year-old Playmate Weds Retired, 76-year-old Mechanic’ section of Wedding Announcements. ---
**Author:** ![TLDRIDKJKLOLFTW](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/51bf81/32.png) [@TLDRIDKJKLOLFTW](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/TLDRIDKJKLOLFTW)\ **Post date:** [April 25, 2007, 6:59pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/most-degrading-performance-by-a-woman-in-a-movie/401286/58 "2007-04-25T18:59:46Z")
[QUOTE=Johnny Hildo] …and Amy Smart in [Crank](http://www.imdb.com/title/tt0479884/) come to mind. [/QUOTE] I wondered what you were talking about, and then I watched [this (probably NSFW youtube link)](http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=WHaQ7sQF5IA). ---
**Author:** ![pokey](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/p/ebca7d/32.png) [@pokey](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/pokey)\ **Post date:** [April 26, 2007, 2:10am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/most-degrading-performance-by-a-woman-in-a-movie/401286/59 "2007-04-26T02:10:34Z")
I think Selma Blair has kind of covered both types of degrading. She was in this movie with Cameron Diaz, The Sweetest Thing, where she gets some guy’s dick stuck in her throat or something like that. What made it so painful was that it was just not funny. I bet there were only 4 people in the world who laughed. The whole rest of the world just thought, “Nice career, Selma Blair.” She also played a really degraded character in Storytelling. She’s an annoying college girl who wants to seduce the professor and he enjoys humiliating her by making her call him nigger during awkward sex that she’s too polite to back out of. ---
**Author:** ![F.U.Shakespeare](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/f/aca169/32.png) [@F.U.Shakespeare](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/F.U.Shakespeare)\ **Post date:** [April 26, 2007, 2:43am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/most-degrading-performance-by-a-woman-in-a-movie/401286/60 "2007-04-26T02:43:02Z")
When I saw the thread title, I searched it for references to ‘Showgirls’, and saw damn near every female character mentioned except the loud, crude comedienne at the club where Nomi (Elizabeth Berkeley) worked when she first came to Vegas. Said comic told a delightful joke that I retell to this day (“_If a light sleeper sleeps with a light on, what does a hard sleeper sleep with?_”) But she also told what may have been the most horrifyingly sexist joke I’ve ever heard: Q: What’s the name for that useless piece of skin around a twat? _A woman_ [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/most-degrading-performance-by-a-woman-in-a-movie/401286.md?page=2) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/most-degrading-performance-by-a-woman-in-a-movie/401286.md?page=4)