# most overrated/underrated group/musician **URL:** \ **Category:** In My Humble Opinion\ **Created:** [November 22, 2000, 6:09pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/most-overrated-underrated-group-musician/42327 "2000-11-22T18:09:47Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 14\ **Page:** 3
**Author:** ![Randy](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/2acd7d/32.png) [@Randy](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Randy)\ **Post date:** [November 26, 2000, 3:39am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/most-overrated-underrated-group-musician/42327/41 "2000-11-26T03:39:02Z")
> [@](#): > > \*Originally posted by betenoir \* > \*\* > > > [@](#): > > > > \*Originally posted by Randy \* > > \*\* > > The Most OverRated Band, bar none, is The Ramones. They were nothing but a New Wave/Soft Punk/Pop Band. They rank right up there with Weird Al, and Gary Paxton in novelty acts. \*\* > > Feh. \*\* Feh.? I’m sorry but I have no idea what “Feh” is supposed to mean. French? Or is it an East Coast thing? I kinda gather that it is not in agreement to my assessment of the Ramones since the next guy seems to agree with it, and his statement is in disagreement with mine. Ramones influenced the Sex Pistols? I doubt it. Punk started over there, The Ramones are from Jersey or something like that. Buzzcocks, Undertones…who are they,(?) and if those are the Bands the Ramones influenced then it kinda proves my point. ---
**Author:** ![woodstockbirdybird](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/woodstockbirdybird/32/7905_2.png) [@woodstockbirdybird](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/woodstockbirdybird)\ **Post date:** [November 26, 2000, 4:09am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/most-overrated-underrated-group-musician/42327/42 "2000-11-26T04:09:14Z")
> [@](#): > > \*Originally posted by Randy \* > \*\* > > > [@](#): > > > > \*Originally posted by betenoir \* > > \*\* > > > > > [@](#): > > > > > > \*Originally posted by Randy \* > > > \*\* > > > The Most OverRated Band, bar none, is The Ramones. They were nothing but a New Wave/Soft Punk/Pop Band. They rank right up there with Weird Al, and Gary Paxton in novelty acts. \*\* > > > > Feh. \*\* > > Ramones influenced the Sex Pistols? I doubt it. Punk started over there, The Ramones are from Jersey or something like that. \*\* Wrong. The first Ramones album came out in late '75/early '76, before most of those bands had even written a song. They have all admitted in print at various times to have been influenced by the Ramones. It’s all well-documented. ---
**Author:** ![capacitor](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/e47774/32.png) [@capacitor](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/capacitor)\ **Post date:** [November 26, 2000, 5:12am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/most-overrated-underrated-group-musician/42327/43 "2000-11-26T05:12:27Z")
I saw a concert where Los Lobos was doing “Tomorrow Never Knows”, and they actually sounded more mystical than the Beatles ever did, even during their Maharishi days. ---
**Author:** ![Nacho4Sara](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/n/3d9bf3/32.png) [@Nacho4Sara](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Nacho4Sara)\ **Post date:** [November 26, 2000, 6:23am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/most-overrated-underrated-group-musician/42327/44 "2000-11-26T06:23:09Z")
Underrated: **Ben Harper**. “Waiting on an Angel” is the song that represents all my sadnesses. He has a beautiful voice, incredible lyrics, and this mystical, tranquil quality that I can’t ever fully express. He has more talent than those who sell millions of records, but at the same time I don’t want him to ever be completely famous. His live performances are so awe-inspiring. Also, **Wilco** is not terribly popular, but they are so talented. When they sing a happy song, I am the happiest person in the world; when they are sad or poignant or introspective, I feel their sadness and confusion. I don’t know what it is, but every aspect of their band - the singing, the bass, the phrasing, the drums - conveys this total sense of wholeness, of truth. And I am waiting for everyone to acknowledge that **Sade** is a goddess of mythical proportions. I don’t even care that she doesn’t write (but produces) her music - she is so talented. Her voice is an awesome instrument, and her songs are beautiful. Overrated: **DMB** definitely. And the **Backstreet Boys**. Blech! And **Jewel** , to an extent. I think her talent is great, but blown way out of porportion. **Sarah McLaughlin** has some great songs, but she is not, IMHO, a genius. ---
**Author:** ![Silo](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/ac91a4/32.png) [@Silo](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Silo)\ **Post date:** [November 26, 2000, 7:18am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/most-overrated-underrated-group-musician/42327/45 "2000-11-26T07:18:23Z")
Yeah, maybe the Beatles were a bit overrated, but they were brilliant songwriters. ---
**Author:** ![Randy](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/2acd7d/32.png) [@Randy](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Randy)\ **Post date:** [November 26, 2000, 7:39am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/most-overrated-underrated-group-musician/42327/46 "2000-11-26T07:39:59Z")
> [@](#): > > \*Originally posted by woodstockbirdybird \* > \*\* > > > [@](#): > > > > \*Originally posted by Randy \* > > \*\* > > > > > [@](#): > > > > > > \*Originally posted by betenoir \* > > > \*\* > > > > > > > [@](#): > > > > > > > > \*Originally posted by Randy \* > > > > \*\* > > > > The Most OverRated Band, bar none, is The Ramones. They were nothing but a New Wave/Soft Punk/Pop Band. They rank right up there with Weird Al, and Gary Paxton in novelty acts. \*\* > > > > > > Feh. \*\* > > > > Ramones influenced the Sex Pistols? I doubt it. Punk started over there, The Ramones are from Jersey or something like that. \*\* > > Wrong. The first Ramones album came out in late '75/early '76, before most of those bands had even written a song. They have all admitted in print at various times to have been influenced by the Ramones. It’s all well-documented. \*\* Wrong. The first Ramones album came out in late '75/early '76, before most of those bands had even written a song. They have all admitted in print at various times to have been influenced by the Ramones. It’s all well-documented. Let’s say you’re right, and it looks like you know what you’re talking about, but this is my point…hypothetically, KC and the Sunshine Band may have played a part in influencing the Rolling Stones to do “Miss You”, but that doesn’t mean that KC and the Sunshine Band are underrated. You could say that certain disco bands influenced Cher to do her new dance stuff, but who cares. Thankfully disco is over now just as most of the bands who have significant Ramones influence are pretty insignificant today. Even The Clash who are in my opinion oneof the best bands from the 80’s, have pretty much disapeared. When I see the Ramones on all these lists of most important and most influential, I have to laugh. I mean songs like Pet Cemetary, Rock n Roll HS, it’s nothing but bubble-gum. I need a little more meat to my music to think its significant. ---
**Author:** ![Homer](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/h/df788c/32.png) [@Homer](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Homer)\ **Post date:** [November 26, 2000, 8:55am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/most-overrated-underrated-group-musician/42327/47 "2000-11-26T08:55:46Z")
I’ve said it before and I’ll say it again. The best group to never make a CD is Tenacious D. Check out [http://www.sidehatch.com](http://www.sidehatch.com) or [http://www.fugitivealien.com](http://www.fugitivealien.com) for more info. Better yet, get your ass on Napster and download “Heinous Realm” or “Jesus Ranch” or “Kyle Quit the Band” or “Kyle Took a Bullet for Me” or “Lee” or “Spiderman” or “Sasquatch” or “Rock Your Socks Off” or one of a dozen other classics. Then thrash yourself for not exposing yourself sooner. –Tim ---
**Author:** ![Emperor\_Penguin](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/c2a13f/32.png) [@Emperor\_Penguin](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Emperor_Penguin)\ **Post date:** [November 26, 2000, 8:57am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/most-overrated-underrated-group-musician/42327/48 "2000-11-26T08:57:44Z")
> [@](#): > > \*Originally posted by RickJay \* > \*\*The most underrated band, at lest over the last eleven years, is (in the U.S.) **The Tragically Hip.** From 1989 to 1995 they were the greatest band in the world, hands down. Since then I wouldn’t say they’ve been the greatest, but they’re right up there. > > **Husker Du** is great, but NO band touches the Hip. There’s a line in the movie Amadeus where someone says that Mozart’s latest creation is too long, and Mozart replies, “No, it’s just the right length.” That’s a Tragically Hip song. Every chord, note, and bar of music is right; the songs begin and end exactly the way they should. Nothing is out of place. Each note played contributes to the story being told. > > The songs are masterworks of pacing and tempo. They elicit emotion and images like no rock band I’ve ever heard. Nobody can listen to “Grace, Too” and not feel the longing and sadness it conveys. Nobody could listen to “Locked In The Trunk of a Car” and not at once feel both their own murderous savagery and a terror of same. The languid hopelessness of “The Luxury,” the sincerest of love in “Bobcaygeon,” or the sheer menace and anger of “Put It Off” all shine through in ways other bands could only dream of achieving. Gord Downie’s singing is unbelievable. The lyrics are poetry of a sort Maya Angelou could only dream of composing; “Nautical Disaster” was probably the best poem written in English in 1993. > > The Hip’s first four albums were four of the finest masterpieces of rock music I have ever heard. I urge anyone who wants to meditate over some truly magnificent rock music to buy “Up to Here,” “Road Apples,” “Fully, Completely” and “Day for Night” with all speed. Grab “Phantom Power” if you can, too. Listen , then listen a few more times, and you’ll wonder how your music collection was tolerable without them. > > Live, there’s no better band around. The Hip have stated that they won’t perform a song if they can’t do it better than it sounds on the CD, and boy, do they ever. They bring the house down with every song. > > As to most underrated, I am said before that **Sarah McLachlan** is a hack, and I stand by it. \*\* You know what **Rick**? I couldn’t have said it any better myself. To me, The Hip are the musical embodiment of Canada. Their sound and style is so unique, and it continues to boggle my mind that they haven’t caught on in the US. Their ability to express emotion is topped by no one. I cannot listen to “Fiddlers Green” or “Wheat Kings” without getting a bit teary eyed. One question though. Did you mean the Up to Here was the first Hip album? In 1987, they had a self titled release (which was very good btw, Highway Girl is an classic.) (A slight aside I heard somewhere the Gordon Downie will be releasing a solo album in the near future. I was wondering if you’ve heard any thing about it). And **Guinastasia**? I listen to Gordon Lightfoot also, so don’t feel too weird (I’m 19). I think \*\*Rufus Wainwright \*\* Excellent work. I love the song “April Fools”. He was actually touring with the Barenaked Ladies on their last tour. Speaking of the Barenaked Ladies, I think they are overrated. Now, you must understand it pains me to say this, but their earlier stuff was far and away their best work (i.e. their first three albums). IMHO, the two albums that found favor in the US were not all that great (a little too poppy (even by BNL standards) for me). ---
**Author:** ![Emperor\_Penguin](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/c2a13f/32.png) [@Emperor\_Penguin](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Emperor_Penguin)\ **Post date:** [November 26, 2000, 9:03am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/most-overrated-underrated-group-musician/42327/49 "2000-11-26T09:03:12Z")
> [@](#): > > \*Originally posted by corvus \* > \*\*I think \*\*Rufus Wainwright \*\* Excellent work. I love the song “April Fools”. He was actually touring with the Barenaked Ladies on their last tour. \*\* That should read: _"I think Rufus Wainwright_ **has done some** _excellent work"_ ---
**Author:** ![woodstockbirdybird](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/woodstockbirdybird/32/7905_2.png) [@woodstockbirdybird](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/woodstockbirdybird)\ **Post date:** [November 27, 2000, 3:02am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/most-overrated-underrated-group-musician/42327/50 "2000-11-27T03:02:01Z")
> [@](#): > > When I see the Ramones on all these lists of most important and most influential, I have to laugh. I mean songs like Pet Cemetary, Rock n Roll HS, it’s nothing but bubble-gum. I need a little more meat to my music to think its significant. > \*\* Randy, my only argument with you was in your refutation of the Ramones’ influence. They did indeed influence the whole English punk scene, while you claimed that “punk started over there.” If you don’t like the Ramones, that’s fine. But they did more than just R&R HS & Pet Semetary, too. I gather that you don’t like them because they’re not “serious”, but most fun music isn’t. There’s room for everything if you’ve got an open mind. I happen to enjoy bubblegum sometimes. And every artist has some lame songs - i.e. your pick for underrated, Neil Young: ever heard “Trans”? ---
**Author:** ![bagkitty](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/7ab992/32.png) [@bagkitty](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/bagkitty)\ **Post date:** [November 27, 2000, 3:28am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/most-overrated-underrated-group-musician/42327/51 "2000-11-27T03:28:52Z")
Most over-rated: this is kinda obvious. Bob Dylan, we have been having the “genius” of Bob Dylan shoved down our throats for almost four decades now. My gag reflex kicked in a long time ago. Under-rated: still have a major warm place in my heart for Joan Armatrading and The Roches. ---
**Author:** ![Randy](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/2acd7d/32.png) [@Randy](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Randy)\ **Post date:** [November 27, 2000, 6:51am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/most-overrated-underrated-group-musician/42327/52 "2000-11-27T06:51:17Z")
Ha…Yea “Trans”. Wow. I think Neil Young came into the time, thinking his music was maybe being viewed as “over”, so maybe he OVERCOMPENSATED. Anyway, most of the music I listen to, is, Im mY HUmble Opinion underrated by whoever is responsible. I completely agree with woodstockybirds critique of Dave Matthews, the only time he has ever sounded good to me was when he was on AustinCity Limits with Emmy Lou Harris, Buddy and Julie Miller and Patty Griffin. That was one of the best shows I’ve seen on TV, and there was just enough/not too much, of him in between those other great singer songwriters to alieve the usual sensation of wanting to kill him. Speaking of Patty Griffin, she’d have to be on that UnderRated list. The Ramones as fun music, OK, I don’t mind fun music, Warren Zevons “Certain Girl” is fun and one of my faves, and Zevon is one of my faves, but he writes enough substantial music to allow him to write fun stuff too, Ditto for John Hiatt. I just don’t respect party bands with no substance, and The Ramones fit in there, IMHO. ---
**Author:** ![betenoir](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/258eb7/32.png) [@betenoir](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/betenoir)\ **Post date:** [November 27, 2000, 5:00pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/most-overrated-underrated-group-musician/42327/53 "2000-11-27T17:00:31Z")
> [@](#): > > \*Originally posted by Randy \* > \*\*I just don’t respect party bands with no substance, and The Ramones fit in there, IMHO. \*\* woody said most of what I was thinking already (except maybe “What the hell is wrong with being from Jersey?!”) But, re: your first post, you call them New Wave/Soft Punk/ Pop. I think it’s wort pointing out that New Wave and Punk (of whatever degree of firmness) did not exist when they started playing. So if they sound new wave/punk maybe it’s because of the amount they had to do with inventing it. (Although they were also undeniably pop. In the best sense of the word. In a thread about underrated bands, somebody should mention the Nuggets compliation.) They did a lot toward creating a whole new genre- partially by reviving a rock’n’roll tradition that was dying when they came along. So I wouldn’t call them a party band with no substance. Tho’, nobody’s saying you have to like them. Umm…yeah, I guess “Feh” is an East Coast thing. ---
**Author:** ![betenoir](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/258eb7/32.png) [@betenoir](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/betenoir)\ **Post date:** [November 27, 2000, 5:20pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/most-overrated-underrated-group-musician/42327/54 "2000-11-27T17:20:30Z")
> [@](#): > > \*\*Tho’, nobody’s saying you have to like them. > > \*\* I mean, everybody has their character flaws 😃 [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/most-overrated-underrated-group-musician/42327.md?page=2)