As a non-guitarist, I’ve always thought more highly of Rhoads than Dimebag, because Rhoads’ stuff just sounds harder to play. The climbing solo from Bark at the Moon is a great example - if you watch Zakk Wylde (a pretty good guitarist in his own right) play it during live performances with Ozzy’s band you can see and hear that he doesn’t even try and play it properly; he plays a simplified approximation of it.
Dimebag’s playing sounds less difficult to me because it tends to be more repetitive, and I’ve always assumed that playing chords is much easier than picking single notes, assuming you’re switching off strings.
He’s all technique, no passion. His technique is outstanding, but it’s like a cook who follows the recipe to the letter without ever creating anything of his own.
If you listen to the J.J. Cale songs he build his career by half-assing versus the Cale originals, you see the difference between “soul” and “precision.”
Granted, it takes great talent to play that precisely, but talent without passion is like driving a car with a governor on the throttle.
Again, I’ll say first off that I don’t disagree with your opinion on Randy Rhoads. I really haven’t heard all of even his limited output.
But the idea that Dimebag (Darrell Abbott) didn’t play single notes is insane
We can take Cowboys From Hell as an example. Earlier I was picking songs that resonated more emotionally with me
Now that I’ve seen this a few times in this thread, may I point out that it was John Paul Jones, the bass player, who came up with most of those well-known Zeppelin riffs? Page was responsible for all the bluesy chord-based songs, but Jones wrote most of those cool riffs.
Well, I’ll say this: when I became more familar with Pantera late in their careers I was pretty shocked to find out that there was only one guitarist, because some of their songs sound like there are three.
**Mister Rik **- I all a huge JPJ fan and know he wrote some very cool stuff - the main riff to Trampled Under Foot comes to mind - but can you shed more light on your assertion?
I want to emphasize this. As Duke Ellington said, “If it sounds good, it is good.” Music is not an Olympics gymanstics competition where you’re rated on difficulty. Sure, there is recognition of guys with chops, but chops don’t make a great musician. In fact, a lot of Beatles songs have great musicianship but none of those guys had much chops or dazzle.
All I can say is that I read the words coming out of JPJ’s mouth in an interview in, I think, Bass Player magazine, several years ago. ISTR him specifically citing Black Dog, Kashmir, and The Immigrant Song, but basically saying, “usually if it was a riff-based song, it was mine, if it was bluesy and chordal, that was Jimmy.” Of course, he was referring to main song riffs, not lead guitar licks. And clearly, the bass line is what makes songs like Ramble On work. The Ocean also sounds very JPJ-ish to me.
Unfortunately, I’ve never been a big Zeppelin fan (though I love and respect JPJ’s playing, being a bassist myself), so I can’t cite many songs by name, even though I recognize them as LZ songs. There’s a particular Zep riff running through my head right now that clearly sounds as if it was written on the bass, but I’m completely clueless as to the song’s title. (Wait, just looked it up on YouTube: Heartbreaker.)
Hmm - interesting. Not something I have heard much about; would love to hear/read more…I definitely think of Heartbreaker as a classic Pagey riff, but he certainly got plenty of influence from Willie Dixon, Robert Johnson and others…
Then I think you need to more clearly define the argument. It’s fair to say that the most obvious meaning of “greatest guitarist” is “the one who is most technically proficient”.
Just a quick note to say while it may be “obvious” it is certainly not universally accepted. I have gone out of my way in this thread to offer other criteria…
A personal joke/tribute. I was playing guitar in the park a couple of weeks ago and this sweaty looking guy in a black t-shirt comes up to us. He looks like he doesn’t see the sun very much, he’s probably in his late 30s, likely lives in someone’s basement.
So he sees me playing and asks who I like. I mention Derek Trucks and the guy knows who he is, but he’s not particularly impressed. He likes the guitarist from Led Zeppelin, but he calls him “James Patrick Page,” because the man is so awe-inspiring that his name is not to be shortened to Jimmy like a mere mortal. It is clear this man worships at the altar of JAMES PATRICK PAGE, can tell me which songs aren’t really about hobbits and where Zep was hanging out when they wrote which album, what mystical force killed Page’s son… Basically he’s something you don’t see much of these days- that really nerdy kind of hard rock fan, the “we’re not worthy!” type of guy. I didn’t think those existed anymore and I thought it was funny that I got stuck in a conversation with one. I played the riffs from three Zep songs while he was there and didn’t get any reaction, by the way. It was hard to get him to leave.
So, for that sweaty guy, I’m writing it as JAMES PATRICK PAGE. It’s important to be properly reverential when discussing greatness.
